Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby Robin on Thu Sep 22, 2011 6:12 am

Releases are supported for 18 months, not just 6. Upgrading to the latest version is OPTIONAL. Two more can be released and "seasoned" by updates and bug fixes in the time it takes one to run out of support. If 6 months is too fast, then just wait awhile! No hurry, no mandatory upgrade. If the LTS is too old (let's say, a year or two into it's 3-year lifespan), just go up one or two versions - always staying at least one behind the latest release for the stability you need.
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby MALsPa on Thu Sep 22, 2011 7:17 am

KBD47 wrote:Another way to go is to dual-boot: Keep one rock solid Linux version on your computer and another cutting edge distribution.


That's how I look at things, too. Get the best of both worlds. It's fairly easy to do, so why tie yourself down to one distro?

KBD47 wrote:I really think if you are using Debian--go Debian Stable or what's the point? I can't understand why one of the most user friendly distros--Mint--would move toward an unstable rolling release for so many of their flavors.


KBD47, I'm with you on that, too. LMDE based on Stable would be better for me than having it based on Testing.

Robin wrote:Releases are supported for 18 months, not just 6. Upgrading to the latest version is OPTIONAL. Two more can be released and "seasoned" by updates and bug fixes in the time it takes one to run out of support. If 6 months is too fast, then just wait awhile! No hurry, no mandatory upgrade. If the LTS is too old (let's say, a year or two into it's 3-year lifespan), just go up one or two versions - always staying at least one behind the latest release for the stability you need.


Exactly. No need to rush out and get the latest and greatest. People complain about the 6-month release cycle as if it's mandatory, and many folks don't realize that those releases are actually supported for about 18 months.
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby sunewbie on Thu Sep 22, 2011 11:48 am

@robin and @ MALsPa

I thought even if I am one version behind, I will still have to upgrade after 6 months. Honestly speaking, after the mess I made, I am not confident to install distro . But I will get over it. It is always better to have a clean install and more importantly a proper partition.

I do know that normal version is supported up to 18 months and LTS upto 3 years. I like your advise to remain one version behind or if not needed then 2 versions behind.

I really appreciate time spared by you all to understand me and my problem and give the best possible advise. I will definitely take your advise.

But I am not planning to upgrade i.e. fresh install of newer version immediately. I do not want to maintain too many distros, so mostly it will be 2 linux distros plus XP.

Mint (all softwares) and Bodhi (lightweight only selected apps) are more or less fixed on my list. Since both have ubuntu base there is very little learning curve other than learning E17. I may or may not install PClinuxOS XFCE (rolling distro). I was having a look at Pinguy OS, but no point in installing both Mint and Pinguy.

I once again thank you all for your support.
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby RaiGal on Fri Sep 30, 2011 2:38 pm

Hello,
I am using Linux Mint 9 but I have found LM10 to be much better for my laptop (wireless drivers,app versions etc). If I am not mistaken LM 10 is going to be updated for another 6 months or so. I was wondering if I install LM10 will I be be able to get any updates at all (even when using sudo apt get update or repositories).
Thank you! :mrgreen:
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby xenopeek on Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:25 pm

RaiGal wrote:Hello,
I am using Linux Mint 9 but I have found LM10 to be much better for my laptop (wireless drivers,app versions etc). If I am not mistaken LM 10 is going to be updated for another 6 months or so. I was wondering if I install LM10 will I be be able to get any updates at all (even when using sudo apt get update or repositories).
Thank you! :mrgreen:

Mint 10 is supported till last quarter of 2012 (the standard 1.5 year for non-LTS releases; counted from its release April 2010). After that you don't get updates.
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby KBD47 on Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:40 pm

Just curious, why not use Mint 11? It is supported for another year.
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby SimonTS on Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:58 am

Mint 11 seems to be very much a 'Marmite' version - people either love it or hate it :lol:

I had so many problems with the RC of Katya, and then also when the full version came out, that I consigned it to the 'never touch again' corner and carried on with Mint 9. Although 10 provided better support for my hardware out of the box, I was able to get 9 to work with a bit of effort and learning, and found it to be far more stable. Maybe I will give Mint 12 a try when it comes out as the beta versions of Ubuntu 11.10 seem to already be much better than 11.04 has been at any point.

Overall, I think that most people will find a version they like and stick with it as long as they can - maybe run other versions in a separate partition for testing.
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby KBD47 on Sat Oct 01, 2011 2:51 pm

I actually like both 9 and 11. I've used the 9 cd several times to make a persistent usb of several other operating systems as its disc creator is excellent. I'm using Mint 11 on my desktop computer without any issues--computer is about 5 years old. I was using 11 on my netbook but had wireless issues with it. Will be very curious to see what the next edition desktop looks like.
Marmite was a new one to me, had to look it up, a beer byproduct sounds yummy (not) :)
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby sunewbie on Mon Oct 03, 2011 7:33 am

I found this thread which shows the difference between windows and linux apps

viewtopic.php?f=47&t=31954
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby sunewbie on Sun Oct 30, 2011 11:41 am

In FCM #54, I got a link to Ubuntu backports, through which one can use newer programs in older version like 10.04 LTS.

Here is a link. This maybe useful :)

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports

Short intro:

Ubuntu releases a new version of its OS every 6 months. After a release, the version of all packages stays constant for the entire 6 months. For example, if Ubuntu ships with OpenOffice.org 2.0.x, it will remain at OpenOffice.org 2.0.x for the entire 6-month release cycle, even if a later version gets released during this time. The Ubuntu team may apply important security fixes to 2.0.x, but any new features or non-security bugfixes will not be made available.

This is where Ubuntu Backports comes in. The Backports team believes that the best update policy is a mix of Ubuntu's security-only policy AND providing new versions of some programs. Candidates for version updates are primarily desktop applications, such as your web browser, word processor, IRC client, or IM client. These programs can be updated without replacing a large part of the operating system that would affect stability of the whole system.

Backports is an official Ubuntu repository and maintained by knowledgeable Ubuntu developers who are often present on IRC and other communications media. But note that software in backports will not receive review or updates from the Ubuntu security team itself.


Lucid Backports
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby KBD47 on Sun Oct 30, 2011 2:58 pm

useful info thanks!
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby t3g on Sun Nov 06, 2011 1:47 pm

The issue I see with many Ubuntu based distributions based off of an LTS is that they do not keep up with the official point releases. It would be nice to see a Linux Mint 9.x to be in sync with 10.04.x and release ISO images with updated code. It would be nice to install a system and be somewhat up to date instead of downloading a significant amount of files the first time the update manager is run. Hopefully Mint 13 can follow suit considering that all LTS versions of Ubuntu will now be supported for 5 years.

I do like how Pinguy OS keeps up to date with the 10.04 LTS point releases like with http://distrowatch.com/?newsid=06826
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby Kilz on Thu Nov 10, 2011 9:43 am

t3g wrote:The issue I see with many Ubuntu based distributions based off of an LTS is that they do not keep up with the official point releases. It would be nice to see a Linux Mint 9.x to be in sync with 10.04.x and release ISO images with updated code. It would be nice to install a system and be somewhat up to date instead of downloading a significant amount of files the first time the update manager is run. Hopefully Mint 13 can follow suit considering that all LTS versions of Ubuntu will now be supported for 5 years.

I do like how Pinguy OS keeps up to date with the 10.04 LTS point releases like with http://distrowatch.com/?newsid=06826


I think that some may misunderstand the purpose of a LTS. The purpose of a LTS is stability. Something that will not change and introduce more bugs so that users that need long term stability can move to linux. Those that complain that a LTS looses its bleeding edge in software probably dont understand the concept. IMHO every distro should have a LTS version so that more corporate users would consider moving away from windows.
Sometimes if someone wants the latest and greatest of an application they dont take into account the linux development model. Software is released early and fast so that users can find and report bugs to be fixed. So if you move away from a LTS expect bugs and problems.
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby sunewbie on Thu Nov 10, 2011 9:51 am

Kilz wrote:
I think that some may misunderstand the purpose of a LTS. The purpose of a LTS is stability. Something that will not change and introduce more bugs so that users that need long term stability can move to linux. Those that complain that a LTS looses its bleeding edge in software probably dont understand the concept. IMHO every distro should have a LTS version so that more corporate users would consider moving away from windows.
Sometimes if someone wants the latest and greatest of an application they dont take into account the linux development model. Software is released early and fast so that users can find and report bugs to be fixed. So if you move away from a LTS expect bugs and problems.


The problem with Windows converts (incl me ;) ) is that we cannot understand what has software to do with updating of core system?. This library stuff and porting to new libraries and moving from GTK2 to GTK3 is something that an end user is not concerned.

Regarding new software, there are alpha, beta and final releases. So the final release should be stable. We can understand if software or OS crashes if I use chromium dev build or FF beta or vanila build. But a stable built or final version is supposed to be stable, that is why it is called final version.

Due to opensource nature, geeks and ends users both are exposed to softwares at a time. Even in the forums, beta and dev versions are openly discussed. This is something that end user has to understand. Always be one version behind to be safe.

Regarding LTS, Vincent and Robin gave me valuable advises, that changed my perspective about LTS version. You may visit older replies.
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby richyrich on Thu Nov 10, 2011 10:36 am

I'll chime in late. Every one of my machine's main OS is either Mint 9 Xfce or 9 Fluxbox. All are as up-to-date as I want them to be (your very first reply by rekik). My main sit-at-and-accomplish-stuff machine (9Xfce) is rock solid stable running kernel 3.0.0.12 and nvidia 285. Did I say screamin' fast yet ? I've only used one pin for a single recalcitrant Thunar package.
Did I mention stable and fast ?
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby tdockery97 on Thu Nov 10, 2011 11:14 am

richyrich wrote:I'll chime in late. Every one of my machine's main OS is either Mint 9 Xfce or 9 Fluxbox. All are as up-to-date as I want them to be (your very first reply by rekik). My main sit-at-and-accomplish-stuff machine (9Xfce) is rock solid stable running kernel 3.0.0.12 and nvidia 285. Did I say screamin' fast yet ? I've only used one pin for a single recalcitrant Thunar package.
Did I mention stable and fast ?
sittin' back smilin' man, with my latest remastersys disk safely tucked away . . enjoyin' a fresh Image

Image , richy

And life doesn't get any better than that. :wink:
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby sunewbie on Thu Nov 10, 2011 11:59 am

richyrich wrote:I'll chime in late. Every one of my machine's main OS is either Mint 9 Xfce or 9 Fluxbox. All are as up-to-date as I want them to be (your very first reply by rekik). My main sit-at-and-accomplish-stuff machine (9Xfce) is rock solid stable running kernel 3.0.0.12 and nvidia 285. Did I say screamin' fast yet ? I've only used one pin for a single recalcitrant Thunar package.
Did I mention stable and fast ?
sittin' back smilin' man, with my latest remastersys disk safely tucked away . . enjoyin' a fresh Image

Image , richy


Is mint 9 xfce / Fluxbox main edition?. Will an end user or new windows convert try other than main version? I have Ubuntu 10.04 LTS, and it has almost all latest softwares (using PPA - after i searched how to add PPA - everything needs to be searched), except Libreoffice which is v3.3.2 Recently v3.4.4 has just released.

Recently I have installed LMDE XFCE (in virtualbox) pointed to latest and mint update configured to receive updates of category 1 and 2. Everything is running fine there too ;)

You are there to help and do things correctly and in less time (with more confidence). I don't have have anybody, who can come to my house and troubleshoot any issues. To add to it i am not a programmer. So I take more time than you or any power user to find a solution. Honestly, in the beginning, I even struggled to represent my problem correctly. My hardware vendor does not know anything about Linux. So I have to rely only on internet and forums and to helpful people like you :)

Please try to understand the difference between a newbie and an end user. Newbie is the one who has just stepped into Linux and willing to learn, likes to experiment and become a programmer someday. An End user just wants to use Linux, because it is better than windows. End user is not concerned with versions, upgrades, latest softwares. I used XP same paint, same Office XP (2002), same outlook express 6, almost same windows media player (though I use jet audio) and IE 5.5 and 6 for a decade. Suddenly you enter a very different, dynamic world. I do not say it is difficult, it is different. You need to give time to understand Linux, to the extend that you can help yourself :) One has to overcome a mental barrier.

In the beginning, one needs to spend some time, try a few distros (live CD) and then settle for one. I did not knew about Virtualbox, before I stepped into Linux world - there was no need to know.

End user generally do not wish to spend time to learn anything extra then his/her work. I learned power point a day before I had to present my Research in an International conference :D (necessity is the mother of invention). I learned to use filters and macros in Excel after joining my business, as I felt the need to do so. End user thinks that everything should be self explanatory and only refer manual in case of emergency, sometimes it is better to read first before trying.

Linux has 1 % market share (suffering form Bug no #1 : ( ). I am talking of rest 80 - 90 % people - average users. They are not much active on net. All the voices, reviews, criticism that you here on net (like Gnome 3 and Unity) are form power users. An end user have completely different perspective. One does not tweak their system (XP has so limited themes and icon sets). Only I change wallpapers :D.

I dared to give Linux a try after XP crashed 2 times in 10 days. I could not understand philosophy of LTS version and so I posted this question and got some valuable suggestions. Had there been no criticism about gnome 3 and unity, i would not even have tried any distro or probably signed on mint forum.

I am not complaining. I hope you are getting my point.
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby richyrich on Thu Nov 10, 2011 12:42 pm

I humbly suggest to you that you shouldn't be running Mint's "still classed as experimental" Debian edition. Good for you if you do stick it out, you will learn a lot, but know that you will have to spend time and work at maintaining your OS, it will not be transparent, and as dependably usable as my LTS community versions are. (Gnome is the Main edition)
And I have a few more years of support and updates yet, before I take time to think of upgrading. Lots of changes will happen before then. So . . , why worry ? be happy ! (and stable)

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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby sunewbie on Thu Nov 10, 2011 2:37 pm

richyrich wrote:I humbly suggest to you that you shouldn't be running Mint's "still classed as experimental" Debian edition. Good for you if you do stick it out, you will learn a lot, but know that you will have to spend time and work at maintaining your OS, it will not be transparent, and as dependably usable as my LTS community versions are. (Gnome is the Main edition)
And I have a few more years of support and updates yet, before I take time to think of upgrading. Lots of changes will happen before then. So . . , why worry ? be happy ! (and stable)

richy


Thank you Richy for your suggestion.

I re-read my post with fresh mind post, and I have to admit that at the time of typing that post, I did not have a cool mind, so I gave an appointment to my mind and did some introspection. It is possible that I may not have taken things in right context. In case if I have hurt you, please forgive me.

I completely agree with you regarding the choice of LTS version, be it main edition or XFCE (now XFCE had moved to debian). I just wanted to have a feel of LMDE, rolling release, but did not want to risk my PC. So I installed under Virtualbox, and in near future, do not have plan to install on main PC.

I prefer to upgrade (fresh install) from LTS to LTS and that too after first update pack is released, mostly after 5-6 months. Till than most of the bugs would have been solved.

and yes, there is a need to slow down, as you say, Lots of changes will happen before then.

Specially, after Unity was introduced in 11.04, first release mostly has bugs, next version (11.10) concentrates on debugging and third, which is an LTS version will focus on stability.

So . . , why worry ? be happy ! (and stable) :)

I am slowing understanding Linux Culture, courtesy due to very helpful community, who whole heartedly volunteer to help newbies like me. I learn more and get clarity by asking questions and openly expressing my views than searching on google.

Thanks
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Re: Regarding Mint 9 LTS Isadora

Postby Kilz on Thu Nov 10, 2011 8:31 pm

sunewbie wrote:
The problem with Windows converts (incl me ;) ) is that we cannot understand what has software to do with updating of core system?. This library stuff and porting to new libraries and moving from GTK2 to GTK3 is something that an end user is not concerned.

Regarding new software, there are alpha, beta and final releases. So the final release should be stable. We can understand if software or OS crashes if I use chromium dev build or FF beta or vanila build. But a stable built or final version is supposed to be stable, that is why it is called final version.

Due to opensource nature, geeks and ends users both are exposed to softwares at a time. Even in the forums, beta and dev versions are openly discussed. This is something that end user has to understand. Always be one version behind to be safe.

Regarding LTS, Vincent and Robin gave me valuable advises, that changed my perspective about LTS version. You may visit older replies.



For those coming from Windows, expect the alpha, beta, and final release to be different than you are used to. In the Windows world Beta software is pretty polished and everyone is safe running it. Not so on Linux, beta software could still have some mighty bad bugs still needing to be fixed. The steps are about one place off,an example, Windows beta = Linux release.
The reason is that in Windows you are paying for the software, so it is expected to have fewer bugs. In linux you are getting it free, so you have to chip in and do something, find bugs!
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