No command line, just click.

Write suggestions and new ideas in here
More ideas here http://community.linuxmint.com/idea/welcome
Forum rules
No support questions here please.
No ideas for application developers here please. For example instead use GitHub for Cinnamon and Nemo.

No command line, just click.

Postby latinomanz on Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:15 am

Hello,

I think command line (aka terminal) should be reserved for special cases, for programmers only, in order to do some basic things, I still have to use the command line like updating repositories for example, people just wanna click and go, thats why most people still prefer Windows because they just click and get their stuff done. Andriod gained popularity because theres no command line, people just click and thats it, people dont have time to remember commands, etc., so the Terminal should only be used for programmers. Some of the Linux gurus prefer the terminal to a nice GUI, but the average folk doesnt, I am a programmer and I still prefer a nice GUI, less time memorising commands and more appealing to the eyes ;-)

Let me know what you think peeps.
latinomanz
Level 2
Level 2
 
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:55 pm

Linux Mint is funded by ads and donations.
 

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby Pilosopong Tasyo on Sun Mar 25, 2012 5:27 am

latinomanz wrote:in order to do some basic things, I still have to use the command line like updating repositories for example

I wonder if you asked or at least made some effort in exploring the menu if there is a GUI method to do this example you mentioned. Apparently, there is: Mint menu > Administration > Software Sources. You can do the same in Synaptic Package Manager. Both tools are GUI.

The terminal is just one of many tools available to you. The CLI provide a common ground which enables you to do things regardless what desktop environment you use, be it Gnome Shell, KDE, XFCE, Mate, Cinnamon, et. al.

Here's an example: Imagine doing a simple task like copying a file from one folder to another. This seemingly trivial task can be done in so many different ways, depending on what desktop environment you use. If you use the Gnome Shell DE, for example, you follow steps 1,2,3. However, you can't necessarily say the same for the KDE desktop. You have to slightly deviate, if not totally follow, a different set of steps. Now do the same trivial task in Mate, in Cinnamon, etc. You'll soon find out that, despite following a core set of steps, they get implemented [slightly] differently among DEs. And with all those slight variations in doing the same task across different DEs, you only need to follow one step in CLI:

Code: Select all
cp /location/of/source.file /location/of/destination/optional-new-file.name

And this single, straightforward command is all it takes to do the job. No need to fuss around the screen clicking here and there. Not only is it straightforward, but this single command applies regardless what DE you use.

latinomanz wrote:Andriod gained popularity because theres no command line, people just click and thats it

Bad example. Linux Mint is an O/S that's designed for desktop computers. This is not a tablet.

And you don't "click" on a tablet. You tap. :wink:
Image
o Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day. Teach him how to fish and he will eat for a lifetime!
o If an issue has been fixed, please edit your first post and add the word [SOLVED].
User avatar
Pilosopong Tasyo
Level 6
Level 6
 
Posts: 1126
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 3:26 am
Location: Philippines

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby Yacy on Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:39 am

It's still 100-times easier to use a mouse then remembering dozen or hundreds of commands, and if you make the slightest misspelling while typing a command, you might lose all you data. On the other hand, if you use a cursor you actually can see what you are doing - wysiwyg style. However, these days, computers are made for everyone, not just geeky developers or other experts who have a degree in rocket sience. Even kids and old people, or people who are not that bright should be able to do basic stuff on computers. At least that's my opinion.
Yacy
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:16 am

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby latinomanz on Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:15 pm

Well buddy, I went to the software sources and I could not see a way to update my repositories and I am not computer dump, I am a full programmer. I just want say a button in the software manager for example that you just click and it updates the repositories for you, thats all ONE SIMPLE CLICK!!!

I cannot ask my grandparents to go the software sources and know what to do. See the simple we do it, the more my grandparents will like it ;-)
latinomanz
Level 2
Level 2
 
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:55 pm

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby Aging Technogeek on Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:55 pm

You have not been looking in the right places. There are at least two ways I know of to update the sources list via mouse click in a GUI.

1. Open Synaptic Package Manager and click the "Reload" button.

2.Open Update Manager and click the "Refresh" button.

These are the two apps that most often need access to the latest package lists so these are the apps that have the update buttons.

But is it really so difficult to open a terminal and enter

Code: Select all
sudo apt-get update


Pilosopong Tasyo mentioned the constancy of terminal commands when changing from one Mint desktop to another. The command line is even more useful when chancing from one Linux distribution to another. Different distros have different GUI methods of doing the same task - it all depends on what the developer(s) like. The command line provides a constant method of getting things done no matter what distribution you are using (with a few limitations - apt or apt-get commands will not work in distros that do not use Debian Package Manager [dpkg] for example). If you ever plan to experiment with different distros, learn some basic commands first. It will make the transitions easier.
Image

Registered Linux User 483387
User avatar
Aging Technogeek
Level 13
Level 13
 
Posts: 4605
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:54 am
Location: Right about here

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby altair4 on Sun Mar 25, 2012 2:20 pm

OK, I've been reading all your posts to this forum and I have to ask you a question: What is it that you expect from Linux?

If you essentially want a free version of Windows or OSX I'm not sure you're going to get that kind of experience from Linux.
Please add a [SOLVED] at the end of your original subject header if your question has been answered and solved.
altair4
Level 15
Level 15
 
Posts: 5986
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2009 10:27 am

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby latinomanz on Sun Mar 25, 2012 2:49 pm

Not a free version of windows since linux has better performance than Windows.

But I have noticed that the goal of every distro is to sooner or later replace windows and take the throne, so I was just giving Mint's developers tips on how to achieve that.

For a decade I have been trying to switch to Linux since RedHat 2.0 and I was able to, it was so hard to use it, i just gave up on it, people used to tell me, to see your other hard drive, just mount it for example. The I would tell them why mount it manually when windows does it automatically? Now this has been solved and this is one of the reasons I use Linux more often now.

So if linux mint programmers just want to appeal to the Geeks of the Geeks (aka Linux users) then it is fine, but for mainstream it is not.

Secondly, why not put that reload button on the Software Manager program since the Software Manager is easier to use than Synaptics. But this is just one example, another pain in the ass is installing a program if it is not in the repositories for example....
latinomanz
Level 2
Level 2
 
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:55 pm

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby altair4 on Sun Mar 25, 2012 2:59 pm

But I have noticed that the goal of every distro is to sooner or later replace windows and take the throne

If the target of that distro is the desktop rather than the server then the folks controlling those distros are delusional.

In the last 10 years or so I have seen Linux adoption triple to about 1.5% of the desktop. Without any other interference it should be in the majority in 340 years or so. But at that point Apple's OS-CXXVIII will be embedded into the human brain at birth.
Please add a [SOLVED] at the end of your original subject header if your question has been answered and solved.
altair4
Level 15
Level 15
 
Posts: 5986
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2009 10:27 am

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby tdockery97 on Sun Mar 25, 2012 3:03 pm

Image
Image

HP Pavilion 17 Notebook, 8GB DDR3, 2.5GHZ A10-APU, Radeon HD 8650G
Registered Linux User #520972
User avatar
tdockery97
Level 13
Level 13
 
Posts: 4869
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 8:54 am
Location: Salem, Oregon

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby latinomanz on Sun Mar 25, 2012 3:09 pm

Well,

Why has linux adoption tripled and why is Android so popular on the cellphone market?

Simply put, they have become easier to use.

I remember back to the RedHat 2.0 days, it was the first Linux I tried, it was so hard to use, I had to mount every hard drive and partition manually, I had to give executable permissions to everything I downloaded even if it was an rpm file, the way to start most programs was by typing in the name of the program along with the parameters on the Terminal, etc, it was such a pain to use, now do we do that anymore? I dont think so, now it is easier to use, so do you see a pattern there???

There could be 2 versions, one server/developer oriented version and one desktop oriented.
latinomanz
Level 2
Level 2
 
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:55 pm

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby squeezy on Sun Mar 25, 2012 3:17 pm

tdockery97 wrote:Image


+1 :!:
squeezy
Level 5
Level 5
 
Posts: 567
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:05 pm
Location: The Land of Enchantment

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby rhodry on Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:40 pm

squeezy wrote:
tdockery97 wrote:Image


+1 :!:


Troll for sure!!
Just look at his posts since joining! He has been reported.

rhodry.
Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass...
it's about learning to dance in the rain.
rhodry
Level 4
Level 4
 
Posts: 347
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2007 7:32 am

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby latinomanz on Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:01 pm

Your mom is what?
latinomanz
Level 2
Level 2
 
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:55 pm

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby Pilosopong Tasyo on Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:37 pm

latinomanz wrote:I went to the software sources and I could not see a way to update my repositories

When you say [sic] 'update my repositories' I interpreted it as either one of the following:

(1) Modifying your local repository list (add/remove/enable/disable repositories, etc.), in which case the Software Sources utility answers that need; and
(2) Synchronizing the local repository list with that of the distro, in which case Synaptic Package Manager, and -- as Aging Technogeek added -- Update Manager will do that for you.

latinomanz wrote:I am not computer dump, I am a full programmer.

Nobody is saying that you are computer dump (or is that a typo and you meant dumb?), and neither is anyone contesting your claim as being a [sic] 'full programmer.' But it only takes a bit of common sense and patience to do a little bit of exploring -- hardly a big deal of brain effort. And if you can't find what you were trying to look for, you could have just asked at the appropriate section in the forum. But from the looks of your initial post and subsequent post thereafter, you did neither.

Now, since you are a full programmer, perhaps you could contribute some of your time and skills in improving the software you didn't pay for? :wink:
Last edited by Pilosopong Tasyo on Mon Mar 26, 2012 12:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
Image
o Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day. Teach him how to fish and he will eat for a lifetime!
o If an issue has been fixed, please edit your first post and add the word [SOLVED].
User avatar
Pilosopong Tasyo
Level 6
Level 6
 
Posts: 1126
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 3:26 am
Location: Philippines

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby latinomanz on Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:59 pm

I mean for me, the way Mint is is fine, I can use it this way, i have been using it on a off for years now and now I use it since this year as my main OS, but I was thinking more about the average user who just want a click and voila!!! he gets what he wants. Kinda like an operating system for dummies, so I was just trying to help because I thought that Mint's owners wanted to make Mint more mainstream.

Yeah I meant dumb, but I wonder if it is better to be a dumb than a dump lol
latinomanz
Level 2
Level 2
 
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:55 pm

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby latinomanz on Mon Mar 26, 2012 12:09 am

Also guys does making a system prettier and easier to use mean it is trying to imitate Windows? Not really, look at OpenSuse, it looks better than Mint and it is not necessarily a copy of Windows. Imitating Windows is already being done by Zorin OS, so no need to worry about it ;-)
latinomanz
Level 2
Level 2
 
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:55 pm

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby MALsPa on Mon Mar 26, 2012 12:18 am

The more things that can be done via GUI instead of CLI, the better for many computer users. I don't think there's any argument about that.

But please just don't take away my command line! Very useful tool!

About this:

Yacy wrote:It's still 100-times easier to use a mouse then remembering dozen or hundreds of commands, and if you make the slightest misspelling while typing a command, you might lose all you data.


Personally, I don't memorize a bunch of commands. If I don't know what a command does, I check its man page, then I copy and paste into the terminal, or I call up the command from my History. I don't do much typing at the command line.
User avatar
MALsPa
Level 8
Level 8
 
Posts: 2030
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:17 pm
Location: albuquerque

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby latinomanz on Mon Mar 26, 2012 12:22 am

Yes, but still with the man pages and google, etc., still most computer users would rather use a GUI, now whenever I have to use the command line i google for 2 mins, copy and paste and problem solved but most fellas are not willing to go through that when on MAC or Windows they can just click and get what they want.
latinomanz
Level 2
Level 2
 
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:55 pm

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby MALsPa on Mon Mar 26, 2012 12:33 am

latinomanz wrote:Yes, but still with the man pages and google, etc., still most computer users would rather use a GUI, now whenever I have to use the command line i google for 2 mins, copy and paste and problem solved but most fellas are not willing to go through that when on MAC or Windows they can just click and get what they want.


Yeah, I understand, and that's why I say that the more stuff that can be done via GUI instead of via the command line, the better for many users. I get your point. At the same time, you don't want to take away this tool (CLI) just because some people don't want to use it.

Seems to me that there are lots of Linux users who rarely use the command line, anyway. Most stuff can be done via GUI.
User avatar
MALsPa
Level 8
Level 8
 
Posts: 2030
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:17 pm
Location: albuquerque

Re: No command line, just click.

Postby latinomanz on Mon Mar 26, 2012 12:54 pm

Well,

I am glad most people backed me up on this one.

Thanks folks!!!
latinomanz
Level 2
Level 2
 
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:55 pm

Linux Mint is funded by ads and donations.
 
Next

Return to Suggestions & New Ideas

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests