New features for Elyssa KDE

[Boo]

So it is time to start thinking of how to improve mint KDE for the Elyssa edition.
Things to think about and post:
What apps to add/remove
What type of theme/background

Of course there will be the improvements from ubuntu 8.04 by default.
I know lots of people will want KDE4 but I don't think it will have enough apps ported to it or be stable enough.

I have already started reducing the distro size and so far I'm down to 802MB.
I don't know how much smaller I can get it without removing OO.o and/or Gimp.

So start the ideas coming.

***EDIT***List of apps suggested so far.***EDIT***

Application List:
Koffice
Krita (replace Gimp)
Kmail
Picasa
Dolphin
KDETV (or some TV app)
songbird
Firefox 3
-Gimp
show synaptic in menu
iplist
hplip (update)
SuperKaramba
CD-software-repository.
RSSowl (replace AKregrator)
KBFX (replace tastymenu)
KDE4 (replace KDE3)
dmraid
smplayer (front end to mplayer)

other changes:
New theme and icons.
KDE mint sounds

Boo

[Fred]

Boo,

I think "Dolphin" would be a good addition. It is an additive GUI. Now if the move/copy to context menu was there like in "Konqueror".....

For what it is worth, I think you did a great job on Mint 4 KDE CE.

Enjoy life,

Fred

[jpedrosa]

hi,
i would appreciate a lot, if you included a TV Visualization program, KDETV? not sure, you probably know something better.

JP

[dracorX]

hm... there would be songbird that i'd appreciate much (as i can't get it running correctly (at least on cassandra)

[akshunj]

Guys, I think Boo is asking which core apps do you think he should include. Think about the apps included in Mint Main Edition, and then which KDE equivalents we would like to see in Mint KDE. Stuff like KDE TV and Songbird don't really have equivalents in Mint Main Edition, thus they are not really core apps. Otherwise, adding apps like that will push the distro further away from the goal of a CD-sized ISO.

I could be wrong. Just my 2-cents...

--Akshun J

[jpedrosa]

akshunj
you may have a point there.

but my point is exactly that, an TV application should be core.

Mint is a distro that works perfectly out of the box.
one of the key "features" for this is having a very "friendly" way to work with media formats, sound, image, video. and they have this by having codecs installed & configured.

Having this said, for me a TV application is just a step further, because tv cards are very common these days.

best regards,
JP

[Fred]

Boo,

If you don't mind, I'll chime in one idea at a time. I don't have very many good ideas and I certainly don't get them in nice neat batches.

It is always nice to get the size of a distro down so that it will fit on a cd, but I hope that is not a high priorly for you. After all, KDE is a big, (size wise), DE. Personally, I would rather see you use your efforts to make it fast and complete. If it fits a cd, fine. If not, I wouldn't worry about it.

A considerable percentage of your users will be relatively new to linux and/or KDE. Give them a good cross section of programs that are available for Linux and the KDE DE. A best of breed for linux and KDE and at least one program to do about anything the average user might want to do. If there is such a thing as an average user.

Speed! Try not to run anything on start-up that doesn't really have to run. And since this is a desktop OS, I would consider using "preload" as default. It certainly makes the desktop feel faster.

Firefox 2.xx is soooo slow. I would highly recommend that you take a serious look at using one of the later beta's of Firefox 3.0, if you can find one that will work ok. I am using the "Firefox 3.0 3b beta" now and I have had no real problem with it, on my equipment anyway. Still some rough edges, but so much faster.

Enough for one post.

Fred

[ed@Mint]

Hi, just wanted to make a suggestion.

I know firefox and thunderbird form a nice duo for browsing and mailing, but since this is a KDE edition, why not use Kmail instead of thunderbird ?
I would not recommend to use Konqueror instead of firefox (though it's a great browser) because firefox is still (to my taste) a little superior to Konqueror.
(Just talking about web browsing here, otherwise i just love konqueror as file manager and all-in-one tool !)

And by the way, why not use Koffice instead of open office ?
I think koffice is a really nice office suite, fully compatible with ODF, and very promising for it's upcoming version 2.0.

This is it.
Continue the great work you've done with Daryna KDE CE, you guys rock

[akshunj]

Hi, just wanted to make a suggestion.

I know firefox and thunderbird form a nice duo for browsing and mailing, but since this is a KDE edition, why not use Kmail instead of thunderbird ?
I would not recommend to use Konqueror instead of firefox (though it's a great browser) because firefox is still (to my taste) a little superior to Konqueror.
(Just talking about web browsing here, otherwise i just love konqueror as file manager and all-in-one tool !)

And by the way, why not use Koffice instead of open office ?
I think koffice is a really nice office suite, fully compatible with ODF, and very promising for it's upcoming version 2.0.

This is it.
Continue the great work you've done with Daryna KDE CE, you guys rock

Ooooo. I think those are good calls. I think KMail is even integrated with KOffice as part of KDE's PIM suite, isn't it? I agree that for a web browser, Konqueror is not there yet. It would be way cooler if the KDE folks put Konqueror out of it's misery, used Dolphin as the file manager, and QT'ified Firefox. Just my opinion...

--Akshun J

[Fred]

akshunj,

If it weren't for the fact that Firefox was so bloated, I would agree with you. I really think that Konq. has more potential in the long run, but you are right, it isn't anywhere near being there yet. It is in bad need of more development resources. I haven't looked at KDE 4 yet. I am hoping that some major improvements are there.

Fred

[ed@Mint]

I think KMail is even integrated with KOffice as part of KDE's PIM suite, isn't it?

Right. And without them, i think we miss one of the great features of KDE, which is full interoperability between every KDE app.

Concerning Dolphin, i am not quite sure what to think about...
I just gave it a short test while testing a kubuntu for about a week and i'm not convinced that it *has* to replace konqueror, but i'm sure people who use it more often can give good arguments about that.
However, if dolphin is set as default file manager and firefox kept as default browser (since we said that konqueror doesn't quite make it yet), then what becomes our beloved Konqueror ?

[jpedrosa]

You can't say the Koffice suports all formats in a reasonable way ... with this graph from the guys at Koffice
http://www.koffice.org/filters/1.6/

has you can see there stilla lot of suported formats on the ** rank, and you can also read what ** means

Best regards,
JP

[akshunj]

You can't say the Koffice suports all formats in a reasonable way ... with this graph from the guys at Koffice
http://www.koffice.org/filters/1.6/

has you can see there stilla lot of suported formats on the ** rank, and you can also read what ** means

Best regards,
JP

It's a "good enough" solution in my opinion, although I hear you. But if someone needs more, they can install OpenOffice from the repositories. Again, just my opinion. KOffice isn't great, but it doesn't really suck either.

Again, I wish KDE just QT-ified OpenOffice and called it a day. They have SO many projects out there. Why they try to have their own web browser, office suite, email client, etc. is beyond me. It makes KDE's reach exceed it's grasp such that they just end up disappointing a lot of their fans. Gnome gets to sit back and reap the benefits of projects like Firefox and OpenOffice. KDE should take a lesson. Ask me how I really feel...

--Akshun J

[ed@Mint]

I think that "Qt-ify" or "KDE-ify" applications such as OpenOffice or Mozilla stuff would more or less be equal to KDE making their own applications
That is way beyond a few function calls to adjust...
And i think it's nice they're making things their way.

Anyway, coming back to Koffice, jpedrosa is right... Though i agree with Ashkunj on the fact that koffice is surely nice enough for me. But since i'm not a heavy office-suite user, my advice about that is not to be taken in priority at all.
Maybe in a future release like Mint KDE 6.0 or so... Koffice 2.0 along with KDE 4.1...
Future will tell us.

[akshunj]

I think that "Qt-ify" or "KDE-ify" applications such as OpenOffice or Mozilla stuff would more or less be equal to KDE making their own applications
That is way beyond a few function calls to adjust...
And i think it's nice they're making things their way.

Not *quite* equal to making their own, although I certainly don't mean to imply that it's a cake-walk. It's just that KDE has soooo many projects that it tries to maintain. OpenOffice and Mozilla are independent (of Gnome or Linux) projects that are under heavily development with lots of resources. KDE just can't put the same kind of effort into developing KOffice.

But this was just an idle rant. I bear no grudge toward KOffice. As I said, I think it's a "good enough" solution for Mint KDE's purposes...

--Akshun J

[jokersloose]

I've read in this tread where the goal is to try to keep Mint small enough to load on a CD instead of a DVD. I was wondering if all of the features of OpenOffice are needed for the ISO image? What I am getting at is this: How many normal PC users ever open things like the spreadsheet, presentation, etc. I know for me I use the word processor, pdf reader in my day to day use. Maybe just load them in the main ISO image and then let people install the other options "if" they need them.

Just a thought.

James

[belovedmonster]

Lose GIMP!!!!

I always say... even if Photoshop came free with Windows it would be useless for average users. Same goes with GIMP, it's just complete over kill for a general image editing app for 99% of people. People just need the basics... resize, crop, colour correct, sharpen etc. Anyone who wants more than that will of heard of GIMP and will know where to get it.

Lucky on KDE in Krita you have a very good image application that can easily replace GIMP.

[ed@Mint]

+1 for Krita instead of gimp (and Krita is part of Koffice )

And it's not just a simple Image editting program... It's goal is to be the KDE equivalent to gimp and it's nearly as powerful.
Lots of gimp user might find all they need without installing another app.
Let's get rid of GTK apps

[Fred]

I agree with ed@Mint and belovedmonster. Krita is a better default app. for the KDE version. Anybody that needs anything more powerful can always install it from the repos.

Fred

[kanishka]

One more vote for Krita!