UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby ketoth on Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:48 pm

sobrus wrote:UP5 seems to be still changing.
Yesterday I've noticed Mate 1.4 on my test machine (great!).
So additional tests are needed, I think.

Yes, but UP5 can't be postponed again and again and again.. It was scheduled for release 2 weeks ago, basically :mrgreen:
But I won't complain too much, since we gonna stick with it for 6 months. Gotta be stable.
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby BostonPeng on Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:52 pm

ketoth wrote:
sobrus wrote:UP5 seems to be still changing.
Yesterday I've noticed Mate 1.4 on my test machine (great!).
So additional tests are needed, I think.

Yes, but UP5 can't be postponed again and again and again.. It was scheduled for release 2 weeks ago, basically :mrgreen:
But I won't complain too much, since we gonna stick with it for 6 months. Gotta be stable.

Don't forget, release dates for Mint are never set in stone. Generally there aren't announced release dates for Mint because each release is scheduled for "when it's ready." Let the *buntu folks fight with the calendar, we prefer clem gets it right first and not have to ship fixes to so many known issues. 8)
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby ptruchon on Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:04 pm

BostonPeng wrote: Generally [...] each release is scheduled for "when it's ready." Let the *buntu folks fight with the calendar, we prefer clem gets it right first and not have to ship fixes to so many known issues. 8)


Hear Hear! My latest partition satisfies my need for a stable, primary system, while my incoming partition satisfies my curiosity and desire to tinker, play, and break things. You guys take all the time you need! I'm gonna reboot now and head over to incoming to see what's new. :wink:
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby Joelito on Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:21 pm

I prefer the "is ready when is ready" philosophy... :)
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby sobrus on Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:44 pm

Releasing UP5 in current state would probably result in a *huge* disaster.
Why?
Because incoming doesn't contain fglrx driver (for unknown reasons - there is fglrx 12.6 in debian testing, in debian sid, and newest version 12.9 supports even x.org 1.13 and kernel 3.5).

Mint team have to be absolutely sure UP5 won't hurt anyone. And almost all Radeon users, including me, would have their system messed up (probably).

If you are very impatient you can enable apt-pinning and get some stuff from sid :)

That said, I find it preety strange to use "rolling" distribution that is "rolling" every 5-6 months or so. Ubuntu release cycle is almost the same, yet it receives updates every day.
I'm not complaining, I know it involves lot of work, but smaller updates every months would be probably better...
But LMDE is best distro I've ever used anyway :)
(but I can change my mind if I receive UP5 without fglrx :P)
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby BostonPeng on Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:01 pm

sobrus wrote:That said, I find it preety strange to use "rolling" distribution that is "rolling" every 5-6 months or so. Ubuntu release cycle is almost the same, yet it receives updates every day.
I'm not complaining, I know it involves lot of work, but smaller updates every months would be probably better...

LMDE hasn't been a true rolling release distro for some time. I don't recall when the change was made but they now refer to LMDE as a semi-rolling release that brings in updates on a semi-regular basis and pushes them out in upgrade packs. If you want a true rolling release you can get it a number of ways, including pointing your repos at Debian Sid itself or going with SolusOS (the guys at mintCast talked to the SolusOS developer back in March).

There was some grousing when LMDE stopped being a true rolling release but it's generally accepted as a good move in light of how few people are actually working on LMDE, plus Clem's workload with the main releases coming out every six months. I wouldn't mind a true rolling release but it's a ton of work and I'm not in a position to pitch in too much so I'm glad to be able to run the unofficial LMDE KDE respin. All in all it's all good.
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby maxibuntu on Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:30 pm

Please, stick to the ready when ready philosophy. Debian Testing is in freeze and still has 600 bugs to be resolved, so what's the hurry? The longer we wait, the more bugs will be resolved. Anyone wanting a true rolling dist can simply point to the Debian repos.

Apart from the nvidia driver issues that I reported in this thread everything is running just fine here (for now I wont update the nvidia stuff).
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby mockturtl on Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:06 pm

sobrus wrote:Releasing UP5 in current state would probably result in a *huge* disaster.
Why?
Because incoming doesn't contain fglrx driver (for unknown reasons - there is fglrx 12.6 in debian testing, in debian sid, and newest version 12.9 supports even x.org 1.13 and kernel 3.5).
fglrx was removed from the debian testing repo.

Code: Select all
#671320
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2012 18:53:44 +0200
Source: fglrx-driver
Binary: fglrx-driver libfglrx libxvbaw1 libxvbaw-dev libgl1-fglrx-glx fglrx-glx fglrx-glx-ia32 libfglrx-ia32 fglrx-modules-dkms fglrx-source fglrx-control fglrx-atieventsd amd-opencl-icd amd-libopencl1 amd-opencl-dev amd-clinfo
Version: 1:12-6~beta-1
Distribution: unstable

Changes:
 fglrx-driver (1:12-6~beta-1) unstable; urgency=low
 ...
   [ Patrick Matthäi ]
   * New upstream beta release.
     - Support for RadeonHD older than 5xxx are dropped!
       Namely the following series have been removed:
       - RadeonHD 2000
       - RadeonHD 3000
       - RadeonHD 4000
       So we close bug reports where only these older ASICs are involved. Users
       affected by this should switch to the free radeon driver.
       Closes: #672519
     - Support for Xserver 1.12 added, but there are people already reporting
       that Xorg segfaults with this driver, we hope this will be solved in the
       future.
       Closes: #671320


This workaround pins the kernel and X from UP4.

Patrick's blog indicates the 64-bit xorg crash is fixed in sid (12-6+point1), with support for discontinued cards (2000/3000/4000 series) via fglrx-legacy-driver in experimental.

EDIT: fglrx has finally migrated to debian testing; see below
Last edited by mockturtl on Sun Sep 16, 2012 2:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby melbo on Fri Sep 14, 2012 9:34 pm

Ran a test UP 5 and it choked on vmware usbarbitrator error

Edit: fixed with http://communities.vmware.com/thread/337769

The rest was flawless
Last edited by melbo on Sat Sep 15, 2012 5:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby sobrus on Sat Sep 15, 2012 7:17 am

mockturtl wrote:fglrx was removed from the debian testing repo.


I know it was removed due to x.org 1.12 incompatibility.
But it is compatible since june and back in sid (you're right - not yet in testing)
Since LMDE isn't 100% debian testing, just based on it, it would be good to put it back instead of killing off approx 20-30% of userbase. That would render LMDE distro very ureliable.

It's not that hard to make fglrx deb package (in fact, AMD installer can generate deb or rpm, providing you have all kernel sources installed to compile kernel module).
I'd rather have untested package than none, just becuse it was temporarily removed from debian.

edit: unfortunately t seems like building deb for debian isn't easy. While installer can do this for any debian version - it just doesn't work. I get some "file not found" errors.
I don't know if I am missing something, or it is just broken. Kernel sources installed. It always worked flawlessy on suse :(

edit2: fglrx in wheezy?
http://www.linux-dev.org/2012/08/debian ... rx-driver/
http://packages.debian.org/wheezy/fglrx-driver
If it works, please include it in LMDE
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby jasmineaura on Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:30 am

sobrus wrote:edit2: fglrx in wheezy?
http://www.linux-dev.org/2012/08/debian ... rx-driver/
http://packages.debian.org/wheezy/fglrx-driver
If it works, please include it in LMDE


Yep, it's back in testing. But even the (un)official AMD/fglrx wiki's Debian page isn't quite up-to-date (even though it was last updated 2/Sep) and gives the impression that it is impossible on Debian Wheezy or even Sid till said date, but there's a reference to the Discussion page, which I looked at , especially the part about "xserver 1.12.3-1 rumored to address the segfaults". So I went crazy 6 days ago and updated through sid (xserver-xorg-core 1.12.3.902-1 with fglrx-driver 12-6+point-1) because it wasn't in Wheezy yet, and a day later I updated (end of) the discussion page to confirm it works. My only gripe was that after switching to the iGPU in CCC and restarting X to put it in effect, X wouldn't start, complaining that it can't find the fglrx module. This is cukoo because it really should be loading the intel module instead. Apparently, it doesn't change xorg.conf, but somehow masks fglrx. Removing xorg.conf and restarting X gets you back to the intel. aticonfig --initial to recreate xorg.conf and get back on fglrx. Would probably be worth retesting now that I have rolled back to pure LMDE and updated to UP5.

sobrus wrote:Since LMDE isn't 100% debian testing, just based on it, it would be good to put it back instead of killing off approx 20-30% of userbase. That would render LMDE distro very ureliable.


From what I know, LMDE "latest" is a bit more conservative in terms of updates than Debian testing. And fglrx was only available in Unstable, at least till 5 days ago when I last checked. So it is still quite fresh in testing. But personally, I think it is more stable and better performing than previous versions, especially given it is a point release, and would likely to be included in *hopefully* coming days. Still, I don't think it's beyond the average LMDE user to get it by (at least temporarily) adding testing to their apt/sources.list

sobrus wrote:edit: unfortunately t seems like building deb for debian isn't easy. While installer can do this for any debian version - it just doesn't work. I get some "file not found" errors.
I don't know if I am missing something, or it is just broken. Kernel sources installed. It always worked flawlessy on suse :(

Also from reading the brief notes in discussion page, it sounds like it hasn't worked since 2009!!! Yikes :P
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby sobrus on Sun Sep 16, 2012 11:33 am

jasmineaura wrote: Still, I don't think it's beyond the average LMDE user to get it by (at least temporarily) adding testing to their apt/sources.list

Yep, I'm also thinking on getting testing/sid version in case of emergency through apt-pinning.
But I don't think it's an elegant and supported method (for example mintupdate doesn't like mixed lmde/debian sources.list).
So I hope Clem will work it out somehow. I like stability of LMDE, so really don't wanna mess with my repos.

And wouldn't it be quite stupid to wait months for super-stable, well tested UP5 update... that just doesn't work? No .. it just can't be this way...

jasmineaura wrote:
Also from reading the brief notes in discussion page, it sounds like it hasn't worked since 2009!!! Yikes :P

so much for building my own packages....
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby jasmineaura on Sun Sep 16, 2012 11:36 am

Prior to UP5, gpointing-device-settings was integrated in mint-menu, when installed, but would show as another "Mouse" entry under preferences.
After UP5, it isn't in mint-menu no longer, due to "OnlyShowIn=GNOME;" line in /usr/share/applications/gpointing-device-settings.desktop , which also changes the name to "Pointing devices".
Without it, many novice users who don't know about it would probably have a hard time configuring touch-pads and some various commonly-used properties like palm-detection, any combination of continuous-edge/circular/edge+two-finger scrolling, as these options are not available through the mouse properties integrated in Mint's Control Centre.
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby BostonPeng on Sun Sep 16, 2012 11:42 am

Snagged UP5 on the KDE LMDE respin and despite having the download interrupted when I had to log off yesterday (a problem with using Starbucks' free wifi in a busy store) it seems to have gone swimmingly. I'm not seeing any problems yet, although I did just complete the du an hour or so ago.
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby naughty_bit on Sun Sep 16, 2012 1:59 pm

1. Print Screen no longer works, it spits out "No command 33 has been defined"
2. Lock screen shows Linux Mint default wallpaper instead of the current one. [FIXED]
3. No gui for Gnome Startup services available.
4. Network manager wireless icon doesn't show up every time and the connected network is not shown in the list. However it does show as icon only that wired is established although it is not.
5. Hitting Alt+Ctrl+Del opens a window with following error message: There was an error running gnome-system-monitor: Failed to execute child process "gnome-system-monitor" (No such file or directory) [FIXED]

NEW:
6. After installing meta cinnamon and meta mate there are lots of repeated shortcuts related to gnome/cinnamon/mate.
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby maxibuntu on Sun Sep 16, 2012 3:27 pm

naughty_bit wrote:1. Print Screen no longer works, it spits out "No command 33 has been defined"


Do a google search on "No command 33 has been defined" and you'll find that some other distros have this bug too. I think it is a metacity bug. I had this error message with UP4/Gnome3 also. I tried to fix this in gconf-editor /apps/metacity/keybinding_commands/command_screenshot with content String "xfce4-screenshooter" (I use xfce4-screenshooter but for gnome you can should use gnome-screenshot). That got rid of the error message, however xfce4-screenshooter does not launch at all...

naughty_bit wrote:3. No gui for Gnome Startup services available.


There is. It is in package gnome-session-bin. The command is gnome-session-properties. However the XDG entry in /usr/share/applications/session-properties.desktop has "NoDisplay=true" and is hidden by default (why?!).

Put this in ~/.local/share/applications/session-properties.desktop:

Code: Select all
[Desktop Entry]
Type=Application
Icon=session-properties
Categories=System;
Name=Startup Applications
Comment=Choose which applications to start when you log in
Exec=gnome-session-properties


On a sidenote, Gnome3 is still buggy as hell, I recommend XFCE...
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby jasmineaura on Mon Sep 17, 2012 4:38 am

ptruchon wrote:
BostonPeng wrote: Generally [...] each release is scheduled for "when it's ready." Let the *buntu folks fight with the calendar, we prefer clem gets it right first and not have to ship fixes to so many known issues. 8)


Hear Hear! My latest partition satisfies my need for a stable, primary system, while my incoming partition satisfies my curiosity and desire to tinker, play, and break things. You guys take all the time you need! I'm gonna reboot now and head over to incoming to see what's new. :wink:


With /var/cache/apt/archives/ symlinked to a shared store? ;)
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby clem on Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:13 am

Thanks for your feedback everyone... there's a lot of support questions in here so I had to filter through and ignore most of the posts unfortunately. UP5 was synced this morning into latest and we've only just noticed the fact that fglrx was missing... so we're in a bit of a hurry now, and trying to add these drivers back in.

Many thanks to sobrus for flagging this issue. We added warnings in the UP info and on the blog and we'll get these in ASAP.
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby Trapper on Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:22 am

My MintUpdater checks for updates via a cron job every day and does not have any difficulty downloading package info. Today, though, it's going bezerk when trying to offer Update Pack 5, I have something quite strange going on. My update manager has updates available but fails to download a lot of package information. It does inform me 1400+ updates are available but NONE are authenticated. Synaptic also chokes on downloading package information and nothing available is authenticated. I am really unsure about updating even with 1412 packages being offered because of errors shown by the updater. Should I continue waiting?

Here are my repos:

Code: Select all
deb http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian main upstream import
deb http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest testing main contrib non-free
deb http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/security testing/updates main contrib non-free
deb http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/multimedia testing main non-free


Here's the error blurp I get from Mint Update:

Code: Select all
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/testing/Release.gpg  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/security/dists/testing/updates/Release.gpg  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/multimedia/dists/testing/Release.gpg  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/testing/main/binary-i386/Packages  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/testing/contrib/binary-i386/Packages  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/testing/non-free/binary-i386/Packages  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/testing/contrib/i18n/Translation-en_US  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/testing/contrib/i18n/Translation-en  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/testing/main/i18n/Translation-en_US  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/testing/main/i18n/Translation-en  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/testing/non-free/i18n/Translation-en_US  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/testing/non-free/i18n/Translation-en  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/security/dists/testing/updates/main/binary-i386/Packages  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/security/dists/testing/updates/contrib/binary-i386/Packages  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/security/dists/testing/updates/non-free/binary-i386/Packages  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/security/dists/testing/updates/contrib/i18n/Translation-en_US  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/security/dists/testing/updates/contrib/i18n/Translation-en  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/security/dists/testing/updates/main/i18n/Translation-en_US  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/security/dists/testing/updates/main/i18n/Translation-en  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/security/dists/testing/updates/non-free/i18n/Translation-en_US  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/security/dists/testing/updates/non-free/i18n/Translation-en  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/multimedia/dists/testing/main/binary-i386/Packages  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/multimedia/dists/testing/non-free/binary-i386/Packages  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/multimedia/dists/testing/main/i18n/Translation-en_US  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/multimedia/dists/testing/main/i18n/Translation-en  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/multimedia/dists/testing/non-free/i18n/Translation-en_US  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/multimedia/dists/testing/non-free/i18n/Translation-en  Unable to connect to debian.linuxmint.com:http:
Some index files failed to download. They have been ignored, or old ones used instead.
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Re: UPDATE PACK 5 FEEDBACK THREAD

Postby clem on Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:23 am

fglrx drivers added.

trapper, switch to another mirror.
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