The house of cards is starting to fall.

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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby exploder on Fri Aug 06, 2010 9:50 pm

I'd love to give it a try, except that the PCLinuxOS site has been down every time I've tried to connect to it.


Here is what happened, it has happened to us too in the past.

PCLinuxOS is offline due to spammers hacking into the website. We are looking into the matter.
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby bobcollard on Fri Aug 06, 2010 11:06 pm

libssd wrote:
BubbaBlues wrote:I think you're going to be very very happy with PCLOS. And tell 'em I said hello. 8)

I'd love to give it a try, except that the PCLinuxOS site has been down every time I've tried to connect to it.

You can download from here :
http://distrowatch.com/?newsid=06178
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby Robin on Sat Aug 07, 2010 9:14 am

It didn't last very long. There were a few issues and no real help. One example was that no matter what browser I used (and I tried three) to download the pdf version of their PCLinuxOS magazine, the download would just stop about 1/4th of the way through and then the little pop-up message said, "All files have finished downloading."

But when I went to open them another pop-up said, "Encrypted: Enter password to view this pdf file."

All they would tell me in the forum is that "It's not encrypted."

No Duh. Thanks, that's helpful.

I can download it in Debian with no problem. Yep, not encrypted alright. But a shame that their own users can't download it.

Looks like a great distro for those for whom it works. My big brother loves it. I tried it a year ago and ran into similar issues then. The issues remain and the questions go unanswered, so I'm done. On to Mepis for a test drive...

-Robin
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby Rifester on Sat Aug 07, 2010 9:48 am

Robin,
Let me know your thoughts on Mepis... I have been following your distro path closely and I am interested in what you think about it. Mepis recognized all of my hardware perfectly. I just wish I could like KDE more. Maybe I just need to use it for a few months. I like the interface, I just don't care for most of the KDE applications. Mepis runs very fast on my machines and the forums seem very friendly (which is important).

Mark
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby MALsPa on Sat Aug 07, 2010 11:20 am

Rifester wrote:Robin,
Let me know your thoughts on Mepis... I have been following your distro path closely and I am interested in what you think about it. Mepis recognized all of my hardware perfectly. I just wish I could like KDE more. Maybe I just need to use it for a few months. I like the interface, I just don't care for most of the KDE applications. Mepis runs very fast on my machines and the forums seem very friendly (which is important).

Mark


Interesting how some folks have such a preference for one or the other (KDE or GNOME). At one time, I couldn't stand GNOME. You might be right, spending time with KDE might change your point of view, that's what happened with me and GNOME.

I think Mepis is great, surprised more people don't use it.
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby Robin on Sat Aug 07, 2010 2:14 pm

I think that alot more users are going to find their way to Mepis as Ubuntu continues it's spiral into bug-oblivion. In an effort to get "closer to Debian," which is known to be rock-stable (even Sid is rock stable compared to Ubuntu), folks who have had trouble installing and/or configuring Debian will look for a "ready-to-use" distro that is - as much as possible at least - Debian.

KDE4 looks absolutely wonderful! I've always admired the K-applications and stuff. But it's just too much for my poor ol' hand-me-down hardware. Maybe when I grow up and get rich and can afford a super-powerful mega-computer with a zillion terrabytes of RAM and a transwarp-speed processor I'll give KDE another shot.

Looking for "Mepis Lite?" AntiX looks really cool. And you can add a desktop environment to it if you like (I'm an Xfce fanboy lately, finally settling on it after a year of trial and error. :mrgreen: ). On top of AntiX it might be kinda sorta like Crunchbang's new Statler Xfce version (based on Debian Squeeze). Both offer an easier way for some folks to install Debian, too.

Hop hop hop,
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby MALsPa on Sat Aug 07, 2010 2:33 pm

Robin wrote:as Ubuntu continues it's spiral into bug-oblivion


Ubuntu's demise doesn't appear to be imminent. Lucid looks very good here.
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby bobcollard on Sat Aug 07, 2010 6:33 pm

MALsPa wrote:
Robin wrote:as Ubuntu continues it's spiral into bug-oblivion


Ubuntu's demise doesn't appear to be imminent. Lucid looks very good here.

Apparently you have not seen the BIG picture. Even Mint is thinking of shying away for Ubuntu.
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby MALsPa on Sat Aug 07, 2010 6:43 pm

bobcollard wrote:
MALsPa wrote:
Robin wrote:as Ubuntu continues it's spiral into bug-oblivion


Ubuntu's demise doesn't appear to be imminent. Lucid looks very good here.

Apparently you have not seen the BIG picture. Even Mint is thinking of shying away for Ubuntu.


Just callin' 'em like I see 'em. Lucid looks great here. And, has Clem said he's considering moving Mint away from an Ubuntu-based? I may have missed that, but so far all I've seen are plans for a Debian-based Mint version. it may lead to plans for for Mint to move to a Debian base, but if you're waiting for Ubuntu to "spiral" into oblivion, you might not want to hold your breath.
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby tdockery97 on Sat Aug 07, 2010 7:15 pm

Ubuntu will not go away any more than Windows will go away. Nor should they. Every user has their needs and every OS has its uses. It's an OS, not a lifestyle. Excuse me while I go have a MINT Julep. :D
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby exploder on Sat Aug 07, 2010 7:49 pm

It is not about Ubuntu going away, if it works for you then you are lucky. Many of us are tired of our hardware not being properly supported, common everyday run of the mill hardware. Also, bugs not being addressed, fsck not working, come on, we all know it is never going to be fixed. I spent a day and a half getting my graphics working right, then an update from the main repos trashed the default theme. It was bad enough having to fix the graphics and fsck but the default theme being trashed was the final straw. If the Ubuntu base works right for you consider yourself very fortunate but for a large number of us the Ubuntu base is a piece of junk.
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby bobcollard on Sat Aug 07, 2010 8:17 pm

As more and more distros are finding out, it is not possible to meet the dates set if you don't have the base to work from. They spend more time ironing out the bugs for Ubuntu to get their own distros working than finalizing their projects. In the mean time Ubuntu is meeting their deadlines without fixing anything and leaving their people high and dry. The bugs are not fixed, the problems are getting worse. Robin is right. This cannot go on.
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby waldo on Sun Aug 08, 2010 1:27 am

There's a fallacy here. These threads attract those with issues, and not those for whom there are no serious problems. Like the Ubuntu 10.04 installation that I am using to write this. After the first month or two of about 300 updates, it is now running very well. But by now I know that Ubuntu releases beta software, so I know to wait before I use it for important tasks. They do get it fixed, however. At least well enough for most of us.

If the Google metrics are accurate (and they are more accurate than any count I can do), then Ubuntu is used on more desktops than ALL OTHER Linux distros combined. They do have bragging rights, and they do have many very satisfied users. I think Mint is better off staying with a winner.

Perhaps Mint would be better off waiting for three or four months after the Ubuntu release to claim theirs is ready? Maybe February and August? Why the rush to come out just after Ubuntu? Mint could still keep the six month cycle, just use it more cautiously. (Okay, maybe put it out as a Release Candidate in November and May, but keep that RC status longer.)

Or maybe it's just more fun to grouse endlessly about the most popular system.
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby Robin on Sun Aug 08, 2010 6:45 am

I absolutely loved Ubuntu (and Mint!) and never had a technical issue (although I've always objected to the inclusion of beta software in a distro that bills itself as "beginner-friendly") until Lucid. And I looked forward very much to Lucid for two reasons:

1. It's a LTS version so I could share it with others knowing it will be supported for a good long while, and

2. For the first time an Ubuntu release was being based on Debian Testing instead of Debian Unstable. I hoped that it would mean "more stable, less prone to breakage" than the usual non-LTS releases.

Okay, so maybe number two describes unrealistic expectations, but "everyone knows," I think, that Debian Testing is more stable than Debian Unstable, right? Perhaps I should have known that even Lenny in Canonical's hands could become outright volatile and crash-prone.

Updates killed my Xubuntu 10.04, which for the first time included PulseAudio (why? No default program in Xubuntu 10.04 depends on it), which I instantly removed first thing, and Plymouth (trouble free on my machine, but I've read that it causes video problems on alot of common hardware - so why use it in a LTS release? Is super-fast boot time really important enough to cripple people's video?).

It's some of their policies that don't make any sense to me, but Ubuntu remains a great distro IF people generally stick to these two rules, which I would recommend to anyone new to Linux:

Ubuntu/Mint users should -

1. - Stay (at least) one release behind the current release, since it's almost never safe and stable at release time. Months later, it'll be alot safer and more reliable.

2. - Set up the Update Manager to accept only security updates and ignore the "recommended" updates that are known to b0rk a perfectly good working system.

Following one or both of those "rules" would probably make Ubuntu safe and fun to use. Of course the Mint team is able to "catch" alot of the junk coming at their users from upstream, but when a release is new, that flotsam from upstream is coming down quickly, furiously, and in large quantities!

-Robin
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby randomizer on Sun Aug 08, 2010 7:02 am

Being based on Debian Testing means little. If I start painting with a canvas that is covered in paint splatters and I throw more paint on it, I'll end up with a crappy finished work. If I start with the Mona Lisa and throw paint all over it, guess what, it's still crap when it's done!
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby hinto on Sun Aug 08, 2010 9:56 am

Robin wrote:Okay, so maybe number two describes unrealistic expectations, but "everyone knows," I think, that Debian Testing is more stable than Debian Unstable, right? Perhaps I should have known that even Lenny in Canonical's hands could become outright volatile and crash-prone.
-Robin


Not really, I ran with Debian unstable (sidux) for ~7 years. If a bug pops up, then it is quashed (usually) within the week.
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby alpha1 on Mon Aug 09, 2010 4:46 pm

Mepis 8 as well as 8.5 has issues opening my NTFS drives (HArd disk as well as removable).
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby bobcollard on Mon Aug 09, 2010 6:47 pm

alpha1 wrote:Mepis 8 as well as 8.5 has issues opening my NTFS drives (HArd disk as well as removable).

Go here for help;
http://mepislovers.org/forums/index.php
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby libssd on Mon Aug 09, 2010 7:53 pm

While waiting for the PCLinuxOS site to come back up, I did a little sleuthing, and stumbled on Pardus.

Since Ubuntu 10.04 is working perfectly for me, and gives me greater control than Mint 9, I really have no incentive to try out yet another distribution, but if I did, I would probably start by looking at Pardus.

Review here: http://cristalinux.blogspot.com/2010/06 ... 20092.html
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Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Postby randomizer on Tue Aug 10, 2010 1:53 am

I managed to get a working Arch installation going and I'm quite enjoying it. I really don't mind editing files and getting dirty with the CLI to get it how I want. No stupid copy/paste bugs either, and no Glipper/Klipper required to achieve it :)
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