LMDE BREAKAGES - tracking TESTING

[Lippy]

That makes sense. I've just updated Zukitwo, though it turned out that it made the problem worse. Some applications (such as those using tabs) would crash, and I still had glitches in the theme. So there may be a bigger problem underlying all this. I've just downgraded Unico back to 1.0.1 and all is fine again, even with the newer version of the Zukitwo theme.

So it looks like the problem is with Unico after all.

[GeneC]

More on problems with theming issues.

LMDE Gnome/Cinnamon = tracking testing fully updated.
I'm having the same problems as above (faulty scrollbars, et) , but seemingly worse. Some pop-upboxes (Software Sources, for one). Text disappears, click-on boxes disappear. This is with Zukitwo, Shiki themes. New Zukitwo just crashes.
Gnomish Gray, Gnomish Dark work ok.

Code: Select all

gene@zordon ~ $ apt-cache policy gtk3-engines-unico
gtk3-engines-unico:
  Installed: 1.0.2-1
  Candidate: 1.0.2-1
  Version table:
 *** 1.0.2-1 0
        500 http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

Tried downgrading to gtk3-engines-unico 1.0.1. No fix for me.

[karashata]

I wish I knew how to help, I have not encountered any issues with things crashing or appearing overly incorrectly (there are a few rather minor issues with my themes and the original Zukitwo themes but those are related to the way the themes are written and not to GTK 3.4 or Unico 1.0.2). I have to admit though that I'm tracking SID and experimental fairly closely and there may be packages from either of those repositories that are not yet present in testing that could account for why things are working fine for me.

[GeneC]

karashata

Yes, my SID install has no theme issue, as well. Just in Gnome/Testing.
Both Zukitwo and Shiki work fine there, and I have the same version of unico ( Unico 1.0.2) on both.
Appears to be something else that is the problem.
Not many of us seem to have the problem, or perhaps not many of us are using those themes.

The 'crashing' (perhaps not the best description) with new Zukitwo was that the themed app would open, but immediately close, in a micro second, on its own.
I imagine this will be fixed with upgrades, as Gnome/SID themed Zukitwo has always worked fine.

[zerozero]

Gene, karashata, Lippy,
this is just one of the symptoms of the 3.2 > 3.4 transition that is well documented here
this will (imo) settle down kinda quickly in sid (i see commitment to bring gnome3.4 into the next stable, so they have to worry)
and this info shows the ongoing work to bring gnome3.4/shell/3.4/clutter/cogl

This package is part of the ongoing testing transition known as cogl. Please avoid uploads unrelated to this transition, they would likely delay it and require supplementary work from the release managers. On the other hand, if your package has problems preventing it to migrate to testing, please fix them as soon as possible. You can probably find supplementary information in the debian-release archives or in the corresponding release.debian.org bug. in the clutter PTS page

this means that:

• the sid breakage should be short (or so we hope )
• when these pkgs migrate to testing all this dust should be settled

but this is going to create another problem:

• cinnamon will break
• there won't be any cinnamon update to gain compatibility because that would cinnamon in latest
• (remember here that cinnamon works in lmde with cogl/clutter 1.8.x but not with 1.9.x or higher, the same happens with the v. for maya: works with the latest, but it's incompatible with 1.8.x)
• most probably only post-maya release we will see a new UP to rectify all this

so, TL;DR
gnome 3.4 is coming to testing and we gonna loose cinnamon for some time.

[GeneC]

hey 'zz'

Things have been quite a 'jumble' with Gnome since 3.0x came out.

After 3.4 stabilizes all we have to worry about it 3.5 - 3.6, et.

http://live.gnome.org/ThreePointFive

[zerozero]

Gene, testing is funny
and now this one as well: iceweasel 12 doesn't install in testing because deps on libfontconfig1 (2.9.x) not available yet on testing http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.p ... 50#p576744
(thanks to gothmog123 for figure it out)

[Transitman]

Gene, testing is funny
and now this one as well: iceweasel 12 doesn't install in testing because deps on libfontconfig1 (2.9.x) not available yet on testing

How odd. I've got Iceweasel 13 installed on my Testing setup just fine.

[roger64]

../...

so, TL;DR
gnome 3.4 is coming to testing and we gonna loose cinnamon for some time.

This would set an unacceptable pattern and I can't believe it. I can't imagine Cinnamon, when a default to LM13, breaking with a pulsating frequency as Gnome upgrades. Each upgrade period for Gnome goes through some kind of freeze (UI or code freeze). I imagine this period will allow Cinnamon to catch up. Maybe testing will become a field of adventure but Mint repositories will have to play a protecting role.

On the other hand, Cinnamon users, in other distros than Mint, may experience this kind of periodic failures, even if, for the time being, it has been avoided for example for Ubuntu 12.04

and a matter of fact comment of Clem -27th of April- about Cinnamon's future (and Mate's)

Rüssel Says:
April 27th, 2012 at 7:38 am

Until now I always went back to Linux Mint 10 (Gnome 2) after trying out newer releases. I like the UI and configurability of Gnome 2, and I like the Mint Menu.
But I’m not sure if I will use MATE in the future. I’ve read that MATE is based on old libraries, which may be outdatet. But I am not shure what that means.
Clem, it would be great if you could explain what disadvantages we have to expect by using MATE in the next 2 years, in comparison with Cinnamon.
Thanks for asking us for feedback!

Edit by Clem: That’s a very interesting question and it’s hard to predict where both MATE and Cinnamon will be in 2 years. MATE has two huge advantages over Cinnamon: It doesn’t rely on Gnome, and it uses a stable version of the GTK (version 2 rather than 3). You can see the ongoing trend and the way Gnome Shell is moving towards touch-screen and mobile interfaces. This doesn’t only affect Shell, it affects Mutter, Gnome underneath and to a lesser extent Clutter and GTK3 themselves. If tomorrow these technologies get dumbed down (and there’s a probability they will) and become useless for the usage we have of them (you can see this with the printer config tool already and the gnome center in Mint 12, and you might see this in Mint 13 with Mutter and some GTK apps maximizing themselves by default and hiding their title and menu bars…) we’ll have to replace or fork them. MATE won’t have that problem because it relies on technologies which are mature and which don’t risk changing going forward. Of course Cinnamon, in terms of codebase, is much more flexible than MATE, so we can make it evolve much more rapidly as well. You’ll see new features florish in Cinnamon faster than in MATE, but we’ll probably have to adapt it and protect it against regressions more often than MATE. I hope that answers your question a bit.. it’s a really complicated topic and it’s hard to give a brief answer.. there are a lot of pros and cons associated with both environments, and underneath the cover there are a huge amount of pros and cons associated with GTK2 vs GTK3 and the many libs these desktops are using.

[zerozero]

How odd. I've got Iceweasel 13 installed on my Testing setup just fine.

that is strange what is your

Code: Select all

apt policy iceweasel libfontconfig1

and

Code: Select all

inxi -Sr

[GregE]

This would set an unacceptable pattern and I can't believe it. I can't imagine Cinnamon, when a default to LM13, breaking with a pulsating frequency as Gnome upgrades. Each upgrade period for Gnome goes through some kind of freeze (UI or code freeze). I imagine this period will allow Cinnamon to catch up. Maybe testing will become a field of adventure but Mint repositories will have to play a protecting role.

On the other hand, Cinnamon users, in other distros than Mint, may experience this kind of periodic failures, even if, for the time being, it has been avoided for example for Ubuntu 12.04

Hi, as I understand it Cinnamon will never be a problem for the main edition of Mint nor other distros like Ubuntu. They bring out a release with a set of libs for that version and a version of Cinnamon to match. Then six months later they do it all again. The problem for LMDE is that it is a rolling release and Debian only support Gnome Shell. Debian will push down new versions of Gnome into their repositories because, after all, they are their repositories. Once you step outside the update packs and activate testing then you are on your own. In LMDE you can guarantee that Cinnamon will break every six months or so as new versions of Gnome and GTK3 etc push down. Is there a solution to this? Maybe Clem can write some coding magic that can withstand lib changes and dependencies. Maybe.

I could be glib and say just install Xfce4 and ignore Cinnamon. Or, retreat back to just using Update Packs. If Debian adopted Cinnamon as an option then the updates would then come through their channels and breakages would be rare. The reality is that Debian Testing is a Gnome distribution and their focus is Gnome Shell.

Installing Xfce is a good idea anyway. Having Xfce in reserve in case of failure of Cinnamon or Gnome Shell is just good sense. The Xfce desktop takes up little disk space and sometimes I wonder why I use anything else.

[zerozero]

This would set an unacceptable pattern and I can't believe it. I can't imagine Cinnamon, when a default to LM13, breaking with a pulsating frequency as Gnome upgrades. Each upgrade period for Gnome goes through some kind of freeze (UI or code freeze). I imagine this period will allow Cinnamon to catch up. Maybe testing will become a field of adventure but Mint repositories will have to play a protecting role.

On the other hand, Cinnamon users, in other distros than Mint, may experience this kind of periodic failures, even if, for the time being, it has been avoided for example for Ubuntu 12.04

Hi, as I understand it Cinnamon will never be a problem for the main edition of Mint nor other distros like Ubuntu. They bring out a release with a set of libs for that version and a version of Cinnamon to match. Then six months later they do it all again. The problem for LMDE is that it is a rolling release and Debian only support Gnome Shell. Debian will push down new versions of Gnome into their repositories because, after all, they are their repositories. Once you step outside the update packs and activate testing then you are on your own. In LMDE you can guarantee that Cinnamon will break every six months or so as new versions of Gnome and GTK3 etc push down. Is there a solution to this? Maybe Clem can write some coding magic that can withstand lib changes and dependencies. Maybe.

I could be glib and say just install Xfce4 and ignore Cinnamon. Or, retreat back to just using Update Packs. If Debian adopted Cinnamon as an option then the updates would then come through their channels and breakages would be rare. The reality is that Debian Testing is a Gnome distribution and their focus is Gnome Shell.

Installing Xfce is a good idea anyway. Having Xfce in reserve in case of failure of Cinnamon or Gnome Shell is just good sense. The Xfce desktop takes up little disk space and sometimes I wonder why I use anything else.

just to clarify a couple aspects here:
- cinnamon broke in 12.04 (in the beta cycle) when they pushed 3.4 into the repos;
- was broken for a few weeks, until glebihan (a mint dev) pushed some nightly builds into his ppa;
- only a few days ago we had a stable working cinnamon 12.04 compatible built;
- regarding lmde, as Greg said, once you leave the UP's, you are on your own, these kind of issues won't happen within the UP, when the next one comes out there will be a cinnamon build compatible with whatever is available at that moment in testing;
- tracking testing (or sid) is not the same, you made that option.

[Transitman]

How odd. I've got Iceweasel 13 installed on my Testing setup just fine.

that is strange what is your

Code: Select all

apt policy iceweasel libfontconfig1

and

Code: Select all

inxi -Sr

Here is #1;

Code: Select all

 
apt policy iceweasel libfontconfig1
libfontconfig1:
  Installed: 2.8.0-2.1ubuntu3
  Candidate: 2.8.0-2.1ubuntu3
  Version table:
     2.8.0-3.1 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
 *** 2.8.0-2.1ubuntu3 0
        700 http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian/upstream amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
iceweasel:
  Installed: 13.0~b2-1~bpo60+1
  Candidate: 13.0~b2-1~bpo60+1
  Version table:
 *** 13.0~b2-1~bpo60+1 0
        500 http://mozilla.debian.net/ squeeze-backports/iceweasel-beta amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
     10.0.4esr-2 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages

And #2;

Code: Select all

inxi -Sr
System:    Host uss-columbia Kernel 3.3.0-4.dmz.1-liquorix-amd64 x86_64 (64 bit) Distro Linux Mint Xfce Edition
Repos:     Active apt sources in file: /etc/apt/sources.list
           deb http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian main upstream import backport romeo
           deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing main contrib non-free
           deb-src http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing main contrib non-free
           deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing-proposed-updates main contrib non-free
           deb-src http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing-proposed-updates main contrib non-free
           deb-src http://security.debian.org/ testing/updates main contrib non-free
           deb http://security.debian.org/ testing/updates main contrib non-free
           deb http://www.debian-multimedia.org/ testing main non-free
           deb http://download.virtualbox.org/virtualbox/debian/ wheezy contrib non-free
           deb http://tridex.net/repo/debian/ wheezy main
           deb http://deb.opera.com/opera/ testing non-free
           deb http://deb.opera.com/opera-beta/ testing non-free
           deb http://mozilla.debian.net/ squeeze-backports iceweasel-beta
           deb-src http://mozilla.debian.net/ squeeze-backports iceweasel-beta
           deb http://liquorix.net/debian/ sid main past future
           deb http://packages.mate-desktop.org/repo/debian wheezy main
           deb-src http://packages.mate-desktop.org/repo/debian wheezy main
           deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/screenlets-dev/ppa/ubuntu oneiric main
           deb-src http://ppa.launchpad.net/screenlets-dev/ppa/ubuntu oneiric main
           Active apt sources in file: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/bimsebasse-cinnamonextras.list
           deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/bimsebasse/cinnamonextras/ubuntu oneiric main
           deb-src http://ppa.launchpad.net/bimsebasse/cinnamonextras/ubuntu oneiric main

[rafaeltosta]

About the gtk3-engine-unico breakage: I own two LMDE systems under XFCE, and I can confirm the problem on both.

The solution is to downgrade gtk3-themes-unico back to version 1.0.1, like someone already said.

The exact file is libunico.so, under some folder in /usr/lib.

This sort of thing are always a drag. I'm glad I could solve it kinda soon this time.

Here's a link to get the 1.0.1 version: http://www.ubuntuupdates.org/package/co ... ines-unico

[zerozero]

if you need an older version of a debian package, try debian snapshot
just enter the pkg name in the search-box and all the v. of gtk3-engines-unico

regarding iceweasel, Transitman is right with squeeze-backports iceweasel-beta installs

Code: Select all

amadeu@amadeu ~ $ sudo apt-get install -s -t squeeze-backports iceweasel
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree       
Reading state information... Done
The following packages were automatically installed and are no longer required:
  xdg-user-dirs-gtk libcaca-dev libslang2-dev libkeybinder0 mate-image-viewer
  libmagickcore4 python-keybinder libv8-3.7.12.22 libglew1.6 libmagickwand4
  libmagickcore4-extra libmagick++4 libdirectfb-extra gir1.2-sushi-1.0
  mint-backgrounds-debian libsushi-1.0-0 libtracker-sparql-0.12-0
  libdirectfb-dev libsysfs-dev
Use 'apt-get autoremove' to remove them.
The following extra packages will be installed:
  libmozjs13d xulrunner-13.0
Suggested packages:
  ttf-lyx latex-xft-fonts ttf-mathematica4.1 mozplugger
The following NEW packages will be installed:
  iceweasel libmozjs13d xulrunner-13.0
0 upgraded, 3 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
Inst libmozjs13d (13.0~b2-1~bpo60+1 Debian Mozilla Team:squeeze-backports [amd64])
Inst xulrunner-13.0 (13.0~b2-1~bpo60+1 Debian Mozilla Team:squeeze-backports [amd64])
Inst iceweasel (13.0~b2-1~bpo60+1 Debian Mozilla Team:squeeze-backports [amd64])
Conf libmozjs13d (13.0~b2-1~bpo60+1 Debian Mozilla Team:squeeze-backports [amd64])
Conf xulrunner-13.0 (13.0~b2-1~bpo60+1 Debian Mozilla Team:squeeze-backports [amd64])
Conf iceweasel (13.0~b2-1~bpo60+1 Debian Mozilla Team:squeeze-backports [amd64])

Code: Select all

amadeu@amadeu ~ $ apt policy iceweasel libfontconfig1
libfontconfig1:
  Installed: 2.8.0-3.1
  Candidate: 2.8.0-3.1
  Version table:
 *** 2.8.0-3.1 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
     2.8.0-2.1ubuntu3 0
        500 http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian/upstream amd64 Packages
iceweasel:
  Installed: (none)
  Candidate: 13.0~b2-1~bpo60+1
  Version table:
     13.0~b2-1~bpo60+1 0
        500 http://mozilla.debian.net/ squeeze-backports/iceweasel-beta amd64 Packages
     10.0.4esr-2 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
     9.0.1-1 0
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

[Lippy]

If you use any Gecko-based browsers such as Firefox or Iceweasel, I'd recommend against upgrading libcairo2 to 1.12 for now. It will make the text appear corrupted. From what I can gather, this is not a bug with Cairo itself, but rather the new version exposes a bug in X. So until a fixed version of X is out, the best workaround imo is to keep libcairo2 at 1.10.

[zerozero]

Lippy,
what v. you have installed of

Code: Select all

apt policy xserver-common libcairo2 firefox libfontconfig1

here's mine

Code: Select all

amadeu@amadeu ~ $ apt policy xserver-common libcairo2 firefox libfontconfig1
libcairo2:
  Installed: 1.12.2-1
  Candidate: 1.12.2-1
  Version table:
 *** 1.12.2-1 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
     1.10.2-2ubuntu2 0
        500 http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian/upstream amd64 Packages
libfontconfig1:
  Installed: 2.9.0-3
  Candidate: 2.9.0-3
  Version table:
 *** 2.9.0-3 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
     2.8.0-2.1ubuntu3 0
        500 http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian/upstream amd64 Packages
firefox:
  Installed: 12.0
  Candidate: 12.0
  Version table:
 *** 12.0 0
        500 http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian/import amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
xserver-common:
  Installed: 2:1.11.4-1
  Candidate: 2:1.11.4-1
  Version table:
 *** 2:1.11.4-1 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

and all looks good

[Lippy]

Code: Select all

daniel@friendcomputer:~$ apt policy xserver-common libcairo2 iceweasel libfontconfig1
libcairo2:
  Installed: 1.10.2-7
  Candidate: 1.12.2-1
  Version table:
     1.12.2-1 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
 *** 1.10.2-7 0
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
     1.10.2-2ubuntu2 0
        700 http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian/upstream amd64 Packages
libfontconfig1:
  Installed: 2.9.0-3
  Candidate: 2.9.0-3
  Version table:
 *** 2.9.0-3 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
     2.8.0-2.1ubuntu3 0
        700 http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian/upstream amd64 Packages
iceweasel:
  Installed: 10.0.4esr-2
  Candidate: 10.0.4esr-2
  Version table:
 *** 10.0.4esr-2 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
xserver-common:
  Installed: 2:1.11.4-1
  Candidate: 2:1.11.4-1
  Version table:
 *** 2:1.11.4-1 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

Ah, that's probably why. I'm using Iceweasel instead of Firefox because at one point Iceweasel was at version 8.0 while Firefox was still on 5.0.

Firefox appears to have all its dependencies built-in so it's likely that it's using an earlier version of Cairo. I've downgraded libcairo2 back to 1.10 and all is well with Iceweasel on here now.

[zerozero]

i'm afraid not Lippy compare with this one

Code: Select all

zerozero@debian:~$ apt-cache policy xserver-common libcairo2 iceweasel libfontconfig1
libcairo2:
  Installed: 1.12.2-1
  Candidate: 1.12.2-1
  Version table:
 *** 1.12.2-1 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
libfontconfig1:
  Installed: 2.9.0-3
  Candidate: 2.9.0-3
  Version table:
 *** 2.9.0-3 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
iceweasel:
  Installed: 10.0.4esr-2
  Candidate: 10.0.4esr-2
  Version table:
 *** 10.0.4esr-2 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
xserver-common:
  Installed: 2:1.11.4-1
  Candidate: 2:1.11.4-1
  Version table:
 *** 2:1.11.4-1 0
        500 http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
zerozero@debian:~$ 

we have to see the diff. between the pkgs updated since this happen
debian
lmde

[Lippy]

Hmm... perhaps the problem also depends on the video driver. I think this is the bug: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=666468. I'm currently using the nouveau driver.

Anyway, these are the packages I upgraded before I got the corrupted text problem in Iceweasel:
LMDE DU 09/05

After I noticed the problem, I then downgraded Cairo which I pulled from Mint Latest since that has the previous version (and removed Banshee and its dependencies since I don't use it now), which fixed the problem for me:
LMDE Cairo Downgrade