Advice required re Linux (newbie) on new computer

[cheshiremusicman]

Hello to all out there. I am a 69 year old computer 'newbie' who is just about to buy a new 'Destktop' to replace a very,very old 'IBM R40 Thinkpad' which I have been running now for over 5 years - please don't laugh; it was a refurbished unit when I bought, it so I think that it's 'Hats off to IBM'. I now live in Thailand, having emigrated from the UK over 5 years ago and I intend to buy a HP pavillion desktop with i5 processor, 1TB storeage and 8GB of Ram. I am not a 'gamer' and will probably use it for processing a lot of old video's that I wish to edit, along with photographic processing and the usual web browsing and emailing. I will also be buying a very small portable unit with a low power processor for taking away on trips, which will be used for emailing and web browsing.
My old system uses XP Pro, which has been very very stable and even with the very limited 40GB of hard disk (again don't laugh) I have been able to do all that I wanted too over the 5+ years I've been using it, obviously downloading a lot of photos onto other storeage media.
I would very much like to use a 'Linux' OS along with Windows 7. Out here in Thailand almost 99% of new computers come only with DOS; probably something to to do with piracy of OS's? You have to purchase your OS separately, obviously at cost unless you are prepared to use a 'cracked/pirated OS - which I am not prepared to do!
I am very happy to hear arguments for NOT using a Microsoft Windows OS and don't have the knowledge to judge what I can and cannot do with a LInux system, so I suppose that I am hedging my bets from a lack of knowledge. Am I going to be restricted in any way by using Linux only and will having a dual bootable system cause any problems - sorry for the 'stupid' question but I do not know the answer to this.
I have heard that it is a good idea to 'partition' the new hard disc and allocate one partition to each operating system, but again I am completely in the dark about these technical matters. If I buy the system with just DOS, how do I go about loading the Linux system onto the new computer, as I presume that I will not be able to access the internet from a DOS only based computer. Do I have to use my old 'steam driven R40' to download the program onto a 'stick' and then load it from that, or is there another way around this?. How much should I allocate of the disk to the LinuX OS partition and how much for Windows 7 if I choose to use that as a second OS? How many partitions can I break the 1TB disc into; bearing in mind that I will want to do some video processing, so presumably it would be wise to have its own partitioned section. Do you allocate a partition for all the other 'programs' that you would use and again what size would you recommend for this.Do I partition the disc before loading any OS or after?
As you can gather from my questions, I have a very limited knowledge of computer systems and would appreciate any help from all you experts out there.
I have read 'Vrkalak's' post of the 18th May 2010 on this forum on "How -to 'help' someone use a computer" and found this very informative and am looking forward to gaining knowledge as I stumble through my first tentative steps using Linux.
Thanking you all once again for any help that you may offer with the above questions and I apologise for the long winded post.

[selittl]

Cheshire, you can do just about anyting on a linux computer as you can on windows. Not having dealt with DOS since before the intertoobs, I will say that you can purchase linux disturubtions online from Ubuntu and even the venerable Linux Mint! http://on-disk.com/index.php?manufacturers_id=70 and others at a very low cost and can then install via the dvd they send you. Also, if you have a friend with a DVD burner you can download via their computer and burn a disk that way. You can also download on your old XP box and create a bootable usb drive. I know this isn't very informative, but I just wanted you to know that there are easy ways of doing this. Mint install media will allow you to partition your drive as you go. You can even download a nifty application called virtual box and install windows 7 within Linux Mint.

Good Luck!

[esteban1uy]

Hi cheshiremusicman!

Here a Linux Mint user speaking from the opposite side of the age spectrum.
This is how I convinced my grandpa (I'm 13 y/o, my grandpa is about your age) to switch from XP to Linux Mint at his shinning new desktop pc:
I burned a couple of DVDs with the images of Linux Mint 12 (one with Gnome desktop and another with KDE) in my laptop and went to my grandpa's, made him put one of those DVDs in his DVD drive and reboot his pc.
Once the Bios splash screen showed I made him select the "boot from cd/dvd drive" bios option, and one minute later he was presented with the Linux Mint desktop in all its splendor. No need of installation instructions, no irreversible changes to his drive, nothing to fear and everything ready to try... that's the beauty of the LiveDVD option.
To make a long story short, he experimented a little with both DVDs, asked me how to do certain things, how to get some software, and at the end he completely fell inlove with Mint 12 KDE, so much that Mint is the only OS he uses currently.

So, if you have the means, burn a DVD with any of the Linux Mint images, or order your disk at OSDisc.com and simply boot it in your machine, that's all you need to get acquainted with Linux Mint.

[DrHu]

I am very happy to hear arguments for NOT using a Microsoft Windows OS and don't have the knowledge to judge what I can and cannot do with a LInux system, so I suppose that I am hedging my bets from a lack of knowledge.

You mention lots of photo and video processing, and while there are a few such applications available on Linux

If you have been using a windows based photo editor or video editor (adobe for example: Although Apple always claims the high ground, whether justified or not, for such applications)), then you may or may not like the difference that Linux has to offer for those types of applications, However you should check the lists available before deciding against..

http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/Lin ... s_software

Specific linux software: photos and videos
There is always online/local (offline) photo sites as well, such as F-Spot
http://linuxappfinder.com/tag/photo%20editor
https://jcornuz.wordpress.com/category/software/

http://www.isoftwarereviews.com/linux-v ... -programs/

As to running windows or Linux, you are likely to find that the normal OS functions: web browsing, email, messaging, voip (skype for example) all work just as well (usually) on Linux.

The exception would be Microsoft specific sites or access controls..

[fauxpas]

I've been into computers for decades and have been a windows man for all that time.

Occasionally I throw a linux distro on to see where they have come and wait to see it's limitations before reverting back to windows...

I've been on mint 12 kde for a while now and find only a handful of things I need to boot into windows for...

Wether any linux distro will be able to totally replace windows is dependant on what you run on the computer... Is the software I use able to be loaded onto linux? If not is there a linux alternative? If not can I run the windows software through wine?

In the past I'd always find way too many limitations... Now, I use mint 99% of the time and only load windows for dvdfab copy software and powerpoint...

Regarding the hard drive I suggest you do what I did for a nice useable dual boot setup...

Partition 100gig for windows... Then 800gig as a storage drive for music video etc... Then create a 100gig partition for linux and a 4gig swap partition...

Make the 800gig storage partition as big as you can to fill the drive... Anything in that partition will be able to be accessed easily by both operation systems...

[cheshiremusicman]

I've been into computers for decades and have been a windows man for all that time.

Occasionally I throw a linux distro on to see where they have come and wait to see it's limitations before reverting back to windows...

I've been on mint 12 kde for a while now and find only a handful of things I need to boot into windows for...

Wether any linux distro will be able to totally replace windows is dependant on what you run on the computer... Is the software I use able to be loaded onto linux? If not is there a linux alternative? If not can I run the windows software through wine?

In the past I'd always find way too many limitations... Now, I use mint 99% of the time and only load windows for dvdfab copy software and powerpoint...

Regarding the hard drive I suggest you do what I did for a nice useable dual boot setup...

Partition 100gig for windows... Then 800gig as a storage drive for music video etc... Then create a 100gig partition for linux and a 4gig swap partition...

Make the 800gig storage partition as big as you can to fill the drive... Anything in that partition will be able to be accessed easily by both operation systems...

Hi 'fauxpas' and 'all prior posters' who has kindly replied with advice, particularly from my 13y/o poster who helped his Grandad get to grips with Linux - makes me feel my age when I type this. I understand that there are a number of 'Linux' OS's out there and I have just seen a note that I made to remind me that on the 26th of this month 'Ubuntu 12.04' was due to be launched to the public, which if I am correct is a Linux system. Is this site dedicated to 'Linux Mint' and what are the differences/advantages/disadvantages between all of these 'Linux' systems and 'Mint'; are some more directed at professional useage?
Fauxpas, is 100GB each not an awful lot of disc to be allocating to the two OS's, why so much? I was thinking that something like 25GB each would be more than enough including updates etc - anybody care to enlighten me on this? What do you use the 'swap partition' for; obviously to 'swap' something around but what; the OS that you want to use? Am I not better having a separate partition for the video processing - I seem to remember reading a while ago that this was recommended for reliability in the 'conversions'. Would the 'video' encoding program be better on its own partition? I've heard the term 'dual bootable', which I can understand refers to the two OS's that you have got on the hard disc, but how do you swop between the two; is this done when you turn on the computer and you are presented with an option as to which OS you wish to proceed with, or can you switch between them as and when you wish?
From what little I have read about any of the 'Linux' systems; I am given to understand that they place only a small footprint on the hard discs and are not prone to attacks by hackers, who wish to wreck peoples operating systems - I noted that even the Mac's have been attacked recently, so will this spread to Linux? Be interesting to hear your views on this.

[ProtoJazz]

I've been into computers for decades and have been a windows man for all that time.

Occasionally I throw a linux distro on to see where they have come and wait to see it's limitations before reverting back to windows...

I've been on mint 12 kde for a while now and find only a handful of things I need to boot into windows for...

Wether any linux distro will be able to totally replace windows is dependant on what you run on the computer... Is the software I use able to be loaded onto linux? If not is there a linux alternative? If not can I run the windows software through wine?

In the past I'd always find way too many limitations... Now, I use mint 99% of the time and only load windows for dvdfab copy software and powerpoint...

Regarding the hard drive I suggest you do what I did for a nice useable dual boot setup...

Partition 100gig for windows... Then 800gig as a storage drive for music video etc... Then create a 100gig partition for linux and a 4gig swap partition...

Make the 800gig storage partition as big as you can to fill the drive... Anything in that partition will be able to be accessed easily by both operation systems...

Hi 'fauxpas' and 'all prior posters' who has kindly replied with advice, particularly from my 13y/o poster who helped his Grandad get to grips with Linux - makes me feel my age when I type this. I understand that there are a number of 'Linux' OS's out there and I have just seen a note that I made to remind me that on the 26th of this month 'Ubuntu 12.04' was due to be launched to the public, which if I am correct is a Linux system. Is this site dedicated to 'Linux Mint' and what are the differences/advantages/disadvantages between all of these 'Linux' systems and 'Mint'; are some more directed at professional useage?
Fauxpas, is 100GB each not an awful lot of disc to be allocating to the two OS's, why so much? I was thinking that something like 25GB each would be more than enough including updates etc - anybody care to enlighten me on this? What do you use the 'swap partition' for; obviously to 'swap' something around but what; the OS that you want to use? Am I not better having a separate partition for the video processing - I seem to remember reading a while ago that this was recommended for reliability in the 'conversions'. Would the 'video' encoding program be better on its own partition? I've heard the term 'dual bootable', which I can understand refers to the two OS's that you have got on the hard disc, but how do you swop between the two; is this done when you turn on the computer and you are presented with an option as to which OS you wish to proceed with, or can you switch between them as and when you wish?
From what little I have read about any of the 'Linux' systems; I am given to understand that they place only a small footprint on the hard discs and are not prone to attacks by hackers, who wish to wreck peoples operating systems - I noted that even the Mac's have been attacked recently, so will this spread to Linux? Be interesting to hear your views on this.

100gb for an OS is an ok size, but it also depends on what you plan to do with it. I curently have mint installed on a 40gb partition and its pushing the size limits after installing extra software, and some general acumualation of downloaded files and software to play with. I also have another computer with mint/windows7 dual booted with about 80gb each, and my main gaming windows install has its own 500gb drive. 100gb may seem to be a lot, but it is a 1TB drive, and assuming its on the desktop can allways have extra drives put in (They are a bit expensive right now, but by the time you fill up the 1TB they should have gone down a bit, just bought a new 1TB drive for $80). Linux doesnt really need a lot of space depending on the version, and what you plan to do. But if youre new to it you will probably want some room to play around, install a few diffrent desktop enviroments (Gnome,KDE, Maybe even XBMC(Xbox media center, Great for playing movies and streaming media)

The swap partition is a partition that linux uses in a way simaler to ram. One of the stikied topics in this section of the forum explains how to dertime how much you need, and how to properly set it up. I highly recomend reading the topic about installing mint as well, If I had read it before I would have made some better choices, such as having the OS in one partition, and all of my data in another, With linux you wouldnt even see that you are using a diffrent partition for your home folder, but it makes upgrading much easier.

I dont know much about video editing personaly, so I cant help much with that, though Im sure there are linux programs for it, but cannot say how good they would be compared to something like final sudio (or is it final cut?) or Sonys Vegas software.

Dual booting Very simple, Im not sure if its better to install windows first, then linux, or if it makes no diffrance, Ive only even installed linux after windows.
Once you install linux , it will automaticly install a program called Grub. When ever you boot up the computer it will present you with a choice of OS to boot into, as well as a few testing and recovery tools (At least with mint) I belive theres options to have it boot into a default OS without bringing up the menu unless you press a key during start up, but I may be wrong.

The main reason Linux is more secure is that it is open source. When theres a security hole found, you dont have to wait for a large company to go through the process of finding it, fixing it, and releasing an update. You have the whole world able to do this, and while the whole world doesnt many people do and as such youre able to recive a much faster update then with windows and mac. Another thing is being free software, most groups have little issue saying "oops, theres a security issue with our distro/software, install this patch, our bad" then a company who has to wory about share holders and a corporate immage. I have no idea if thats actualy how it is, but Im sure it makes a diffrence at some level that its not a big company product but a community project.

As far a learning how to use linux, it again depends on what you plan to do. There is a lot that can be learnt, and probably a lot that will need to be learn to use linux, but at the same time in the Month or so Ive been using it Ive found many things just work. I was told installing a network printer on linux would be a nightmare, and that it would make me switch back to Windows. Couldnt have been easier. With windows I had to download software and drivers to get it to work. Linux I just said I want to install a printer, Linux gave me a list of printers it found, mine was there, I told it to install, printer said it had the wrong driver, so I picked a new driver from the list, and boom, Im printing.

I agree with esteban1uy, I plan on bringing my grandmother a few live cds to try out and see what she thinks. The tighter security, built in remote desktop support, and just the fact that it comes with office, a pdf reader, flash and all the codecs and other software you need really would make both her life, and mine easier. Shes not bad with computers, she was one of the first people around here to get the apple when it came out, and used to teach others how to use them for a living, but she tends to get annoyed when thinks stop working how she would like, and doesnt want to have to keep up with updating her software and other tasks.


(For some reason, when I read over my post I read it in the voice of John Redcorn)

[fauxpas]

100gig may be overkill, but it future-proofs the system drives... You never know what software you're gunna run and a lot of software saves jobs to the system drive as default... I let Sony Vegas save work to the system drive and its 20+ gig per video...

If I had a terrabyte it'd look the same as below except the storage drive would be much bigger...

[cheshiremusicman]

100gig may be overkill, but it future-proofs the system drives... You never know what software you're gunna run and a lot of software saves jobs to the system drive as default... I let Sony Vegas save work to the system drive and its 20+ gig per video...

If I had a terrabyte it'd look the same as below except the storage drive would be much bigger...

Hi 'Fauxpas',
Yes, I see what you mean; and as you said previously, you can always add another hard disc to a 'desktop' for little cost. I will take your good, sound, logical advice and use 100GB for each of the OS's. I'm still confused between all of the 'available Linux OS systems', what with the latest release of 'Ubuntu' etc ! I suppose the old adage about 'Suck it and See' - a VERY English expression I might add, before anybody gets offended, is appropriate here. I have just bought a 16GB usb stick and will download some of the 'Linux Os's' and give them a try on my old trusty 'Steam driven IBM R40 ThinkPad' , if they work on this , they will work on anything ; maybe I could get a job as a 'OS systems tester' on this basis .
Many thanks once again for all of the help. I look forward to reporting back as to my progress. Maybe I can start an 'Over the Hill Linux Coaching Post' - based on my own experiences with the systems? I used to have to write (Many, Many Moons ago) Technical Instruction Manuals/Scripts of 'How to Do' for training purposes, as well as training staff up on new equipments of various types. I used to find this very rewarding and great fun, and found that it certainly tested your OWN KNOWLEDGE to the enth degree. I can think of no better job than that of a 'Teacher/helper' who has a bunch of 'willing students' and nothing worse than one who has 'unwilling one's' - of which I had enough I am sorry to say; but that was in the days of the strong 'Trade Unions' back in the UK who thought they had a job for life - before reality actually hit them .

[fauxpas]

With the linux distros, mint 12 kde is the first distro I have stuck long term with...

I've tried them all and abandoned them within hours or days, but I tried mint 12 gnome and kde and I have mint 12 kde dual booting with win7 on both my main laptop and gaming machine...

You could always check youtube reviews of the distros but if you check http://distrowatch.com/ twice as many people hitting up mint over ubuntu and the others...

[esteban1uy]

Maybe I can start an 'Over the Hill Linux Coaching Post' - based on my own experiences with the systems? I used to have to write (Many, Many Moons ago) Technical Instruction Manuals/Scripts of 'How to Do' for training purposes, as well as training staff up on new equipments of various types. I used to find this very rewarding and great fun, and found that it certainly tested your OWN KNOWLEDGE to the enth degree. I can think of no better job than that of a 'Teacher/helper' who has a bunch of 'willing students' and nothing worse than one who has 'unwilling one's' - of which I had enough I am sorry to say; but that was in the days of the strong 'Trade Unions' back in the UK who thought they had a job for life - before reality actually hit them .

That will be great!

Most of the reviews around are from very "techy" guys, so the newcomers can only partially understand what they are talking about.
I'm pretty sure you'll have a lot of readers if you start a blog or a forum thread about your impressions, difficulties and discoveries while testing different linux distributions.
Teaching is not about sharing what you know, but sharing how to deal with things you don't know (grandpa's quote, originally in Spanish).

[cheshiremusicman]

Maybe I can start an 'Over the Hill Linux Coaching Post' - based on my own experiences with the systems? I used to have to write (Many, Many Moons ago) Technical Instruction Manuals/Scripts of 'How to Do' for training purposes, as well as training staff up on new equipments of various types. I used to find this very rewarding and great fun, and found that it certainly tested your OWN KNOWLEDGE to the enth degree. I can think of no better job than that of a 'Teacher/helper' who has a bunch of 'willing students' and nothing worse than one who has 'unwilling one's' - of which I had enough I am sorry to say; but that was in the days of the strong 'Trade Unions' back in the UK who thought they had a job for life - before reality actually hit them .

That will be great!

Most of the reviews around are from very "techy" guys, so the newcomers can only partially understand what they are talking about.
I'm pretty sure you'll have a lot of readers if you start a blog or a forum thread about your impressions, difficulties and discoveries while testing different linux distributions.
Teaching is not about sharing what you know, but sharing how to deal with things you don't know (grandpa's quote, originally in Spanish).

Hello my young friend,
I think that you yourself could also contribute to this suggested 'Thread', as you have told me that you personally helped your Grandfather get started with LinuxMint. What if any problems, did your GF come across in understanding the OS? I think that these are the kind of things that I personally would like know. As you will have seen, I have been asking for advice as to 'which' Linux system people consider to be the 'Best', if there is such an animal ! I realise that we all have our own different priorities in what we want a system to 'DO' for us, but it would be nice to get some feedback from people on here as to their experiences - like 'fauxpas' in the previous post who has tried 'Ubuntu' and didn't find it to his liking and reverted back to 'Mint'.
The ' Technicalities' are fine for those who understand and appreciate them, but for most 'users' it is the end result that counts, NOT how it is achieved. Ease of use and understanding is paramount as far as I am concerned and that was what I always tried to instill in the people that I used to train and write manuals for. The old motto 'KISS', 'Keep It Simple Stupid' was the one that I always tried to orientate my thinking/writing/teaching on. It is great to understand the technicalities involved, but it is definitely NOT necessary unless you are the one who has to fix a machine or a system and sometimes can cloud the basics of what is required of a person - so not a good idea in my humble opinion.
Maybe you and I could get together to write such a 'Thread' and share our experiences over the net, what do you say to this idea?
I don't know if any moderator is reading this, but I would be interested to know what you think of this idea, or has this been covered well enough already by previous threads? If so where do I have to look to find these threads please?
I intend to buy a new, very small, low power, portable today (for holiday use) and I intend to load 'LinuxMint' onto this from a usb 16GB stick after I have downloaded it on the old 'Steam Machine', so I will start to make notes of how the download/installation goes etc and maybe this can form the start of a 'HOW TO Thread for complete newbies'
Thanks again to all of you for your help and advice, please keep it coming, it is most appreciated.

[esteban1uy]

(...) maybe this can form the start of a 'HOW TO Thread for complete newbies'

Well, I think that the very fist step towards this goal is getting in contact with one of the forum moderators (Vincent Vermeulen, for example) and let him know your idea.

[cheshiremusicman]

(...) maybe this can form the start of a 'HOW TO Thread for complete newbies'

Well, I think that the very fist step towards this goal is getting in contact with one of the forum moderators (Vincent Vermeulen, for example) and let him know your idea.

Ok,thanks for the contact name. Unfortunately, I've had to postpone the purchase of the 'holiday computer' for a few days and I have asked a friend of mine if he would be kind enough to download and burn the DVD of 'Mint' for me, as I do not have this facility.
Sorry, for the stupid question , but how does one get in touch with people like the Moderator that you mentioned?

[esteban1uy]

(...) maybe this can form the start of a 'HOW TO Thread for complete newbies'

Well, I think that the very fist step towards this goal is getting in contact with one of the forum moderators (Vincent Vermeulen, for example) and let him know your idea.

Ok,thanks for the contact name. Unfortunately, I've had to postpone the purchase of the 'holiday computer' for a few days and I have asked a friend of mine if he would be kind enough to download and burn the DVD of 'Mint' for me, as I do not have this facility.
Sorry, for the stupid question , but how does one get in touch with people like the Moderator that you mentioned?

Go here: http://forums.linuxmint.com/memberlist.php?first_char=&mode=&sk=m&sd=d
You'll see some names in blue/violet or red colour, those are forum's moderators and administrators. Click on any of those names and use the "Send Private Message".