Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby FedoraRefugee on Mon Feb 09, 2009 9:52 pm

I do all the cooking here myself. I have been a professional cook (line cook, not a "chef") and I enjoy it. Plus, I work from the house and use Linux as my business OS. Not to mention my wife cant boil water... :D

Fred, once again you have brought up a very preceptive point. I dont think any of us regret the ease of use that Linux is really beginning to enjoy, after all, this is why we DO use Mint and not Slack or Gentoo (though I do have a Gentoo install I dabble with and I have enjoyed Slack in the past, as I have about any distro you could name.). I am not against making life easier and I am admittedly a GUI and eyecandy type person though I can use the terminal quite proficiently. What I am against is trying to turn Linux into something it is not. I have been somewhat sheltered to this attitude having primarily been a Fedora user though we always have got our share of users coming through the forum who have no clue what Fedora is and who are not willing to roll up their sleeves and actually have to dig in to get something to work. I am so happy to see so many Linux brothers like you guys here, I am amazed at the number of people in this forum that do appreciate Linux for what it is.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby Fred on Mon Feb 09, 2009 10:08 pm

All this talk of gourmet food is making me hungry. What time should I be there for a free meal. lol

I will of course have to eat with Fedora first, to get the strength to make it all the way to AK. :-)

Fred

EDIT: A shameless attempt to get a dinner invitation and a free, as in money, meal. :-)
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby FedoraRefugee on Mon Feb 09, 2009 11:07 pm

Fred wrote:All this talk of gourmet food is making me hungry. What time should I be there for a free meal. lol

I will of course have to eat with Fedora first, to get the strength to make it all the way to AK. :-)

Fred

EDIT: A shameless attempt to get a dinner invitation and a free, as in money, meal. :-)


With 5 kids showing up for regular meals you would not be noticed!!! I just got a tortilla press and made cheese enchiladas tonight. Turned out very well for a first go.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby aviynw on Mon Feb 09, 2009 11:35 pm

I still think that these suggestions SHOULD be told to the linux mint team as opposed to, or maybe in addition to, the xorg or pulseaudio team. I am certainly no expert, but wouldn't these issues be a matter of making a script and a gui? Does pulseaudio development even deal with gui stuff? If it was fitting for fedora to add such a script to handle xorg I don't see why it wouldn't be a fitting job for us as well.

I also disagree with several points about what the purpose of linux should be. Many people here seem to think that whatever it should be, it should attempt to drag people into developing for it. To the point that if you are not willing to develop for it you are not welcome to use it. To the point that the creation of gui tools is bad because then people won't learn how to develop for linux. Even if someone doesn't contribute in any sort of way I still think they should still be welcomed to use it. When I help people on forums it isn't because I want them to eventually help linux later on, and when I ask for help I don't ask with that intent. Ubuntu translates from zulu as "humanity to others", I think that's what it should all be about. In that light, If someone makes a suggestion with no intention to contribute, that request should still be heard.

I remember reading a review of linux mint that depicted that it as a distribution that really listened to user feedback. It said something along the lines of, “you can make a suggestion today and literally see it be included in the next release.” So far my experience suggests otherwise, I hope that isn't the case. Whatever the reality is, all should be aware of that reality, and if you disagree with the community's purpose you belong in a different community.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby FedoraRefugee on Tue Feb 10, 2009 12:02 am

aviynw wrote:I still think that these suggestions SHOULD be told to the linux mint team as opposed to, or maybe in addition to, the xorg or pulseaudio team. I am certainly no expert, but wouldn't these issues be a matter of making a script and a gui? Does pulseaudio development even deal with gui stuff? If it was fitting for fedora to add such a script to handle xorg I don't see why it wouldn't be a fitting job for us as well.

I also disagree with several points about what the purpose of linux should be. Many people here seem to think that whatever it should be, it should attempt to drag people into developing for it. To the point that if you are not willing to develop for it you are not welcome to use it. To the point that the creation of gui tools is bad because then people won't learn how to develop for linux. Even if someone doesn't contribute in any sort of way I still think they should still be welcomed to use it. When I help people on forums it isn't because I want them to eventually help linux later on, and when I ask for help I don't ask with that intent. Ubuntu translates from zulu as "humanity to others", I think that's what it should all be about. In that light, If someone makes a suggestion with no intention to contribute, that request should still be heard.

I remember reading a review of linux mint that depicted that it as a distribution that really listened to user feedback. It said something along the lines of, “you can make a suggestion today and literally see it be included in the next release.” So far my experience suggests otherwise, I hope that isn't the case. Whatever the reality is, all should be aware of that reality, and if you disagree with the community's purpose you belong in a different community.


Why are you beating a dead horse? :roll: These suggestions have been aired. If I am not mistaken the way things work is Husse sees these posts. If he feels it is a worthwhile suggestion then he will talk to Clem. If you want to persist then why not just PM him personally?

Everyone has their own personal opinion about what the purpose of Linux should be, from system admins who use CLI only to windows rejects looking for a free ride to everything in between. I do not develop for Linux, I am just a user. I am a construction worker with an aluminium installation business, I do not know the first thing about coding. I have helped many people through the years, I have probably dissuaded many more. So be it. If you like Ubuntu's philosophy then use it. If you can build a better mousetrap then build it. If you cannot then give the idea to someone who can. If no one listens then maybe your idea is not so good. THAT is the way it works. There are way too many chuckleheads coming in here with their limited view of what Mint SHOULD be insisting that they will make it the ultimate replacement for Windows that it should be. It is an old, wore out tune. No one is saying these suggestions are not worthwhile. But Clem is driving this ship, it is his baby. Either use it or get off, it is your choice. THAT is what Linux is about. Freedom. You have the freedom to build your own ship, the same as Clem did. There are things I would change about Mint if I was in charge. But I am not, and this is the best distro AT THE MOMENT. I have no complaints.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby badmotor on Tue Feb 10, 2009 12:20 am

These are my least favourite threads - two very opposite views and the arguments just going round and round. :roll:

I have actually made suggestions about applications and things in the past that have shown up in the distro. It does happen. :)
But I would never have the audacity to tell developers to 'make a couple of scripts' of whatever to do something I want when I don't know the first thing about coding myself. Mint is based on components developed upstream, and some of those issues from them come into the end product. Mint is one of the best out there, I wish I could develop and contribute but I'm just a happy end user.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby TerminusEst on Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:42 am

You are certainly welcome to your opinions and so far you havent really said anything that particularly bothers me, but how is it that you deem yourself being the community spokesman against ak dave when most of us agree with him? Why dont you just learn how to use Linux? Eventually it will get easier, we are all working towards that goal, but you need to keep in mind the fact that this is a different OS that has very deep roots (unix).


I'm not the community spokesman, and I like the way Linux is built up. As one example, editing a text file is far easier and enjoyable job than editing some registry. But I remember the days when Windows itself also had text files to edit the configs of the system and of the programs. Then, 'cause of technical issues, they created the registry to unify the way to edit those config files. It was wonderful! After that, they screwed up the registry creating those CLSI or something like that. Since this moment the registry became a painful way to edit something on Windows. I prefer the text files and, I think so, most people will find easier to edit a text and humanly (humanly? Not sure if this is the correct way to write it) readable file than the Windows registry. What I'm trying to say is that Windows evolves, though it evolves badly sometimes. I hate Windows myself. I have seen that BSOD more times than the very Bill Gates. And the installation process... oh! God, I think that installation screen has been burned on my retines, 'cause I see it everywhere. In truth, I do not know why Windows has became what it is today. It should have been OS/2 or Mac OS, they are so superior.

I understand, from what I read, that you are afraid of Linux becoming just a Windows clone. This is not my goal. Take Mac OS: it is friendly like Windows (IMO far more friendly) and have the strenghts of the Unix systems. Can you say it is just a clone of Windows? If you someday took a kext file on your hands you won't say that. Linux won't be ruined if, someday who knows, there be a GUI for every command it has on CLI. Why not? If someone here wants a Linux that doesn't have these tools, but just a CLI, well we know there are more Linux distros out there than ants in the world. Some of them will be the way you like. If you don't like a friendly OS, man you are wasting time using Mint, 'cause it IS friendly. The most friendly Linux I have seen in my entire life (no, I don't think Suse of Fedora are more friendly).

Lastly, but not less important, I would like to apologize for the way I acted on my previous post with AK DAVE. Sorry for that.

Thx in advance.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby FedoraRefugee on Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:16 am

TerminusEst wrote:I'm not the community spokesman, and I like the way Linux is built up. As one example, editing a text file is far easier and enjoyable job than editing some registry. But I remember the days when Windows itself also had text files to edit the configs of the system and of the programs. Then, 'cause of technical issues, they created the registry to unify the way to edit those config files. It was wonderful! After that, they screwed up the registry creating those CLSI or something like that. Since this moment the registry became a painful way to edit something on Windows. I prefer the text files and, I think so, most people will find easier to edit a text and humanly (humanly? Not sure if this is the correct way to write it) readable file than the Windows registry. What I'm trying to say is that Windows evolves, though it evolves badly sometimes. I hate Windows myself. I have seen that BSOD more times than the very Bill Gates. And the installation process... oh! God, I think that installation screen has been burned on my retines, 'cause I see it everywhere. In truth, I do not know why Windows has became what it is today. It should have been OS/2 or Mac OS, they are so superior.

I understand, from what I read, that you are afraid of Linux becoming just a Windows clone. This is not my goal. Take Mac OS: it is friendly like Windows (IMO far more friendly) and have the strenghts of the Unix systems. Can you say it is just a clone of Windows? If you someday took a kext file on your hands you won't say that. Linux won't be ruined if, someday who knows, there be a GUI for every command it has on CLI. Why not? If someone here wants a Linux that doesn't have these tools, but just a CLI, well we know there are more Linux distros out there than ants in the world. Some of them will be the way you like. If you don't like a friendly OS, man you are wasting time using Mint, 'cause it IS friendly. The most friendly Linux I have seen in my entire life (no, I don't think Suse of Fedora are more friendly).

Lastly, but not less important, I would like to apologize for the way I acted on my previous post with AK DAVE. Sorry for that.

Thx in advance.


I can agree with all that! :D

What I do not get is the point that Windows evolves said like Linux does not? Man, how long have you been around? Have you read the nostalgic Linux review that Exploder posted a couple days ago? Here:

http://www.tuxradar.com/content/archive ... stros-2000

This was right around the time I started with Linux. I started with debian and really couldnt figure it out, but I tried. I managed to install it but...A couple years later I moved to RH8. I would say that was really about the first "usable" distro in my experience. I distro hopped until Fedora core 4 when I really got into Linux 100%. I dropped Windows completely, switched my business over from XP, and basically never looked back. I have been very active in the Fedora forum community ever since and I have watched Fedora grow into what Linux is now.

Your impression of what some (including me) are saying is wrong. We want Linux to become easier, more user friendly. You miss the point. Easier does not mean like Windows. You seem to picture us as these grumpy old curmudgeons who dont even use a WM/DE or if we do just use openbox or something. This is so far from the truth, we do use Mint because it is polished and easy. Fedora is NOT an easy distro to use, debian is easier than Fedora despite Linus' opinion. Fedora, by nature is cutting edge and will break quite often. Any given update will leave you without X. Debian is the perfect, vanilla Linux. It is as stable as the day is long. Gentoo is a model of total control, it may be a lot more involved, but the rewards are worth the effort. You want to see what Linux used to be like? What a pure Linux distro would be like? Try slack. You see, it is not one size fits all. Each distro has its place. Yet they are all Linux and with little effort I can pretty much turn one into any other. Maybe excepting package management which would become way too involved. You can use Fedora as a server, you just have to tweak it and accept that you will not be using the latest updates. Debian can be very exciting and cutting edge, just try sid for yourself! A kid can use Gentoo...once it is installed. :)

I think what you are reading with some of our posts is a sadness because of the lack of some folks perspective. Some have an irrational fear of even opening a terminal; terminalitis. I have seen this so much and I surely do not understand. What is so hard about opening a terminal and pasting a line of code in? Yet this is the roadblock for so many. Should we do away with the terminal in Linux? This question will usually receive a resounding "yes" in certain forums. This is so sad. The terminal is the reason why I moved to linux. The power to fix anything via command line to a config file. What we are saying is just be careful which way Linux evolves. Catering to those with a limited "Windows" mentality just because they perceive a certain way is easier is a huge mistake. There has to be a meeting in the middle of the user and the OS. Like it or not nothing in this world is truly idiotproof, and an OS will never come close.

edit: I have already been long winded but I want to say something else. You know why I left Fedora? It was because of all the new "user friendly" crap they are starting to build. Packagekit, policykit, pulseaudio, going from xorg.conf to HAL policy on everything...This is the result of "trying" to make Linux easier! :twisted: Fedora is cutting edge so it sees the first implementation of all this stuff, and let me tell you brother, it is SO screwed up! What used to be a simple gedit in xorg.conf is now a convoluted walk into policyland. What used to be an easy entry into fstab is now an hour long process of trying to get all the separate pieces "talking" to each other. Auto-everything is great until your stuff is not recognized. This is the price for things getting "easier" and this is the reason for my pessimistic outlook in threads like "what will Mint be like in 10 years?" See, I have been there before most Mint users. It is coming to this distro too! Just wait! Hopefully things will work better, be more stable, by the time Ubuntu gets them. But it is all coming. Back in the old days you may have had to google a problem, but then the solution was simple. You typed some cryptic gobbly-gook into a terminal and presto, your new automatic bread butterer was recognized and worked. That was what Linux was all about. I sure am losing sight of what it is these days.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby AK Dave on Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:01 pm

Mmm... tortilla press... that sounds cool. I rarely use my pasta maker, but I think I'd get good mileage out of a tortilla press. What do you recommend, FedoraRefugee?

Terminus: No hard feelings. Do you need help getting xorg and your nVidia card to be happy together?

aviynw: You CAN make a suggestion and see it implemented in a forthcoming release; however, some suggestions are best handled by the development team committed to a specific application rather than Mint's development "team" (*cough*Clem*cough*).

In case I didn't mention it before, I think that Fedora's gimmick to capture an xorg failure and default to a "safe-mode X" is totally awesome and I wish Mint had such a feature, but I'd also like to see such a feature in Ubuntu and Debian since I interact with both of those also. So where is the appropriate point in the stream to insert such a change? Options: A) change Mint, hope it gets picked up in Ubuntu, hope it gets picked up in Debian; B) suggest Fedora's change to Ubuntu, hope they pick it up, hope Debian picks it up after Ubuntu has had it around for 2-3 years; C) try to get a Debian developer interested in the problem sometime before 2019; or D) recommend Fedora's feature be adopted into Xorg itself and from there be rolled out to everyone who uses linux. Mmmm... I think 'D' is the answer.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby Fred on Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:13 pm

badmotor wrote:
These are my least favourite threads - two very opposite views and the arguments just going round and round. :roll:


One one level, I have to agree with you. To the extent that they become contentious, argumentative, and repetitive, we would probably be better off without so much rhetoric. Sometimes less is more. :-)

On the other hand it is an educational tool as well. There are a lot of very new Linux users reading these threads, even though they may never actually post. Look at the views some of these threads draw. It is a good thing for them to see some of the push and pull within the community that in the long run drives Linux development. The equilibrium between stake holders is an important part of determining where Mint and Linux go in the future. Remember, Linux has always been a system built by users for users, not by some private entity for the purpose of making a profit for shareholders. Arriving at a consensus is a very messy process. Sometimes it isn't very pretty but to sweep all this under the rug and pretend it isn't there serves only to disenfranchise those so shielded. Yes, Linux tends to be somewhat of a free-for-all, but therein lies a great deal of its' strength and flexibility too.

So I say, let the games commence! But try to keep it on a constructive note as opposed to a destructive one. Linux, contrary to popular opinion, is not a democratic process. There are no voting boxes that carry any weight. It is a meritocracy. So put your ideas out there and justify their worth if you can. Just be careful what you ask for, you might get it. The cream will rise to the top, the rest will pass into oblivion, where it belongs. :-)

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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby FedoraRefugee on Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:21 pm

Tortilla press: I got this one buy it now on ebay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/TORTILLA-PRESS-Cast ... 1|294%3A50

You could use any heavy object to press them out, the secret is kneading the masa ball into a perfect round about the size of a golf ball. Corn tortillas are dirt easy it is just corn flour and water mixed with some salt. Ratio is on the corn flour bag. I also season mine with essence of Emeril (I season EVERYTHING with essence of Emeril! :D ) recipe can be found here:

http://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/emer ... index.html

D) recommend Fedora's feature be adopted into Xorg itself and from there be rolled out to everyone who uses linux. Mmmm... I think 'D' is the answer.


Some of the Fedora developers work closely with the xorg guys. This will probably be the case in the long run anyway.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby AK Dave on Tue Feb 10, 2009 7:00 pm

Essence of Emeril... sounds kinda NSFW. I use the heck out of that stuff, make it myself out of the best quality ingredients I can reasonably obtain. The other mix I use a lot of is a blend of equal parts of turmeric, paprika, ginger, cayenne, coriander (ground and whole toasted), cardamom, cumin (ground and whole toasted), cilantro, and cinnamon.

Got ta, got ta, got ta have me one of those tortilla presses.

In other news... Xorg and Pulseaudio both have active development teams of coders who understand their respective application pretty well, and both are getting better and better every new release. Its exciting, at least to me.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby ahogg on Tue Feb 10, 2009 11:26 pm

I would just like to drop my two cents in the mix here and try to help the discussion back to a "matter of fact" discussion. Many of you out there are far more capable than I with Linux. In fact I would be lying if I said I wasn't somewhat envious of those who are efficient with the command line interface. I am well aware of the power that it can have in many situations over the GUI. But realistically--for me--I do not currently have the extensive amount of time to drop what I'm doing and dive right into learning command line. I know a little, and I mean a little. The GUI is what I look to to get things done. And I would like to point out that it is so "in your face" obvious that Linux Mint--not necessarily Linux--but Linux Mint has compiled a very user friendly GUI that is quite functional. And I would bet good money that if those of you who are command line driven, would spend a bit more time in the GUI of Mint, you may just stumble across some much easier ways to get things done than in command line. I will emphasize that that is in no way with everything. I take you back to one of my opening remarks that command line is indeed a powerful tool. But it has become evident to me that many of the command line users often attach too many steps or instructions in reference to getting things done. As one small example, if you are in Windows and you want to download the ISO and burn it, you need to also download a free burning utility and so on and so forth. On several occasions I have downloaded various Linux ISO's, but just before starting the download, I place a blank disc in the burner. When the download is complete, Nero is instantly launched and you can even change the burning speed. And all you have to do is click the burn button, and then a bootable image is transferred to CD. This is one small example that is also very similar in the Linux Mint GUI. But even command line itself has become more graphically friendly, dare I say that word. It even incorporates some of the drag and drop features of todays GUI's. If you want to get really daring, I might even say that one day, command line will have evolved into it's own little GUI all by itself, which on a really small scale, already is. It reminds me a little bit like how Linux and X server co-exist. Which is which, which is better, and so on and so forth.
I too recognize wholeheartedly that Linux Mint is not trying to be Windows. If it were, then I would have nothing to look forward to. But it appears to me that it is appealing to both crowds--command line users, and us knuckle headed newbies that don't know nothin'. Was it appropriate for the post to say that "It must be done?" Maybe not, but somehow I understand the point that was being made. It wasn't designed to talk down to the command line user. You guys have your own wishes I'm sure, and we have you to thank for much of the developement. But the guy who just needs his computer to work for him and do things that Windows wants hundreds of dollars to do and in sub-par fashion I might add, he is going to inherently comment on things that could make his or her experience better in the GUI. Once again, we can argue all day about what Linux is REALLY all about. To me, if the development of a comprehensive, powerful, and graphically pleasing GUI was not a part of the Linux Mint project, well then they wasted a gross amount of time and resources to open it up to other perspective users. That being said, maybe Microsoft should take the command line direction and start booting to DOS again. Perhaps then, a wonderfully powerful and relatively trouble free GUI may accidentally reveal itself, and they might have something worth a third of what the ask for it. Just something to think about. People, it doesn't make sense to battle back and forth over stupid stuff. It is what it is. And nothing is perfect. Even OS-X isn't perfect. Yes I said OS-X. Anybody who dares to say that it is a crappy product is just being bullheaded. I will agree everyday of the week that their is nothing special about Mac hardware. In fact if apple would make available a copy of OS-X designed to work on any PC hardware with no legal issues, well the hardware geeks among us know all too well, that we could run the wheels off OS-X with hardware costing a quarter of the price. But that ain't happening. So you'll have to settle for the legally questionable workarounds. Even still, you can say all you want, OS-X is an excellent product and is also a UNIX based OS. If you don't care for it, that's fine, but that doesn't mean it's garbage. The bottom line is that the X server and command line seem to be merging more and more everyday. Neither one of them will be completely eliminated in the foreseeable future. But does the fact that you can do more and more in the GUI mean anything? To me, it doesn't mean the extinction of command line, it just means that more knuckle headed newbies--like me--will get on board with Linux in some fashion, I hope.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby FedoraRefugee on Wed Feb 11, 2009 12:02 am

Can I ask a stupid question?

Exactly who is arguing for command line usage here?
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby Guest on Wed Feb 11, 2009 1:17 am

FedoraRefugee wrote:Can I ask a stupid question?

Exactly who is arguing for command line usage here?


To me its like having a passenger car and a truck. The car will get you around most of the time but when you have to move that load of manure its good to have the truck. A GUI is similar, its often neat fast and fun but it has its limits, that when the command lines comes in real handy. Enjoy
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby AK Dave on Wed Feb 11, 2009 3:31 am

When I got back to Linux after years not using it, the GUI was handy. But the first time I had an "issue" I discovered that fixing the problem through the GUI was not only convoluted, but hard for anyone to explain without twenty seven eight-by-ten color glossy pictures with circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back of each one explaining what each one was (thanks, Arlo). But a single line of text to cut-paste into the terminal often solved the same problem.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby FedoraRefugee on Wed Feb 11, 2009 9:08 am

Guest wrote:
FedoraRefugee wrote:Can I ask a stupid question?

Exactly who is arguing for command line usage here?


To me its like having a passenger car and a truck. The car will get you around most of the time but when you have to move that load of manure its good to have the truck. A GUI is similar, its often neat fast and fun but it has its limits, that when the command lines comes in real handy. Enjoy


Yes!

And Dave, yes, I agree completely.

But you both miss my point to ahogg. Once again yet another poster wants to carry an argument that some of us (me, Fred, Dave...) are against GUI or easy. It makes me wonder if my long winded posts are actually read or if they are quickly skimmed and key words picked out. Unfortunately, this is the way I write, you need to comprehend the whole paragraph for the key idea. No one is trying to say we need to get rid of GUI tools. To the contrary, that is why I use Mint. I am a GUI guy. Does this mean I do not use the CLI? Of course not. Oftentimes it is much easier to use the terminal.

I argue with ahogg on that one point, when giving directions in a forum it is ALWAYS easier to post a couple lines of code then it is to give GUI directions. It is infinitely more precise, there is very little chance for error in translation/comprehension, and you can argue all you like but it is much easier in execution. Just open a terminal and copy and paste. Instead of running all over menus hunting particular tools with a mouse. It is also much cleaner to copy these little code instruction blocks and paste them into a OO.o or text file and save them in a folder for later use. I have a folder in my /data that is called "terminal commands" but also contains shell scripts and other useful tidbits going back years. Everything from mounting a drive, enabling midi, and locking down a file to rebuilding a yum cache.

The main problem that most of these newer folks do not recognize is that your preceptions change as you grow in Linux (hopefully you grow and do not remain at the basic level). I used to think much like many of you. I wanted Linux to rule the world, I wanted Linux to come to me and not have to work to grow to Linux. Your views will change after a few years, trust me. :D
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby ronnoc on Wed Feb 11, 2009 1:33 pm

AK Dave wrote:So which of you two is going to volunteer to do this?


aviynw wrote:I never said I had the expertise to do it. I sense from your comment you think it is ungrateful of us to make a requests like this when we are not contributing an equal share to the distribution. Just because someone makes a request doesn't mean they are not grateful. Neither of us were demanding it or claimed that the mint devs owe us it. It was simply a request.


The best of both worlds is, in reality, to have three things:

    * An active Mint community that has this distro's best interests at heart and continuously tries to find new ways to make it better.

    * A team of volunteers who share the same passions and can lend themselves to help facilitate the desired improvements. I have seen many positive changes in this area over the last year with artwork, mint tools, and community-driven projects like the Newsletter, Podcasts, etc.

    * Any lastly, something many more of us can do (present company included) is contribute a few dollars. If every active board participant sponsored even $1 a month, we could make a big difference. I will look to do this starting next month =)

But really the point is, we should encourage suggestions even if they are not practical at this point in time. We all want Mint to succeed.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby AK Dave on Wed Feb 11, 2009 2:17 pm

But we do encourage suggestions.

All I was doing that started this flurry of discontention was to point out, quite reasonably I thought, that the two specific suggestions made (while totally valid) would be best handled by the respective application development teams and not Mint.
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Re: Two improvements for Mint - It must be done!

Postby ronnoc on Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:02 pm

AK Dave wrote:But we do encourage suggestions.

All I was doing that started this flurry of discontention was to point out, quite reasonably I thought, that the two specific suggestions made (while totally valid) would be best handled by the respective application development teams and not Mint.


You did. I was simple taking the opportunity to make sure no one mis-understood, as well as to list (again) things we can all do to make Mint better in the long run =)
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