Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

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Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby Mereyub on Sun Mar 27, 2011 2:14 am

1st I'm new and this is my 1st post: Also New to Linux
Okay - I want to wrap my mind around this issue so i understand it correctly.
I was looking at Ubuntu and heard about the changes, I also heard a lot of people are not happy about it.
So if Linux Mint is based off of Ubuntu then will the changes effect Linux Mint future as well? if Not Please tell me why it wont .

I also know about Linux Mint Debian edition - Which version should i try 1st Linux Mint Debian or Linux Mint 10
and if you have time a small reason to why.

Thank You and God Bless
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby kvv on Sun Mar 27, 2011 2:59 am

Hello and welcome.

1. Linux Mint is going to use Gnome 3 in it's next release according to it's main developer Clem. It won't ship Gnome Shell by default but it will most likely be available in the repo.

2. About Ubuntu's move to Wayland there is nothing official yet even from Canonical. From what I have seen but Linux Mint doesn't rush changes wherever possible.

3. LMDE is a rolling distribution and is considered to be more stable, many here will tell you to use it if you are comfortable with linux. However, I prefer the main, mostly because of the ppas and the helpful ubuntu community, plus it's more noob friendly. :)

Edit: In case none of it made sense to you (since I am not sure if you are new to Linux), Ubuntu and other linux distributions are going through huge changes in their user interface, mostly to make it prettier for casual users. Linux Mint will most likely wait for things to stabilize before adopting those changes.
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby Mereyub on Sun Mar 27, 2011 3:21 am

Thank You - and Yes i am new to Linux - I have poked around a bit and i know how to install but that's about it.
So GNome 3 is not the same as GNome - I'm thinking that G3 is some sort of framework?

Well I guess i will try Linux Mint 10 and see how that Go's :D
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby neernitt on Sun Mar 27, 2011 3:36 am

I will recommend to use linux mint 10 gnome. da best Os I ever watched :D
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby kvv on Sun Mar 27, 2011 4:09 am

Mereyub wrote:So GNome 3 is not the same as GNome - I'm thinking that G3 is some sort of framework?

Well I guess i will try Linux Mint 10 and see how that Go's :D


Yes, currently Ubuntu, Linux Mint, Fedora use the Gnome 2 desktop framework so to speak. Ubuntu will be splitting away from Gnome in it's next release and is going to use the Unity shell which is built upon Gnome 2 framework, where as Fedora is using the Gnome shell with Gnome 3, all of which is very new. You can check for Gnome Shell and Unity shell videos on youtube if you want to.

Linux Mint is sticking with the current UI but with Gnome 3. So I would say that Mint is your safest option for now. :)
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby Mereyub on Sun Mar 27, 2011 5:03 am

There was something else i was reading i cant remember what it was - but it was about Ubuntu Changing something that would cause it not to be as compatible with as much hardware as it is now.
Would this type of change effect Linux Mint or would it be a case of Linux Mint although based on Ubuntu is not complete bond to it - Is my thinking right?
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby AlbertP on Sun Mar 27, 2011 8:08 am

Linux Mint will keep using a normal Gnome with a panel - I guess you can download Unity from the Software/Package Manager from version 11 on, and probably also Gnome Shell.
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby Jix on Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:01 am

Mereyub wrote:There was something else i was reading i cant remember what it was - but it was about Ubuntu Changing something that would cause it not to be as compatible with as much hardware as it is now.


I think Unity needs OpenGL to run. Most ATI cards aren't supported on Linux. They have to be emulated and that means OpenGL doesn't work in those cases. A weird choice from their part, if you ask me.
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby neernitt on Sun Mar 27, 2011 12:02 pm

Is there any way to upgrade gnome 2 to gnome 3 in julia?
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby AlbertP on Sun Mar 27, 2011 12:43 pm

There is a PPA on Launchpad with Gnome 3. You can add it using this terminal command:
Code: Select all
sudo add-apt-repository ppa:gnome3-team/gnome3


EDIT: These instructions are intended for Ubuntu 11.04
Last edited by proxima_centauri on Tue Apr 19, 2011 2:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Edited to specify that these instructions are for Ubuntu 11.04 only
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby Mereyub on Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:04 pm

Mereyub wrote:There was something else i was reading i cant remember what it was - but it was about Ubuntu Changing something that would cause it not to be as compatible with as much hardware as it is now.
Would this type of change effect Linux Mint or would it be a case of Linux Mint although based on Ubuntu is not complete bond to it - Is my thinking right?



Hey I remember What it was - It was something called Wayland - what will this mean is this what will limit hardware compatibility
Will this effect Linux Mint?
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby neernitt on Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:01 am

thanx albert :D
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby tyhee88 on Tue Mar 29, 2011 10:27 pm

I have a different suggestion of a distribution to start.

My suggestion is Linux Mint 9, because:

1. It's a great distribution;
2. I think it will be the longest supported Mint version still using Gnome 2;
3. As an LTS release it rates to be slightly more stable and reliable than LM 10, and potentially quite a bit more stable and reliable than LMDE;
4. It gets the extra hardware compatibility that Ubuntu brings;
5. Did I mention-it's a great distribution?

This isn't anything against LM 10 or LMDE, both of which I understand are great releases (I've used LMDE on a testing machine and loved it, but haven't tried LM 10)-but in this coming period of uncertainty in Gnome, and the base Ubuntu change to Unity, there's a fair bit to be said for the extra security and longer support period of an LTS release.
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby linuxviolin on Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:28 pm

kvv wrote:Linux Mint is sticking with the current UI but with Gnome 3.

AlbertP wrote:Linux Mint will keep using a normal Gnome with a panel

It seems so, maybe... The same UI? :? But the 'fallback mode' of GNOME 3 is not a real-like GNOME 2 mode. E.g.:

GNOME 3 also support a 'fallback mode' in which we run gnome-panel, metacity and notification-daemon instead of GNOME Shell. Note that this mode is not a 'Classic GNOME' mode; the panel configuration will be adjusted to be similar to the shell.

(From the Fedora site about Fedora 15 Alpha)

You have also for instance no right click option on the desktop... And this 'fallback mode' is not officially supported, I guess. And GNOME 2 and its components "will not receive new releases after GNOME 3 is released." (From the GNOME 3 web site)

You can read a few thoughts Fedora's Martin Sourada writes on Blogspot:

There's substantial difference between KDE 4.0 and GNOME 3.0 release -- while KDE 4.0 was just a premature release, GNOME 3.0 is broken by design. No amount of minor releases can fix that. ... Unless you want a highly usable open-source software for tablet, GNOME 3 probably isn't for you.

Or read "another GNOME user who goes under the name of Jack Dostoevsky vents his frustrations on Reddit":

GNOME Shell does not work on dual monitors. There is no easy way to make changes to GNOME Shell. There is no minimize button unless you enable it through gconf-editor. Where are my places? There is no easy way to go back to Gnome 'classic'.

There is no easy way to go back to Gnome 'classic.' At least that I can see. I've been fiddling with this all for a couple hours now, and only just before writing this lengthy diatribe did I attempt to move back to Gnome 2 (it appears that gnome-panel 2.91 is installed, but I'm not yet sure if that's a functional part of Gnome Shell, or if there's some way for me to get to it). There is no option at the login menu for me to choose my shell. I could probably force it to do what I want, but (in my mind) I want desktop software that makes it relatively easy to do what I want it to do. I generally leave the command line kung-fu at for server work. There is mention of 'Gnome classic' in the Alpha release notes, but a point is made that it's not actually a 'gnome classic' but more a resource-unintensive mode for lower powered machines.

OK, these are about Fedora but the same may be applied to others GNOME distros, maybe... :roll:

EDIT:

From Adam Williamson:

GNOME 3's fallback mode is not 'GNOME 2 style'. It exists to be used on systems which cannot run GNOME Shell for technical reasons - same deal as Unity 2D. It's intended to function as similarly to Shell as is practically possible; although it uses gnome-panel and metacity, you can't expect it to work the way these components did in GNOME 2. Where practical it will be tweaked to work more like Shell.
Last edited by linuxviolin on Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby AlbertP on Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:32 pm

I do not know the exact details - only that Linux Mint 11 will not use the complete Gnome Shell by default.
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby linuxviolin on Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:42 pm

AlbertP wrote:I do not know the exact details - only that Linux Mint 11 will not use the complete Gnome Shell by default.

I heard that, yes, but I'm waiting to see how this will be done. And this could be *perhaps* possible but maybe just in early versions, at the beginning... I fear. (So, maybe in Mint 11 but and after?) :roll:
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby Mereyub on Thu Mar 31, 2011 1:47 am

So from all that i have been reading here it seem like a good idea to start with Linux Mint 9 LTS for the support and the Gnome 2
But keep My eye on Ubuntu and Linux Mint to see what the future may turn out to be

But i would really like to know if Ubuntu just disappeared one day would that Mean that Linux Mint would be dead to
or is that why Debian is in play as well :?:
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby Koffeehaus on Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:03 am

Okay, Linux Mint 11 will use Gnome 3 under gtk2 UI. how will that work? Will there at all be any cosmetic differences or will the change be mainly under th hood?
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby Koffeehaus on Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:14 am

Mereyub wrote:So from all that i have been reading here it seem like a good idea to start with Linux Mint 9 LTS for the support and the Gnome 2
But keep My eye on Ubuntu and Linux Mint to see what the future may turn out to be


Well, Linux Mint 10 looks nicer, from the eye-candy perspective. Plus it has an advanced menu. Overall, user experience is way better on m10 than on m9. So, I'd re-recommend you back to linuxMint 10 Julia :D

But i would really like to know if Ubuntu just disappeared one day would that Mean that Linux Mint would be dead to
or is that why Debian is in play as well :?:


Yes, if Ubuntu disappears Mint Main Edition would disappear as well as every new Mint edition is based upon respective Ubuntu Edition. So think of it this way, if Ubuntu is a Mercedes, then Mint is a Brabus. No Merc - no Brabus.

Debian edition might still be around though.

While alternative scenario is - technically Ubuntu can't disappear completely - more likely it will be the Canonical (the company behind Ubuntu) - So, if Ubuntu would be no longer supported - most of it's users would migrate to other Ubuntu- Based distros, and Mint would be the first choice for many. This way Mint would simply enlarge its user/developer pool.
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Re: Ubuntu Changes, Will Linux Mint as Well?

Postby Mereyub on Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:53 am

Do you think Canonical would ever do that? - I'm still trying to wrap my mind around open code and how Linux or Distros of Linux get worked on and developed -
Do the folks at Canonical mind if other Linux Distros are based on them?
Is there a chance that Linux Mint could ever - lets say separate from Ubuntu and become its own Canonical?
or am i thinking of this wrong. :?:
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