Is this war, with privilege? Not on MY comp!!!

[KilUma]

When running Windows the user has the ability to change anything, even core system elements. A knowledgeable user can change any and every aspect of a windows operating system and file system. This is also true for curious children and unknowing adults, and none of it requires special privilege unless such privileges have been setup in advance.

By contrast, linux based OS's are built on a privilege access protocol. The problem with this protocol is the user is below root. An owner of a machine is routinely denied read/write access because of privilege.

If I had one complaint about linux OS's(just so happens I have only one), it is the system of privilege. As I see it, this is my machine. If I want to mess it up, let me. But I also understand that privilege is used for program and network security.

The fact that privilege is such a blanket protocol has left the advanced user(albeit not expert) rather frustrated.

If I could log on as root, and have consistent root access, while keeping things simple.....

Errrrrrrrrrrrr....

I want to open a .png file in gimp(can do). I want to modify this image(can do). I want to save my changes to the same file name and location(can not do). This file has root only write access.

[sagirfahmid3]

And that is why Linux is so secure and hard to mess up. If lets say some program in Windows poses as a legitimate program, but is actually a virus, you cannot do anything if it decided to delete your system32 folder and screw up your pc. I don't understand why this extra security of Linux bothers you so much--if you want to mess up your pc, you can logout to the Gnome Display Manager and for the username type in "root" and for the password, whatever password you set.

A MUCH safer way is to open the terminal and type in "gksu nautilus" or "gksu pcmanfm" or "gksu thunar" which will open the file manager as root and you can do whatever you want to, but as soon as you close that file manager, you "un"-root yourself and return to a regular user.

[KilUma]

It's not that I have a problem with the security, nor do I actually WANT to mess up my computer. I just don't ever want MY system to tell me I don't have authority. Especially when I am trying to get something done. Thank you for the tips.

[karlchen]

Hello, KilUma.

When running Windows the user has the ability to change anything, even core system elements.

This was true for Windows versions up to and including Windows ME. Starting with Windows NT Windows did have a fine grained hierarchy of access privileges. The problem was that too many users tended to work under an almighty administrator account all the time, instead of using normal user accounts for their everyday work. Starting with Windows Vista, even members of the administrator group do not simply have their administrative powers all the time. Yet, when needed, they have to confirm they wish to use their administrative privileges. This is done by confirming the UAC dialog. Guess what a lot of self-assigned experts do and recommend doing to others? Switch off UAC.
So the problem with Windows security is not that Windows were insecure by design. It is the users who do not understand that they undermine their own security by working with full administrator rights all the time. Same as being logged on and doing everything as user root on Linux.

As I see it, this is my machine.

Yep, it is.

If I want to mess it up, let me.

There is nothing there preventing you from doing so prvovided you are a member of the admin group. The first user created during the Mint installation will be a member of the admin group.

If I could log on as root, and have consistent root access

Only a pretty trivial change is needed to allow root to logon interactively. Yet, even having logged in as yourself, there is nothing which prevents you from running a root terminal all the time, provided - you remember - you are a member of the admin group.

About the .png file owned by root:
Grant write access to other users on the .png file in question. Inside a terminal run a command like

Code: Select all

sudo chmod o+w /path/to/name_of_image.png

Again this will work only if you are allowed to use sudo for this purpose. If you are not, well, somebody else must have denied this privilege, maybe for a good reason. Who knows.

Cheers,
Karl

[karlchen]

I just don't ever want MY system to tell me I don't have authority.

If you have installed your current system yourself, then your account will be a member of the admin group. In this case you can prefix "sudo" or "gksu" - as appropriate to any command in order to run this command with root privileges. I.e. in cases where your Mint tells you that you have not got the right to perform a certain operation, you can increase your privileges temporarily with the help of "sudo"/"gksu". The idea behind it is the same as the idea behind the Windows UAC dialogue: run with low privileges wherever you can. Elevate your privileges only where necessary. And be aware that you are doing so.

Cheers,
Karl

[MALsPa]

I hate that I have to use use my key to get into my home. It's MY home!

[sagirfahmid3]

I hate that I have to use use my key to get into my home. It's MY home!

LOL!
+1 for that awesome comparison!

[tdockery97]

I hate that I have to use use my key to get into my home. It's MY home!

Best comparison I've ever read. Good job, MALsPa.

[toad]

to the op:

Which file are you trying to manipulate? If it is in your home and you do not have write access then you probably messed up rights by doing stuff as root in ~ - something you should not really be doing unless you understand the UNIX rights system.

If the file you are trying to manipulate is elsewhere simply copy it over to ~ as user!

Finally, if it is in ~ then use

Code: Select all

sudo chown username _path/to/file/filename_

That should do the trick.

[mank_in]

just right click on folder , open as administrator.

[Lumikki]

When running Windows the user has the ability to change anything, even core system elements.

This is not true, at least in todays Windows versions. You can not change core elements in Windows. Windows OS is preventing you to do many changes what are related the OS it self.
This is actually the second biggest reason why I desided to come in Linux from Windows. Unability do what I wanted, unless the change I wanted was what Windows allowed or was design.

It's true that Linux requires you to login root way too many times to do changes, but it doesn't prevent you do what ever you want.
So, what you talk is unneccassary amount of root logins is required in Linux. I agree.

[Habitual]

I hate that I have to use use my key to get into my home. It's MY home!

Locks are for honest people.

[toad]

Anybody interested in solving this at all or is it going to be a ranting session.

Not that I mind the latter but I wouldn't want no further part in it.

[pluraldave]

I'm not sure what there is to be solved. If you need to edit a protected file/folder you do so using sudo or gksu as appropriate. If you don't even know what sudo/gksu is then there is good reason not to be editing those files.

Also, +1 to the locks/house analogy.

[dcihon]

I couldn't help myself from putting in my 2 cents.

If you start letting LInux be like Windows then you will introduce the same problems Windows has.

You don't see MAC OS trying to make itself like Windows , what you see is Windows trying to make itself like a MAC.

[DrHu]

Windows OS now and later (from Vista onwards) can be just as annoying..

http://www.windowsecurity.com/articles/ ... part1.html

It was frustrating users who could not seem to get around it. Windows developers also had a lot of trouble coding because of UAC restrictions and needed workarounds. Now, with Windows 7, the UAC can be turned off completely removing that level of security to provide more flexibility and choice.
Caution!
To keep your system secure, it is recommended that you do not turn off the UAC completely or if you do for any reason, remember to turn it back on. .

Howver better security is for the most part more desirable than less security, unless it really really is antithetical to the normal user..
--but that should be up to the user

Just like windows, you can kill almost all the security in Linux by such actions as..

• Always run as root
• Have full access to all files + programs
• Run applications as root, giving them full access to the kernel and system

It's a choice; I personally don't find the few minor privilege operations necessary for security that odious, I like..

• I like that some system files are not user accessable to change, such as /etc
• Having to enter a password to do system tasks
  --installing software, updating the OS, updating applications (if needed)
• Having to enter a password to login to the desktop
• Being able to separate users more completely by removing extended permiussions for others, world..
  --and so on