Extremely Concerning that Linux Mint Forums Block Tor

[sylvain1_]

I am relatively new to Linux Mint, although I have had it installed for months. Despite having many questions, I have not had an account here for months due to the Sucuri firewall block of tor.

The fact that tor is blocked from accessing this site is extremely concerning. The reason why I switched from Windows to Linux was for privacy. As people increasingly realize how little privacy they have on Windows and Mac, more and more will switch to linux. These users need a private way to ask questions and get help.

This is especially concerning in the era of bulk surveillance. We know from the Snowden revelations that the NSA takes advantage of Windows error reporting. Through the error reports, they are able to see (and store in everyone's permanent record) configuration details for everyone's computers. They then know exactly which vulnerabilities are present on everyone's computers. They can either craft custom malware to infect your computer, or they can infect your computer in a mass-automated way using TURBINE/TURMOIL/TURBULENCE (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TURBINE_( ... t_project). You could be doing nothing wrong, but that will not stop their computer program from automatically hacking you without human intervention or any legal accountability.

We face a similar problem when we post inxi information or other logs on a forum like this. All we are trying to do is get help for our serious technical problems. But if we cannot post that information with a significant degree of anonymity, then multiple world governments and their algorithms now know exactly how to hack into your computer in an unstoppable way.

Some people might think that using a VPN is sufficient. A VPN is sufficient for hiding your location from website administrators, but it is insufficient against multiple global adversaries, such as the U.S., U.K., Israel, China, and Russia. They are able to hack into the VPNs or use traffic analysis to monitor them. And groups like Team Cymru can monitor up to 94% of internet traffic. But even discounting those adversaries, a VPN can actually weaken your privacy if they are lying to the consumer about their no-logs policies. For example, Avast sold data regarding every click that their VPN customers did.

I realize that it is inconvenient to configure Sucuri to unblock tor nodes. But given the serious dangers involved in posting any error logs on a public forum in a world with multiple global adversaries, the ability to post here with Tor is bare minimum necessity.

Here is a potential compromise solution. Start a separate help support forum for linux mint which is solely accessible through tor. Register a .onion address for it, and run it as an alternate support forum for privacy-conscious users. Even if the onion forum goes down for periods of time, due to not having the protection of Sucuri firewall, the clearnet forum would be unaffected. You could protect the main forum with Sucuri, and you can provide the .onion for people switching to Linux for privacy reasons.

Finally if you are a site administrator, I have a message for you, from https://v236xhqtyullodhf26szyjepvkbv6ii ... ewall/9854 .

Hi! I tried to access your site forums.linuxmint.com while using Tor Browser and discovered that you don’t allow Tor users to access your site. I urge you to reconsider this decision; Tor is used by people all over the world to protect their privacy and fight censorship. By blocking Tor users, you are likely blocking people in repressive countries who want to use a free internet, journalists and researchers who want to protect themselves from discovery, whistleblowers, activists, and ordinary people who want to opt out of invasive third party tracking. Please take a strong stance in favor of digital privacy and internet freedom, and allow Tor users access to forums.linuxmint.com. Thank you.

[axrusar]

You are free to send the rant note to https://sucuri.net/website-firewall/.
IMO, the linux mint devs have the right and need to use some sort of protection on the website against malicious actors that might likely use TOR to attack the platform.
You can learn how to setup your own TLS VPN server in the right place to make sure there are no logs.
BTW, the website has google tracking on it, you may want to block that

[sylvain1_]

Running your own VPN server might hide your IP address, but you forfeit the benefit of being in a crowd, making you easier to identify. Regardless, it is weak protection compared to tor.

I offered a compromise solution. I do not see a response from you regarding that. Another idea would be to create a tor mirror of this forum as an onion. You can prohibit anyone from actually logging into it, but at least then tor users can SEE the forum and search it in order to find answers to their technical problems.

You should consider blocking those Google ads/trackers. Even google ads have been known to spread malware, but now they are known to spread state-sponsored malware. And I guarantee that state actors have malware to infect linux-based systems. See https://restoreprivacy.com/state-spywar ... n-channel/ and https://archive.ph/Vkxt1 for more information. Given the reality of spyware in 2024, allowing tor (on the safest security level) is the bare minimum needed to protect mint users who care about their fundamental right to privacy.

[Pepi]

Sometimes it will block me with my VPN on. Depends on what city I'm using.

[AZgl1800]

if you don't like the forum as it is, sorry folks, that is just the way it is.

the Volunteers here, don't have the time to support an extraneous forum for one or two users of tor.
adios

[Knightstmplr1]

Sometimes it will block me with my VPN on. Depends on what city I'm using.

It is not the city you're using but it is the exit node IP Address from TOR, a Proxy, or VPN that you are using, as they go through several connections before they exit to that particular IP Address exit node and then try to connect to a platform such as this.

If that exit node IP Address has ever been used by spammers or scammers in the past and put on an international blacklisting service such as stopforumspam.com or cleantalk.org/blacklists, just about all forums and social media uses these blacklists in their automated systems to stop forum spammers and scammer from entering their systems in the first place as a layer of protection since moderators and administrators of these platforms cannot be online 24/7 trying to mointor for that garbage too.

This is why I usually ask folks why they feel they need to use such devices to access safe sites such as this forum.

Save the TOR, VPN, or Proxies for the unknown entities out their in The Wild, Wild, Web, shut it off for those few sites that you know are safe like this one.

[TaterChip]

Keep in mind I'm posting this as someone partially in the dark.

Why would you log into somewhere with TOR. Doesn't that compromise the whole reason for using TOR?

[sylvain1_]

Keep in mind I'm posting this as someone partially in the dark.

Why would you log into somewhere with TOR. Doesn't that compromise the whole reason for using TOR?

If you are logging into Facebook, Google, Apple, etc., then yes, tor will not protect your identity (although tor will still hide your location).

If you are logging into a website that does not know your real name, your phone number, or your clearnet email address, then tor is still useful. However, you must not visit that website through the clearnet, you must have good OPSEC, and the email address that you use for registration must also be made entirely through tor and not tied to your real-life identity in any way.

For more information, you can look at https://anonymousplanet.org/.

[Dullard du Jour]

There are a lot of issues in this world that I find concerning , this site, or any site that blocks Tor is not on that list of concerning issues.

If you feel this site is unsafe, then you should not come here, Tor or not.

[TaterChip]

Keep in mind I'm posting this as someone partially in the dark.

Why would you log into somewhere with TOR. Doesn't that compromise the whole reason for using TOR?

If you are logging into Facebook, Google, Apple, etc., then yes, tor will not protect your identity (although tor will still hide your location).

If you are logging into a website that does not know your real name, your phone number, or your clearnet email address, then tor is still useful. However, you must not visit that website through the clearnet, you must have good OPSEC, and the email address that you use for registration must also be made entirely through tor and not tied to your real-life identity in any way.

For more information, you can look at https://anonymousplanet.org/.

From what little I have watched on the subject, using TOR with logged in accounts can blow your OPSEC. Those various log-ins can help someone completely build a profile, and piece together the info they need. It's how a lot of people get caught. All it takes is one mistake.

I'm all for maintaining your privacy. It's why I ditched windows and came to linux, ditched Facebook, and only have limited contact with google (thanks to Android), and every hard drive I own is encrypted, and according to the web, with a password that would take over a thousand years to crack (I just need it to remain secure for 50.. I wont care when I'm gone). However, I cant see how coming to a linux forum on the clearnet will cause me any grief in the future. TaterChip isn't on my drivers license, and this is the only place that name is used, so it can't be used to build a profile. I don't come here to engage in what could be considered illicit activities. I'm sure one of the Mods would spank me if I did.

Just my way of thinking, your mileage may vary.

[sylvain1_]

I have given multiple reasons for the value of tor, including the original post.

Today I bring another, recent reason. Not that the forum itself would sell the data, but the google trackers on it would, and your isp would, and Team Cymru, which analyzes netflow data, would. https://techcrunch.com/2024/01/26/natio ... rrantless/.

For further research, and to understand why government surveillance, as opposed to corporate surveillance, is concerning, read Permanent Record by Edward Snowden. (recommend pay in cash at local bookstore if possible)

Always remember, surveillance is for the benefit of the surveillant, not the surveilled. That is why we inherited an evolutionary instinct to not like being watched by strangers.

[Pepi]

Sometimes it will block me with my VPN on. Depends on what city I'm using.

It is not the city you're using but it is the exit node IP Address from TOR, a Proxy, or VPN that you are using, as they go through several connections before they exit to that particular IP Address exit node and then try to connect to a platform such as this.

If that exit node IP Address has ever been used by spammers or scammers in the past and put on an international blacklisting service such as stopforumspam.com or cleantalk.org/blacklists, just about all forums and social media uses these blacklists in their automated systems to stop forum spammers and scammer from entering their systems in the first place as a layer of protection since moderators and administrators of these platforms cannot be online 24/7 trying to mointor for that garbage too.

This is why I usually ask folks why they feel they need to use such devices to access safe sites such as this forum.

Save the TOR, VPN, or Proxies for the unknown entities out their in The Wild, Wild, Web, shut it off for those few sites that you know are safe like this one.

It only happens when I set my VPN to Detroit