Persistent USB boot not working

[ajgiampa]

I just did an install to a 1GB USB flash drive per the instructions on pendrivelinux.com. The OS boots up fine and looks great, but it is not saving my settings. The boot menu does give me the option to boot up with a persistence option, but it doesn't seem to be working.

Is there a setting I have to enable once I've booted to Mint Linux? The line in the syslinux.cfg file that pertains to the persistent menu options is as follows.

Run Linux Mint Persistently
kernel /casper/vmlinuz append noprompt cdrom-detect/try-usb=true persistent file=/cdrom/preseed/mint.seed boot=casper initrd=/casper/initrd.gz quiet splash

Should the /cdrom/ path be changed to something else since this is a USB boot?

[ajgiampa]

The free space on my 1GB USB stick is over 200 megs, so it seems odd that a couple of "settings" would require so much space. From the other threads, it seems like people formated to ext2, I wonder if I should have done that instead...I'll try it. Your issue with reduced pen drive availability is also concerning since I was planning on getting a huge pen drive after I figure out how to get all this working....let me know if you get it resolved.

[Guest]

Thanks for the info. I guess I'll have to try getting a larger pendrive. So it seems like a 4gig USB pendrive might work best since it would have the least amount of wasted space (not recognized by Linux, even though your MAC or a PC might see the extra space). When I get one, I'll do the pendrivelinux.com install via Windows (the same method I used on my 1gig pendrive), and let ya know how it goes. Maybe by then the unusable space issue will be solved.

[Guest]

The latest Ubuntu did install normally on my stick, the same as if it were a hdd. For some reason Mint does not work this way even though the installers look identical. Pendrivelinux.com must realize this difference, because the guide they show for Ubuntu is different than the one for Mint on their website. I'm looking forward to a fix to the bootloader in Mint to allow stick system installs. Ubuntu works great on my 8gb stick, as expected, using the default ext3 filesystem, and shows 4.1gb of space remaining after doing all the system updates available, plus some driver downloads. As a bonus, I was able to easily boot this stick off both of my laptops, with all my settings retained! I am amazed at the silent performance of the stick. Next I'm going to take it work, hehe!

[ajgiampa]

Well, I just got my 8GB stick, installed mint per the pendrivelinux.com instructions and got the same results you got. Persistence works, but only 1GB of free space. I'll use it for now, until I fill the 1GB. Maybe by the time I fill that, Mint will accomodate the larger sized pendrives. I also tried changing the formatting to ext2, but it wouldn't boot....so for now I guess we wait.

[kwatson512]

I've done a lot of experimenting with USB installs, with over two dozen distributions. I'm currently running Ubuntu 8.10 from a 16GB stick with a 4GB persistence file (which is called casper-rw, BTW). I'm typing this from there. I found that a larger persistence file (8GB) didn't work--I ran out of room, couldn't save changes, etc. Also, a smaller file didn't give me enough room for photos and files. 4GB works well. The Ubuntu Live CD includes a brain-dead simple Live USB creator, and you use a slider to select the size of the persistence file.

I have never succeeded with Mint on a stick, but I notice that Pendrivelinux has a process for Mint 6 now. (I did successfully install Mint 4 natively to a USB stick, but it ran so slowly it was unusable.) It includes installing the ubuntu live USB creator, but you use a custom syslinux.cfg file because Mint has different files and directories than Ubuntu.

I'll have to say that I've had mixed success with USB sticks. Sometimes the Pendrivelinux process has worked for me, and sometimes it hasn't. That could be something unique with my hardware, or even a difference between my USB devices and those they used to develop the processes. Persistence varies by distro. Size of the persistence file is usually (but not always) specified in the syslinux.cfg file.

Here's what I've learned so far--hope this helps.
- Syslinux is the best bootloader for USB. It works much more quickly than others, and it works on the FAT filesystems, which makes it convenient to install from Windows and to have a multi-purpose stick. Syslinux does not work with Ext2 or 3 (that's where extlinux comes in).
- You can format a USB stick to EXT2 or 3 and install to it from a Live CD (usually with the HDD physically removed from your computer), but I have found that to be too slow for all but the smallest distros (Puppy, DSL, TinyMe, MiniMe).
- When you're running from a USB, you can't mount the unused portion of the stick, no matter how large it is. (You can go to the trouble to create a separate partition on the stick, give it a mount point, and ensure /etc/fstab allows your system to recognize it, but I've found that to be too much trouble for a temporary, carry-around sub for my desktop.) So you can "see" all the partitions on your computer, additional devices plugged in, but not the rest of the stick that you booted.

Mint is a very refined, user-friendly distro, and I'd like to get it working on a USB stick. I'll try to make time to try the Pendrivelinux procedure for Felicia and report back here. Looking at both the Windows and LiveCD versions, I believe the LiveCD one will work better. I don't know what's in the USBMint.exe file, but the procedure for Windows doesn't show how to use the Live USB creator. If you don't move the slider, the default is the smallest possible (I think it's 256K).

I'm sure others have experimented with this--good luck and let us know what you find out.

BTW, I have a Lenovo X61s laptop with 4GB RAM, triple-booting WinXP, Mint 5, and Fedora 10; a Dell XPS400 with 4GB RAM dual-booting WinXP and Mint 5; and Ubuntu 8.10 on a 16GB Corsair Flash Voyager USB stick.

[Nevart]

Hi,

I'm having the same problems but... my drive is a whopping 160GB and it still is not saving changes (it's a Memorex Ultra TD USB2.0). I went to all the trouble of downloading and configuring packages only to find they are not there on the next boot.

I believe the problem may have something to do with Mint thinking that it is running from a CD (this also will happen on a normal flash drive, so it is not just because of the type of drive I am using). I am using FAT32 so that I can use the drive if I need to switch to Windows for some reason.

In Ubuntu there is some command that you add to the start-up script to tell it that we are running a "live" copy and not a CD, but I have no idea how to do it. Should probably mention that I had exactly the same problems in Ubuntu as well. I installed that first, and then switched to Mint.

I have absolutely no desire at all to install the OS onto the internal hard drive. Ubuntu and Mint both make the assumption that we will eventually want to install them internally. I certainly am very attracted to the idea of being able to have a portable OS that I can just plug into another computer and use anywhere, so that everything is just the same no matter what the location. Installing it on the computer would not achieve that result, so I really don't want to do that.

Nev :


Edit: wanted to add, I think I have discovered some evidence to suggest I am right in my supposition that Mint thinks it is running from a CD even when it is not. This is because it is reporting that it has something like 393MB free, which I take to be the difference between the actual size of the installed files and the maximum capacity of a standard CD.

Strangely, while Ubuntu can declare the Memorex disk as a separate entity to the file system, Mint does not seem to have this ability. Ubuntu and Slax both are able to allow normal access to other parts of the disk, but Mint not only does not allow disk access, it does not even seem to have an awareness that the disk exists.

Another Edit: I renamed "isolinux" to "syslinux", so maybe it no longer thinks it is a CD. Because for some reason Ubuntu (and probably Mint) does not recognize a USB HD as a USB Flash Disk - a trait that seems to be unique to them - I can't set the persistence file using the "create USB disk" tool. Does anybody want to instruct us with information on how to manually create a persistence file and then tell Mint where to find it (if indeed this is necessary)?

[kwatson512]

I just went through the Pendrivelinux process to install Mint 6 to my 16GB USB drive using the Live CD method, and it worked flawlessly. I have a 4GB persistence file, and it is saving all my preferences, new apps, network specifics, etc.

One thing I always do first with persistent USB installations is to add a new user (me) and disable automatic login, then log out and back in as myself before starting with configuration. "Liveuser" may not save changes with some distros.

Nevart,

In Ubuntu there is some command that you add to the start-up script to tell it that we are running a "live" copy and not a CD, but I have no idea how to do it. Should probably mention that I had exactly the same problems in Ubuntu as well.

Can you describe the steps you took to install, and precisely what failures you experienced?

I renamed "isolinux" to "syslinux", so maybe it no longer thinks it is a CD

There's no need to go through any of these esoteric steps. With the Ubuntu Live USB Creator, it's really very simple. For Mint, you do need to replace the Ubuntu syslinux.cfg file with the one on Pendrivelinux.

Try this Pendrivelinux method. I'd be happy to respond to questions or clarify any small steps.

[ajgiampa]

I just went through the Pendrivelinux process to install Mint 6 to my 16GB USB drive using the Live CD method, and it worked flawlessly. I have a 4GB persistence file, and it is saving all my preferences, new apps, network specifics, etc.

When you view the filesystem folder after booting from the pendrive, does it show around 14gigs of free space (of some logical number based on the size of you install)? On my 8gb drive, I only see 1 gig of free space when booting from the pendrive. I did not use the liveCD install method though, so maybe that has something to do with it.

[kwatson512]

Mine shows 3.3 GB used and 1.4 GB free space. That adds up to slightly more than the 4GB persistence file I set up. As I said before, the system can't read the rest of the USB drive while you're booting from the persistent USB install. The USB drive shows, but can't be read because I haven't set up a mount point for it.

I'm not sure you can set the size of your persistence file with the Windows version of the Pendrivelinux process.

[ajgiampa]

Ok, so all we should have to do is install to the USB stick via the liveCD method and during that install, I'll set the size of the persistant file to be equal to the size of my USB stick. Does the LiveCD install method prompt for this or is there a setting I must change somewhere else during the install?

This may be another topic entirely, but I've used some other distros (DSL, Puppy) that have something called a frugal install, which works great because it loads the OS into RAM, which makes everything run really fast on PC's that have a lot of RAM. Does Mint have any options to do this from the USB pendrive, since I've noticed that running from the USB stick seems to lag for some processes (such as media playing).

[kwatson512]

ajgiampa,

When you go through the Pendrivelinux LiveCD process, it will become very obvious to you. After installing the live USB Creator, you can select it in the menu. There will be a slider that you can move to select from the minimum to the entire stick. I'd like to know if you are successful using the entire stick--I haven't had success doing that.

The Live USB runs just like a Live CD, but with persistence you can save changes (like additional users, changed look and feel, additional apps and other packages, etc.). The only thing I have found that doesn't persist is time zone. I have to set it after booting every time (minor annoyance). Booting is quite slow, since it's pulling up the equivalent of the entire Live CD and the multi-GB persistence file. After boot it runs almost as fast as a HDD install. You do have to be a little patient with resource-intensive applications (multimedia, large file transfers, etc.).

Yes, with Puppy I prefer the frugal install. Puppy is structured entirely differently from every other Linux distro I know. There are others that can be loaded entirely into RAM, but none of those have all the user friendliness or completeness of Mint (IMHO).

Good luck.

[Nevart]

There's no need to go through any of these esoteric steps. With the Ubuntu Live USB Creator, it's really very simple. For Mint, you do need to replace the Ubuntu syslinux.cfg file with the one on Pendrivelinux.

Try this Pendrivelinux method. I'd be happy to respond to questions or clarify any small steps.

Hello, and thanks for your response. Unfortunately the USB creator method will not for me with the disk I am using because even though it is a USB disk and Windows and Slax both recognize it as such, for some reason Ubuntu and Mint do not. It may have something to do with how the drive identifies itself (System Volume Information folder?).

This is further complicated because Mint will not allow it to be installed via the "Install" method either, because that will only detect the internal SCSI and IDE drives.

Can you tell me how to manually create the persistence file? I think this is the possible solution, but I don't know what is involved in doing that. I could not find a utility in the menu to allow post-install modification of such things.

[kwatson512]

Nevart,

Creating a persistence file manually is pretty involved. Here's a comprehensive tutorial on all types of USB installs.

mschilling,

I don't know why my native installations on USB sticks are so slow, but they have consistently been that way for all of the full desktop-top distros (OpenSUSE, Mandriva, Ubuntu, Mint, etc.). By slow I mean click on something and wait 15 or 20 seconds for the action to happen. However, using syslinux on Fat32 and running a persistent live version works pretty well for me. However, this is just a backup desktop for me. I have Mint on my laptop, but keep an equivalent copy of my desktop (files, e-mail, configs, applications) on the USB for when I don't have (or don't want to carry) my laptop and I have access to another computer that can boot to USB.

[kwatson512]

Thanks. I believe the one I got (http://www.corsairmicro.com/products/vo ... fault.aspx) is pretty much equivalent to yours. I may try a native install in a week or two, but I'm satisfied with the live USB with persistence I have now. (Not my primary system.)

[kwatson512]

I actually have one of each, both 16GB. Currently I have Mint 6 on the blue one (not GT) and Ubuntu 8.10 on the other one. Both are persistent live USB installs.

[kwatson512]

Well, against my better judgment (based on past experiences) I took up the challenge and installed Mint6 on my 16GB Corsair Flash Voyager GT USB flash drive. I did it as a full installation, with the HDD physically removed from the laptop. The system will not boot from that stick. I think it has to do with how drives and partitions are identified. Here's the /etc/fstab file from that installation.

Code: Select all

# /etc/fstab: static file system information.
#
# <file system> <mount point>   <type>  <options>       <dump>  <pass>
proc            /proc           proc    defaults        0       0
# /dev/sdb1
UUID=fd5f700c-7c35-411e-809a-125cb26104be /               ext3    relatime,errors=remount-ro 0       1
# /dev/sdb5
UUID=fed3cd19-39cd-4863-9b26-35a63331876c none            swap    sw              0       0

I tried booting two ways: with the HDD in the machine, and with it removed. With the HDD installed, here's the error message (after selecting Mint 6, kernel 2.6.27-7-generic in the boot menu):

Error 17: Cannot mount selected partition

Press any key to continue...

With the HDD removed, here's the error message:

Error 25: Disk read error

Press any key to continue...

Thoughts?

[kwatson512]

Sorry for the multiple posts, but I've made a little progress. I still think I have an fstab issue, but I solved another one. I realized /boot/grub/menu.lst identified the boot drive as (1,0) and sdb1 so I changed all the references there to (0,0) and sda1 since I'm booting directly from the USB stick. (On installation I used the live USB to install to the other stick, so it identified the destination as sdb.)

Just tried booting, and got bounced to BusyBox with the following message:

Starting up ...
Loading, please wait...
19+0 records in
19+0 records out
kinit: name_to_dev_t(/dev/disk/by-uuid/fed3cd19-39cd-4863-9b26-35a63331876c) = dev(8,21)
kinit: trying to resume from /dev/disk/by-uuid/fed3cd19-39cd-4863-9b26-35a63331876c
kinit: No resume image, doing normal boot...
mount: mounting /root/dev on /dev/.static/dev failed: No such file or directory
mount: mounting /sys on /root/sys failed: No such file or directory
mount: mounting /proc on /root/proc failed: No such file or directory
Target filesystem doesn't have /sbin/init.
No init found. Try passing init= bootarg.


BusyBox v1.10.2 (Ubuntu 1:1.10.2-1ubuntu6) built-in shell (ash)
Enter 'help' for a list of built-in commands.

(initramfs)

So I'm still stuck...

[kwatson512]

Thanks for the link. I followed the wiki and changed /etc/fstab, but got the same error on boot again.

[kwatson512]

Interesting... I just reformatted my non-booting USB stick and used the Pendrivelinux Live CD method to make another Live USB instance of Mint 6. This time I slid the slider all the way to the right, asking for a 14.4GB persistence file. However, what I got was a 4GB persistence file. Subsequent to that I learned that FAT32 filesystems can only accept files up to 4GB. So the limitation is in the filesystem, not the Live USB Creator. Still, it works like a champ!