Mate not ready for prime time

[JoeBingo]

Two days and about 1/2 a dozen reinstalls later. I'm so frustrated and disappointed with Mint13Mate.

Any theme I use ends up using too much CPU and display becomes FUBAR. Tried just sticking with Mint-X and Mint-Z and it helped A LITTLE but still had times of high CPU and messed up display.

Mint 11 is AWESOME ... no burps, gurggles, bells or glitches. Too bad support will end in October. If the Mint experience doesn't get better by then, so will my use of Linux end.

Just frustrated right now. Posting problems here seems to get few responses and little help, so I don't expect very many will see this rant anyway.

Pros:

MATE is stable and it works on all computers
MATE is among the most productive and easy to use desktops available.
MATE continues where Gnome 2 left off and introduces its own incremental improvements.
MATE comes with support for mintMenu, mintDesktop, Compiz and everything that made Gnome 2 the most popular Linux desktop.
MATE is built with GTK2, it features more themes and integrates with more applications than any other desktop.

Cons:

Some parts of Gnome 2 were not migrated to MATE yet and a few aspects such as Bluetooth support might not work as well as they did with Gnome 2.

Mate is stable ... BS
Works on all computers ... MAYBE ... and thats a big maybe ... if you don't change any default settings AT ALL
Among the most productive and easy to use desktops available ... BS
Continues where Gnome 2 left off ... BS ... one step forward and six steps back
Features more themes and integrates with more applications than any other desktop ... SURE ... just don't expect to be able to use the computer if you install more themes than the two that are included.
Other than that, I guess there are no cons.

Oh and don't expect to use all features of a keyboard with shortcut buttons either. The web button will open your Mint13 home folder. The Calculator button will cause an error stating that gcalctool is not a valid command ... and that's because the former Calculator in Mint (gcalctool) was replaced with mate-calculator but nothing in the installation software points to the new calc ... still points to the old application which is no longer included.

should I go on ... BS

[sagirfahmid3]

Dude calm down, MATE works on my pc just fine. Just because it doesn't work on your pc doesn't mean it doesn't on others'. You can definitely solve the keyboard problem by editing keyboard shortcuts. Let's give MATE a year or two more to get settled, it's still relatively new compared to Gnome2, Xfce, KDE, and LXDE.

Also, you didn't post up your specs. Don't expect MATE to work on a 400MHz Pentium III; graphics card must also be up to the challenge (works with my laptop's Intel GMA 950 just fine). If Mint doesn't cut it for you, there's Fedora, OpenSUSE or Debian.

As monkeyboy so eloquently puts it:

If you don't like it, make something better
If you can't make something better, adapt
If you can't do either ball your panties up and cry

[bimsebasse]

Try something else, MATE isn't the only DE out there.

[JoeBingo]

There's nothing wrong with my computer. As I said, Mint 11 is AWESOME !!! ... Mint 13 not so much.

I built my computer by hand. I used an Intel motherboard. Yes it is older ... but Mint 13 is the ONLY OS I've EVER had any problems with. I use the oboard, LAN, sound AND graphics. I'm NOT a gamer and don't need anything else.

MB: Intel D845GERG2 using onboard Intel Extreme Graphics Controller ... using an Intel 2.8GHz processor

Got any instructions for editing keyboard shortcuts?
Any hints on how to keep MATE from using so much CPU or do I need over a 3GHZ processor to run Linux now? ... Even the SHIKI-WISE theme from Mint11 ends up using too much CPU over time in Mint13.

One step forward and 6 steps back. The more it looks like Windows and with all the issues ... I may as well go back to Windows and at least have stability if not security.

I would have recommended Mint11 to ANYONE. It made me a "cheerleader" for Mint. But Mint13 can't even come close to providing stability and reliability and ease of use that 11 has ... and that's just sad.

[JoeBingo]

I have installed and reinstalled MATE about 1/2 a dozen time over the past two days.
RIGHT NOW ... it is absolutely a DEFAULT install with NOTHING tweaked ... theme is default and everything.
I've downloaded and installed level 1-3 updates and updated all installed packages that are Upgradable Upstream
In Firefox, I am running two add-ons ... ADBLOCK and Forecastfox

IF you were just casually posting on a forum as my last reply was and ALL OF A SUDDEN ... your display looked like this ... would YOU be a happy camper with MINT 13 ... MATE ???????????????

[JoeBingo]

Oh and the two replies in this thread thusfar just prove my point about little help with problems.
I guess I should take the advice, wad up my big girl panties, cry and go back to Windows. Thanks guys. I really appreciate it.

[sagirfahmid3]

No problem

[JoeBingo]

... POS

[mpiter]

Oh and the two replies in this thread thusfar just prove my point about little help with problems.
I guess I should take the advice, wad up my big girl panties, cry and go back to Windows. Thanks guys. I really appreciate it.

Just out of curiosity I checked the 40 posts you have already left on Linux Mint forums. For someone claiming receiving "little help with problems", you wrote several posts thanking people for their help and you marked "[SOLVED]" several threads that you had started. So you obviously have already received help from people here. For this particular thread, although unpleasant, the answers you received were not stupid. Their tone was at the level of yours. We harvest what we sow most of the time.

Before going into your problem, let me say that I do not think that Mate Linux Mint is that crappy. I have already installed and used the OS on 2 computers and tested it without installing it on a third one. The OS is very stable on my architectures. I still find small bugs from time to time, but nothing very annoying. It is normal considering the youth of Mate compared to Gnome 2.32 or XFCE. Unfortunately Compiz is still, and has been for more than a year, fairly buggy but version 0.9.8 that will be distributed with Ubuntu 12.10 and Linux Mint 14 might be good.

About your problem, did you check with md5sum that the ISO image you used to install Linux Mint was not corrupted?

If your ISO image is good, it is likely that you are unlucky with hardware incompatibilities. In this case, if you cannot find answers to some of your questions here, try Ubuntu forums. There are still more Ubuntu users today than Mint ones.

As other people suggested, if you cannot make Mate to work on your computer try other desktop environments. Any Gnome 3 shell might be too slow for your computer, including cinnamon, but take a look at XFCE. It is very similar in philosophy to Mate but is older, lighter, probably more bug-free, and may fulfill your needs without straining your computer resources.

Consider also trying Ubuntu 12.04 and Xubuntu 12.04 from a USB key without installing them. Just test the Live versions on your computer. At least it would hint whether your problems stem from Mate or Ubuntu. If Ubuntu works, you might consider sticking to that distribution for a while waiting for Mint being compatible with your hardware, if ever. You can install Mate and the Mint menu on Ubuntu 12.04. I did it yesterday on Linux Ultimate Edition 3.4 that I was testing (it is Ubuntu-12.04 based as Linux Mint 13). I could create on Ultimate Edition exactly the same environment than on Mint. Of course, it would be strange to recreate Mint environment on another computer but if it works on the other environment...

Also, if you were happy with Linux Mint 11, why do you want to upgrade to 13? Except if you really need a driver that you cannot install on Mint 11 you can keep your old version. If it works, do not mind the end of support. My girlfriend is still using Ubuntu 10.10 which was the last good Ubuntu version. Support stopped for that version a few months ago but her computer is still rock solid, satisfying her on all accounts, including connecting recent hardware. She has absolutely no reasons to upgrade to a newer version that might strain her computer down. Do you have a good reason to do it?

If you decide to stay with Linux, do not reinstall anything before I send a second post in this thread. I am going to give you hints to avoid repeating the present ordeal you are going through right now. I need to do a few other things today then I will post a few tips here. You will see how we can safely test a new system without risk for your data and for your previous system.

[JoeBingo]

About your problem, did you check with md5sum that the ISO image you used to install Linux Mint was not corrupted?

No I didn't check the md5sum. I'm not sure how to without installing an application to do so. I did download and image two different ISO files, one through torrent and one via a download mirror. I tried/installed both, with the same results/anomalies.

Also, if you were happy with Linux Mint 11, why do you want to upgrade to 13? Except if you really need a driver that you cannot install on Mint 11 you can keep your old version. If it works, do not mind the end of support. My girlfriend is still using Ubuntu 10.10 which was the last good Ubuntu version. Support stopped for that version a few months ago but her computer is still rock solid, satisfying her on all accounts, including connecting recent hardware. She has absolutely no reasons to upgrade to a newer version that might strain her computer down. Do you have a good reason to do it?

I switched because of MY "unknowns". I wondered with end of support ... how would I upgrade some packages and applications that are often updated for security, esoteric and convenience reasons ... and remain confident in compatibility. OR even know it would be prudent to update certain packages and applications.

Perhaps my philosophy should be ... if it isn't broken don't fix it ... but my question is ... why would ANYONE reasonably want to upgrade/update versions when there is no longer support? Furthermore, if there was nothing wrong with version 11 ... why abandon it in October for a buggy and/or experimental version(s)? Why not continue to improve (if that's even possible) version 11? The answers to those questions, in whole or part, may reflect valid reasons for my switching to the newest version.

If you decide to stay with Linux, do not reinstall anything before I send a second post in this thread. I am going to give you hints to avoid repeating the present ordeal you are going through right now. I need to do a few other things today then I will post a few tips here. You will see how we can safely test a new system without risk for your data and for your previous system.

Despite my profound frustration and venting ... I greatly appreciate your response and offer of help. I have a HUGE learning curve concerning Linux and am little more than a "buttonologist". I know nothing of compiling, programming or simple terminal commands that most in the community routinely do without second thought. I'm just looking for an OS EXACTLY like Mint ... without the frustrations of bugs and compatibility issues. I haven't given up on Mint yet and anxiously await your following posts should you selflessly share your gracious and valuable considerations. Thank you

[GeneC]

......Despite my profound frustration and venting ... I greatly appreciate your response and offer of help. I have a HUGE learning curve concerning Linux and am little more than a "buttonologist". I know nothing of compiling, programming or simple terminal commands that most in the community routinely do without second thought. I'm just looking for an OS EXACTLY like Mint ... without the frustrations of bugs and compatibility issues. I haven't given up on Mint yet and anxiously await your following posts should you selflessly share your gracious and valuable considerations. Thank you

Joe
I would take a serious look at Mint 13 XFCE. Its simple and bulletproof. It can pretty easily be set up to look and act much like older Mint versions that used Gnome 2.3...

http://blog.linuxmint.com/?p=2088

[JoeBingo]

Gene ... that certainly appears to be worth a look that I hadn't considered. Thank you

[JoeBingo]

I reinstalled Mint 13 MATE and ONLY updated level 1 & 2 recommendations
Result: Still experienced high resource usage manifest as display anomalies.

I gave Mint 13 XFCE a try and the initial reaction was I had time-warped back to Windows 95/98. Never-the-less, I gave it a try.
Result: I experienced high resource usage manifest as display anomalies DURING level 1-3 update and installation.

I've given up on ALL incarnations of Mint 13. I'm back to Mint 11 Katya.
Result: I'm rock solid stable and reliable again. All level 1-3 updates installed as well as all packages Upgradeable Upstream installed.

Observation: Apparently something baseline different between Mint 11 and Mint 13 MATE as well as Mint 13 XFCE is beyond the capabilities of my computer (Intel D845GERG2 motherboard utilizing onboard video, audio and LAN ... with a 2.8GHz Intel processor). Something in Mint 13 is causing high resource usage and I don't think any amount of end user tweaking will remedy the situation.

Lucky 11 and not so lucky 13 I guess. Maybe I'll give it another shot when 14 comes out.

There is definitely a resource hog afoot in MATE ... at least with this simple Intel hardware configured system I'm using. MATE DOES NOT play nice AT ALL ... not even the "dumbed down" versions of Mint 13 !!!

[qhris]

I understand how you feel Joe, I go through it once in a while too and it gets frustrating for me because I don't know enough about repairing the system myself. I'm having an issue with cinnamon on my wifes laptop right now, and have been scouring the forums off and on all day. Its a simple issue probably, but I can't figure it out. What I have learned here on these forums is that eventually I'll get the answer somewhere here or someone will post the cure. Don't forget that most of the help here is volunteer so the response times are a little longer than paid sites.
One thing I like about the peeps here is that they help you learn if you are willing, I have learnt a lot in the last few years, but still know so little compared to most. When ever I get help or a new terminal command to try, I always copy it and make a note of what its for. I have a bit of a collection now and it does come in handy.
I wish I could help you with your issue, I have built my own desktops as well, and with linux, they just fly like no tomorrow, but I know from my experience with them, they each have there own personality and have to be tweeked a little differently.
Hang in there Joe, it will get sorted.

[JoeBingo]

Thanks qhris. I don't know that tweaking would help with my situation. Mint13 just doesn't work out of the box on this machine.
I do have an older Dell desktop in the closet. It's newer than what I'm using, but it too is the same generation 2.8GHZ processor. I may give it a try tomorrow.
The difference is night and day between Mint 11 and Mint 13 on this box. Mint 11 is snappy with NO PROBLEMS at all, while 13 SUX !!! LOL
It REALLY and TRULY is a giant step backward for me to even try and update from 11 to 13. It's a shame support for 11 will end in October. It MAY mean an end in sight for my use of Mint and I was honestly LOVING it. Just sad indeed.

It's just not worth spending hundreds of dollars on hardware upgrades to run an open source OS when the current configuration works absolutely fine with virtually all other operating systems ... just not Mint 13.

[xclusive585]

I could never go so far as to say Mate is not ready for primetime. It has no more or less issues than Ubuntu, which is easier to use and better working than almost every other distro.

Mint has been my favorite Distro since I discovered it, they take whats good about Ubuntu, couple it with an excellent package selection, and desktop environments that do not lock you out of use like Gnome3 and Unity do.

As far as issues? I think once 13 (12.04) has been out to walk for awhile, the issues will calm down.


(I also had issues installing Mint, I had to use different disk-image burning software than I was using, to get a good burn of Mint13.)

[qhris]

I agree Joe, its too bad its not working for you. I have 1 puter out of 5 that is giving me grief right now, up until recently I had no worries. That shows me though that there is something happening that I don't know about. My fix was to install mate on it to get it going (its my wifes). It works fine now with no issues.....I put cinnamon back on and it does the same thing lol, it fails.
I like cinnamon much more than mate though, the looks or whatever, I'm not sure, so I'll keep looking for the fix.
I know that with linux graphics cards are tricky too, ATI always gives me grief and seem to need more attention to set up than nvidia, just my experience. I have the LXDE on my oldest box and it does the job. It lives in my garage now and mostly plays music and the news for me, but it runs quite well. I've run the gaunlet of linux OS over the years and I think the Mint OS is by far the best and most stable. I have 1 windows box that I play some games on, it always reminds me of how bad things were before linux came along for me, I think my version is Win-Updater-Scanner-7, because thats all it ever does when I turn it on lol.
Good luck there

[Alpha-Geek]

Joe, have you ever tried checking what process is sucking up resources by using "System Monitor"? It might give you a idea of where to look for a solution. Just sayin'
Or, if you're more comfortable using Terminal, run this

Code: Select all

sudo ps aux

[JoeBingo]

Even though I'm back to up and running wonderfully in Mint 11 ... I hate (yes, a strong word LOL) that MATE is kicking my butt and want to try and resolve any hardware/software conflicts.

SOoooo ... I'm going to give it another try after posting this. Maybe my display can be tweaked in BIOS and maybe the swap tendency can be changed. I have 1 gig of RAM and will try and use all of it I can. I've been given nothing else to try, by posts here, and will continue to flail about in hopes of stumbling on something that resolves the high resource usage and display anomalies.

Even if BIOS tweaks and swappiness HELPS ... it still won't correct/resolve whatever the resource hog is. When idle, the System Monitor ONLY reports CPU usage as resources used by System Monitor itself and it fluctuates a great deal. All other processes are at zero. So, SOMETHING is using a considerable amount of CPU but isn't reported uniquely in System Monitor.

The idea of using the old Dell box I have in a closet isn't going to work. For one, it only has a CD ROM. And when I swapped out a DVD unit into it late last night, the drive wasn't recognised as a DVD and I couldn't change anything in BIOS to correct it !!! ... yeah, really old I guess LOL.

I do have a Dell Latitude D830 laptop running XP Pro but aren't going to touch it because I NEED the laptop for travel and using GPS software.

Off for one more try with Mint 13 then ... cover me ... I'm going in HA !!!

[GeneC]

Joe

Perhaps downgrading to an older kernel in Mint 13 would help?
(Perhaps the same one that Mint 11 uses, if that is available).