Installed Celena, can't install windows

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Installed Celena, can't install windows

Postby rootkowski on Thu Oct 11, 2007 1:32 pm

Hello everyone!

I just made a nice fresh install of Celena on nicely newly partitioned harddisk. I followed the wiki about partitioning. Though not in 100%. The thing is, though Celena works very well, I cannot install windows xp. :oops: When I boot the pc with the cd in it just says something like: setup is inspecting the hardware and after that the screen is just black and the cd drive quiet. Any idea what might be wrong?

The partitioning is as follows:
Primary
1. /boot
2. /
Extended to the rest of the drive
Logical
3. /usr
4. /opt
5. /var
6. /an ntfs for windows
7. /an ntfs for windows documents
8. /home
9. swap

I read somewhere once that xp has to be on the first partition of the drive, but since on the wiki it said it didn't I took the risk. Is there any way I can now install windows? All help will be very appreciated! Thanx a lot![/list]
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Re: Installed Celena, can't install windows

Postby scorp123 on Thu Oct 11, 2007 3:57 pm

rootkowski wrote: setup is inspecting the hardware and after that the screen is just black and the cd drive quiet. Any idea what might be wrong?
It's a bug in Windows XP. It can't handle your harddisk partition tables and gets stuck in an infinite loop ("black screen of death" during setup). Best thing would be to give an empty harddisk to it with a completely empty partition table; you will probably need a second harddisk for this ...

For some experiment here in the office I had to remove a Kubuntu installation and put XP on the PC ... and I had the same problem that you are facing now. Black screen of death during XP setup, right when it boots. Only after I removed all partitions via a Linux live CD I was able to install XP. But I guess removing all your Linux partitions is not really what you want? Hence my suggestion above to give Windows a completely empty harddisk it can install on, e.g. a spare disk somewhere somehow?

Besides: Always install Windows first and Linux afterwards. Windows has the nasty habit of overwriting whatever boot loader code it finds in the 'Master Boot Record'. If you install Windows after Linux it will most definitely ruin your GRUB which you'd then need repair first or else you won't be able to get into Linux again. Linux on the other hand detects Windows' boot loader code and integrates it automatically into GRUB. Hence what I said above: Always install Windows first.
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Postby rootkowski on Thu Oct 11, 2007 4:20 pm

Thanks for your reply. I guess you confirmed my fears ;-)

I've been googling and I've read so much about this issue, that I'm dizzy and still haven't found a(nother from what you gave) solution. But I just wonder (I don't know much of such things so don't laugh too much if it's a stupid idea) if i would flag my linux partitions as hidden, they should be hidden for windows too, right? Would it work then to install win?

Thank you again for the reply :-)
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Postby carlos on Thu Oct 11, 2007 4:48 pm

I second what scorp is saying here. I recently installed celena on a dell d800, windows was previously installed on it. I had to repartition the hard drive and free up space for linux. Mind u windows was installed first. Just make sure that the hard drive is defragged then repartiton afterwards, which u can do while installing linux via the livecd.

There are some good articles online just google for it. Good luck.
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Postby rebecca232a on Sat Oct 13, 2007 9:28 am

Just confirming that the windows installation system is abominable! If you're going for a dula boot system or even a triple boot, make sure that Windows is the first thing installed to the disk.

From my experimenting, there's are two major operating systems that don't play nicely with anyone - and they're Windows and Solaris - which thinks that you coldn't possibly want to share a hard disk with another OS (mind you - that was an early version of Solaris 10 - they might have fixed it now!)

Another problem I found with Windows installs after experimenting with early linux was that windows NT (family?) would flat our refuse to install on a disk saying that the disk identifier was wrong. I had to get around that by ghosting an old windows image on the machine and then installing NT over the top.
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Postby scorp123 on Sat Oct 13, 2007 10:44 am

rebecca232a wrote: mind you - that was an early version of Solaris 10 - they might have fixed it now!
Nope. They didn't :lol: SUN doesn't even consider this as being a 'bug'. It's a *Feature* :lol: Solaris still flat out destroys your disk and re-partitions it from start to end Solaris-style by putting its 8 disk slices on it. Amen. Bye bye files, bye bye Linux, bye bye Windows, bye bye whatever else was on that disk. SUN's mantra seems to be: "When you have Solaris, you don't need anything else ..."

If you want to try out Solaris: The safest way still is either to use a 100% dedicated machine for this or to put it into a virtual machine (e.g. VMware, VirtualBox ...) where it can't do any damage.
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Postby scorp123 on Sat Oct 13, 2007 11:14 am

rootkowski wrote: if i would flag my linux partitions as hidden, they should be hidden for windows too, right? Would it work then to install win?
You can try that. But I doubt it will work. Hidden or not, those partitions still occupy space and they still have address entries in the partition table, and it will still confuse the Windows installer and cause it to go into an infinite loop which will give you a "black screen of death".

Best thing would be to buy a second harddisk which is completely empty and install Windows there.

If you can't do that ... well then: In that case what I would suggest to you:

A) make a backup of your Linux installation:

1. your /etc directory where all your system settings are
2. your /home where all your personal settings are
3. your package selection (so you get all the programs back)

You would probably need a bunch of DVD-R disks or an external USB harddisk for this (they're not expensive these days ... and maybe a friend could borrow you one?)

As for "How the hell am I supposed to do a backup???" => Carefully read this thread:
http://www.linuxmint.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3969

All the steps you'd need to do above are described in that long posting. Best thing would be to print it out I guess (unless you have a second computer and you can get into the Internet when you need to ...)

Then:

B) Destroy all your Linux partitions:

Yes, I mean it. When your backup is done boot into a live CD, fire up 'gparted' or the shell program 'fdisk' and delete all partitions. Really. All of them. The partition must be completely empty afterwards. And you did make sure you really understood that thread about backups, right? :twisted:

C) Let Windows have its way:

Install it. Now the stupid installer should work. To avoid complications: Don't give the entire harddisk to Windows, just give as much or as little space you think you really need to. Leave the rest empty: that's where Linux will be reborn and come back from the dead.

D) Patch Windows:

Yes, do it. This will take all night long. If you have Windows XP with SP2 pre-installed you will need to download yet another 82 or so patches. Have fun. And remember how much fun and joy it is to use Linux :lol: It is important that you do this before you attempt to reinstall Linux. Chances are that there are a few stupid Microsoft updates that will mess with the harddisk again, so it's best not to change the harddisk structures until Windows is 100% finished with patching.

E) Time for a rebirth: Install Linux again:

Let Linux take over the empty space you left for it in step C) ... Linux should install and you should afterwards get a new GRUB boot menu which shows both Linux and Windows. That's what you wanted, right?

F) Restore your settings:

Again, it's all described in that backup thread. Basically what you need to do is the reversal of steps 1., 2. and 3. in A) above:
1. restore your /etc directory so you get your old system settings back
2. restore your /home directory so you get your personal settings back
3. restore your package selection so you get all the programs back that you had installed before (apt will download all of them again so you should then have your system back exactly how you had it before you destroyed all partitions ....).

I know it's frustrating like hell. Installing Windows on an empty second harddisk would definitely be less frustrating and less time-consuming.
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Postby rootkowski on Sun Oct 14, 2007 12:53 pm

Thank you all for your replies and great help!!!

I'm back "to life" after long hours of experimenting what works and what doesn't, where on the hard disk I can place windows and where I can't etc. And since (for now) I don't have another hard disk to put into the computer I had to let windows have it its way (hateful thing!). And yes I do enjoy reinstalling linux since it's sooo simple and restoring the files and settings as well. Instead of taking 1 or 2 days as for windows it's just a question of copying back the backed up /home partition etc. and there it is. Everything exactly as it used to be :-D

Now my hard disk is divided like this:
Primary
1. xp
2. mint
Extended
3. windows files
4. mint files
5. swap

Less ambitious than in the beginning but it works. Before I even decided to install celena instead of cassandra I had linux on an extended partition and I felt it was worth trying to move things around to see if the system(s) will boot faster. And it does!

I'm happy I had another chance to learn something. But after this lesson I do hope that the wine project will develop to such an extend that it won't be any problem at all to run any windows' app on linux. I wouldn't need to waste time and disk space on windows then.

Anyway, once again I thank you all for your wonderful help and support!

Cheers
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