Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

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wayne128

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by wayne128 »

Jolicoeur wrote:Should a new person to Mint choose the Debian or the Mint 9 versions?
i would think this applied to me, having used Mint9 for several months with smooth sailing and LMDE with some rough stuff over just a few days:
1. if this is first time you are switching to Linux, the answer is Mint 9
2. if you do not understand how to partition a drive, do not understand how to handle this "/", then you may be alright to run LMDE with live CD without installation. Installation would be a challenge to you until you get over the partition and /.

whereas, for Mint9, what you really need to remember is to choose 'install side by side' at some point and you do not (yet) need to understand partition, and /.

3. You would also need to handle some editing of configuration in order to be able to browse Network file sharing.

hope this helps
Murdock

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by Murdock »

starrfleat wrote:I installed Linux Mint Debian on my Acer Aspire 9410 laptop, a 32 bit PC. Impressive O/S. My laptop now compares favorably with my DELL Optiplex 745 duo core desktop. Whips around the internet so well on the included Firefox, I don't feel a need to install the Google Chrome browser, or any other. In time, I might install the WINE version of Internet Explorer for those pesky sites which don't cooperate well with Firefox, or any other non-IE browser.
To help this O/S draw more people away from Windwoes, I'd echo the requests of others. It would be great to have the Broadcom FWCutter driver installed when you install everything else. It would be so much easier to not have to haul my laptop to the other end of the house with my desktop, just to plug in the FIOS wire so I could download and run the Debian version of the driver, which seems to need to be connected to complete installation. Needless to say, I have a wireless card in my laptop, altho I could run with a FIOS plug-in wire. My desktop is currently on that, however.
I, too, would prefer to have GDEBI installed. I downloaded and installed it myself, but having it already installed conveniently gives me the option of just hunting down software not listed in the Synaptic "directory". Just get the Debian version of something, and let GDEBI handle dependencies, etc.
Much thanks for Linux Mint Debian. Now I may be able to run my laptop until it crumbles, without having to settle for a highly stripped down O/S just to get speed and performance out of it. :mrgreen:
Try out Vector Linux Gold and specify XFCE on old hardware like that. It flies.
red-e-made
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Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by red-e-made »

Derp.
Last edited by red-e-made on Sun Sep 26, 2010 11:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
red-e-made
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Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by red-e-made »

craig10x wrote:regular Mint 9...either gnome or kde versions....This debian version is in the Research and Development beginnings and is for the advanced who love to do lots of tinkering....it's not smooth and polished like the ubuntu/kubuntu based regular Mint versions...Moving away from an ubuntu base means they have to figure out all kinds of things to plug into it that normally are done in ubuntu to begin with...bug fixes, tweaks...all kinds of stuff...and mint has a small staff and have to work on the main versions at the same time, so expect a LONG LONG time for this to get to where they want it to go...

maybe a year from now, it might be newbie friendly...but right now? uh uh... :wink:
I'm ... really not seeing it. Using the same exact same machine to run both Mint 9 and Mint Debian, here are the two core differences I found:

1. Mint Debian takes a bit longer to start up. (45s to sign in, then 20s to fully loaded desktop, as opposed to 25s/10s with Mint 9).
2. Upon installation, having to run three commands in the Terminal to get Nvidia set up, and installing all the compiz* stuff, which takes all of 30 seconds to do. But this is only done one time.

Honestly, I think a lot of people just read the word "Debian" and get nervous. The fact is, the Mint Team did a great job in making this noob-friendly, and I say this as someone who still has no idea what the grep command is all about.

In short, Mint Debian has no more "tech savvy" requirements than Mint 9 did. At least when I used the same machine to run two different distros. YMMV. But I think this vague "it won't be ready for a year" blanket statement that doesn't even offer specific examples is a bit hasty, fwiw.
Lady Quindecim

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by Lady Quindecim »

In fairness to the "Debian not being nu-bee friendly," The way the questions were presented for the initial partition set was different. If you are used to Mint from about 6 on, that may have seemed weird. I don't know, maybe earlier.

But I remember the first few times I was changing up the way I set up my partitions, there was some trial and error and reading up here and there.

It used to not be easy at all if you did not understand mountpoints, fstab, etc, but we have gotten so used to how easy Ubuntu has made things, that even a little "Oh, wait, what was that question again?" people think it is hard.

It is still WAY easy to set things up on the hardware I have. If you are not sure, put a VM on your Windows box and try it a few times. I think I can install any MInt several times over for what it takes to install Win, so the messing around is worth it, even if you just want to understand Isadora better.

Over all, I like the LMDE. I will be happy if/when we get LXDE 64. Don't be afraid of it! It is all okay!
craig10x

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by craig10x »

Well, some examples of "not newbie friendly at this point" are things like: the installer (doesn't offer the simple option of wiping your drive and doing a 100% drive install or place "side by side" (50/50) with the currently installed distro....such as the standard Mint edition has...

Simple things like gdebi not being installed by default...The touchpad "tap" being shut off and having to be turned on (should be default)...
The poor debian font rendering requiring artistic tinkering (instead of having great font rendering "out of the box" like the ubuntu/kubuntu based versions)...not having Chromium available on debian (should be available through Mint in that case)...I've also heard people having problems getting certain programs to work properly which run smooth and "out of the box" on the standard editions....etc etc

And of course, when debian testing which i heard is currently "frozen" for stable... unfreezes their updates...you don't know yet how things will respond (possible breakage) so Mint team might have to do some tweaking with that i would imagine, as well...

maybe a year down the road is a bit overblowing it, but they say the goal is to get it as smooth and out of the box as the standard editions, and don't forget their small team has to work on those editions as well! So, that will mean a slow go i believe...hope i am wrong but i am just looking at it with a "conservative" eye....

Also, since coming to Mint..i initially was only into Gnome but have now fallen for KDE :lol:
So, i suspect until it gets to the point where there is a KDE 64 bit version, that is as smooth, great looking and as polished as Mint 9 KDE... i've got a LOOOONG WAIT :wink:
Last edited by craig10x on Sun Sep 26, 2010 10:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
red-e-made
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Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by red-e-made »

A lot of these things are easily taken care of through a quick Google search - much like starting out with any other distro for the first time (gdebi not installed, for example: dpkg -i [filename.deb]) and Chrome for Linux is in the Package Manager. And so on. I think that having come from the Ubuntu-based Mint, we of course see these "rough edges", but I'm not really seeing a steeper learning curve anyway.

Having said that, yes, I agree the font thing is bothersome. I've had to install several different Japanese character font sets, as opposed to getting them all in one. But yeah. If you're trying Linux for the first time, LMDE and Mint 9 have similar levels of "stuff to learn", in my opinion, with rougher edges being more noticeable if you're used to the Ubuntu build.

EDIT: By the by, is there a bug report thread for this? Because MintUpdate only seems to be working if I manually open it and refresh it. Otherwise it just shows "your system is up to date" in the panel all the time.
secipolla

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by secipolla »

red-e-made wrote:By the by, is there a bug report thread for this? Because MintUpdate only seems to be working if I manually open it and refresh it. Otherwise it just shows "your system is up to date" in the panel all the time.
http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.p ... 64#p314764
red-e-made
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Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by red-e-made »

secipolla wrote:
red-e-made wrote:By the by, is there a bug report thread for this? Because MintUpdate only seems to be working if I manually open it and refresh it. Otherwise it just shows "your system is up to date" in the panel all the time.
http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.p ... 64#p314764
Thanks!
dpcdpc11

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by dpcdpc11 »

congrats on this release... still rough around the edges but it's ok...
one problem for me though: PPPOE via DSL doesn't seem to work... I've been trying out this from the live CD... can I do something to make it work?
secipolla

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by secipolla »

dpcdpc11 wrote:congrats on this release... still rough around the edges but it's ok...
one problem for me though: PPPOE via DSL doesn't seem to work... I've been trying out this from the live CD... can I do something to make it work?
It came with a little flaw in its ppp package. To fix it, see http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=141&t=55320 (second post may be simpler).
dpcdpc11

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by dpcdpc11 »

thanks for the reply... I'll wait for another Mint Debian release to download to my USB stick and test it.
Jaia

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by Jaia »

This version of Linux is the best out there. No doubt.
Fast! Very user friendly. And still so debian based that I almost forget I'm using mint.
You have created the best of both worlds!

Thank you so much for this! :D
Cheers!
z06gal

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by z06gal »

Is anybody having trouble activating your wireless drivers? I can't seem to figure that out. Thanks.


Robin
Glenn101

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by Glenn101 »

I am a Debian fan from way back and still occasionally will install a stock Debian distribution. I am more of a bleeding edge user and often will have three or four different installations on my main computer. There might be some kind of fetish involved here, but my psychologist had an accident some time back and no longer is able to help me.
I have been using Sidux for some time but it has has its own bumps lately. I have never liked Ubuntu. I am not dissing it. It must have something that others like. The main problem I have is that the packages are not compatible with the base Debian distribution. My feeling is that such a distribution should retain compatibility and concentrate on the user experience rather than reinventing the wheel with every package.
When I read about a version of LinuxMint based on the stock Debian system, I decided to give it a try. I am using it now as I type. I installed XFCE4 as my window manager over gnome or KDE. I went with XFCE when KDE released its first version of KDE4 as a stable release when it was almost unuseable. For me it still hasn't made it back to the very user friendly product that it had become in the 3.xxx series. XFCE does everything I need it to do, and does it well, and quickly. I will probably never go back to KDE unless there is something really compelling.
Right now, I plan to use LinuxMint Debian for my work horse. I hope that it is not dropped because I really like it. The installation was a breeze. Getting XFCE installed was easy also. Apt-get has to be the best ever package manager. There are several good front ends for it, but I still opt for synaptic across all of my installations because it is familiar and serves me well.

Thanks to all of the LinuxMint developers.

Glenn
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Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by ilanesh »

How very sad, that you went over to Debian and left ubuntu, the instaoll from the new linux mint debian is impossible to install, this is not for newbies at all anymore.
Ubuntu by all means is the most userfriendly distro, AND THE INSTALLER IS SO WONDERFUL and easy, and now beuatyful linux mint went over to horrible user unfriendly debian distro. The installer is horrible, impossible to know what to do.
I am so disapointe. Very sad.
ruscook

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by ruscook »

ikey wrote:
ilanesh wrote:How very sad, that you went over to Debian and left ubuntu, the instaoll from the new linux mint debian is impossible to install, this is not for newbies at all anymore.
Ubuntu by all means is the most userfriendly distro, AND THE INSTALLER IS SO WONDERFUL and easy, and now beuatyful linux mint went over to horrible user unfriendly debian distro. The installer is horrible, impossible to know what to do.
I am so disapointe. Very sad.
  • We never "left Ubuntu"
  • LMDE is a separate edition (you'd know this if you read the notes)
  • The other editions will continue as normal, based on Ubuntu (you'd know this if you read the notes)
  • Ubiquity (the Ubuntu installer) suffers many bugs too
  • live-installer (the LMDE installer) is not impossible, otherwise how would people be using LMDE?
  • LMDE is user-friendly, it just doesn't hold your hand, (you'd know this if you read the notes)
Please do not think I'm criticising you, you're making highly ill-informed comments.
If you had an issue with something then please discuss it in a mature manner.
I love LMDE! I moved from Ubuntu to Arch because of bloatware. LMDE is a nicely packaged, responsive system. Please keep up the good work, thanks
deleted

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by deleted »

Hmmm... I was a newbie and specifically chose Debian about 8 years ago. (Then kanotix and sidux when I needed 64 bits). I chose it for 2 (well 3 reasons). 1) rolling release 2) 25000 pre-built packages 3) stability. I think Debian had a bad rep of being hard and unfriendly. I didn't find it that way then and it certainly isn't that way now.
-Hinto
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Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by kmb42vt »

Just thought I share this: :mrgreen:
"Humph. Choice, it is the quintessential Linux delusion, simultaneously the source of it's greatest strength, and it's greatest weakness." (All apologies to The Architect)
Jesse654

Re: Linux Mint Debian (201009) released!

Post by Jesse654 »

secipolla wrote:When you run update-grub, grub reads its configuration files, checks other installed systems and recreates /boot/grub/grub.cfg
That happens in all systems that have grub2 but you can only "see" the results for the system that has its grub installed to the MBR.
What confused you is that whenever grub (package grub-pc) is updated it installs itself to the MBR (I think this happens if it was originally installed to the MBR). So say you had grub2 from LM9 installed to the MBR, then you installed LMDE and overwrote the MBR again. When your grub-pc is updated in LM9 (not update-grub but an update to the package) it installs itself to the MBR again and then you get a new grub screen. If grub-pc is later on updated in LMDE it does the same and that may have confused you.
Yes, I believe the grub package was updated (last) with LMDE. And, yes, you are correct, the results confused me. :)
secipolla wrote:If the grub in the MBR is from LMDE and you run update-grub in LM9 you won't see any difference in the grub screen until you run update-grub in LMDE and it detects the changed grub.cfg in LM9.
Aha! That is quite useful information. So...if I wanted to tinker with grub options for, say, my second installed system, I'd have to go into the 2nd system, change the grub file, update-grub there, then reboot to the 3rd (LMDE), update-grub again, then reboot to the 2nd to analyze any changes. What a PITN! OTOH I'm learning a lot about grub.

And if one of my systems updates grub again...I better keep a look out for which one.
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