LMDE was what I meant all along

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LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby anzan on Tue Nov 23, 2010 11:57 am

I had installed Ubuntu 7.04, looking for an easy way to have a Debian based system that a number of users would be able to install and maintain.

Over the years Ubuntu has moved more and more to become "Ubuntu" rather than a Linux distro, just as Mac OS X is built on BSD/Mach but has little to do with the Unix userland.

The Unity shell, intended to present a recognizably "Ubuntu experience" on desktops, netbooks, tablets, and mobile devices makes good business sense. However it has nothing to do with what I want, need, and use. Ubuntu One, the Software Centre selling software (Fluendo etc), the music purchasing service and so on are all understandable directions but have nothing of interest to me.

Various services and daemons complicate runtime.

The elimination of the notification area to be replaced by "windicators" will make other WMs difficult to use (for example, the nm-applet will not show up in Fluxbox's taskbar). Other modifications will no doubt make only the Unity DE useable. There is a move towards eliminating right-click and middle-click functionality as these are impossible on a touch screen interface and the idea is to have a universal experience with Unity.

Oh, and the global menu. Urf.

So I thought I would try LMDE in a Live DVD session. Everything worked.

Installation was quick and not only painless but pleasant. My desktop looks exactly as I had it set up except that the Ubuntu "circle of friends" is replaced by the Debian "swirl".

My deep thanks to all involved in LMDE. This is what I had looked for from Ubuntu all along.



I have so far replaced Ubuntu pn two machines and another sixteen or so will soon follow.
Thanks to all developers.
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby tenfoot on Tue Nov 23, 2010 2:37 pm

I have LMDE on three machines - 2 desktops and a laptop. Had a few issues, initially, but they were all quickly resolved through members of this Forum. Some updates have caused minor problems - one reset my "login automatically" to requiring a login - but, even with my limited technical expertise, they were easily solved.

I'm now waiting for LMDE at Christmas. If Clem and the other developers are as successful with that as they have been with this edition, they will be on another winner and I'll be a very happy geriatric indeed!
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby Carl on Tue Nov 23, 2010 2:46 pm

Agreed LMDE is all I've ever wanted from a Linux distribution :D
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby mikecore on Tue Nov 23, 2010 3:58 pm

I also do not like the direction Ubuntu is heading, But I understand it. LMDE greatly appeals to me form the standpoint of this. I really like the Debian base, I also really like the idea of a rolling release, and finally I love the elegance of the Mint branding. I'm getting older now and I'm looking for my linux box to just work and change slowly feature/theme wise, and change quickly bug wise, thats not asking for too much is it? :mrgreen: .

I'm going to try this on my new laptop. and hope MInt keeps LMDE going.
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby rtrev on Tue Nov 23, 2010 5:55 pm

I'm new here, so maybe this comment is out of place. My apologies if so.

I love LMDE. It's just what I've been looking for and not finding for years now. So, I donated a small amount to the Mint team. I figure they deserve it. Maybe it will improve the chances of LMDE being around for a while.

I came from Ubuntu, where money is apparently no object. That's clearly not the case here, so I gave my measly little contribution, and hope others will also.
:D
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby anzan on Tue Nov 23, 2010 7:31 pm

Yes, I certainly understand Ubuntu's direction and wish them the best and I've thanked Mark and the various devs. I also understand Android and find it a useful OS for mobile devices, where I primarily "consume" information. But to get work done, to actually produce anything, Ubuntu is becoming much less than ideal.

I will be setting up a small annual donation to Mint (and to Debian), as I have already done with GNOME and a few other FLOSS projects.
Thanks to all developers.
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby anzan on Tue Nov 23, 2010 7:33 pm

Oh, and I just noticed that I had Adblock on and so excluded the block for this domain.
Thanks to all developers.
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby Dyfi on Wed Nov 24, 2010 11:10 am

Hi,

Agree with all the replies. LMDE is a special distro - over time I have tried quite a few but this really is a good one!

Thanks Clem and team - please keep it going!

Regards,

Dyfi.
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby Grundoko on Wed Nov 24, 2010 10:28 pm

I first used Linux when I was, I don't know, maybe 12. I started with Ubuntu 7.10.

I loved it, it was very simple, I could browse the web, and get things done quickly, and efficiently, without any extra work. This was when I had very little knowledge of computers, and especially Linux.

I became hooked, I've been a Linux lover ever since, but for the past few years, I've been using Windows more and more again, and I've always been distro hopping. I'd format once every two weeks or so, installing a new distro, never finding any of them to meet my expectations. I wanted a snappy fast distro, with a nice looking, but unobtrusive, and simple interface, like what I had experienced in Ubuntu 7.10.

My favorite distro of all time, which has been my main distro since release has been Linux Mint 8: Helena. It was so fast, bug free, and just plain elegant. I never once had troubles with it, everything just worked. It had all the up to date software, and it just worked, which was the main point.

Since Isadora, things have been going all down hill. The implementation of the Indicator Applet is driving me crazy. I can find nowhere a way to get the old sound notifier back, I hate the indicator applet, it simply wastes time. I need to be able to use the scroll wheel on the icon, without even clicking it to bring up the scroller. I'm all about efficiency. The less clicks I have to make to do something, the more efficient I am at what I am doing, and the better the system. Also, it seems that things are getting slower in Ubuntuland, things are SLOOOOOWWING DOWN, and getting buggier.

LMDE is exactly what I've always wanted in an operating system. It's super fast, super elegant, super stable, it's got all the up to date software (not quite as up to date as Ubuntu, but I'll live with that), it's got the Mint tools which made me fall in love with Helena, and it's got the simplicity I want.

I no longer feel the need to distro hop, LMDE is it.

I can't wait for the updates they're making at Christmas, because LMDE does still have a few rough edges, but I'm am extremely pleased thus far.
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby rhodry on Thu Nov 25, 2010 7:53 am

Just a quiet word of caution for some folk getting excited about LMDE, if I may.

Please don't get me wrong either, I love it, I have migrated nearly all the Mint installs that I am involved in to it, BUT, there is one aspect of it that some less experienced users may get caught short by. LMDE is based on Debian Testing but Testing has been frozen now for some time in anticipation of it becoming the new Debian Stable. Testing will then become "testing" again; ie it will be opened up to a swag of updates from Sid (current Unstable)!!

This will be the real test for Clem and the other developers here. How Mint-type "Stable" can they keep LMDE when the Debian base becomes far more volatile. Personally, I think they will do a great job; I just don't want to see expectations shot to bits because people don't understand the true nature of the beast. I have used raw Debian Testing in the past where packages have just disappeared from the repo overnight because the packager wanted to work on something. The pressure here I think will be on how Mint Update is going to work in a much more volatile environment.

Anyway, I am not a pessimist, just a realist. In the new year LMDE may well become a much more movable beast than many users are expecting?! Mind you, I will still be there for the ride! :)

Cheers,
rhodry
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it's about learning to dance in the rain.
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby vooid on Thu Nov 25, 2010 8:00 am

rhodry wrote:Just a quiet word of caution for some folk getting excited about LMDE, if I may.

Please don't get me wrong either, I love it, I have migrated nearly all the Mint installs that I am involved in to it, BUT, there is one aspect of it that some less experienced users may get caught short by. LMDE is based on Debian Testing but Testing has been frozen now for some time in anticipation of it becoming the new Debian Stable. Testing will then become "testing" again; ie it will be opened up to a swag of updates from Sid (current Unstable)!!

This will be the real test for Clem and the other developers here. How Mint-type "Stable" can they keep LMDE when the Debian base becomes far more volatile. Personally, I think they will do a great job; I just don't want to see expectations shot to bits because people don't understand the true nature of the beast. I have used raw Debian Testing in the past where packages have just disappeared from the repo overnight because the packager wanted to work on something. The pressure here I think will be on how Mint Update is going to work in a much more volatile environment.

Anyway, I am not a pessimist, just a realist. In the new year LMDE may well become a much more movable beast than many users are expecting?! Mind you, I will still be there for the ride! :)

Cheers,
rhodry



would setting the mintupdate just to level 1 and 2 solve some problems relating to unstable packages?
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby gotjazz on Thu Nov 25, 2010 9:00 am

nope - but changing your repos to squeeze would. or just not sweating :D
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby rtrev on Thu Nov 25, 2010 10:59 am

I'm keeping two current LMDE installations on my machine. If an update hoses one of them, I'll hold off on the other one until I come here and get the scoop on what's up. :wink: :D
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby rhodry on Fri Nov 26, 2010 7:12 am

gotjazz wrote:nope - but changing your repos to squeeze would. or just not sweating :D


Yeah, sorry, I did not mean my previous post to sound alarmist at all. :shock: I had just detected a "tone" amongst a number of posts on the forum generally that indicated LMDE is the future of "stable rolling release" computing for us all. Maybe - but not necessarily so - is all I am saying. Rolling releases by their nature tend to break more often than static ones; however, bugs also tend to get fixed more readily as well.

I am sure Mint Debian is where I want to head, I was just concerned 'newbies' don't fully understand the nature of Debian development cycles and how the stability/volatility mix can vary quite significantly within each version at various times. Managing that support effort is the developers challenge in a rolling release.

Anyway, I am just "waxing lyrical" here because we all know we have the best developers in the game :D and there are some great distros out there based on Debian Unstable (Sid) even. Aptosid is one that comes to mind and in fact Ubuntu is (or at least was originally) based on Debian Unstable.

I can't wait for the next iso!

rhodry.
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Re: LMDE was what I meant all along

Postby anzan on Sat Nov 27, 2010 7:36 am

rhodry. as the thread's starter, I thought I should mention that I appreciate your points.

The fact that the freeze is on right now is one of the reasons this is a great time to install. Once stable is released I'll have most users switch sources to stable for a few months or as long as they wish. A few of us might in fact go to sid for a while.

The flexibility of upgrade choice is one of the great benefits of Debian. The ease of setting up with codecs et al enabled and the choice of using the Mint tools and look is the great benefit of LMDE.

Ubuntu unfortunately more and more offers less and less choice. Which is fine for those who choose choicelessness. It's just not for me. And doesn't have to be.

So, really, LMDE was what I meant all along when I first installed Ubuntu 7.04.
Thanks to all developers.
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