what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

All Gurus once were Newbies
Forum rules
There are no such things as "stupid" questions. However if you think your question is a bit stupid, then this is the right place for you to post it. Please stick to easy to-the-point questions that you feel people can answer fast. For long and complicated questions prefer the other forums within the support section.
Before you post please read this

what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby varonbondumb on Thu May 12, 2011 1:00 am

3 year Ubuntu user, said 'no' to Unity, fresh to Linux Mint and *loving* it. Ashamed I didn't try it before.

I've read how fast LMDE is and I want to try it, but I've never used Debian and my computer guru friend who recommended Mint to me recommended I stay away from Debian (not specifically LMDE, mind you) since it was a lot rougher than regular Mint. Well, right now I'm running the LMDE LiveCD and I'm poking around in things, and it doesn't look *that* much different. Now, I understand [slightly] that LMDE has the rolling updates and that they are stable, testing and unstable, right? Ok, my question is

1) How can I keep it so my computer only updates on the most tested / stable updates so that I don't have any breakages?

Is that in the update manager - edit / preferences, leave it on 1, 2 and 3?

2) What is it that makes LMDE so "rough around the edges" and 'not as user friendly' as LM10 and on?

Thank you for your help.
varonbondumb
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 4:23 pm
Location: Raleigh, NC

Linux Mint is funded by ads and donations.
 

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby JasonLG on Thu May 12, 2011 1:55 am

varonbondumb wrote:3 year Ubuntu user, said 'no' to Unity, fresh to Linux Mint and *loving* it. Ashamed I didn't try it before.

I've read how fast LMDE is and I want to try it, but I've never used Debian and my computer guru friend who recommended Mint to me recommended I stay away from Debian (not specifically LMDE, mind you) since it was a lot rougher than regular Mint. Well, right now I'm running the LMDE LiveCD and I'm poking around in things, and it doesn't look *that* much different. Now, I understand [slightly] that LMDE has the rolling updates and that they are stable, testing and unstable, right? Ok, my question is

1) How can I keep it so my computer only updates on the most tested / stable updates so that I don't have any breakages?

Is that in the update manager - edit / preferences, leave it on 1, 2 and 3?

2) What is it that makes LMDE so "rough around the edges" and 'not as user friendly' as LM10 and on?

Thank you for your help.


1. No you can't use LMDE as a rolling release and pick and choose updates. It'll break stuff. What you can do is change your sources to track stable instead of testing before your first update. LMDE won't be a rolling release after that basically you'll be using Debian 6.(I did this for my main machine.)

2. The main differences I've came across is as far as usability is no launchpad integration. It makes it a little harder to keep up with the current stable versions of programs.
"I see" said the blind man to the deaf man who stuck his wooden leg out the window to check the weather.
JasonLG
Level 7
Level 7
 
Posts: 1624
Joined: Thu May 20, 2010 9:15 pm
Location: Polk City, Iowa USA

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby tdockery97 on Thu May 12, 2011 2:14 am

In addition to setting your sources to track Squeeze instead of Testing, you can add the Debian Squeeze backports repository, which will help keep your installed applications more up-to-date.
Image

HP Pavilion 17 Notebook, 8GB DDR3, 2.5GHZ A10-APU, Radeon HD 8650G
Registered Linux User #520972
User avatar
tdockery97
Level 13
Level 13
 
Posts: 4846
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 8:54 am
Location: Salem, Oregon

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby mikhou on Thu May 12, 2011 2:22 am

How do you do this? Add the backports I mean.

mikhou
mikhou
Level 4
Level 4
 
Posts: 234
Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2009 8:55 am

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby varonbondumb on Thu May 12, 2011 2:51 am

JasonLG wrote:What you can do is change your sources to track stable instead of testing before your first update. LMDE won't be a rolling release after that basically you'll be using Debian 6.(I did this for my main machine.)


Ok, thanks. How do I do that? Will that keep me from getting these packages that I keep reading about that could potentially break my stuff?

i've read multiple accounts of people using LMDE successfully and more in a more stable manner than "stable" versions of Ubuntu.
varonbondumb
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 4:23 pm
Location: Raleigh, NC

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby amina on Thu May 12, 2011 5:14 am

[Can someone tell me what launchpad integration means? I mean I read about it but still not understand what you really use it for (I mean, practically, like "I can use it to..." or "When I click on..."). I have noticed absolutely no difference.]

Regarding stability, I switched to LMDE from Ubuntu exactly because I found it to be unstable.
My impression is that on Ubuntu, instability means not major breakages but some small, hard-to-describe-and-look-for-solution, but really annoying bugs.
LMDE may be "testing", things may stop working like Exaile or Virtualbox did for me, but then you have error messages and obvious search terms. And once you solve those issues, they're really solved. I prefer this kind of instability :)

Switching to stable probably eliminates both type of annoyances (but it is not so much fun) :D
amina
Level 3
Level 3
 
Posts: 140
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2011 4:45 am

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby loukoumas on Thu May 12, 2011 8:30 am

Debian testing is more stable than Ubuntu
Linux Mint Debian 64bit user
User avatar
loukoumas
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 29
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:36 am

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby zerozero on Thu May 12, 2011 8:34 am

Launchpad integration means that you can't and you shouldn't use ubuntu's PPA's in your LMDE install: they are made for Ubuntu and most eventually will affect the stability of your system;

To add the Backports (only if you decide to change to stable) see here what they are

http://backports.debian.org/

and basically you just have to add to your sources.list

Code: Select all
deb http://backports.debian.org/debian-backports squeeze-backports main
zerozero
Level 16
Level 16
 
Posts: 6467
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 2:29 pm

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby mikhou on Thu May 12, 2011 8:45 am

My understanding of backports is that you have to manually choose everything that you want to upgrade, correct? So even if you have the backports in your sources.list, do you have to manually choose an upgrade if it's available?

mikhou
mikhou
Level 4
Level 4
 
Posts: 234
Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2009 8:55 am

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby wayne128 on Thu May 12, 2011 8:52 am

mikhou wrote:My understanding of backports is that you have to manually choose everything that you want to upgrade, correct? So even if you have the backports in your sources.list, do you have to manually choose an upgrade if it's available?

mikhou


I think better to read Debian backport so that it answers your question
http://backports.debian.org/

http://backports.debian.org/Instructions/
wayne128
Level 10
Level 10
 
Posts: 3277
Joined: Tue Jul 13, 2010 12:15 am

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby mikhou on Thu May 12, 2011 10:11 am

I've read both of those pages before, but I'm just having trouble understanding how backports work. It sounds like you have to know exactly what package you want to install from the backports and you have to keep up with the backport pages to see what is new out there. Maybe I am wrong. But that kind of defeats the point of having a package manager that shows you what new updates are out there so that you can do an update. It's not that I haven't researched them. And I get the point of them. I'm just not sure how they show up in Synaptic and/or Update Manager. I guess I oughta just add the repo to an existing install and try it myself.

mikhou
mikhou
Level 4
Level 4
 
Posts: 234
Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2009 8:55 am

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby craigevil on Fri May 13, 2011 10:31 pm

Once you install a package from backports it will upgrade to a newer version in backports.

A basic Debian Stable sources.list
Code: Select all
##################
## Debian Stable  ##
##################
#Stable
#deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ squeeze main contrib non-free
#Stable Sources
#deb-src http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ squeeze main contrib non-free

#Security Updates  http://www.debian.org/security/
#deb http://security.debian.org/ squeeze/updates main contrib non-free

# Please note: The debian-volatile project has been discontinued with the Debian "Squeeze" release.
# See http://lists.debian.org/debian-volatile-announce/2011/msg00000.html for details.
# Debian Volatile is now squeeze-updates
# Squeeze-updates
deb http://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ squeeze-updates main contrib non-free

# Debian Stable Backports
# For information visit - http://backports.debian.org/
# Secure apt: apt-get install debian-backports-keyring
#deb http://backports.debian.org/debian-backports squeeze-backports main contrib non-free
Debian Sid KDE4.8.4 Kernel 3.4 Thinkpad R40 CPU Pentium M 1.3MHz RAM 2GB ATI Mobility 7500
Debian - "If you can't apt-get something, it isn't useful or doesn't exist"
Giant Debian sources.list | Debian upgrade script smxi | sysinfo script inxi
craigevil
Level 5
Level 5
 
Posts: 559
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2010 6:10 am
Location: down the rabbit hole

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby varonbondumb on Mon May 16, 2011 3:29 am

Just installed LMDE. Here's what I have checked and unchecked so far:

Software Sources
Linux Mint Software:
checked: main, upstream, import, source code (unchecked - backport, romeo)

Third-Party Software:
checked: debian 6.0 'squeeze', security updates, main non-free (unchecked debian testing, testing updates [main contrib non-free], testing [main non-free])

From what I have read, testing may allow for a few more breakages but also keeps me with updated programs about 7 - 10 days faster. If that's so, I'm in no hurry.

I got my sources from here: http://community.linuxmint.com/tutorial/view/443

Linux Mint Debian Edition (LMDE) is a rolling distribution based on Debian testing (wheezy), but if you want to use a stable release for servers or if you simply prefer to have a modified (mintified) Debian stable, you can follow the simple steps below.

1) Download Linux Mint Debian 32-bit (201101) or Linux Mint Debian 64-bit (201012) if you prefer 64-bit edition.

2) Boot from Live DVD and install Linux Mint Debian.

3) Right after installing Linux Mint Debian, when you boot your system for the first time, change your repositories from testing to stable (squeeze). In Terminal, run the following commands to backup and edit your 'sources.list' file. When done, save the file and close gedit.

$ sudo cp /etc/apt/sources.list /etc/apt/sources.list.backup

$ gksudo gedit /etc/apt/sources.list

Your 'sources.list' should look like this after editing:

# deb http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian main upstream import
# deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian testing main contrib non-free
# deb http://security.debian.org/ testing/updates main contrib non-free
# deb http://www.debian-multimedia.org testing main non-free

deb http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian main upstream import
deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian squeeze main contrib non-free
deb http://security.debian.org/ squeeze/updates main contrib non-free
deb http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze main non-free

4) Now, update the package lists, install debian-multimedia-keyring, and update your system.

$ sudo apt-get update

$ sudo apt-get install debian-multimedia-keyring

$ sudo apt-get dist-upgrade

5) Reboot.

6) Now you are running a "mintified" Debian stable.
varonbondumb
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 4:23 pm
Location: Raleigh, NC

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby lmintnewb on Mon May 16, 2011 4:08 am

Just some opinions. I've never used lmde. Wanted to .. but had the same concerns you do. Not a linux guru and don't feel like dealing with breakage every other week. So I found another debian based light middleweight distro. It's awesome ... stable as can be. Using a fraction of the resources and has way better features imo than Mint 10 ( buntu based ) did.

Would say check your software sources under the gnome control center or similar. Check in synaptic too and in the update manager. Make sure all of them are pointing to stable etc. Other than that would just say you don't have to constantly upgrade/update. Once you get your sys stable. Don't worry about all the gazillion new updates flying out. Then it'll be rock solid and stay that way.

Think I saw some stuff about Mint starting to propose to begin releasing monthly snapshot updates. Instead of constantly rolling off the presses and causing mass breakage for many people updates. Would be a much better approach jmo. Also would say ... CLONEZILLA and/or another backup util ... set up a recovery partition etc. Then once you have your comp stable and set the way to like it. BACK IT UP.

Then if you get hit by the breakage blues you can just restore the back up in 15mins and be good to go. Right back to a time when things weren't so borked and aggravating. Still admire the talent of the Magic Mint developers and like the Mint community. But I won't use anything Mint based on buntu, or have any derivative of buntu installed on this comp. So until the day comes when they get the bugs worked out with their debian releases. Leaves me lil option but to use an alternative instead.

After thought: Summin else a wise person could do. Is not install all updates immediately. Hold off for awhile and wait to see what happens with certain stuff. For example. If you wait a week and check the forums. Notice 3,000 posts from people complaining and whining about lmde breakages with this or that recent update. Then you know hey ... might not want to install that one or might want to wait awhile until it's been resolved.
lmintnewb
Level 7
Level 7
 
Posts: 1574
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 5:13 pm

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby hopeful on Mon May 16, 2011 5:01 pm

lmintnewb,

You mention in your post excellent experience with a particular Debian derivative which you do not name, I suppose out of loyalty, as you are on the Mint forum. I appreciate this.

Would you nevertheless indicate it to me?

I successfully used Mepis and also Kanotix for quite some time, but abandoned them in the wake of the KDE4 mess.

LMDE might eventually become what I am looking for, and this is why I am on this forum, provided Debian gets CUT (constantly usable testing, or whatever they name it after they finish their usual Debian-quarrels) decided and working, but at present it is not yet for me.

Mint and Ubuntu are fine for general everyday-purposes. If I need to be shure that applications I am installing do work, and that they are not just in the repository because they happen to be somewhere in Experimental or Unstable, then, as a scientist, I cannot rely on them. My experience is very mixed in this respect with both, Mint and Ubuntu.

Thanks in advance,

hopeful
hopeful
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 2:23 pm

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby gwilson on Mon May 16, 2011 11:25 pm

On the general topic of LMDE stability...

I had switched completely over to LMDE and was pretty well pleased except for one thing. About every fourth time I boot into LMDE it fails to complete the boot-up to the desktop. I am fairly certain that it has to do with my particular combination of hardware and the order in which drivers are loaded (or something like that), but it became enough of a nuisance that I considered going back to Mint 10 (ubuntu-based). I also had some issues with the way my ATI video functioned under LMDE. In the end, I installed Mint 11 rc and migrated all of my settings and data over. Mint 11 rc hasn't missed a beat, so I am pretty happy. LMDE is the only flavor of Mint that has ever given inconsistent performance on my hardware. I suspect that the problems I have experienced are pretty uncommon since I don't see a lot of people complaining.
gwilson
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2010 3:01 pm

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby michaelzap on Tue May 17, 2011 1:48 am

Personally I would stick with the testing repos. That's what LMDE was based on, and it's really very stable all things considered. If you really want your system to be based on the Debian stable repos, I'd suggest that you install regular Debian and then "Mintify" it by adding the Mint repos.

But as others have said, the Debian testing repos are not all that scary. Consider that Ubuntu is (generally) based on the Debian unstable (sid) repos. I just check online before I update to make sure that there's no major breakage that I need to be worried about, and if there is (which is rare) I wait to update until the problem has been sorted.

Ubuntu is far less stable than Debian, so if you felt comfortable with that, you'll be fine in Debian.
michaelzap
Level 3
Level 3
 
Posts: 160
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2010 9:32 pm

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby christoff522 on Tue May 17, 2011 9:29 am

Too much is being put into LMDE not being stable. It IS stable!
It is at least twice as fast as main edition, theres also no noticeable difference in packages (from what I have seen).

You just have to be a bit savvy, trust in the updates, and maybe ONE day, be prepared to get your hands dirty.
I've been using various distros for 4 years now and I have used LMDE for 2 months, I have no intention of using another distro, I've found the one I like now.

Trust me when I say that you are not going to upgrade and suddenly nothing works. LMDE is built for testing/stable, you do have accessibility to use Ubuntu packages if you need them, but if you search around you can find packages that are built specifically for debian. Also there are reports on the internet of people who have ran Sid (the "unstable repo") for 3 years.

If you have used linux at any time you will get problems you have to google, this is no different than LMDE, but I think you may be surprised at how little you will have to do this using debian, its one of the foremost distros, and everything that is in testing has been given the thumbs up whilst it was in Sid.

You dont need to make LMDE more stable :)
christoff522
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 31
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 11:28 am

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby amina on Tue May 17, 2011 9:55 am

gwilson wrote:About every fourth time I boot into LMDE it fails to complete the boot-up to the desktop.


Strange but I had this problem on Ubuntu and it was exactly one of the reasons for which I switched to LMDE.
Since then stange phenomenons almost never happened.
Sorry that I cannot help, just would like to emphasize that LMDE is not necessarily less stable, it probably depends on the PC in question (?).
amina
Level 3
Level 3
 
Posts: 140
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2011 4:45 am

Re: what can I do to make LMDE more stable?

Postby lmintnewb on Tue May 17, 2011 12:17 pm

Amendment to above post.

Though before cloning your Minty lmde install. You're going to have to use the sid ( testing ) repos for awhile. Or Debian testing ... Cause while all the software in the Debian stable is going to be well ... stable. It's also going to be old/outdated and not include much of the stuff you'll want.

Latest version of web browsers etc and so forth. So nothing wrong with using those sid repos to get the stuff you want up to date and installed. But then would definitely use a backup util as mentioned. So that you can always restore your computer to that point at any time in the future. Should you run into breakage issues you are unable to resolve.

(note) PM sent to guy who requested info. Lemme know if ya didn't receive it and I'll shoot you another.

Also ... not sure, since I haven't used them. Some of the Debian based Mint releases may blow the doors off of what I'm using now. Esp some of the one's with the lighter DE's ( desktop environments). Or even lmde w fluxbox as it's desktop or so forth. Only thing that has me leary about it. Is all these breakage reports you see in these forums related to Mint Debian stuff.

That could all be user error and linux ignorance too though honestly. I mean many of the people trying to use Mint Debian releases. Probably have zero clue what they're doing. So needless to say ... end result = breakage.

Betting it's nothing using common sense wouldn't cure/avoid. Plus using a backup util to cover your butt no matter what happens. Backing up your OS, is just in general a wise thing for people to do me thinks.

I'm interested in Mint's Debian ... Just was having dvd drive issues ( didn't have the right discs ) and my comp is so old. It's bios doesn't allow for usb bootin. Didn't feel like flashing bios yada, yada, blahblah. Just found it easier to go Debian distro hopping instead and found a good one. But am sure Mint Debian stuff is fantastic software too.

Point I'm trying to make hopeful. Don't let all this unstable/breakage stuff scare ya away from at least trying some of the Mint Debian releases. If you have the means convenient to do so. Which I don't atm ... or I'd be running lmde ( w fluxbox), lxde or some of the others alongside the rest of the stuff on my comp right now.
lmintnewb
Level 7
Level 7
 
Posts: 1574
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 5:13 pm

Linux Mint is funded by ads and donations.
 
Next

Return to Newbie Questions

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests