Networking Notworking! (SOLVED)

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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby TuftyDave on Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:59 am

altair4 The windows machines ARE already on fixed ip addresses AND already in /etc/hosts
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby TuftyDave on Wed Apr 17, 2013 5:01 am

(post deleted)
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby altair4 on Wed Apr 17, 2013 6:46 am

TuftyDave wrote:altair4 The windows machines ARE already on fixed ip addresses AND already in /etc/hosts

Then I cannot help you as I cannot reproduce your symptoms.

You claim that you can connect to these machines by ip address so I would bookmark them that way as I explained in a previous post.
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby Dominosdad on Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:33 am

I've been following this with keen interest, if not always understanding.
However, my own aim, and I'm sure many others, was to install Linux, use it on an everyday basis (with the GUI) and get to grips with the command line stuff as I go along.
And the fact that basic network uses aren't available "out of the box" rather undermines the GUI approach.
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby altair4 on Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:46 am

Dominosdad wrote:And the fact that basic network uses aren't available "out of the box" rather undermines the GUI approach.

Samba has worked for me out of the box for almost 10 years now - As soon as I moved away from Suse and started using Debian based distos. There are certain things that ocassionally get in the way but they are simple to fix:

Samba Browsing Problems Checklist: viewtopic.php?f=42&t=88146&start=0

The newest generation of routers is adding a new complication to this mechanism and in this particular case I will admit that I have no idea what's going on but it's beginning to feel like there are multiple routers in play here.
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby roblm on Wed Apr 17, 2013 12:51 pm

This problem is very perplexing. I agree with altair4. I have a 4 computer network that has 3 Windows XP systems and a Linux Mint system, which was set up without any major difficulty. I have also tested on this network a Ubuntu, Puppy Linux, Windows 7 and Windows 8 systems. The only time I had a major headache was trying to get the Puppy Linux system to connect with the printer attached to one of the WinXP systems. I have a Linksys router that is about 5 years old.
TuftyDave, I'm recommending starting from the beginning and going over every configuration on the WinXP system and Mint system.
I would also like to see the files I requested from you yesterday.
I think it would be easier if you could turn off the Vista system and work with the other two first.
Make sure the Linux firewall is really off when testing. If you run the GUFW command in terminal, the status of the firewall may appear to be off but it is actually on. Run the "sudo ufw disable" command to be sure.
On your WinXP machine under Local Area Connection > Internet Protocol (TCP/IP) > Properties > Advanced > Wins > , I assume the box next
to "Enable LMHosts lookup" is checked, and in the NetBios setting below it try changing the default setting to "Enable NetBios over TCP/IP". Also, when you make changes on the Windows system, you need to also restart the Mint system to see the effect.
Last edited by roblm on Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:50 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby TuftyDave on Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:15 pm

I'd like to just make an observation at this point....
The error I get from Nemo when attempting to access the Windows network is primarily "UNABLE TO MOUNT"
I think I've said more than once that I CAN access at least one fo the Windows machines in other ways.
Specifically, I CAN use the 'smb://192.168.0.108' URL in firefox.
That DOES open the shared files on my windows box and I CAN access them and I CAN drop files in there.
Logic tells me then that there isn't problem with my router blocking anyhting or ports being closed that should be open because i CAN access with read & write permission the remote windows system.
Furthermore after I've issued the smb URL and looked in one of the shared folders, a mounted system appears in Nemo showing that directory.
So once again, I CAN ACCESS DATA, but not the way I should or want to be able to.
I should be able to click the Windows Network Icon to gain access to the shared computers & data.
So is this not a MOUNTING problem? Shouldn't we be looking at where the MOUNT is attempted & how it done & what variables it gets and where it gets them from?
Again, forgive me if I'm being silly, I don't know the Linux systme at all, but it seems logical to me to try to find out why it's not MOUNTING when that is what the error message says?
Last edited by TuftyDave on Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby TuftyDave on Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:22 pm

I should add however that the smb://[ip address] URL isn't a 'solution' for me, as I didn't intend to use firefox, and it only works on the windows XP machine, it doesn't work at all on the Vista machine.
I would like to be able to do what the OS is 'supposed' to do and open / mount my networked windows machines with Nemo by clicking on the 'windows network' icon.
So again, can anyone help with how I look into why the 'mount' isn't working?
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby altair4 on Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:39 pm

** The very first post was about "share list" which is a name resolution issue. Now it sounds like a Windows permissions issue.

** You don't put smb://192.168.0.xxx in Firefox you put it in Nemo:
Code: Select all
nemo smb://192.168.0.xxx

When Nemo opens up bookmark it: Bookmarks > Create Bookmark

It will show up on the left side panel of nemo just like a "mapped" drive does in Windows. You can even right click the bookmark and rename it to STEVEVAIO or whatever.

** As far as the machine that you cannot access this way pass the user name of the person who owns the share:
Code: Select all
nemo smb://user-name@192.168.0.yyy

See if you get prompted for a password.

The problem may not the SMB permissions of the Windows share but the NTFS permissions of what's being shared. Does the folder itself allow the Linux user read / write access.
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby TuftyDave on Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:59 pm

altair4
You just hit the nail bang smack on the head!
I can now open both the XP and the Vista machines with the nnemo commands you specified.
I was told by someone else to issue the smb coman via a firefox URL. Like I say I'm a newbie I know nothing of Linux...
So I don't know why they told me that, but when I issue 'nemo smb://192.168.0.100 ' (for my Vista machine)
Not only does it work, but it tells me the name of the work group and asks me to log on to vista with my password. All this works perfectly.

So.......

Big questions!

Am I to assume that the nemo window that opens when you choose 'places' is for some reason unable to get a list of machines from 'windows Network' when I click it?
And that is all that is wrong? Because as soon as I specifically TELL nemo what to look at it's absolutely fine?
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby TuftyDave on Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:01 pm

OK, can you just clarify when you say "The folder itself" exactly which folder you mean?
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby halicon on Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:05 pm

im no expert by any means but this sounds like the problem i had with my home network i have a cisco ea4500 router i had to unplug the ac eall adapter for 10 mins and boot it back up reboot all pc's and its worked fine ever since might work for you hope it helps
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby TuftyDave on Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:06 pm

Here's the properties of "WIndows Network"

Name: Windows Network
Type: unknown type (application/octet-stream)
Size: unknown
Location: network:///
Volume: unknown
Accessed: unknown
Modified: unknown

Permissions: The permissions of "smb" could not be determined.


Open with: No applications available to open "unknown"
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby TuftyDave on Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:10 pm

halicon We just determined there is no problem accessing the Windows machines from Linux. From the Linux box I can now open folders on both XP and Vista machines, I can read files & I can write files.
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby TuftyDave on Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:21 pm

This may also help guys...
All I have to type into a command line is 'nemo smb://TOSH'
(TOSH is my toshiba laptop running Vista)
It finds it & opens up the login window telling me it's on the MSHOME DOmain.

So the 'Windows Network' folder on the Linux box seems to be where the problems are. When clicked, it's not passing any information about the devices on MSHOME and they are only found when I look for them specifically.
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby altair4 on Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:36 pm

Am I to assume that the nemo window that opens when you choose 'places' is for some reason unable to get a list of machines from 'windows Network' when I click it?
And that is all that is wrong? Because as soon as I specifically TELL nemo what to look at it's absolutely fine?

Yes. That mechanism appears to be broken. Samba/smb communicates with ip addresses not names. There is a mechanism that both Windows and Samba use that connects a specific ip address to a name and for whatever reason that is broke. Since you've basically covered the usual suspects in fixing this issue I suspect that the Vista machine has assumed the role of Master Browser and is mucking things up. It's a rat hole I don't recommend going down if you have the luxury of setting static ip addresses.

Setting them up in /etc/hosts should have bypassed this as well and I'm at a loss to explain that one. If you were to run "nemo smb://steveavio" it should have sent you to the correct machine because of the hosts file.

Anyway, the easy way out is to set these machines with static ip addresses and connect to them directly. But since they are static you have the luxury of bookmarking them since the ip addresses will never change.
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby TuftyDave on Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:44 pm

Many many thanks for your help here guys, much apreciated...
When I come to doing the opposite, ie looking at the Linux box from the windows box, I'll open a new question (If I need to that is!)
Thanks again...
This really gives me more impetus to carry on using Linux.

Dave.
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Re: Networking Notworking!

Postby roblm on Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:44 pm

altair4 wrote:
Setting them up in /etc/hosts should have bypassed this as well and I'm at a loss to explain that one. If you were to run "nemo smb://steveavio" it should have sent you to the correct machine because of the hosts file.


altair4, should the "/etc/host.conf" file have been used instead. Here's an excerpt from the Official Samba 3.5 How to and Reference Guide:

name resolve order = host lmhost wins bcast
where “host” refers to the native methods used by the UNIX system to implement the gethostbyname() function call. This is normally controlled by /etc/host.conf, /etc/nsswitch.conf and /etc/resolv.conf.

An older version 2.2.6 of the guide uses the word hosts instead of host, referring to the "/etc/hosts" file:

name resolve order = wins lmhosts hosts bcast
The string used to define the parameter can take up to four values:

lmhosts

Uses the Samba server's local lmhosts file

hosts

Uses the standard Unix name-resolution methods, which can be /etc/hosts, DNS, NIS, or a combination, depending on how the local system is configured
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Re: Networking Notworking! (SOLVED)

Postby altair4 on Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:31 am

name resolve order = host lmhost wins bcast
where “host” refers to the native methods used by the UNIX system to implement the gethostbyname() function call. This is normally controlled by /etc/host.conf, /etc/nsswitch.conf and /etc/resolv.conf.

"This" refers to gethostbyname or the mechanism by which it is used not the data itself.
name resolve order = lmhosts wins host bcast

lmhost and host either don't exist in Linux or are not set up with any samba related data. wins refers to a WINS server and that isn't set up by default either and even it it was all of the hosts on the network would have to be configured to point to this server for name resolution. That leaves bcast which Windows also uses. It's listed last but it's the only one that works by default which is why I recommended placing it first ( or at least placing it before "wins" ) in my HowTo.

97.68% of all the Samba questions on forums don't relate to samba at all but this byzantine ( at least from a home LAN perspective ) netbios name resolution issue. For my money it would be easier to slap Bonjour on every Windows machine and everyone could connect to each other using an mDNS qualified host name and bypass all this :)
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Re: Networking Notworking! (SOLVED if you boot from DVD!)

Postby TuftyDave on Thu Apr 25, 2013 11:26 am

UPDATE

All these problems disappear if I boot from the DVD and run the 'demo' version.
Using the 'samba.conf' from the 'demo' version on the installed HD version doesn't fix these problems, so it looks like it's not a samba problem.
No one as yet knows why this is.
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