Trying to Set Stable - Lost Apps [SOLVED]

[odo5435]

I'm testing LMDE Lxde on a live flashdrive created with UNetbootin prior to replacing Win7 on an Asus EeePC netbook. It's slow progress for me working the various issues but it's getting there.

My current stumbling block is trying to set it to Debian Stable. Following the instructions provided on the HOWTO: LMDE "LTS / Stable" page produced the following

Code: Select all

sudo su -c "sed -i.bak s/testing/squeeze/g /etc/apt/sources.list && apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade"
Ign http://packages.linuxmint.com debian InRelease                             
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze InRelease                             
Ign http://deb.opera.com stable InRelease                                     
Hit http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates InRelease                       
Get:1 http://packages.linuxmint.com debian Release.gpg [198 B]                 
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze Release.gpg                           
Ign http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze InRelease                         
Get:2 http://deb.opera.com stable Release.gpg [189 B]                         
Hit http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/main i386 Packages             
Hit http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/contrib i386 Packages           
Hit http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/non-free i386 Packages         
Ign http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/contrib TranslationIndex       
Ign http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/main TranslationIndex           
Ign http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/non-free TranslationIndex       
Get:3 http://packages.linuxmint.com debian Release [12.1 kB]                   
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze Release                               
Hit http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze Release.gpg                       
Hit http://deb.opera.com stable Release                                       
Ign http://deb.opera.com stable Release                                       
Hit http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze Release                           
Ign http://deb.opera.com stable/non-free i386 Packages/DiffIndex               
Ign http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/contrib Translation-en_US       
Ign http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/contrib Translation-en         
Ign http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/main Translation-en_US         
Ign http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/main Translation-en             
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/contrib TranslationIndex               
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/main TranslationIndex                 
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/non-free TranslationIndex             
Get:4 http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/main i386 Packages [9,887 B]       
Get:5 http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze/main i386 Packages/DiffIndex [2,023 B]
Ign http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/non-free Translation-en_US     
Ign http://deb.opera.com stable/non-free TranslationIndex                     
Ign http://security.debian.org squeeze/updates/non-free Translation-en         
Get:6 http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze/non-free i386 Packages/DiffIndex [2,023 B]
Ign http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze/main TranslationIndex             
Ign http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze/non-free TranslationIndex         
Get:7 http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/upstream i386 Packages [5,208 B]   
Get:8 http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/import i386 Packages [19.4 kB]     
Ign http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/import TranslationIndex               
Ign http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/main TranslationIndex                 
Ign http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/upstream TranslationIndex             
Hit http://deb.opera.com stable/non-free i386 Packages                         
Err http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/main i386 Packages                     
  404  Not Found
Err http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/contrib i386 Packages                 
  404  Not Found
Err http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/non-free i386 Packages                 
  404  Not Found
Ign http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze/main Translation-en_US           
Ign http://deb.opera.com stable/non-free Translation-en_US                     
Ign http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze/main Translation-en               
Ign http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze/non-free Translation-en_US
Ign http://www.debian-multimedia.org squeeze/non-free Translation-en
Ign http://deb.opera.com stable/non-free Translation-en
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/contrib Translation-en_US             
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/contrib Translation-en                 
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/main Translation-en_US                 
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/main Translation-en                   
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/non-free Translation-en_US             
Ign http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/import Translation-en_US             
Ign http://debian.linuxmint.com squeeze/non-free Translation-en               
Ign http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/import Translation-en                 
Ign http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/main Translation-en_US               
Ign http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/main Translation-en                   
Ign http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/upstream Translation-en_US           
Ign http://packages.linuxmint.com debian/upstream Translation-en               
Fetched 51.1 kB in 8s (6,184 B/s)                                             
W: GPG error: http://deb.opera.com stable Release: The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY A2019EA84E7532C8
W: Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/squeeze/main/binary-i386/Packages  404  Not Found

W: Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/squeeze/contrib/binary-i386/Packages  404  Not Found

W: Failed to fetch http://debian.linuxmint.com/latest/dists/squeeze/non-free/binary-i386/Packages  404  Not Found

E: Some index files failed to download. They have been ignored, or old ones used instead.

Apart from there appearing to be an error I understand little about the output. What is it trying to tell me?

Additionally, prior to doing this I checked the Software Manager and some 30,000+ packages were listed. Now Software Manager tells me there are only some 2,500 packages. The missing applications are the ones I need for my system. Can I get these back or are they not available in the "stable" format?

[istrandi]

All the 404 errors mean that the URL's you supplied it were wrong... apart from that I can't help you. Try checking those again.

[tdockery97]

It looks like you are trying to turn the "new" LMDE into a Squeeze version. That won't work too well for two reasons. First, Mint only mirrors the Debian Testing repositories. Second, the newest LMDE iso's (201108RC & 201109) are too far beyond Squeeze to easily downgrade. If you want to run an LMDE based on Stable (Squeeze), you really need to use the iso's from either last December or January and make your changes to their sources lists. Then you will be in proper sync with Squeeze.

[odo5435]

Thank you both for your help.

Just so I get this clear in my (tiny) brain, If I want a 'stable' version of LMDE I must use an old .iso. If I want the newest version of LMDE then I must use a 'testing' version along with the possible crashes that might ensue. Is this correct?

It looks like you are trying to turn the "new" LMDE into a Squeeze version.

Well, that was not my intention. I've obviously got the wrong impression that 'Rolling Release' meant that every "new" version is a continuation of the previous version (i.e. there are no incompatibilities between versions). Where do I need to go to find out more on this subject?

Second, the newest LMDE iso's (201108RC & 201109) are too far beyond Squeeze to easily downgrade.

Does this mean that at some point I'll have to download another .iso in the future and upgrade my old "Squeeze" into the new "Whateverit'scalled"? I thought the reason people prefer Debian was that there was no need to ever 'upgrade' again.

It seems I've some serious misconceptions. Is there a site you can direct me to that'll enlighten me?

[tdockery97]

Debian Squeeze is the "stable" release, and a new version is released every 2-3 years. It is not considered a rolling release, as your Debian Squeeze installation does not automatically become the next stable (which will be Wheezy). You can upgrade to Wheezy when it becomes finalized, but it is not automatic. Debian Testing (which is Wheezy, which will be the next stable in a couple or three years) automatically leads to the next stable and continues on and becomes the testing for the next new stable. Debian Sid (unstable) is always Sid, and is the repository where packages start the process of truly heading on the road to the stable release. Note that there are a couple of repositories above Sid, namely Experimental and Volatile, but I don't think anyone actually uses those as the basis for their Debian installation. As far as rolling release, Sid is actually the "real" rolling release for Debian. Hope that helps a little.

NOTE: Debian Sid is considered a true rolling release, Debian Testing (like LMDE) is considered a continually updating release, and Debian Stable (currently Squeeze) is, well, stable and pretty much receives only security and a very few system/app updates.

[odo5435]

Thanks for that and it did help to clear things a little, but the area I'm having difficulty is the 'upgrade' procedure. Part of what attracted me to Debian was the prospect of never having to upgrade, ever again (at least not every couple of years or so).

Just to get this right in my head (again), if I want a stable release then Squeeze is it; but I'll have to upgrade that to Wheezy at some point in the future. This will involve a complete re-install as is suggested for other versions of LM.

If I'm happy to remain in "testing" mode then choose the current version (at the moment Wheezy) which will mean possible instability but also never ever having to upgrade again because it's a 'Rolling Release'.

Am I getting any closer?

[tdockery97]

Yes you are. The upgrade from Squeeze to Wheezy though will be more like Ubuntu does their upgrades, without having to do a complete reinstall, but you have to manually initiate the upgrade rather than just automatically "cruising through" like in Testing. I think some of us use Testing because we regard stable as boring, not enough action. Some use Testing because stable has old, old apps that don't get updated as frequently. So all in all, it's a matter of personal preference and how much time/effort you want to put into maintaining your system.

[odo5435]

It's all becoming clearer now and I appreciate your patience. There are just a couple of more points I need clarified because I need to be reasonably certain that I know what I'm getting into. One of the applications I'll be using will be for the family accounts and they're somewhat complicated.

From what I've read (yes I did do some research before I ended up here) the Testing version can get out of sync with the apps. As I understand it, an update will occur one day that could break an application (say GnuCash) and it may take a while for it to be sorted (either the app upgrades or a workaround is found). Or the opposite, a new release of an app occurs which'll be unusable for a while. Am I on the right track? Does this happen often? How difficult/complicated can the ensuing fix/workaround get?

I know you'll just say back up, back up, back up but I've fallen down in this area in the past. My programing skills are nil so the prospect of having to find solutions by myself is not appealing.

[tdockery97]

With LMDE things can periodically break. The frequency and severity of breakages depends on a huge variety of factors including which desktop environment you are using, whether you use the open-source or proprietary video drivers, which applications you have installed, and so on. A big factor in preventing breakages is in HOW you do your updates. If you watch the threads regarding breakages in the forum, that can warn you that maybe you should hold off for a few days and watch for fixes/work-arounds. Personally, I've found that if I do the updates a certain way I very rarely have breakages. If something is not going to be compatible, it gets held back until the necessary dependencies come through.

Just keep in mind that if you want to go down the Linux Mint Debian road, there are very many people on our forums willing to go far out of their way to help you.

[odo5435]

Thank you very much for your patience. Your moderator instinct must have had you pulling your hair over how far off topic I was straying.

In this case it seems my need for stability is going to get overridden by my laziness (in avoiding upgrades). My brain is telling me not to be so stupid, I'll never be able to extricate myself from the inevitable mess I'm going to end up in. My heart is saying why not live on the edge for a while. Also, somehow I think the laziest option in terms of maintenance would be to go stable.

But heck, you only live once! I can always download and revert to stable if it all gets to be too much. Of course, although I'm promising myself I'll religiously do backups, it's as certain as night follows day that, the first time I completely bork things, I'll have a good reason for not having done one (backup).

Thank you once again for your help. It's very much appreciated.