Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

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Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby lwhistler on Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:26 am

Why is there no good stable video editing program for Linux, equivalent to iMovie or Windows Movie Maker?

GIMP, OpenOffice, FireFox, Linux Mint and Ubuntu are good examples of software development for Linux but nothing for video editing. I recently read in a HD Video magazine that Apple developed Final Cut Pro as a loss leader to sell Macs, why can't the same thing be done for a Linux editor?

Kdenlive is the easiest Linux editor I have attempted to use but the dependencies drive me crazy and it crashes all time. My final editing is always done on Windows Vista with Windows Movie Maker. The Linux editor should not be dependent on other software that must be installed.

I would like to see a GIMP like project for a video editor.


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Last edited by lwhistler on Fri Dec 18, 2009 5:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby tinca on Fri Dec 18, 2009 4:28 am

lwhistler,

a typical newcomers remark. There are good video editors in Linux, I use OpenShot, which achieves all that I need.

Perhaps searching the forum or Googling before making such a sweeping statement might have given you some options.

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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby DrHu on Fri Dec 18, 2009 4:36 am

lwhistler wrote: I recently read in a HD Video magazine that Apple developed Final Cut Pro as a loss leader to sell Macs, why can't the same thing be done for a Linux editor?

Linux isn't usually being sold or being presented as an OEM or platform solution (hardware + software, including OS), so a loss leader to drive sales makes absolutely no sense

As well as that, there are many video editing tools in Linux available
--and if a particular application is crashing or has too many dependencies; which is an efficient way of using general system resources via shared libraries, a little like windows .dll files, only more open and comprehensive. Then the problem, if it is not already described as a bug for particular kernel or application version or desktop manager (Kde, Gnome etc), lies in your system's setup and configuration
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=636VZ_R-NVs
http://desktopvideo.about.com/od/editin ... idedit.htm
http://www.wikihow.com/Choose-Video-Edi ... -for-Linux
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby mintnoob on Mon Dec 21, 2009 6:05 am

lwhistler wrote: My final editing is always done... with Windows Movie Maker.

Mine too.

The lack of a decent movie editor on Linux is one of the reasons I keep an XP dual boot.

OpenShot has potential. It has a nice simple look to it, but there's a couple little things that I don't like about it like you can't drap photo the your preferred length, I don't like their cut tool, and no auto drag clip alignment as MovieMaker has.

Linux has about a dozen video editors, but they all kind of suck, which is a shame. I think half of the Linux video makers should merge with the other half to produce better video editors to catch up with Win and Mac since we are in the "youtube age."
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby tinca on Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:00 pm

mintnoob,

you are obviously working to a higher level than I am, concerning "video editing". My needs are more basic.

I record TV from my Hauppauge USB device from within "Kaffeine".
I use "Projectx" (a java program) to keep lip sync.
I then run "mplex" to put the video and sound back together.
Then it is "Openshot" to make transitions etc.
Then "DeVeDe" to create the DVD structure so that I can play it on my Sony home theatre system.
And finally "K3b" to burn to "Taiyo-Yuden" discs.

The ONLY problem I have with this is that I live in a weak "Freeview" signal area in the UK, and sometimes the downloaded file just has too many errors in it for "Projectx" to work its miracle.

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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby gravelbay on Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:35 pm

mintnoob wrote:
lwhistler wrote: My final editing is always done... with Windows Movie Maker.

Mine too.

The lack of a decent movie editor on Linux is one of the reasons I keep an XP dual boot.

OpenShot has potential. It has a nice simple look to it, but there's a couple little things that I don't like about it like you can't drap photo the your preferred length, I don't like their cut tool, and no auto drag clip alignment as MovieMaker has.

Linux has about a dozen video editors, but they all kind of suck, which is a shame. I think half of the Linux video makers should merge with the other half to produce better video editors to catch up with Win and Mac since we are in the "youtube age."


I'd never heard of OpenShot before. Looks like it's very new. I checked out the web site and it looks like it's worth a try, so I'm downloading it now. Thanks for the tip. I really got spoiled by Adobe Premier on Windows and all Linux video editors have frustrated me with instability and/or lack of capability.
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby MrD on Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:52 pm

Openshot was the last editor I tried in a long list. I was getting a bit depressed really trying to find my Sony Vegas. The rest all crashed on me and/or were useless for previewing my editing. Openshot does not crash on me, but it is rather simple right now. Unless I'm utterly wrong, here's my view on it:

You can cut clips into segments with the razor tool, expand the clip zoom to find the exact spot as you then click on the timeline.
You cannot alter the length of a piece of media with drag and drop like the editors we love on Windows, so you end up recutting clips as you go along.
You cannot change clips volume on the fly, or even turn them on and off.
Video transitions are available,, text media too, but no audio transition like fade to be found (audio comes in full blast with each clip)
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby tinca on Mon Dec 21, 2009 5:18 pm

MrD,

if you are looking for a single program that will do all that you could in Windows, then you are going to be disappointed.

I gave up Windows some time ago, so I had to find a way to get a DVD completed. I have to use a few programs to achieve the same result and obviously there is a learning curve as well, but I am happy with my results.

The problem concerning cutting is achieved from within "Projectx", just make the cuts you need and save them as individual clips.

The full sound problem can easily be solved once "Projectx" has split the file into both audio and video. Open "Audacity" and work on the .mp2 file. Fade the front and end of the sound file, and then export it as a .mp3 file. Use "mplex" to join the original video file to the new .mp3 file. You then finish up with a clip that has beautiful sound that fades in, and then at the end fades out.

Like a lot of things in Linux, you have to do a bit more in the way of self help.

Best regards Keith
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby Bit Mad on Tue Dec 22, 2009 7:43 am

Video editing is an immensely complex thing to ask of a bunch of part-time hobby programmers.

lwhistler wrote:I recently read in a HD Video magazine that Apple developed Final Cut Pro as a loss leader to sell Macs, why can't the same thing be done for a Linux editor?


If one of the commercially supported distros were to pile some resources into it, then that would be great - but the rewards aren't likely to be worthwhile. The amount of potential Linux users who really want a good Video Editor isn't really a huge subset of the total out there.

:)
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby gravelbay on Tue Dec 22, 2009 6:12 pm

Bit Mad wrote:Video editing is an immensely complex thing to ask of a bunch of part-time hobby programmers.

lwhistler wrote:I recently read in a HD Video magazine that Apple developed Final Cut Pro as a loss leader to sell Macs, why can't the same thing be done for a Linux editor?


If one of the commercially supported distros were to pile some resources into it, then that would be great - but the rewards aren't likely to be worthwhile. The amount of potential Linux users who really want a good Video Editor isn't really a huge subset of the total out there.

:)

No argument here. But I do wonder how many people are staying with Windows or going to a Mac because they can't get the work done efficiently in Linux. My boss, for one, just dumped a pile of money on a Mac because his Windows computer was driving him nuts. I'll put dollars to donuts that, if there was a serious, stable, video editor in the Linux world, he'd have given that a shot first.

But you are right that it is an incredibly complex task and I could not begin to imagine the amount of work it takes to write something like Premier or Final Cut Pro. :shock: Wow. Hat's off to those guys.
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby mintnoob on Tue Dec 22, 2009 7:59 pm

I think half of the Linux video editing projects need to merge with the other half and instead of next up and coming Linux guru making a name for himself by producing another distro that just has a different background and color scheme, they need to help out with video projects and other lagging Linux apps.
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby Missed on Wed Dec 23, 2009 1:54 am

If you are prepared to wait a little while, VLC are releasing an editor . . . . . . . .


http://www.learningubuntu.com/news/crea ... deo-editor


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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby Bit Mad on Wed Dec 23, 2009 5:57 am

mintnoob wrote:I think half of the Linux video editing projects need to merge with the other half and instead of next up and coming Linux guru making a name for himself by producing another distro that just has a different background and color scheme, they need to help out with video projects and other lagging Linux apps.


That's the beauty of FOSS & Linux, people are free to develop in exactly the way they want. Trying to encourage otherwise is like King Canute ordering the tide not to come in :D
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby Bit Mad on Wed Dec 23, 2009 10:28 am

Missed wrote:If you are prepared to wait a little while, VLC are releasing an editor . . . . . . . .


That's brilliant news!

Image
( http://www.digitalversus.com/news_id-12124.html )

"available for download as of February 2010 for PC and Linux platforms" :D
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby lwhistler on Wed Dec 23, 2009 1:29 pm

The VLMC (VideoLAN Movie Creator) looks promising. I have bookmarked their page and will give it a try.








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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby mintnoob on Wed Dec 23, 2009 3:57 pm

Bit Mad wrote:That's the beauty of FOSS & Linux, people are free to develop in exactly the way they want. Trying to encourage otherwise is like King Canute ordering the tide not to come in :D

I wish I didn't have to, but when there are such glaring problems with Linux and Linux programmers are focused elsewhere, it wouldn't be beneficial to the Linux community for me not to speak up about it.
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby MrD on Wed Dec 23, 2009 5:54 pm

DV camcorders,small cameras that take HQ video, home video making, Youtube and other popular media sites, have become such commonplace in a lot of peoples lives that the requirement for any OS that hopes to gain a sizeable portion of computer users surely must be that there is a working video editor with a minimum of features available?

This news from the people at videolan sounds good. But it will be some time before it is of any user to mainstream users. The six students involved on it are only going to release a pre-Alpha in the first quarter of next year? How long till RC's?

It does make sense at this point in linux's history for those creating various editors to talk about coming together, pooling their knowledge and resources/time and create a single compatible program that will benefit the OS as a whole. 6 people with 6 editors that don't 100% work or have all the features that a user commonly needs is not effective. That group coming together could potentially put a complete, working, feature full piece of software on their C.V's rather than what will appear to be a patchy, incomplete, feature lacking hobby project. And feel a lot better about themselves for being part of a project that produced a viable and much welcomed piece of software that sees much use.

Have those people near the top of the ladders talked to the heads of these individual projects and discussed with them what help they need? Asked if they are interested in a group project merging their work for the benefit of the OS? We, the end users, can discuss our needs, but I suppose it is up to the more important people to notice the needs of the community, find the time to think about it and then act appropriately. In the circles I operate in, I get access to and materials needed to survey everyone I can interact with, to make their lives better. How do we now ask enough linux users if they want/need a decent video editor in such a fashion that the survey and its results become apparent to the people that matter? Without a voice, nothing will get done.
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby Bit Mad on Wed Dec 23, 2009 7:48 pm

Well, they've certainly got the basics in place :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02vdwNsvbZI&hd=1

They wouldn't have announced it if it wasn't in a useful state :D
I think it will be huge. I don't think that's wishful thinking.... it has the potential to kill off most other projects if they get it right. :mrgreen:
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby Koninator on Thu Dec 24, 2009 3:34 pm

I'm using PiTiVi from Mint Software (http://www.linuxmint.com/software/?sec= ... &release=6)

In PiTiVi you can have multiple video streams, pictures (jpeg,png,...), multiple audio streams,....

But there is one trick when you are finished select everything in time line, and press "Link together arbitrary clips"
( sixth button from left under time line ) then "Render project" -> "Modify"
Convert to Container set from " Ogg muxer [oggmux] " to " FFmpeg 3GP format muxer [ffmux_3gp] "
( second from bottom-up. It appears that program has some issues with containers and codecs )
But 3GGP works fine :)

You can change "Audio Output" and "Video Output" settings, but "Export to" leave 3ggp.

If you want to have AVI container, first encode project with 3GPP container, then import 3GPP file in new PiTiVi project, and recode into AVI container ( inside time-line you must have only 1 video - 3gpp ).
Use "Avi muxer [avimux]"
tested with:
-Video Codec "Xvid video encoder [xvidenc]" and "x264enc [x264enc]"
-Audio Codec "L.A.M.E mp3 encoder [lame]" and "AAC audio encoder [faac]".
( or recode 3GPP file with some other program )
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Re: Linux Video Editor - Why no good program?

Postby vincent on Fri Mar 05, 2010 5:42 am

I'm using PiTiVi as well; OpenShot was my first choice, but I couldn't run it for more than a minute without crashing and it gave me segmentation faults when I tried to use pidgin, rhythmbox, brasero, totem, etc. Have any of you guys tried Cinelerra though? I hear it's a much more complex editor than most other linux video editors out there nowadays, but it's not available in the repos and after my ordeal with OpenShot, I'm loathe to try and install a video editor manually again. :lol:
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