dutrow wrote:For some reason, my root/administrator account does not show the lock-box that indicates software patches are available. I can see it on my other user accounts, but I cannot perform the updates from there. So, two questions.
1) How to I reclaim the lockbox icon in my root/administrator account?
2) How do I perform updates/installations while logged into a regular user account?
(I am a Linux Mint newbie, but a moderate Linux user.)
rich_roast wrote:a more drastic alternative is to somehow make it so that, when installed, root may not log in, at least not in runlevel 5
remoulder wrote:rich_roast wrote:a more drastic alternative is to somehow make it so that, when installed, root may not log in, at least not in runlevel 5
GASPS - you can't do that - you'd have the open source is a democracy brigade up in arms However I do agree, though it has to be done via pam.
FedoraRefugee wrote:Fedora did EXACTLY that! You cannot log into root in init5! That is one of the main reasons I LEFT Fedora!!! See, as much as I agree with not running as root [...] I do not condone dumbing down Linux. You should be free to do whatever you want in Linux, even if it is detrimental to your system.
rich_roast wrote:FedoraRefugee wrote:Fedora did EXACTLY that! You cannot log into root in init5! That is one of the main reasons I LEFT Fedora!!! See, as much as I agree with not running as root [...] I do not condone dumbing down Linux. You should be free to do whatever you want in Linux, even if it is detrimental to your system.
I agree with the assertion that dumbing down Linux is a bad thing, but I am not convinced that setting the default install to bar root from logging in at init5 necessarily means that. I am assuming that anyone wishing to reconfigure pam to allow them to login as root at that runlevel would be able to do this; pam's online documentation doesn't seem to have been finished but it seems to me that someone wishing to run X as root would be able to educate themselves to that effect - thereby learning about Linux and security. The problem at this time appears to be that an unknown number of users seem to be logging in to an X session as root on a regular basis without necessarily knowing about the potential dangers - dumb Linux.
It's probably quite easy to overstate the dangers of running X and GUI apps as root, too. I'm pretty sure that in the heady days of my Linux youth (FC 2, then later LFS) I ran X as root once or twice, usually after installing to make some pretty hefty configuration changes before settling down to regular use. To my knowledge I was never burned. That said, this was also because back in them days there wasn't the same level of ease in getting the OS to run satisfactorily post-install as a regular user (IIRC - or maybe it was just me being a mewling newbie ), and these days I can't think of any good reason to log in as root, although I'm open to suggestions.
As it is, I stand by my thinking that it would be a good idea to bar root from logging in on the default install (or provide a recommendation to do this during the install process with an explanation - although this would probably mean a somewhat significant amount of adapting the installer program), and as a minimum a notice somewhere visible that logging into an X session as root is a bad idea. I'm all in favour of education and see these suggestions as the most effective way to achieving this; as it is I think users are using their root account in an uneducated manner because there's no direct incentive to check any documentation before just doing it, which in these days of "instant gratification" (that some other threads seem to be talking about) is possibly the norm.
It is quite easy to reconfigure pam. In fact, a new user does not ever go through the "don't run in X" indoctrination, they simply search "log in as root" in the forum and follow the easy, laid out directions in the 20 how-to's in that forum! In fact, my good buddy Rahul (one of the devs) will waste all his breath arguing FOR this feature then he writes his own how-to in the Fedora wiki to bypass it. And can just not recognize the hypocrisy involved. But I digress... It has reached the point where it is like telling a ten year old kid "don't you dare do this, I will not allow it, I will lock the door so you can't get it!" then leaving the key on the table. What the heck do you think the kid is going to do? I just fail to see the point.
FedoraRefugee wrote:[...] threads that evolve into the "don't dare run as root" will always overstate the dangers. We have all logged in as root, the function is there for a purpose. Once we get our Linux legs we figure out we really do not need to do this, but the dangers are minimal. It is just as easy to bork something running as su in the user account. And other than root kits I have yet to hear about any serious Linux threats. I suppose you could be hacked, but...
FedoraRefugee wrote:Anyway, the point is why not just spend the time educating people on the correct way to do things?
And other than root kits I have yet to hear about any serious Linux threats. I suppose you could be hacked, but...
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