jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

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jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby wheeledgoat on Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:33 pm

I'm not a fanboy, but over the years I've most often found myself purchasing ATI graphics cards, for whatever various reason at the time.

But now, as I enjoy my newfound freedom from Windows, I'm looking to fortify that decision as I move forward. Given my difficulties with getting my Radeon HD 4850 to work with Mint 15 (rolling back my xorg version for the ATI driver to work, and subsequent conflicts with games that require the most recent xorg), should I be looking to Nvidia?

What I mean is: does Nvidia have a better long-term reputation for supporting Linux, or is this just an ebb in an otherwise even flow? (kinda like HP has made a name for themselves by supporting open source more than their competitors).

Mint installed on my still-rockin' budget build from '08:
3ghz Athlon 64 dualcore on DFI LP DK w/ 8g DDR2, GeForce GTX 760 & Turtle Beach Riviera

Win7 on my lite build of 2012:
3.1ghz i3 dualcore on Biostar H61 w/ 8g DDR3, Crucial M4 128g SSD
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby HarzVieh on Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:55 am

Well.. we all remember the famous middle finger from our core developer, and the promise he will come and "format C:" their hard drives.. :lol:
If I remember correct a cople of years ago, it was the other way around, and ATI Linux drivers did perform better compared with Nvidia.
The really new thing is Steam, and for that we need really good and stable 3D drivers. Can't imagine that such a big firm like AMD do not have
the money or will to support Linux. What I think the issue here is: there are simple not enough people in the IT sector who can do the job.
I remember some news here in Germany.. like the Government made the Green Card for IT specialists, and how they have been surprised that not
so many did come. Anyway.. I did buy over the years so many CPU's and Graphics from AMD and ATI.. 8) so my demand for Linux drivers is legitimate.
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby Jamesc359 on Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:36 am

Any comments I can offer is purely anecdotal, so keep that in mind this is purely my own experience. NVidia's drivers have never given me any kind of issue. They're fast, easy to install and control and all around I've had very good experiences with them on both Windows and Linux. AMD on Linux is not a place I care to go at the moment, I've got no major complaints about their drivers on Windows though. Hopefully that'll change in the future, but for now I'm sticking with NVidia on Linux. On Windows, I'd buy which ever provides the best performance to cost ratio.
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby wheeledgoat on Wed Jun 26, 2013 1:21 pm

thanks for weighing in with your thoughts and experiences. maybe I will bite the bullet and buy an additional graphics card, moving the ATI card over to my Win7 machine and putting a new Nvidia in the Linux box. hmmm. it does make me a little sad, I've always liked ATI. hopefully it's a temporary situation as old hardware is phased out, and they're planning better for smoother transitions in the future.

Mint installed on my still-rockin' budget build from '08:
3ghz Athlon 64 dualcore on DFI LP DK w/ 8g DDR2, GeForce GTX 760 & Turtle Beach Riviera

Win7 on my lite build of 2012:
3.1ghz i3 dualcore on Biostar H61 w/ 8g DDR3, Crucial M4 128g SSD
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby HarzVieh on Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:13 am

I know it is not official but, assuming it is the future hardware for the Steam Box, then:
The processor board itself features a quad-core AMD R-464L APU clocked at 3.2 GHz (2 MB x 2 L2 cache) which also contains a 384-core Radeon HD 7660G GPU.

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/Steam-Box-Modular-Computer-xi3-Trinity-Series-Radeon,news-42046.html
Can't imagine having this hardware for sale, and give Liunx 3D drivers not that much attention..
Edit:
It would give Valve total source-level control over the entire platform... I'm sure they'd love that.

http://phoronix.com/forums/showthread.php?81666-AMD-Has-Massive-Radeon-Patch-Set-Power-Management!
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby HarzVieh on Fri Jun 28, 2013 10:24 am

hmmm. it does make me a little sad, I've always liked ATI. hopefully it's a temporary situation as old hardware is phased out, and they're planning better for smoother transitions in the future.

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2152930
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby wheeledgoat on Fri Jun 28, 2013 1:23 pm

holy crap that thread is useful. i had patched together most of that from various sources, some of which I forgot to bookmark... but that link there is pure gold.

Thanks a ton, Harz!!!!!!

Mint installed on my still-rockin' budget build from '08:
3ghz Athlon 64 dualcore on DFI LP DK w/ 8g DDR2, GeForce GTX 760 & Turtle Beach Riviera

Win7 on my lite build of 2012:
3.1ghz i3 dualcore on Biostar H61 w/ 8g DDR3, Crucial M4 128g SSD
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby Booman on Wed Jul 03, 2013 4:08 pm

My GeForce 550 Ti has been a HUGE blessing with games in Linux. Not only does Mint install the drivers with a few clicks, but my games are running fast natively and with Wine.
I don't regret purchasing an Nvidia card at all.
The 550 Ti is still available at newegg.com for about $100
So its a great investment and it can play most modern titles, but also hundreds of older titles. If you have patience with Wine of course.
I personally use PlayOnLinux and have successfully played 60+ games
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby nankura on Thu Jul 04, 2013 4:47 pm

Honestly. alot of people will claim ATi is bad on linux. yes the driver's arent that great, but i've used both an nvidia GTX 460 and a lovely ATi HD 7770. the only problem ive ever had is out of the box graphical support, newer ATi cards dont go to well with "Free drivers" right now. but there working on it. so getting drivers setup can be a pain in the ass in a way

But once you surpass that. performance is really no different. ive seen minimal difference in most games, and some games a massive boost considering that the 7770 is far better than the 460 GTX

Its really personal preference and how much manual labour your willing to put into it. if u can look past the out of box graphical support for newer ati cards with linux. the rest is easy as 123 and quite smooth/enjoyable

Along with i am actually currently using windows 7 with my ATi for gaming. and i have no issue's with the driver's what so ever. i play over 10+ modern games, including company of heroes 2, dota 2, starcraft 2. and tera online

And any game i play run's with high and stable framerate's with maximum setting's.

I have to strongly disagree with anyone who say's ATi driver's are faulty. maybe it depends on what you actually do with them, such as multimedia creation or digging deep into ATi's coding. but beside's that, if your just a general user and gamer. you wont have any problems with ATi

Along with, the ATi drivers have a lovely "Anti screen tearing" feature, i adore that feature, it goes great with compositing
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Postby HoppityBob on Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:47 pm

I've used nvidia since day one and have never had troubles until Mint 15 where I suddenly can't install any proprietary drivers at all without getting a black screen, same on kubuntu. Has me totally beat at the moment.
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby HarzVieh on Wed Jul 17, 2013 1:46 am

Nankura, can you please write a How To?
by nankura on Mon Jul 08, 2013 7:19 am
everytime i install ATi drivers i do it manually, i never use the automated tools

i download the drivers off the website
install kernel headers
install 32bit Compatability Libs
install ubuntu restricted extras
install drivers

And everything works like a charm

like explain each step from above, or give us some link if this exist already? 8)
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby nankura on Tue Jul 23, 2013 12:36 pm

HarzVieh wrote:Nankura, can you please write a How To?
by nankura on Mon Jul 08, 2013 7:19 am
everytime i install ATi drivers i do it manually, i never use the automated tools

i download the drivers off the website
install kernel headers
install 32bit Compatability Libs
install ubuntu restricted extras
install drivers

And everything works like a charm

like explain each step from above, or give us some link if this exist already? 8)


sorry it took so long, ill explain these steps if your still interested - i was on holidays

bring up the terminal and follow these steps

Code: Select all
1. sudo apt-get install linux-headers-generic
2. sudo apt-get update
3. sudo apt-get install ia32-libs


usually i reboot here. it might not be necessary, but i like to refresh the system

Now exit the terminal and open the software center

- search for the restricted extra's and grab the ubuntu version

Now head to to the ATi website http://support.amd.com/us/gpudownload/l ... linux.aspx

Download the beta or official drivers, which ever you personally prefer and extract them to a folder, i usually extract the installation to my downloads folder

then follow these steps in the terminal

Code: Select all
cd /home/username/Downloads
sudo sh amd-driver-installer-catalyst-13-4-x86.x86_64.run or the beta filename as necessary


now follow the installation steps of hitting next alot, reboot, and u should be fine
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby Booman on Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:37 pm

Once you launch the Catalyst it should be a Graphical User Interface correct?

Do you have to disable Neuveau drivers or have to close Xorg?
I've seen these problems with Nvidia drivers in the past.
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby nankura on Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:39 pm

yes when you launch catalyst it should provide you with a graphical user interface, as for the free drivers, usually you dont have to remove them when it comes to ATi/catalyst. i know the issue your talking about with nvidia, i used to run nvidia

but ive never had to do that with ATi
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby phill1978 on Wed Jul 24, 2013 11:09 am

does the opensource driver offer a GUI or is there a custom community one ?

if not, how does a gamer expect to tune any of the many settings the closed source offers?

Also does the opensource driver support crossfire or trifire ?

thanks
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby HarzVieh on Thu Jul 25, 2013 3:55 am

Thank you Nankura.. 8)
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby nankura on Wed Aug 07, 2013 1:24 pm

no problem

And im not sure if open source drivers have a GUI, ive honestly never used them. as far as i know is its all done via editing xorg configs

To be honest thats beyond me, ive only ever had to edit xorg to enable compositing on openbox
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby Booman on Wed Aug 07, 2013 1:36 pm

I've never touched the OpenSource drivers either. Never had to.
Are you wondering if there are some 3D settings to enhance games?
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby js3915 on Wed Aug 07, 2013 1:44 pm

Ive mainly dealt with Nvidia, but the one thing i like is Nvidia has more a unified driver than ATI/AMD. My older nvidia 9800 and think even my 8800 card ((cant think that far back today for some reason)) either way used the same driver for install that my current 560ti uses... I have an older laptop with ATI driver and trying to find legacy drivers for it was a headache least till like the last couple years or so they made detection better but none the less it sold me more to Nvidia. Also felt in terms of gaming which i did more. Nvidia was better supported over ATI. ATI has some good products but i always felt Nvidia was one step ahead. Nvidia's open source driver neuveau has made lots of leaps and bounds too
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Re: jumping ATI ship, swimming over to Nvidia?

Postby nankura on Thu Aug 08, 2013 8:06 pm

js3915 wrote:Ive mainly dealt with Nvidia, but the one thing i like is Nvidia has more a unified driver than ATI/AMD. My older nvidia 9800 and think even my 8800 card ((cant think that far back today for some reason)) either way used the same driver for install that my current 560ti uses... I have an older laptop with ATI driver and trying to find legacy drivers for it was a headache least till like the last couple years or so they made detection better but none the less it sold me more to Nvidia. Also felt in terms of gaming which i did more. Nvidia was better supported over ATI. ATI has some good products but i always felt Nvidia was one step ahead. Nvidia's open source driver neuveau has made lots of leaps and bounds too


i do get your point, it sucks that ATi kinda chuckout support for old gpu card's

My point was that i disagree on people complaining about ATi performance wise if you happen to have a new gen ATi card, like i have an ATi 7770 and an nvidia GTX 460 - there pretty much on par in performance with the 7770 being slightly better when gaming. so i see no real "massive performance difference" in wine gaming or linux native gaming between ATi/nvidia
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