A little bit of a version dilemma

Questions about the project and the distribution - obviously no support questions here please

A little bit of a version dilemma

Postby SC23 on Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:33 am

I jumped into Mint head first with 15, Olivia/Cinnamon. I didnt really research the support/updates side of it until I was way down the road. I have been very happy with it but now come January it seems the updates and such will be coming to an end. I realize I can run without updates and that nothing will quit working, but it just feels wrong to not be able to click the update button.

I am wondering how the other Olivia users out there will deal with this.

I am planning on getting the next LTS version when it comes out, but that looks like late Feb/Marchish at earliest. I thought about updating to Petra, then the LTS afterwards, but the upgrade process is basically wipe and reload..which is a chore at best, at least for a noob like me..

So the question is.. what would you suggest?

Thanks,
SC
User avatar
SC23
Level 3
Level 3
 
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:54 am

Linux Mint is funded by ads and donations.
 

Re: A little bit of a version dilemma

Postby Geoff_P on Tue Dec 17, 2013 4:36 am

I am in exactly the same situation.
I have decided to accept the "no updates" situation until LM 17 LTS version is available, which will most likely be at the end of May.
I have loaded LM 16 onto a spare laptop for evaluation, and I like it, but for me there's not a significant enough difference to warrant the time and effort in upgrading my main machine when the LTS version is only 6 months away.
Image
Geoff_P
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 4:42 am

Re: A little bit of a version dilemma

Postby xenopeek on Tue Dec 17, 2013 4:51 am

Next LTS will be a bit later than that. Somewhere around May.

I've skipped both LM15 and LM16 for my primary install (though I have LM16 installed also) and indeed will just move to LM17 once it arrives. You could "hack" and upgrade in place to LM16, but there is a risk that it won't work right and you'll need to do a clean install anyway. If you'd accept the risk, worth a shot. Else you might also consider January-May is not that long a period.
User avatar
xenopeek
Level 21
Level 21
 
Posts: 14735
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:58 am
Location: The Netherlands

Re: A little bit of a version dilemma

Postby SC23 on Tue Dec 17, 2013 5:46 am

So.. in the same boatish.. whats the down side to LM Debian? Im considering it since it does the rolling versions and I wont have to play this again. I loaded up the Live version and with Cinnamon its almost indistinguishable from the Ubuntu base. I did notice there were only 6000ish packages in the package manager..so I guess that would be one ding.. but I use my machine as a work desktop mostly and what I need is in there. What other downsides are there? And other benefits besides the rolling versions?
User avatar
SC23
Level 3
Level 3
 
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:54 am

Re: A little bit of a version dilemma

Postby xenopeek on Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:35 am

LMDE will generally be a tad faster as Debian is a more lean base system as compared to Ubuntu. Downside is you lose compatibility with Ubuntu. If you need additional programs, or newer version of them, on Ubuntu you can usually find a PPA from the developer with that. While you could theoretically use a PPA also on Debian, because of difference between Ubuntu and Debian base that's not recommend and might cause problems on your system. Ubuntu base might also support a tad more hardware devices and peripherals. If not of that is relevant for you, LMDE might be a good fit.

I'd say it does require you to be a bit more of a responsible citizen, and keep an eye on the testing ongoing for a next update pack in the
Update Packs Repositories > Linux Mint Debian Incoming forum so you know what issues you might run in to during upgrade and how to solve them. Like for UP#7 there was this topic: viewtopic.php?t=144198. UP#8 is coming up next and a similar topic will be started in that forum for that.

To clarify; LMDE has basically three repositories:
  • The Linux Mint repository where software added by Linux Mint is kept (Cinnamon, MATE, Firefox, Thunderbird, etc): http://packages.linuxmint.com/list.php?release=Debian
  • The "incoming" repository, where a few times per year upgrades from Debian testing repository are copied to and then tested for a month or so by the Linux Mint developers and interested users from the community. Users will post workarounds and solutions for issues they find, and for some issues upgrade/downgrade of packages might be done by the Linux Mint developers to fix problems.
  • The "latest" repository, which is basically a copy of the "incoming" repository after it is deemed stable enough for all users.
By default you'll have the Linux Mint repository and "lastest".

It's good to be aware that you can get upgrades through the Linux Mint repository at any time that the Linux Mint developers do upgrades there. You will only be getting upgrades for the "latest" repository when a new update pack is done (with except of security updates I believe). It's also good to understand what Debian testing repository is, and that this doesn't mean you will be running bleeding-edge versions of programs.
User avatar
xenopeek
Level 21
Level 21
 
Posts: 14735
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:58 am
Location: The Netherlands

Re: A little bit of a version dilemma

Postby SC23 on Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:07 pm

Thank you for that insight Xenopeek..

So in your opinion, once the packs are tested and released in Latest, do you think LMDE is as stable as its Ubuntu counterpart?

I really like Cinnamon and the ongoing development there, but from what I know, it seems ya kinda get locked into the version you get with your LM Ubuntu unless you get real risky and try to update it. Do you get Different versions of Cinnamon..and I suppose other system type things.. from the Latest repo.. and lastly.. how are kernel updates in that mix?

Do appreciate the infos..
User avatar
SC23
Level 3
Level 3
 
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:54 am

Re: A little bit of a version dilemma

Postby xenopeek on Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:27 pm

I'm not running LMDE so perhaps you should move other questions about it to the LMDE forum :)

As Ubuntu is taking packages from Debian testing and even unstable, I'd say there might not be that much of a difference stability wise. But only if you are a responsible citizen. You can't run a rolling release without reading up on issues you might face before upgrading. Arch Linux for example, a true rolling release (you can get upgrades any minute of the day), gets slack for being less stable and breaking on users. That's just users not being reponsible; waiting too long to upgrade and not reading up on latest news of things they need to be aware of before upgrading. The same, but less frequently because you have upgrades just a few times per year, goes for LMDE is my opinion.

With regards to Cinnamon, the new version of Cinnamon usually gets tested along with a new update pack. In that regard it might be a little more predictable that using PPA to get the new version of Cinnamon on older, non-LTS, releases of Linux Mint (Cinnamon is backported to the LTS release, and tested with that).
User avatar
xenopeek
Level 21
Level 21
 
Posts: 14735
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:58 am
Location: The Netherlands

Re: A little bit of a version dilemma

Postby SC23 on Tue Dec 17, 2013 4:32 pm

Aaahhh I get it now.. you get continual security updates.. and then periodically you get system/os version upgrades as update packs.. and before you do an update pack, you research possible issues and such..

Much to chew on and consider :)

TY Again my always informative friend!
User avatar
SC23
Level 3
Level 3
 
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:54 am

An Update

Postby SC23 on Mon Jan 06, 2014 5:28 pm

After much gashing of teeth, I decided to backup my data, repartition my drive as it was a mess with tests, and do a clean load from scratch. After I did the install, I created a data partition and now I have an OS partition and a data partition. My hand was pressed when my small Mint partition finally got full..so I decided to install Mint 16 Cinn, ride it out until the LTS comes out and be upgrade ready..

If my drive wouldnt have been so messed up and full I would have probably ridden out 15 until the LTS.. Theres not significant change in 16 to move from 15 (which was great for me) imho..
User avatar
SC23
Level 3
Level 3
 
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:54 am

Linux Mint is funded by ads and donations.
 

Return to Non-technical Questions

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests