And they said I was trolling…

[linuxviolin]

When I wrote about the same thing a couple of years ago, they said I was trolling…

Here, Bozhidar Batsov has blogged this in two parts: The Linux desktop experience is killing Linux on the desktop, and The Linux desktop experience is killing Linux on the desktop, Part II.

From the second part:

This machine has its every part carefully selected for maximum Linux compatibility (the machine is a bit old, but that wasn’t always the case) - a GeForce 9600GT known to work “great” with the open-source nouveau driver, an Asus Xonar DX sound card, supported by the great Oxygen HD audio driver, etc. I do know how to buy hardware (contrary to popular belief). […]

Distro hopping is something that mostly newbies do, because they fail to grasp a fundamental thing in the land of Linux - 95% of the stuff that comprises a distribution is generic stuff found in most other distros. You cannot seriously expect that the same drivers in a different distro will yield wildly different results… Sure, bugs do tend to occur, and sometimes they are truly distribution specific. Sure, some distros happen to patch the stuff they ship heavily, while others favor shipping vanilla versions of both software ant the kernel. […]

The Linux desktop application stack suffers from a few serious problems:

- a few individuals make crucial decisions without taking any input from the user community
- many projects have only one principal developer that happens to do things his way without regard for anyone else
- often highly unstable beta quality software is pushed as stable to the end users
- a lot of prominent apps that are multi-platform seem to undergo sub-par testing/QA process under Linux and experience common problems like crashes and memory leaks that don’t manifest that often on other platforms

[…] Most of you probably remember that Pidgin (formerly Gaim) used to be the default IM client in GNOME based distros. At some point this quickly changed and Empathy became the default client. Part of the reason for the switch was the unwillingness of the lead developer in the Pidgin project to collaborate with the GNOME developers. I still remember the controversial fix that made the input area non-resizable with no option to go back to the previous setting. I guess GNOME’s devs were really pissed about something since they replaced the all around great Pidgin with a vastly inferior and immensely buggy (at least for the first year and a half) product. […]

Are we your users or your beta testers? A few examples from recent years:

KDE 4.0
GNOME 3.0
Empathy
PulseAudio
NetworkManager
Beagle

The list could go on and on… Microsoft and Apple have certainly had their fair share of mistakes (Win ME, Win Vista, OS X Leopard), but nothing on a scale as epic as KDE 4.0 or GNOME 3.0…

Some users are more important then others it seems…

All those programs run on all major OS, but they perform worse on Linux:

Firefox
OpenOffice
Flash Player

Obviously writing great multi-platform apps is possible as illustrated by software such as VLC and Google Chrome. But what about all the rest. I feel that Firefox’s days as the dominant browser on the Linux desktop are numbered - most of my friends that use Linux have already switched to Chrome (or the open source Chromium). Firefox on Linux is like a bad joke - slow, memory hungry and unstable. […]

I live in a country from the former Soviet block (Bulgaria) and I’ve seen first hand what Communism leads to. I’ve also seen first-hand why Communism doesn’t actually work - few people actually live and abide by it and the rest of society simply practices the fine art of “getting by” and lives on their shoulders. The Communism can only really work if everyone is pulling their own weight in it (which sounds a bit absurd indeed).

Something similar is happening on the Linux desktop ship - everybody says he’s on board, but very few people are actually rowing and bringing the Linux desktop to it’s designated port.

I’ve written only two desktop project for Linux from scratch (an English-Bulgarian dictionary utility and a GUI front-end for pacman on Arch Linux), but I’ve contributed bug reports and patches to lots of projects. No matter what your opinion about me is - I’ve done something for the Linux desktop and I’m doing something for the desktop now as well - writing this article…

What have you done? Sure, very few users are software engineers, but that doesn’t mean they can’t help. Bug reports are just as important as patches. Ideas and suggestions for improvements are highly valued as well. Don’t sit in the shadows doing nothing - step into the light and do something to help your favorite project get a little bit better.

Step by step. Fix by fix. Improvement by improvement. This is how good software gets created. […]

While I was writing the last paragraph I got another GNOME 3 shell corruption (time for killall gnome-shell to take the stage) on my totally supported hardware… A skype sound notification interrupted the song I was listening to (thanks a lot, PulseAudio)… And yet I’m still here. I did switch to Windows 7 on my laptop and I do intend to use Window 7 at least for a while there. It’s not perfect either, trust me about that. Poor terminal emulator (though great PowerShell), a few random application crashes (but these happen in Linux as well in recent years) just to name a few.

The Linux desktop is at the edge of a cliff now. It’s up to us to decide whether we would save it or push it over the edge.

[AdamS]

well, were I stand on this.

Bunch of BS, the guy should have taken the time to pick a supported laptop.

But if ya want to use a windows platform that suffers rot, pore file system and infections numbering some 12 billion.

be my guest, but your a minority and make no mistake about it.

Thous who use Linux and get to know Linux.

Never go back.

The ones who give up, are the ones who don't think things threw or don't have the time to think them threw.

They never get to KNOW Linux, 8 years of using Linux and he limited him self to a VERY small specific amount of distro,s.

Then he goes and buys a laptop powered by the worlds largest monopoly.

Very much doubt many Linux users who know Linux would have made the same mistake.

I know I wouldn't, I build and buy based on Linux, NOT windows.

[linuxviolin]

the guy should have taken the time to pick a supported laptop.
[...]

I build and buy based on Linux, NOT windows.

I guess you have not read the part II of the article:

This machine has its every part carefully selected for maximum Linux compatibility (the machine is a bit old, but that wasn’t always the case) - a GeForce 9600GT known to work “great” with the open-source nouveau driver, [...] I do know how to buy hardware (contrary to popular belief). Actually I’ve been a hardware enthusiast for most of my life and I know much more about the inner workings of computer components than most people. That said - the hardware that I bought for my home PC was not the hardware that I wanted to buy, but the one I had to buy.

Even the ill-fated T520 Sandy Bridge laptop was supposed to work very well with Linux

[AdamS]

Not a single inch of it would I have picked.

[Roken]

My own view, who cares?

I use both Linux and Windows depending on what I'm doing. If I'm using software that either won't work on Linux (not even in a VM) or for which there is simply no alternative, I use Windows. The rest of the time I use Linux. I can do this because it's my computer and I'm free to do what I want with it. If others prefer to use Windows as their main OS, then that's their prerogative, I'm not going to criticise them for it.

That's the beauty of the Linux philosophy, it's about freedom, which means people are free to use something else if they want. If they decide to turn up in a forum to vent their spleen based on their own bad decisions, I ignore them; pure and simple.

[Elisa]

I have a friend which uses win$ just 4 one game. And when he is on win$ he always plug out the physical network cable and says - this is the only way how win$ can run safely
...and I do agree with him

[colyn]

Most blogs are a waste of time to read. They are either one person's personal opinion or are hearsay.

If you think Linux is trouble...find another OS that you can be comfortable with..

[monkeyboy]

The OP is using another persons "rant" as credible evidence that it was not trolling years ago. Its very possible that either or both of those positions are flawed and thus the argument could collapses like a house of cards. Its a common logic flaw.

[exploder]

I have a computer that should be able to run Linux, all the hardware is supported but it never has worked reliably. The computer has a Foxconn mainboard and I believe it to be one of the boards that they deliberately altered the BIOS to only run Windows properly on. Some of you might remember all of the news articles about Foxconn doing this. When I first got the computer it would destroy a hard drive in about 3 to 5 times of booting the machine! Three BIOS upgrades and about 7 hard drives later, the computer no longer destroys hard drives but Linux just will not run properly on this computer. After 2 years of this computer just being a large paperweight, I decided to try putting Windows Vista on it. I had a legal copy of Vista that came with an HP computer that was struck by lightning.

Vista works perfectly on the computer and all of the hardware worked out of the box except the NVidea GT 220 but Windows Update provided the driver anyway. It took 2 days to get all of the updates, clean off the countless restore points that were created, (only one current restore point is needed) and install all of the familiar open source applications I have been using for years. Vista is not the ideal choice by any means, it uses a lot of disk space and more RAM than I would like but it does work reliably on the computer. It took a lot of tweaking to get Vista working decent. I edited the registry to get rid of the shortcut arrows and changed the menu show delay so the menus were fast. I ran Bleachbit to clean up all of the Windows Update mess, (Yes, there is a version for Windows.) and I set all of the programs that automatically look for updates to let me manually get them when I want them.

It took a lot of hours of work to get Vista to the point where it could do everything my Linux computer could. With the system services tweaked and tons of changes to various settings, Vista will not suffer from Windows rot or become virus infected. My Wife has always run Windows because she is a gamer and her Windows 7 computer is set up very similar to this one. I was surprised that nearly every open source program I use in Linux was available for Windows! I installed LibreOffice, VLC, Bleachbit, Virtualbox, Firefox 5 etc, so the applications match up to my Linux computer perfectly.

Running the computer with Vista on it is nearly the same as running my other computer with KDE on it. Both operating systems have their advantages and disadvantages but I was very surprised how similar the two systems could be made to be. All of this goes to show that manufactures tampering with hardware can influence your Linux experience. Foxconn tampered with the BIOS and got caught but how many other manufacturers have done the same thing and not been caught? I built my other computer and carefully chose it's components on a very tight budget but it works as expected with any given Linux distribution. I am not by any means a Microsoft fan but I have nothing against people making a living from selling software as long as they play fair. The Foxconn BIOS tampering was a pretty dirty deal. I would bet others have purchased hardware that has been tampered with and were left with the same type of situation I dealt with.

[linuxviolin]

The OP is using another persons "rant" as credible evidence that it was not trolling years ago.

A "credible evidence"? lol Just at least we're not alone.

exploder, quite interesting experience...

I was surprised that nearly every open source program I use in Linux was available for Windows!

Not me! And often for some, they perform much better on Windows, or worse on Linux if you prefer, like Firefox, OpenOffice, FlashPlayer...

About KDE, something that I miss in KDE4 is a feature presents in Windows since ages. It is: "Tile Windows Vertically"...

[exploder]

I used Windows Vista on my computer with the Foxconn board board as a last resort to be able to use the computer on a daily basis. I have learned a great deal from the experience. I can still run all of my favorite open source applications in Windows and they all run just fine. I also learned that it is a myth that you do not need to use the command line in Windows. I had to use the command line several times to do things like adjusting the amount of disk space System Restore uses. It took a lot of work making Windows to remain quick and responsive. Cleaning up the hundreds of files Windows Update leaves on the system proved to be a very lengthy process using Bleachbit, it took a couple of hours! Windows uses a lot more hard drive space than Linux to have the same level of functionality, even after spending a couple of days of investigating how to get the system really clean.

It has been years since I used Windows, luckily I was able to find enough information to tweak and tune Windows to where it really runs nice. I also turned off automatic updates for everything, it seemed totally ridiculous having everything looking for updates and it just slows down the system. I would much rather install updates myself as they become available and keep the system running fast. I used some old registry trick to get rid of the shortcut arrows and speed up the menus. All things considered, I did as least as much tweaking in Windows as I do with most Linux distributions I run.

I case anyone is interested in some of the open source applications that run in Linux, here are some of the applications I have installed and tried

Gimp
LibreOffice
Firefox
Bleachbit
Virtualbox
VLC

All of these applications run very well in Windows Vista and I would not want to live without any of these. My Windows system has a 27 GB install footprint where my Linux system only has about a 3 GB install footprint to have the same functionality, that's one heck of a difference! memory use in the Windows system is about one third more with areo enabled. Fully updated and tweaked, the Windows systems memory management seems about as good as the Linux system and I am not finding any memory leaks anywhere with any of the applications I have installed. I do have a tip for anyone duel booting or using Windows on any of there computers, Avira Personal Edition does not use very much resources, it's free and does a good job. Avira Personal Edition is free but it does bring up an add when it updates, it seemed like a small price to pay considering it is free and does a good job. I have used Avira on my Wife's Windows computer for years and it has always kept her computer virus free.

I will never be a fan of Microsoft's business practices but I can not fault the people that write the code that goes into making the operating system. I never have had a problem with people making a living selling software to feed their families. There is enough open source software available where I do not feel like I am locked into using proprietary software either, you do still have choices available. It is unfortunate that Foxconn's business practices forced me into using Windows on this particular computer but it has taught me a few things and I can walk away with some new knowledge from the experience.

I do think that if Linux distributions would refine existing technology more rather than constantly introducing new technology that Linux would be more successful and could do well as a mainstream solution. Windows versions tend to have a long life as far as support goes, Vista was released in 2006 and is still supported. I used Vista because I had a legal copy, not because I thought it was very good but they have updated things enough things where it is stable and runs pretty decent. My Wife runs Windows 7 and it seems to be much lighter and faster. Microsoft made a huge mistake with Vista because it would not run on netbooks, they put themselves in quite a bind by this mistake. Linux seems to introduce too many drastic changes every six months and I think this is why so many of us have so many problems with graphics drivers. I have working options with my NVidea GT 220 in Windows and for being a low end card it works very well in Windows. If Linux distributions would stick with a version of xserver-org and a kernel for a length of time I think that NVidea could refine their drivers to work just as well under Linux.

Windows will never replace Linux as my operating system of choice but it is clear to me that things need to be better refined rather than drastically changed to get things where we need them to make Linux more attractive to manufacturers.

[DrHu]

I think you can pick apart any OS for deficiencies; Linux is not different in that regard, however Linux like pother OSS products are freely available without the constraining factors of patents or license to use (rent that software or OS, and pay when it expires..)

Linux as a product is more than comparable to any of the two main commercial lines available, either Microsoft windows and applications or OSX and applications

If you can't find an OSS application that meets the 90% user need, then you aren't really looking

--and if you need to find such an application(s), look to the tables of comparison available
http://www.linuxrsp.ru/win-lin-soft/table-eng.html
http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/Lin ... s_software

The only objection to this is if you really notice that an OSS application cannot meet your specific needs or it is mandated by your employer(s)
--if that isn't the case, you are not being completely honest

But I don 't agree that you have to buy a Linux notebook(if you can afford the price difference, do so), in order to run a Linux OS on a specific notebook
--it is, of course, best to make some research, and if you need a method of evaluation, you can check the specs on a Linux notebook supplier, for ideas
http://www.emperorlinux.com/

The supplier I always check, as I think they make a good line, with good support..

[exploder]

That's some very good information DrHu. I must agree with you too, you never actually own a copy of Windows, that is you really can not make any real changes to the operating system itself. I was however amazed at the number of open source applications I am able to run and use. I have a better understanding of how I could make someone's experience better that is forced to run Windows for whatever reason. I am used to running Linux where I have nearly every application I need out of the box. With the knowledge I have gained I could provide a Windows user a much better experience than I could before. I fix computers on the side to earn extra money.

Far too often I run into hardware that has no Linux drivers and am forced to put Windows back on. I felt like I was not giving the customer enough out of the box software, now I see that I can give them a much more complete set of applications. I have given people PCLinuxOS KDE as a replacement for Windows with good results. Windows users seem to adjust to KDE quickly and the rolling release aspects seem to keep people pretty happy. People's poor habits seem to get them into trouble with Windows more than any other single reason, Linux is certainly more secure and less likely to sustain damage from poor habits.

It was nice for me to learn that even under unfavorable circumstances I could find good open source software to use on proprietary operating systems.

Edit: Sorry linuxviolin, I did not mean to hijack your thread. Just wanted to share some interesting information I had discovered.

[linuxviolin]

Sorry linuxviolin, I did not mean to hijack your thread. Just wanted to share some interesting information I had discovered.

Do not apologize. Your posts here are interesting and quite true. Plus, they say some things I, and other, try to say since a long time, but, like I said, "they" say we're trolling...

About Open-source software, you're right, there are plethora of them in Windows too for practically all your need (and many Linux apps)

About the drivers, like I said elsewhere, the problem is:

When you see, at the contrary of Windows, Mac OS or BSD, there is not even a stable API (not ABI, but even API) in the kernel, thus actually favoring the regressions and the breakage in as many drivers as possible, as long as proper regression tests don’t catch them and code is not changed to restore the functionality! Thanks for this to "the shi***** of the Linux kernel geniuses, the honorable Greg Kroah-Hartman"! Stupid!

[exploder]

Do not apologize. Your posts here are interesting and quite true. Plus, they say some things I, and other, try to say since a long time, but, like I said, "they" say we're trolling...

It just seems like sharing information to me, letting people know they have options under different circumstances. Open source operating systems seem to go in all different directions sometimes and then there are manufactures purposely stacking the deck to make Windows work better than other operating systems. It would be difficult to keep things like Adobe Flash working right in Linux when the graphics sub system changes so drastically from one release to another. People cry that these companies are not supporting Linux when in fact they can only do so much with all of the constant changes.

About Open-source software, you're right, there are plethora of them in Windows too. (and many Linux apps)

I never realized just how much was available for Windows! I was shocked by how much configuring I could do with my NVidea graphics in Windows, there are so many configuration options available. Linux distributions keep using newer xserver-org packages and kernels and they also use technology that is not even supported by the graphics card manufacturers. How is NVidea or any manufacturer supposed to keep up with all these changes? It would make more sense for distributions to stick with something for a decent length of time and work out the issues that arise. I hate reading through the release notes of distributions only to find that hardware I have will not work like it did because they went with a new version of something. It seems like new releases are abandon ware because they never fix the bugs they released with.

The best example of good development practices I have found is PCLinuxOS. Many seem to want Linux to stay a hobbyist type of thing rather than a mainstream choice. I have always believed Linux could do well in the mainstream if somebody took the time to actually release when ready. No software is perfect by any means but it should at least meet a persons basic expectations. I have visited quite a few Windows forums to find answers for configuring Vista and was surprised how they all view Ubuntu as Linux! More focus needs to be placed on fixing bugs and regressions before releasing to the public. Ubuntu is a poor representation of Linux in my eyes because they release with so many serious bugs and regressions.

Edit: I found out tonight the latest version of Pidgin will run on Windows! I am so close to having all of my favorite applications running on Windows and so far all of them run great!

Edit 2: At first I was very disappointed having to run Windows to make the Foxconn system usable but after finding that nearly every open source application I like and use has a version that will run on Windows I am kind of excited about it. I can use everything that I have learned when I reload computers for extra money. I never knew that I could offer people such a complete set of applications! I can add real value to my service and still promote the use of open source software! This experience was a real eye opener for me! Who would have ever thought that something could be learned from hardware that was deliberately tampered with! I reload computers for a fraction of the cost the local places do and they just throw Windows on and call it a day. I put all of the updates on, tweak the system and childproof it so to speak, so they can not break it very easily. Now I can also offer a decent set of applications so they really have something nice to work with!

[GoustiFruit]

Then consider installing them Avast instead of Avira. Smooth updates, light on resources.

[lmintnewb]

This thread has taught me many things.

1. We all have way too much time on our hands apparently and can overthink even the most trivial thing until it's been beaten to death and then beaten some more.

2. Exploder tamed vista. Only ever used one comp with vista. Never gave me any problems. Though agree it's craptastic and only truly worthwhile in the hands of a tech guru such as exploder, or someone who just plain lucks out by a quirk of fate.

a. Exploder has access to ALOT of hdd's.
b. There's a windows version of bleachbit ... hmmmm.
c. He's almost talked me into PCOSlinux. They have a lighter weight edition if I remember correctly ? Or there's always the just install a light DE and set it to default. If you're that impressed with it exploder. Then I must really be missing out w/o giving it a full install tryout.

3. Roken's post imo is composed of pure wisdom and reeks of a positive attitude that should be shared by true nix community members. Though I couldn't agree more with his outlook. I won't criticize winblows users themselves ( esp since I am one ). But will all too often criticize M$ at the slightest opportunity, lol. I despise them and think they embody craptasticness. When pressed however will readily admit the software they produce can be made to run well enough for most PC users needs ... sighs. Really really pressed will even admit to actually having become fond of XP over the years. ( don't tell anybody ! )

ditto colyn.

4. Agree with DrHu ... that's why he's the Dr and I am da newb I guess ... more sighs.

5. I forgot what I was going to type here ... errrrr.

Ah came up with an edit after thought. 6. GLR seems to know more than a lil about comps, components and making nix work.

7. Even managed to come up with a 7 ( by this point, I'm trolling, lol.)

Use Avira too, tis light, reputable enough and what I really like about it. Can disable it from automatically starting and wasting RAM and only start it when I need it. Yes ... sure there are others that allow it. Avast in the latest editions, used to prefer it ... has become a bloated pig dog. While no doubt works well enough. Ya don't need an up to the minute anti-vir running every sec your PC is turned on, imo. Main thing about M$ security in my view is using your computer with common sense. The whole sec viruses will getcha paranoia seems to me just that. Mainly paranoia.

If it were anything as bad as so many people seem to suggest and think. You wouldn't be able to turn on a computer running a winblows OS without it instantly being infested by computer nasties. That clearly isn't the case in real life. As gazillions of people use them everyday without becoming infected.

Have gone longgggggggg periods of time with nothing more than a good firewall running w no winblows infections. Want an AV I can start when I need to use it. Otherwise don't want it slowing up my comp scanning anything and everything and protecting me from things that go bump in the night and hide under your bed. When the biggest thing you need to protect yourself is common sense. Using any OS platform that still applies in general ... imo anyway.

[exploder]

Have gone longgggggggg periods of time with nothing more than a good firewall running w no winblows infections. Want an AV I can start when I need to use it. Otherwise don't want it slowing up my comp scanning anything and everything and protecting me from things that go bump in the night and hide under your bed. When the biggest thing you need to protect yourself is common sense. Using any OS platform that still applies in general ... imo anyway.

I clearly have way too much time on my hands! I saw something interesting about malware in Linux again! Someone put a theme on gnome-look a couple of days ago that would wipe your hard drive! Gnome-look immediately removed the theme when it was reported but this is the third instance I have heard about. I wanted to try the theme in a Virtualbox install to see it for myself but it had already been removed... This goes to show that any operating system can be compromised if you do not take the proper precautions. Many distributions warn you to only use packages from their repos and this was a good example of why.

Then consider installing them Avast instead of Avira. Smooth updates, light on resources.

I have tried Avast anti-virus it had a slick user interface but it slowed the computer down. I don't really notice Avira running and I have had real good luck using it to remove viruses from other peoples computers. My step dad uses Norton and I think it is as bad as having a virus! Norton seem to flood the registry with entries and is a total nightmare to remove. I would much rather have Linux installed on the Foxconn system but after 2 years of trying I can see that it just isn't going to work unless I buy another motherboard for the machine.

a. Exploder has access to ALOT of hdd's.
b. There's a windows version of bleachbit ... hmmmm.
c. He's almost talked me into PCOSlinux. They have a lighter weight edition if I remember correctly ? Or there's always the just install a light DE and set it to default. If you're that impressed with it exploder. Then I must really be missing out w/o giving it a full install tryout.

I have access to a few computers, wish I had extra hard drives. I searched far and wide for a real rolling release and PCLinuxOS was just hands down the best choice. Take a look at the 2011 releases when they are officially released and I think you will be very pleasantly surprised. I have been enjoying the development process and have seen some first class teamwork take place developing all of the new brushed metal artwork. Texstar made the plans for how all of the new features were going to be deployed and everything is in place except for the new package manager, it is in the works though. When you can enjoy the development process and look forward to the changes with excitement, that really says a lot. I have always liked the idea of a rolling release and these guys know what they are doing! The PCLinuxOS team builds and maintain all of their own packages, that's no small task! PCLinuxOS has the hardest working group of people out there, these guys and gals are building a lot of new editions and have really put a lot of hard work.

Edit: The whole point of my bringing up Windows was not to promote it's use. My point was that if it has to be used, you could make it nearly as nice as you can any Linux distribution. I have not used Windows myself for several years and I had no idea that so many of the open source applications I use everyday had Windows versions available. I tried to throw in a few tips on making Windows run nicer without breaking anything too. Some tweaks people write don't really do anything and could cause more harm than good. Many of us have friends and family that run Windows and some of the information I posted might be of help to you when they need your help. A lot of people duel boot because of work or because they enjoy gaming, some of the information might make things a little nicer for them too. It's nice to know that open source developers take the time and effort to build Windows versions, they make things better for everyone. We see these applications everyday because we run Linux and we tend to take them for granted but these applications can make a big difference to someone running Windows. I had no concerns about spyware, malware or viruses because I am familiar with these applications. I think these applications developers deserve our thanks and appreciation for the great service they provide for free. I have real respect and admiration for these developers after this experience.

We take powerful applications like Gimp and LibreOffice for granted but these applications open up a world of possibilities for people to be creative at no cost. Give people the tools and they will use them! I learned how to use The Gimp because it was freely given to me. I am no graphics artist by any means but I can do things I never dreamed I would be able to do because someone made it possible for me to have such a powerful tool. I could not afford to buy Microsoft Office or Photo Shop, I just don't have that kind of money to spend on software. I am totally amazed that I was able to take Windows Vista and transform it into something so similar to the Linux distribution that I use everyday. I never imagined I could learn so much because of hardware that was not Linux compatible.

[lmintnewb]

Good attitude, agree much is taken for granted. Try not to ... but sure I'm guilty as charged myself. Long time nix fence sitter, staunch M$ disliker and nix newb. Had flirted with it on and off and studied the subject of gnu/linux here and there. Now amazed what all the people behind these gazillion nix distros have been able to do. Big time talent and generosity. Try to remind myself to be grateful and support their cause when a chance presents. As for photoshop ... yep agree there as well. Think only professional graphics designers, people who need it for a living or work field, would want to spend amounts like that for editing software.

Same thing ... use gimp, not overly good at it. Can make passable graphics if needed. Sure there's more power there than I'm able to handle. Blown away by how many talented people decided to share what they made instead of hanging a price tag on it. One of the many reasons I've grown to detest M$. Wouldn't even try to list em all, lol. Too many to bother trying.

3rd party software makers put out programs for people to use freely that puts to shame the stuff M$ sells people. About all the tools I use that make XP worthwhile ( or the other MS OS's ... I've used ) arent made by M$. All freeware and opensource stuff. I usually tell people given the chance ... DONT USE M$ !!! Explore the alternatives out there. Linux being the crown jewel of FOSS. Though once you've paid for it or bought something it comes on. Can't see how getting the most of it would be a bad thing. They paid for it, none of my business what they do with it eh.

Though will do my best to plague and bash the daylights out of any ignorant M$ fanboys n girls I happen across who tout M$'s stuff. Think tech would be who knows how much further along if it weren't for craptastic corps trying to monopolize software and info tech. M$ being the worst craptastic corp I know of where that's concerned. Ok am definitely trolling now. Just piped up to say couldn't agree more exploder the FOSS people of the world are amazing folks.


PS, also ... as if all the tons of other sleazebag things M$ has pulled in the name of da almighty dollar. Bill Gates named an entire corp after his own male parts. That is just plain arrogant and inappropriate ! No matter how ya view it.

[exploder]

I do not have anything against Microsoft selling software at all. I do have a problem with Microsoft's business practices though. People have families to feed and cloth and there is nothing wrong with selling software as a product. Squashing competitors, stealing work from small companies, threatening lawsuits and claiming theft of intellectual property and an assortment of other dirty dealings is what I don't like. Make a good product and offer it at a reasonable price should be enough to succeed and be profitable. I can't blame the people that code Windows, they are doing nothing more than earning a living the same as me. I don't have anything against people that prefer Windows, many people have never tried anything else. I stopped using Windows when I called to re-activate XP and they accused me of installing it on more than one computer. That shows how long it has been since I used anything from Microsoft.