Installing LMDE with earlier packages

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Installing LMDE with earlier packages

Postby meztek on Thu Nov 21, 2013 9:28 pm

I know that LMDE is a rolling release, so there are no release demarcations per se, but I made the foolish decision to apt-get upgrade and dist-upgrade on a machine with rather specialized software on it. I know that everything worked fine when I installed LMDE earlier this year in June. Is there any way I can either roll back a current install, or install LMDE and have the installer use the "most recent" packages from a specified date such as, say, 10 June 2013? I am really in trouble if I cannot roll back to that time. I should never have upgraded my packages.

In case this has been discussed before, I did try to search for anyone else having this problem and did not find anything. If I missed something, please direct me to where I can figure out this problem.
At least, I *think* I know what I am doing.
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Re: Installing LMDE with earlier packages

Postby Monsta on Fri Nov 22, 2013 12:28 pm

There's no way to roll back unless you made a backup copy of the partition (e.g. with Clonezilla) beforehand.
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Re: Installing LMDE with earlier packages

Postby meztek on Fri Nov 22, 2013 3:39 pm

I can't even roll back my apt-get upgrade and dist-upgrade? This seems like a big problem with a rolling release system. Suddenly my system is seriously dysfunctional because of an update and I cannot undo the change that caused it.

In the future, should I just not upgrade packages in bulk, or is there a better way to ensure that nothing breaks?
At least, I *think* I know what I am doing.
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Re: Installing LMDE with earlier packages

Postby Monsta on Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:02 pm

meztek wrote:I can't even roll back my apt-get upgrade and dist-upgrade?

Roll back to where?

meztek wrote:This seems like a big problem with a rolling release system.

This doesn't have anything to do with rolling releases. You would get the same result in Ubuntu.

meztek wrote:Suddenly my system is seriously dysfunctional because of an update

Well, you can create a thread describing what's broken, and someone may help you fixing it.

meztek wrote:In the future, should I just not upgrade packages in bulk, or is there a better way to ensure that nothing breaks?

LMDE should always be upgraded "in bulk". Breakages do happen though. If you want to be absolutely sure nothing breaks on the next update, don't use LMDE. Switch to Debian Stable or Mint 13 (LTS).
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Re: Installing LMDE with earlier packages

Postby meztek on Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:36 pm

Monsta wrote:Roll back to where?

Oh, sorry, that might not have been clear. I did an apt-get upgrade and an apt-get dist-upgrade, and some things stopped working. While I could try and figure out what is going wrong, I would much rather just roll back to the point before I did the upgrade. I have looked around and this does not seem to be possible unless, as you mentioned, I backed up the install partition.

Monsta wrote:This doesn't have anything to do with rolling releases. You would get the same result in Ubuntu.

I am not saying package breakage is a problem. I actually came from Debian, by the way. Either way, what I mean is that if I had a problem with a package upgrade in, say, Mint 13, I would have the option to just re-install Mint 13 from the disk. I know this is not how you are "supposed to" solve problems, but as a university student I do not always have time to investigate problems and try to solve them.

Monsta wrote:Well, you can create a thread describing what's broken, and someone may help you fixing it.

I think I will try that, thanks. If it is a software problem due to an upgrade, which board would be most appropriate for me to post it in? Update/Upgrade Issues, or Software & Applications?

Monsta wrote:LMDE should always be upgraded "in bulk". Breakages do happen though. If you want to be absolutely sure nothing breaks on the next update, don't use LMDE. Switch to Debian Stable or Mint 13 (LTS).

So you are saying that I was not incorrect in upgrading everything? I just want to make sure. I have gone back and forth about whether or not I should be running frequent apt-get upgrades over the years.

So, what is the difference between the updates in Mint 13 and the updates to LMDE that make LMDE a rolling distribution?
At least, I *think* I know what I am doing.
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Re: Installing LMDE with earlier packages

Postby Monsta on Fri Nov 22, 2013 6:00 pm

meztek wrote:Either way, what I mean is that if I had a problem with a package upgrade in, say, Mint 13, I would have the option to just re-install Mint 13 from the disk.

You can reinstall LMDE from the disk, why not?

meztek wrote:If it is a software problem due to an upgrade, which board would be most appropriate for me to post it in? Update/Upgrade Issues, or Software & Applications?

Update/Upgrade Issues.

meztek wrote:So, what is the difference between the updates in Mint 13 and the updates to LMDE that make LMDE a rolling distribution?

In Mint 13, you will almost never get a newer upstream version of any package, only the minor updates/security bugfixes provided by the Ubuntu maintainers. (They have several newer kernel versions backported there, though.)
In LMDE, the whole system is updated when the new Update Pack is released and you apply the updates. You get a new kernel, new system libs, new apps, new everything. And new bugs, of course. :D

Technically, LMDE is not a rolling distro like, for example, Arch Linux. The Update Packs are based on the frozen snapshots of Debian Testing repositories. The "rolling" here is only from one snapshot to another.
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Re: Installing LMDE with earlier packages

Postby meztek on Mon Dec 02, 2013 4:51 pm

Monsta wrote:You can reinstall LMDE from the disk, why not?

I could, but I am saying that if I reinstall Mint 13 from the disk I get the same Mint 13 that I had when I first installed it. If I install LMDE from the disk I get the most recent rolling release. Suppose in 2010 I imaged a system with Mint 5 and at the same time another system with LMDE. If I reinstall Mint 5 now, as far as I am aware it would have the same or mostly the same packages that it did in 2010, whereas LMDE would be installed with the latest packages available in the repositories. Is this thinking incorrect?

Monsta wrote:In Mint 13, you will almost never get a newer upstream version of any package, only the minor updates/security bugfixes provided by the Ubuntu maintainers. (They have several newer kernel versions backported there, though.)
In LMDE, the whole system is updated when the new Update Pack is released and you apply the updates. You get a new kernel, new system libs, new apps, new everything. And new bugs, of course. :D

So it seems Mint 13 is a much better choice for me. I want a system that will remain the same for a while until I image with the next release in the future. At first I thought I would really like a rolling release. I am not so sure it is for me though. Thanks for helping clear this up for me.
At least, I *think* I know what I am doing.
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Re: Installing LMDE with earlier packages

Postby Monsta on Tue Dec 03, 2013 3:01 am

Yes, it's a good choice if you need a stable system with minimal changes and a good support period (5 years). And if you'll need some newer software, you can always use PPAs for that.
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