Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

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Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby vortexmak on Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:19 am

I dont know if its just me but Ive tried Linux tens of times, right from Red Hat 3 to Mint GNOME and Mint KDE but I cant find a single advantage of sticking to Linux.

Nautilus is too simplistic and despite Dolphin having lots of features, I still have to come back to Windows to do stuff.
Just in case Im missing something, I have the following gripes with the system... do you seasoned guys face the same problem or you use a solution?

1. No send to option ...
2. The folders do show thumbnails but theres no provision for reading folder.jpg
3. No custom views based on folder types like there is in Windows 7 .. i.e. different views for Photos , Videos, Documents.. etc
4. How do I see the disk usage of all drives as is visible in My Computer ?
5. There is not a single program comparable to one note .. I just want to copy images and text but Basket Notepad cant copy both at the same time
6. Still cant get Mouse gestures to work in KDE
7. KDE feels slow when compared to Windows
8. If someone sends a link in Kopete, instead of opening it up in Firefox, it saves the link to the system then opens it up. Thats just lame
9. The system gets too hot when Im using Linux, dont know why, maybe the power management features are not that good.

How can people whine Windows is buggy and virus prone .. I never had a single virus since 3-4 years back.. KDE Plasma crashes a lot, i have seen explorer crash only once. I have seen windows BSOD's only twice since Ive been using XP. I have yet to see a BSOD in Win 7

No voice chat application ..
I had heard a lot about Amarok and Songbird.. they are nothing in terms of simplicity and cusotmisability compared to foobar
Had to go through hoops just to get Picasa working but no video support.

I wanted to learn Linux but now I think that I can never do that, since what works on one Distro/DE doesnt work on another, each Distro is like a different OS. I guess the best I can do is learn the general UNIX commands and shell scripting

(PS: I had to boot Windows to post this, as whenever I clicked the submit button in FF linux it just asked me to save the post.php page)
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby exploder on Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:26 am

Good luck with Windows! :)
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby feed3 on Sun Feb 21, 2010 11:01 am

3. No custom views based on folder types like there is in Windows 7 .. i.e. different views for Photos , Videos, Documents.. etc


You can set it manually, right click on the folder, click on the icon and choose whichever icon you want to use.
If you want it to be set automatically by dolphin itself, not sure. maybe an expert of mint can help.

4. How do I see the disk usage of all drives as is visible in My Computer ?


"My computer" is for win. But, you can easily know how much free space available by tuning some setting in dolphin and it will show you at status bar(if it ain't set up by default)
a- open dolphin
b- setting -> configure dolphin
c- choose "general" from the left pane, choose tab status bar, check the box for "show space info"

7. KDE feels slow when compared to Windows


It's just not true for me. Not because of i'm inside linux mint forum not in the wins' forum, but it is because mint just run much faster than xp in my machine. Yes, win 7 seems faster but after a while, it became slow. FYI, i'm triple booting win xp sp3, win 7 x64 ultimate and mint helena kde x64. Yes, once in a while i had to boot to my win to get things done as it can only be done from my win, but that's the reason why i'm multi booting right now. Nothing is perfect, even for wins, not even for linux.

8. If someone sends a link in Kopete, instead of opening it up in Firefox, it saves the link to the system then opens it up. Thats just lame


Dont know about that, am using pidgin and no big issues for me so far.

9. The system gets too hot when Im using Linux, dont know why, maybe the power management features are not that good.


Try to configure the power management setting to fit your needs. System setting -> advance -> power management. (in kde) but, as far as i know, the default setting isn't going to use your resources to the max as the cpu is set to dynamic even for the perfomance profile.

How can people whine Windows is buggy and virus prone .. I never had a single virus since 3-4 years back.. KDE Plasma crashes a lot, i have seen explorer crash only once. I have seen windows BSOD's only twice since Ive been using XP. I have yet to see a BSOD in Win 7


You will get infected EASILY if you doesnt corncern on how the virus/malware is spreaded and most people dont. They simply double click on their usb drive which have autorun.exe of the virus in it and so on.. They dont even know how to "see" if they system is infected or not by virus (see the task manager for running process, see the hidden files and folders for suspicious thing such as Name_Of_Folder.exe and so on). well, not all but most of my friends were like that. :-p

I wanted to learn Linux but now I think that I can never do that, since what works on one Distro/DE doesnt work on another, each Distro is like a different OS. I guess the best I can do is learn the general UNIX commands and shell scripting


Sorry if my words are harsh for you but if you want to learn it, you wont posting things like this but instead, you will try to get helps. I don't even have my own computer back then when i learn linux for the first time (at that time, trying using slax killbil, knoppix and backtrack 2 and using it on my workstation at my workplace. so, imagine it..) :-)

For your other points, i leave it to the experts here. My advice, if you want to learn linux, try to enjoy it. Try to enjoy every moments of learning it as much as you can, when there's nothing to do anymore with it, nothing to try anymore, nothing to fix anymore, then it is the "doomsday" for me. Such a boring life to go through when you dont have any "toys" to play around. But, as you know, there's always a different opinions among the others.
Cheers. :-)
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby exploder on Sun Feb 21, 2010 11:15 am

feed3, you have more patience than I do! Just the tone of the original post made me want to say, "see ya" to the original poster.
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby Carl on Sun Feb 21, 2010 11:28 am

exploder wrote:feed3, you have more patience than I do! Just the tone of the original post made me want to say, "see ya" to the original poster.


Agreed I have very little time left for "I'm going back to windows" or "sayonara Linux" although I have the greatest respect for people who do :wink:
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby rec9140 on Sun Feb 21, 2010 11:36 am

vortexmak wrote:I dont know if its just me but Ive tried Linux tens of times, right from Red Hat 3 to Mint GNOME and Mint KDE but I cant find a single advantage of sticking to Linux.


Nautilus is too simplistic and despite Dolphin having lots of features, I still have to come back to Windows to do stuff.
Just in case Im missing something, I have the following gripes with the system... do you seasoned guys face the same problem or you use a solution?


don't use them. I only deal with KDE, so this will only address what works on KDE.... For KDE the file manager is Konqueror, same as your browser.

vortexmak wrote: 1. No send to option ...


Just a matter of adding what you want, example:
http://www.kde-forum.org/artikel/14019/ ... -menu.html


vortexmak wrote:2. The folders do show thumbnails but theres no provision for reading folder.jpg


Where in KDE are you trying to read this or even get this? Open Konqueror, put /home/mint (for the live DVD) in the URL, hit enter. click the view above and change the view mode... when you hover over an image it will show a preview..

If this is in anything other than KDE or Konqi, I have no idea what your referring to.


vortexmak wrote:3. No custom views based on folder types like there is in Windows 7 .. i.e. different views for Photos , Videos, Documents.. etc


Set them up, in Konqueror, View Mode, Select a view mode and then customize it, then save it, then you can pick that mode.

vortexmak wrote:4. How do I see the disk usage of all drives as is visible in My Computer ?


Filelight, from the menu or Run command. See attachment.

vortexmak wrote:5. There is not a single program comparable to one note .. I just want to copy images and text but Basket Notepad cant copy both at the same time


Don't know what this one note is or what it does over CTRL-V and CTRL-C just like that and most other os's copies images and text... I do it daily... Want a snapshot on the screen hit the PrtScrn button, NOT SHIFT PrtScrn just PrtScrn that runs KSnapshot and you can copy a region or window, see the attachment, thats how I got that..

vortexmak wrote:6. Still cant get Mouse gestures to work in KDE


Far as I know they don't exist in KDE... I don't use them, but I don't ever remember them being added to the OS as a whole.

vortexmak wrote:7. KDE feels slow when compared to Windows


I would disagree, vehemently, and can a test that KDE 3.x has run on a clunker AMD K6 that barely could run w*censored*s 95 with 2MB RAM, and a junky 64MB video card, FAR MORE EFFECTIVELY than any version of that other os.....

Depends on if your using KDE 4.x or a the STABLE RELIABLE KDE 3.5.10...

First, off disable, if KDE 4.x

1) Plasma and plamoids
2) ALL EFFECTS, that means turn off the "composting" features.

Second is this on a Live DVD environment or a installed version? The DVD will have times where it is MUCH slower than a real installed version.

vortexmak wrote:8. If someone sends a link in Kopete, instead of opening it up in Firefox, it saves the link to the system then opens it up. Thats just lame


First set, your default browser to the correct browser for KDE, Konqueror, then retry.... I don't use Kopete or any other similar programs, so don't know their behavior. I don't think its "lame" Linux works differently than other OS's.

vortexmak wrote:9. The system gets too hot when Im using Linux, dont know why, maybe the power management features are not that good.


Is this a laptop? How old? Then you may need to adjust the power management settings, if its plugged in, the default does not use an power management options, or it could be an incompatibility between Linux and your power management features.

vortexmak wrote:How can people whine Windows is buggy and virus prone .. I never had a single virus since 3-4 years back.. KDE Plasma crashes a lot, i have seen explorer crash only once. I have seen windows BSOD's only twice since Ive been using XP. I have yet to see a BSOD in Win 7


Because it is... this or that virus - w OS, this or that 100,000 bot net - > w os... this or that hack... ie: google -> w os....


vortexmak wrote:No voice chat application ..


Don't use em.. I use a voice chat device -> telephone :) ... I've seen mention that skype works in Linux.... maybe thats what you want... run synaptic and install it.

vortexmak wrote:I had heard a lot about Amarok and Songbird.. they are nothing in terms of simplicity and cusotmisability compared to foobar


Amarok rocks at least in KDE 3.5.10 (will need to use KMint Elyssa to use) is outstanding... whats the issues with Amarok... what simplicity and customization are you looking for? Can't speak to songbird... or foobar... as foobar in means a whole different thing , and spelled different, to me and probably a few others ... :) You want minimal try VLC... its already on KMint 8

vortexmak wrote:Had to go through hoops just to get Picasa working but no video support.


Don't use it, so others will need to chime in... but video support to do what? google wants to embrace Linux only in the terms of it saving it $$$$ on an OS to run its servrs, but when it comes to support for Linux with their programs and services... they kick Linux to the curb.....

vortexmak wrote:I wanted to learn Linux but now I think that I can never do that, since what works on one Distro/DE doesnt work on another, each Distro is like a different OS. I guess the best I can do is learn the general UNIX commands and shell scripting


Some things via the GUI work differently, thats why you need to find a GUI or X Window Manger or just X that you like KDE, or what ever it is... then you can focus on that.... most have the same options just in different places, not unlike that other OS that moves things around a little on each upgrade.

Learning the shell/CLI, as well as scripting, but remember you can have scripts for the shell in python, bash, tcl, tsch,perl, and more!

You need to understand that Linux is a different OS and some things don't work the same as another OS, thankfully. There are a lot of things that do especially in the GUI side, as the "standard" has been set, and wasting time trying to change this is just that a waste of time.
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby monkeyboy on Sun Feb 21, 2010 12:37 pm

Simply put (again) Linux is not Windows and if you won't of can't learn another way be happy with your Microsoft choice. So on behalf of the million of daily Linux users worldwide I wish you luck.
If you don't like it, make something better
If you can't make something better, adapt
If you can't do either ball your panties up and cry.

Complaining is like masticating most anyone can do it.
However doing it in public is really hardcore.
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby travelinrob on Mon Feb 22, 2010 1:45 am

@monkeyboy- 'No matter where you go, there you are.'
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby feed3 on Mon Feb 22, 2010 2:11 am

exploder wrote:feed3, you have more patience than I do! Just the tone of the original post made me want to say, "see ya" to the original poster.


:lol: To be honest, if i ain't take some break and clear my head out before posting that post, i might be yelling at vortexmak for some uneducated "facts" on the post. :evil:
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby vortexmak on Mon Feb 22, 2010 7:33 am

My apologies to everyone ... I did re-read my post and I agree the tone should have been different.
It's just that I had been continuously at Linux trying to install Picasa on Wine, configure KDE mouse gestures, trying to get Basket Notepad to work properly and when I put in an SD card in my laptop's card reader to copy some mp3 files to the card, the system didn't copy anything, displaying some permission related messages. i just got so angry and frustrated, I switched back to windows to copy the stuff and that's when I wrote the post, I suppose some of my anger crept in.

i guess I had bitten off more than I could chew, I suppose I'll take it slower and switch back and forth as and when required.

feed3, rec9140, thanks a lot for taking the time to address each of my whines. I really appreciate you taking the time. Having no documentation compounds the problem.

I didn't start with Konqueror and KDE 3.5 cause 4.x with Dolphin is how its going to be in the future, so no use sticking to old technology.

I suppose the philosophy of Linux is for a multiuser terminal based system, not the single user desktop that we use.
For example, I think, the users data is given less importance. its just the linux filesystem that is given importance. I have all my documents, videos etc on different partitions but the system is only concerned with the home folder.

Is there any way to send global keyboard shortcuts to any Wine application even when it is not active ?

One more problem I am having is while posting messages to this forum from within Linux. Firefox always asks to save the post.php page instead of actually submitting the post.

Thanks again for taking the time.
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby BrianD on Mon Feb 22, 2010 2:53 pm

I always read these sorts of "questions" (in reality, they're parting shots, more often than not!) in the same vein as this:

I am an expert automobile driver, having driven the same 1968 Volkswagen Beetle since before I could legally drive on the roadways. I have heard all the uproar about these new-fangled Vauxhalls, Ferraris, etc, so I decided to try one out last weekend. Here are the reasons I'm returning this gawd-awful piece of junk to the dealership:

1) Water coolling?? really? ...with our planet running low on resources, you want me to use water for the engine to run efficiently? pfft.

2) Horrendous gas mileage! 12 mpg??? seriously? I can easily get 30 mpg in my Beetle, and in fact had to switch back to my Beetle to drive to the gas station to fetch more gasoline for this so-called "sports car".

3) The engine's in the wrong place!! I opened up the back, and there's barely enough room to store the t-tops, and no sign of an engine whatsoever. This thing is an excellent example of what happens when your engineering students do not complete their homework.

4) Acceleration is outlandishly sensitive. It seems like I'm exceeding the speed limit on the local roadways after travelling only a few hundred feet. In my trusty Volkswagen, I can only exceed the speed limit on very windy days, when I'm on a long, straight, downhill run. ...and, even then, only barely.

5) Outrageously expensive parts, even for routine "home mechanic" type repairs! ...the tires on this thing barely lasted through the weekend, and now the dealership expects me to purchase new ones (at over $300 apiece!!) before they'll consider taking the car back. I've had the same tires on my Beetle since 1987, and they cost me $12.00 each.




;)

PS: No offense intended to any Volkswagen (or, for that matter, Vauxhall, Ferrari, Lambourghini, etc!!) owners.



PPS: I installed Linux Mint 7 (Gloria) on my Dell Inspiron D400 notebook, dual-booting with Windows XP Professional / SP2. The XP install, including partitioning/formatting the entire 80G drive, took 1 hour and 34 minutes. There was no support for video (640x480 VGA only), no ethernet, no wireless, no bluetooth, and no audio. The Linux Mint install, including re-partitioning/shrinking/formatting a good chunk of the 80G drive, ...including booting into the LiveCD and then clicking the "Install on HD" icon on the desktop, took 22 minutes. Everything worked, right out of the box. 1024x768 24-bit video, ethernet, wireless, bluetooth, and audio all "just worked." In fact, I could see the 20G Windows partition, so I mounted it and then downloaded and copied the Dell drivers to the Windows desktop so that I could install them under XP once (if I ever, hahaha) boot into the Windows XP partition again.

PPPS: This is my first post on this forum. I've been a Linux Mint user for a little over a week. I've been a Linux user for a little over a lifetime. ;)
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby hemimaniac on Mon Feb 22, 2010 3:10 pm

LMAO BrianD

Thanks
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby Aging Technogeek on Mon Feb 22, 2010 10:56 pm

vortexmak said,

It's just that I had been continuously at Linux trying to install Picasa on Wine


Why? Picasa is on the Featured Applications list in Software Manager. Just click and it is downloaded and installed.
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby Aboroth on Wed Feb 24, 2010 3:44 pm

Personally, I can't stand using Windows, because of one thing. And that is...

Newly created windows get keyboard focus. That is freaking RETARDED.

On more than one occasion I have hit "Enter" while typing something important right as the dialog box asking me to restart the computer for updates comes onto the screen.

Who in their right mind thought that was a good idea? If you want the user to pay attention to it, fine; you can put it up on the screen without keyboard focus to force the user to see it. But to promote *unintential input* to occur? That is just stupid.

There is no way to make windows not do that, at least up through XP; it is hard-coded into the kernel. I'm pretty sure in Vista too, and probably Windows 7.

That is such horrible UI design, it is unbelievable.
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby vortexmak on Thu Feb 25, 2010 4:56 pm

Tallahassee .. i.e. BrianD

Car analogy was funny, but an irrelevant mock nevertheless.
i don't know about anyone else because everyone must have tweaked their linux systems but to me the default setup felt sluggish.
Comparing to Windows XP is not really fair since its a very old OS, Linux on the other hand gets updated quite frequently. You would'nt have needed any drivers if you had used Windows 7.

Aboroth ..

The focus problem was present in XP and could be minimized using some tweaks. Windows 7 no longer has this problem.

Guys ... I'm not trying to sing praises for Windows here, I just used the examples in my original post to give an idea of the functionality I was missing.

Coming back to Linux ... any ideas why I cant post on this forum using Firefox ? It always shows a Save dialog. If I cant post on the forum I cant ask solutions to the problems from within Linux.


Could you give me names of some feature rich File Managers which have functionality similar to or more than the Windows 7 file explorer ?
This would help me narrow down the applications I need to try out.

Thanks
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby DrHu on Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:11 pm

vortexmak wrote:I dont know if its just me but Ive tried Linux tens of times, right from Red Hat 3 to Mint GNOME and Mint KDE but I cant find a single advantage of sticking to Linux.

I cant find a single advantage of sticking to Linux
It's you, it must be
  • Choice
  • Free Choice; no vendor lock-in
  • Covers all or most of the application needs of users, excepting windows gamers; dos games are covered, as well as various game console emulators, SNES
  • The whole list, which is of course subjective, just like preferring windows or Apple OS-X is
    --and I can't piece together that whole list

vortexmak wrote:How can people whine Windows is buggy and virus prone .. I never had a single virus since 3-4 years back.. KDE Plasma crashes a lot, i have seen explorer crash only once. I have seen windows BSOD's only twice since Ive been using XP. I have yet to see a BSOD in Win 7

I never had a single virus since 3-4 years back.
And do you still feel you need (feel safer ) with an anti-virus, anti-spyware product suite, either from Microsoft or the OEMS, who started that product line..
http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/ ... al_new_bug
--it doesn't go away with new SP or patches or bug fixes

How can people whine Windows is buggy and virus prone ..
Because it is: both buggy and virus prone, just keep checking on IE (Internet Explorer) bugs
http://www.pcworld.com/article/127065/b ... ffice.html
--since you mentioned windows XP
I don't as windows has improved quite a bit through the various OS purchases required of users; vendor lock-in
    WinXp pro was pretty stable, NT was even OK, and Win7 is just an evolutionary step after the Vista problems..

One item that tended to crash Windows OS was their need to have the kernel include graphic driver code (the video driver was in the kernel), and until the driver issues were worked out, kernel crashes (BSOD) were fairly common
--unfortunately Linux had to adopt the same policy, but in Linux case, since they have no clout with OEMs, like Nvidia or ATI, they had to, as those vendors only supply binary files for inclusion to the various Linux distributions..

The rest of your commentary is simply a rant of why Linux doesn't look like windows
--you probably will agree with those pundits (PCWorld ) etc who have columns every so often declaring Linux as unfit for the desktop or not there yet! and so on

They decry the abundance of choice within Linux, and point to the manufacturers desktop look/functions as built and the only choice if you have that OS, windows or MAC: the same deal.
    --unless you would be thinking, changing the skin color or adding an extension to the explorer (file manager) desktop is actually a choice, instead of a slight design change.

vortexmak wrote:Could you give me names of some feature rich File Managers which have functionality similar to or more than the Windows 7 file explorer

Sorry, I wouldn't know where to start the comparison, I don't think much of windows explorer as a file manager

Sure, if you actually want a file manager (something than can find files quickly and edit them
In Gnome desktop, Gnome commander
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNOME_Commander
--if you have used windows that long, you might be familiar with XTree file management. Of course it works fastest because the keyboard (not the mouse) is the focus tool
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XTree
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison ... e_managers
Last edited by DrHu on Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:54 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby rec9140 on Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:31 pm

vortexmak wrote:Coming back to Linux ... any ideas why I cant post on this forum using Firefox ? It always shows a Save dialog. If I cant post on the forum I cant ask solutions to the problems from within Linux.


Use Konqueror.

vortexmak wrote:Could you give me names of some feature rich File Managers which have functionality similar to or more than the Windows 7 file explorer ?
This would help me narrow down the applications I need to try out.


What features are you looking for... as Konqueror has all the file management features I want and desire.. I have no idea what the other OS offers.
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby mick55 on Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:35 pm

I cant find a single advantage of sticking to Linux.

Then obviously Linux is not for you.

There's no point trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.
If it doesn't work for you, then it doesn't.
Don't worry about it and move on.

For me, the move away from Windows was due to their Draconian EULA,
- not a burning desire to learn a new Operating System.

After mucking around with the "easy" Linux distros,
I found that what I really wanted was a super stable platform,
irrespective of the huge learning curve.

I am extremely glad I expended the effort because both Debian and
Slackware give me everything I require, and I could never
return to the conditions imposed by Microsoft.

Linux is not a religion, and I am not here to convert you.

Good Luck
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby vortexmak on Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:36 pm

rec9140 wrote:
Use Konqueror.


Strangely, I always thought most of the people using Linux would be using Firefox.

Hasn't the KDE dev team already dropped Konqueror and kept Dolphin as the file manager from 4.x ?
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Re: Tried GNOME , KDE ... looks like its back to Windows

Postby rec9140 on Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:54 pm

vortexmak wrote:Strangely, I always thought most of the people using Linux would be using Firefox.


I don't use it, can't stand it.

vortexmak wrote:Hasn't the KDE dev team already dropped Konqueror and kept Dolphin as the file manager from 4.x ?


No. Konqi is alive and well... I don't know where this stupid dolphin came from in 4.x, never heard of it till then, and I don't care to hear about it or know about, and it got turned into sliced fish food with the tuna's thats fine with me.
Julep....mixing.....KDE Done right, and minty.
http://www.juleplinux.com

Its been a great 3 year run! Thanks for the fish.. but time for new waters....
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