idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

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idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby scottlinux on Wed Sep 07, 2011 9:43 pm

What do you think if LMDE just used the Debian provided / supported Iceweasel instead of Firefox?

It appears that Firefox for LMDE is packaged and maintained by Clem in the LMDE repositories. I guess the main benefit is that this would free Clem from having to worry about repackaging Firefox and we could also benefit of the quick updates from Debian for Iceweasel.

meh?

*ducks*
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby ThistleWeb on Wed Sep 07, 2011 9:50 pm

For plenty of folks the name and icon for Firefox is important, but perhaps take a look at the version numbers to see if you're comparing like for like. The last I checked Iceweasel in the Debian repos was like 3.6 or something, we're now at 6.0.2 or something close. If you're gonna maintain a Debian version of something current, you may as well go with the branded version that people recognize.
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby scottlinux on Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:19 pm

LMDE is still on Firefox 5 at the moment.

http://packages.linuxmint.com/list.php?release=Debian

Debian has Iceweasel 5 and 6 right now,

http://packages.debian.org/wheezy/iceweasel

http://packages.debian.org/sid/iceweasel

Just wondering if it is easier from a maintaining - stance to just rely on upstream as Linux Mint does for Firefox from Ubuntu. Cheers,
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby wyrdoak on Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:04 pm

I tried to launch Firefox from the menu just now, in fact I tried all of them, FireFox will only launch from the terminal and with no errors showing in the terminal. I don't know what changed. I haven't received any updates today.

I just downloaded and installed Iceweasel 5 from the package manager.

Iceweasel 5 seems to be working quit nicely. Go figure?

Code: Select all
deb http://packages.linuxmint.com/ debian main upstream import
deb http://debian.linuxmint.com/incoming testing main contrib non-free
deb http://debian.linuxmint.com/incoming/security testing/updates main contrib non-free
deb http://debian.linuxmint.com/incoming/multimedia testing main non-free


EDIT: I did get FireFox launching from the menu again. A gremlin got in and change the launcher command line to point to the icon and not the app'. :mrgreen:
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby anmys on Thu Sep 08, 2011 2:17 am

Debian has all the versions at presnt. Here is what it shows on my system :

$ apt-cache policy iceweasel
iceweasel:
Installed: 6.0.2-1
Candidate: 6.0.2-1
Version table:
7.0~b4-1 0
400 http://ftp.debian.org/ experimental/main amd64 Packages
*** 6.0.2-1 0
600 http://ftp.debian.org/ unstable/main amd64 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
5.0-6 0
800 http://ftp.debian.org/ testing/main amd64 Packages
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby Beardedragon on Thu Sep 08, 2011 9:32 am

It's all a matter of personal preference, Name Brand, Cutting Edge, Stable, or what works on your system. IceWeasel Works for me.
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby scottlinux on Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:17 am

Right now (I don't know if others are aware) Firefox in LMDE is packaged together by Clem, and provided in the linux mint debian repo. For the past few updates of Firefox, there has been a delay (understandably) to repackage every new version of Firefox that comes out.

Since Firefox is on the fast track for updates, I am asking / proposing that LMDE instead just use the upstream instead of our current method:

https://bugs.launchpad.net/linuxmint/+bug/842124
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby rivenathos on Thu Sep 08, 2011 2:11 pm

I can report great performance and timely updates/upgrades with Iceweasel. I use the repository from the Debian Mozilla team:

http://mozilla.debian.net/

I know this method works for me. I do not suggest anything to people haphazardly unless I have tested it out on my systems. :wink:

Also, if you choose to use this repository, you may see a warning such as this:
W: GPG error: http://mozilla.debian.net squeeze-backports Release: The following signatures couldn’t be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY 85A3D26506C4AE2A


If so, you will need to add the archive key to your apt keyring.

In your terminal as SU, key these lines in:
Code: Select all
gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key 06C4AE2A

and
Code: Select all
gpg -a --export 06C4AE2A | apt-key add -


You should not get that error anymore.
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby lmdeman on Fri Sep 09, 2011 5:56 am

Atm the only drawback of getting iceweasel from http://mozilla.debian.net/ is the lack of localization (English only).
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby grizzler on Fri Sep 09, 2011 6:07 am

For those like me who don't want to wait until repositories are updated, there's always Mozilla's own tarballs. Added bonus: proper localization (i.e. including the searchplugins, which Mint has managed to overlook until now).
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby Murdock on Fri Sep 09, 2011 8:18 am

Iceweasel works great for me.. My main is Chrome.
Very seldom I hit a site that 'asks" for Internut Exploder. Iceweasel slices through it.
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby Carl on Fri Sep 09, 2011 9:09 am

grizzler wrote:For those like me who don't want to wait until repositories are updated, there's always Mozilla's own tarballs. Added bonus: proper localization (i.e. including the searchplugins, which Mint has managed to overlook until now).


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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby craigevil on Sat Sep 10, 2011 2:00 pm

$ apt-cache policy iceweasel
iceweasel:
Installed: 8.0~a2+20110905042011-1
Candidate: 8.0~a2+20110909042004-1
Version table:
8.0~a2+20110909042004-1 0
500 http://mozilla.debian.net/ experimental/iceweasel-aurora i386 Packages
*** 8.0~a2+20110905042011-1 0
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
7.0~b4-1 0
1 http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ experimental/main i386 Packages
6.0.2-1 0
500 http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable/main i386 Packages


Personally I run Firefox and Chrome. I use Iceweasel to play around with newer versions, crap just realized there is a newer version, time to run apt-get dist-upgrade. :)

Mozilla Firefox has been my default browser forever, while Thunderbird is my default email client. Not iceweasel or icedove, but the REAL deal from Mozilla.
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby secipolla on Sat Sep 10, 2011 4:53 pm

Interesting question.
I usually default to Chrome (although Chromium is now following it closely) and have Firefox from Mozilla (the latest I 'installed' in my home folder).
Mint's solution comes from an apprehension to users crying if they had Iceweasel. It's understandable. Linux users must evolve a bit before that can be dumped (already happening as we see Ubuntu falling from 1st desktop Linux as it has a bad practice of relying on half-truths to sustain itself there, so FUD → half-truths → freely informed users).
Using Iceweasel would obviously be simpler and wiser but something that could be developed instead is an installer like flash-plugin-nonfree, i.e., it would download Firefox/Thunderbird from Mozilla in the system locale (could even have a CLI option to override that), extract it to /opt and do the required postinst operations like symlinking the executable to /usr/bin, installing a desktop file and setting update-alternatives. Then there would be the Mint extensions like its custom search and something that would, say, when Firefox reports an update (it would be set only to report and not install) and the user asks for it, Firefox would open as root for that or something like that.
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby jeffreyC on Sat Sep 10, 2011 5:12 pm

The main problem with Iceweasel is that the Debian devs are not web browser devs, and from the current problems with Firefox it seems to be difficult enough for those who are.
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby gavinhc on Sat Sep 10, 2011 6:21 pm

jeffreyC wrote:The main problem with Iceweasel is that the Debian devs are not web browser devs, and from the current problems with Firefox it seems to be difficult enough for those who are.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Iceweasel just a repackaging of Firefox without the copyrighted Mozilla branding, since that stuff goes against the Debian Free Software Guidelines? I don't see how recompiling the codebase with a different name and logos requires anyone to be a web browser dev.

I have been using Iceweasel from the mozilla.debian.net repos since Firefox 4 was released and have been continuously upgrading since then, far faster than offered through the Mint channels. I use the same versions of Firefox on two Windows machines and a MacOS system and have seen no real differences between them. If anything, Iceweasel seems more stable than the equivalent Firefox versions on the other OSs.
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Re: idea: use Iceweasel instead of supporting own Firefox

Postby craigevil on Tue Sep 27, 2011 5:25 pm

Firefox just updated today to 7.0. So did Thunderbird.

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Iceweasel in Debian repos will probably be updated in the next day or so.
$ apt-cache policy iceweasel
iceweasel:
Installed: 8.0~a2+20110923042012-1
Candidate: 8.0~a2+20110923042012-1
Version table:
*** 8.0~a2+20110923042012-1 0
500 http://mozilla.debian.net/ experimental/iceweasel-aurora i386 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
7.0~b6-1 0
1 http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ experimental/main i386 Packages
6.0.2-1 0
500 http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable/main i386 Packages
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