Why does anyone use linux?

Chat about Linux in general

Why does anyone use linux?

Postby rxd on Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:36 am

Not a flame question, just curious. Why does anyone use Linux? I have been trying to use Linux Mint on a laptop that I dual boot with Windows 8.1 and I just keep running into problems. While I am certainly not a huge fan of Windows, it does seem to "just work". Latest example of many of my issues, I need to connect to one of our offices via L2TP vpn. Can't get it to work. Works fine on Windows 8.1, Windows 7, iPhone, iPad. Doesn't work with Linux Mint.

Nobody uses vpn with Linux? Is this just a hobbiest OS? I have spent days searching the internet for an answer and find none. How can people be using Linux for work without the ability to vpn in to their office?

Don't get me wrong, Linux Mint seems like a really nice OS. I guess that's why I get frustrated when basic features like vpn don't work. In the past few months how many times am I on the road using Linux and then the office calls me. Oops, time for a reboot to load Windows.... Really?
rxd
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:33 pm

Linux Mint is funded by ads and donations.
 

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby xenopeek on Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:47 am

Linux works fine with L2TP VPN, at least with L2TP/IPSec. Perhaps your office is using some variant that locks you in to one vendor? You can run a L2TP/IPSec VPN server on Linux Mint that can be connected to from iOS and Android as well, and you can connect to a L2TP/IPSec VPN server running on <whatever> from Linux Mint.

When searching for help, you may find better hits when searching for Ubuntu or Debian (depending on which Linux Mint you are using). There are several easy step-by-step guides to set up a connection to L2TP/IPSec from either. You'll probably need l2tp-ipsec-vpn. There are some dependency problems in Debian testing that cause it to not be available there right now.

Proprietary (closed source) software used in companies can cause problems to use Linux for work. Wine can solve some things, for others there may be a Linux native alternative you can use to connect to a proprietary server, and sometimes--yes--it requires a policy change. Promoting an open source alternative and getting your company out of the vendor locked-in forced upgrade cycle pit of despair :wink:
User avatar
xenopeek
Level 21
Level 21
 
Posts: 15451
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:58 am
Location: The Netherlands

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby rxd on Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:56 am

I am trying to set up my laptop as a l2tp vpn client to a Cisco ASA device.

I am using the same settings that I use for my iPhone, iPad, Windows 7 and Windows 8 pc's in the L2TP Ipsec VPN Applet and Manger.

How do you connect and to what? What vpn client software are you using?
rxd
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:33 pm

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby xenopeek on Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:02 am

I can't recall :( Most things I need to connect from home to work for I can access over public Internet so it's been a few years since I set up to connect to Cisco VPN on Linux.

What specifics settings you need to access your server, IDK. Have you install l2tp-ipsec-vpn and are you using that?
User avatar
xenopeek
Level 21
Level 21
 
Posts: 15451
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:58 am
Location: The Netherlands

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby rxd on Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:11 am

Yes, that's the package that was installed with the L2TP Ipsec vpn manager package.

We don't use any proprietary software to connect. We use the built in vpn software in IOS and in Windows.
rxd
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:33 pm

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby rxd on Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:41 pm

Still after a month of searching the internet I can find no answer.
Linux just isn't ready for the big time.
Pity
rxd
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:33 pm

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby macrohard on Mon Mar 17, 2014 10:08 pm

As a response for connecting to Cisco VPN device over IPSec (such as a Cisco ASA), one option that might be suitable might be Shrewsoft:

https://www.shrew.net/home
macrohard
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2014 6:44 pm

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby MALsPa on Tue Mar 18, 2014 12:46 am

rxd wrote:Nobody uses vpn with Linux?

I don't know anything about VPN, but a quick web search using the terms linux mint vpn leads me to believe that yes, quite a few people do use VPN with Linux.

rxd wrote:Linux just isn't ready for the big time.
Pity

Pft. Yeah, pity.
User avatar
MALsPa
Level 8
Level 8
 
Posts: 2030
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:17 pm
Location: albuquerque

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby eanfrid on Tue Mar 18, 2014 2:36 am

I use free open source ssl and ipsec VPNs all the time on my network since many years. You are looking for the wrong kind of software: (closed source) VPN clients for (expensive) commercial closed source VPNs meant to run on a proprietary OS. These companies make money by selling their software, you know.
Main desktop: Debian GNU/Linux Wheezy 64bit - MATE 1.8.1
(i5 2400@3.7GHz - 16GB DDR3 - HD6770 w/radeon driver - SSD+RAID1)
Safer than Dropbox
User avatar
eanfrid
Level 7
Level 7
 
Posts: 1871
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2012 2:49 am
Location: FR

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby rxd on Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:38 am

Why do you think I'm looking for something proprietary?

I am trying to get L2TP-IPSec working. This is something closed source?

It's just the stock garbage answer when something in Linux doesn't work right. "You're doing something closed source...", "Use such and such BS instead...", "You shouldn't do that...".

stuff. This OS doesn't support a lot of things that it should. Instead of creating news distros or desktops everyday why not actually make Linux work better? Because doing the new shiny stuff is more fun but doing the ugly grunt work of making the OS more usable sucks. But without that grunt work getting done Linux will be stuck at 2% usage.

Whatever. It's a shame because Linux really could have made major gains especially with the Windows 8 debacle.
rxd
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:33 pm

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby Habitual on Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:13 am

Linux is not Windows.
Baby Duck Syndrome?

VPN HOWTO
How to Setup a VPN (PPTP) Server on DebianLinux
What's a landing but a take off in reverse?
User avatar
Habitual
Level 8
Level 8
 
Posts: 2274
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2010 8:31 pm
Location: LM17Q-Xfce

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby MALsPa on Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:43 am

As they say, "Linux isn't for everyone." The OP asks, "Why does anyone use linux?" For a lot of us, it's simply a better OS than Windows or OS-X or whatever -- for everyday usage, not just for some kind of hobby. In my case, when I started out with Linux I did have to keep my Windows computer for a couple of job-related things. Didn't cause me to moan and complain about Linux, though, and it didn't stop me from eventually getting to a point where I got rid of my Windows computer; I've been using only Linux at home for some years now.

Sorry I can't help with the VPN issues but to me it sure looks like other Linux users are using VPN with Linux. Good luck.
User avatar
MALsPa
Level 8
Level 8
 
Posts: 2030
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:17 pm
Location: albuquerque

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby rxd on Thu Mar 20, 2014 8:35 am

Sure, the built in PPTP VPN works perfect. Unfortunately I also need L2TP IPSEC for some clients. Doesn't work at all. And that sums up Linux in a nutshell. If you only need the things that work in it, and that's WAY LESS than Windows, it's great. But otherwise you are just going to keep running into brick walls...
rxd
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:33 pm

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby xenopeek on Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:20 am

L2TP/IPSec works problem free on Linux, both as a server and as a client. However, for your particular server--sure, it might not work with that one specifically. That's always the case in the corporate world... At my employer, for some internal websites only IE works right, for others we're told IE doesn't work at all and we either use Google Chrome or Firefox. Some have Java applets, and for some you need a newer JRE or they don't work, while others don't yet work right with the newer JRE :| Yes, sure, on Windows everything works just fine :lol:

You have one example of a thing that for you works on Windows, but doesn't work on Linux. Don't blow up that one example. That said, as we like to say around here--use whatever works best for you to get the job done.
User avatar
xenopeek
Level 21
Level 21
 
Posts: 15451
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:58 am
Location: The Netherlands

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby Distro-Don on Thu Mar 20, 2014 1:19 pm

You ask, "why does anyone use Linux?". I use Linux because It does everything I want to do better than anything other that I have tried. If I needed to do something that needed Windows, for example, I would use it to do that, if I could do it off line so that I didn't have to worry about getting a virus . In other words, I would use whatever worked the best. For me, right now, that is LMDE MATE.
Distro-Don
Level 3
Level 3
 
Posts: 100
Joined: Thu May 23, 2013 8:43 pm

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby rxd on Mon Mar 24, 2014 8:56 am

xenopeek wrote:L2TP/IPSec works problem free on Linux, both as a server and as a client. However, for your particular server--sure, it might not work with that one specifically. That's always the case in the corporate world... At my employer, for some internal websites only IE works right, for others we're told IE doesn't work at all and we either use Google Chrome or Firefox. Some have Java applets, and for some you need a newer JRE or they don't work, while others don't yet work right with the newer JRE :| Yes, sure, on Windows everything works just fine :lol:

You have one example of a thing that for you works on Windows, but doesn't work on Linux. Don't blow up that one example. That said, as we like to say around here--use whatever works best for you to get the job done.


Lol, google linux l2tp and see how many people are having problems with it with no solution....
rxd
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:33 pm

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby fraxinus_63 on Tue Mar 25, 2014 4:59 am

My few pence worth on this debate:

The thread title is not helpful. For many of us, Linux is easily the best choice for our working lives - and the fact that we don't pay for the product doesn't even come into it. Good security - configurability and choice of working environment - the right and the power to modify packages and scripts as we need - help and learning opportunities in the community - did I mention security :D ?

However, the issue of Linux connectivity with corporate VPNs is a very serious topic and a bit of an elephant in the room. I work at home for myself so this does not affect me. However, over the last 18 months two Linux-using friends of mine have had to revert to Win desktops because of issues with corporate (and university) VPNs. These are knowledegable people who like the challenge of problems but have simply not had the time to deal with these issues adequately.

If I had to deal with a VPN I would attempt a native Linux solution - but if I ran into problems I'd run a Windows guest in VirtualBox. That's OK for me - I use VB all the time and have a virtual WIndows setup already. However, many less technical Linux users would find this a challenge. Without tech support from someone I suspect they would not take this route - even if they knew it existed.
fraxinus_63
Level 3
Level 3
 
Posts: 157
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2010 2:25 pm

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby rxd on Sun Apr 06, 2014 8:25 am

Thanks fraxinus for at least conceding that there IS a problem with Linux and corporate vpn's.

You can't imagine how annoying it is to get these stock Linux "answers" that the problem does not exist.

Nonsense. The problem does exist and there is no solution. And this is the problem with Linux. It either works or it doesn't. If it works for you, you sing its praises. If it doesn't you're screwed and the Linux "gurus" insist it does work and you're doing something wrong or are dumb...
rxd
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:33 pm

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby xenopeek on Sun Apr 06, 2014 8:53 am

Well, I'm sorry if it came across as that. You mentioned L2TP VPN and when I Googled that all my top hits are tutorials for various Linux distros on how to set that up (Ubuntu, Arch Linux, Gentoo, etc.) and tutorials from VPN providers on how to use their L2TP VPN from Linux. You say you see many errors when you search for it; Google must have us in non-overlapping filter bubbles :wink: I highly doubt all these tutorials are there if it doesn't work in those scenarios (I got it to work also, after all). But okay, it doesn't work in your scenario and that's a bummer.

Your question was "why does anyone use Linux" and you implied L2TP VPN doesn't work. I think the majority of people haven't a clue what that is, and never use or need it. So why do they use Linux? Because everything they need works for them on Linux :wink:
User avatar
xenopeek
Level 21
Level 21
 
Posts: 15451
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:58 am
Location: The Netherlands

Re: Why does anyone use linux?

Postby zeke on Sun Apr 06, 2014 10:33 am

A few years ago, I tried and failed to get a linux client connected to my company's vpn. I believe it was actually a client supplied by the vpn vendor (Cisco I believe). In my case as I recall, the client made an initial connection, but it failed with a message about some component that was unavailable on the server (I've long since forgotten the details). I didn't pursue it very far, as ssh tunneling was adequate for what I need to do, but I suspected a configuration issue on the server. The IT people at my company aren't unfamiliar with linux, and in fact it is used quite a bit internally. However, I got the impression nobody else had asked them about problems w/ a linux vpn client (I believe linux users tend to use ssh tunneling, and I think the administrators would prefer that option if it's adequate).

My point is that I would guess there are a lot of variables involved in getting things to work in all situations - if there is evidence others have been successful, and you're talking about one environment (sorry I haven't read every post in the thread), I would suspect something specific, and possibly common to other situations where there are problems, that is preventing things from working.
zeke
Level 1
Level 1
 
Posts: 29
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2010 6:34 pm

Linux Mint is funded by ads and donations.
 
Next

Return to Chat about Linux

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests