Whats your take on Wind0ws?

Post by **clem** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 8:51 am

For me:

- nintendo wii --> games
- windows --> pocket pc connectivity, crappy sharewares when I'm bored, support for device or software that don't work on linux now and then

- linux --> everything else

Clem

AlsaPhil · Post by **AlsaPhil** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 8:52 am

Nothing

I am personally happy not to need MS Windows anymore but I don't hate it.
I can't forget that I began my computer user career with Bill Gate's products

PS - My son (11) challenge me sometimes to a duel with FIFA 07 (soccer game)

I have learned to loose on MS XP

hippy · Post by **hippy** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 8:57 am

AlsaPhil wrote:Nothing
I am personally happy not to need MS Windows anymore but I don't hate it.
I can't forget that I began my computer user career with Bill Gate's products

I agree with what you say, i too do not dislike windows, it is after all what got me interested in computing in the first place, but as software develops and changes so have i. Now i have wine running which allows me to use the echolink software i do not use windows anymore

jes · Post by **jes** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 10:14 am

LinuxMint 2.2 "Bianca"

i only use Windows on my wife's computer ...

nick · Post by **nick** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 10:27 am

Started on PDP11 in 1973, stopped using computers in 1990, dropped out, worked for National Trust until 1999, Bought home computer again in 1999 Windows installed, crashed every 20 minutes, thought " my old PDP never behaved like this" after 3 weeks installed Suse 6.0, never used windows since.

So not qualifield to say as have only ever used windows for three weeks

BTW hippy I am also Radio Ham, have Gpredict, Xtlf. GMfsk, installed hamlibs, controlling my radio's also sgcontrol as interface, Xlog and Tlf
Linux? even 65 year old's like me can use it

Nick

npap · Post by **npap** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 1:44 pm

I miss those blue screens, the malware, spyware and the virus updates and msoobe(Ms Out of Box experience) cheks!

How about the myriads of security updades. Virus scans? Gee! I miss that hunting game.

If I could get my scanner to work in Linux, I would ditch Windows!

PS. Linux is 'too good to be true!' Let's support it and keep making it better and available to all.

euthypro · Post by **euthypro** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 2:07 pm

I also don't hate Windows. I owe a lot to it, crashes and all. A few years ago I switched to OS X. It does the job for me, but I still need Windows, specially when I travel. Two months ago, in South America, my Windows laptop crashed. Recover, restore, nothing worked. I pulled out my spare copy of XP. It installed fine, but then came the incessant popups: "Register this product or else." And I thought: "Damn, this thing is threatening me." So I downloaded and installed Mint. I'm still banging my shins on the furniture with Linux, so to speak, but I'll learn it and use Windows less and less, unless they change their attitude.

Cheers,

A.

kenetics · Post by **kenetics** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 7:17 pm

I'm from the old DOS days when Norton Commander kept me happy (glad to see that there are NC clones for Linux). Tired of having to reinstall Windows every 6 months and also having to pay for Windows upgrades to correct problems in their legacy OS. If it wasn't for PhoneTray I would ditch Windows altogether (PhoneTray keeps away the telemarketers and other annoying phone calls and is a free Win program). My sons are into gaming and graphic design so no takers for Linux there (yet). My wife loves the Yahoo games so she is also stuck with Winxp. YAHOOOO!

kenetics · Post by **kenetics** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:42 am

phantom_crystal wrote: Aren't Yahoo games Java based?

She likes the one's you have to buy and download. These are Win only, I believe.

richard · Post by **richard** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:20 pm

This monopolist,one world view, domination and control of computers by Microsoft is criminal.

Why am weening myself away from Windows completely?

The high cost,licensing, and registration of software to one machine is garbage. . .

Linux and Unix have become the 'free' choice candidates . . despite all of the software money making profiteers of this world. . .

Computers are just tools.

Software to me is like a book in the library. . . I'm not trying to rewrite the book or become the author of someone else's work. I just want read, and extract the information and use the information. How many books can you find on the same subject in a library? Why should software be copyrighted? A computer without software haves no purpose and is totally useless.

Programmers and book writers should get some return on their work. Fine. . .How much money is enough money? Does Bill Gate's need more money? I think not . . . . and now I don't need Bill Gate's software as long as there is an effective free alternative.

My next question is: When does originality cease to become original? How many different books or software packages does one need to write and continually rewrite to accomplish and promote the same end result? Why should every new version of commercial software be bought and paid for in $$$$ and be registered? Stupid concept? I think it is. . .

This continual Version upgrade of software with the 'lower Suds', whites - 'whiter than white' mentality dupes people into spending more of their income on this spiraling out of control notion that we have to continue to provide programmers a livelihood so they can continue to steal money from us by selling to us this 'new and improved' concept. . . unfortunately it's all good money spent down the toilet. . .for most of us.

. . . Next the nerve to specify how I can use it and place restrictions on my personal use makes makes me believe software is nothing more than a money making scheme promoted by software profiteers . . . . .

Computers in my mind have lost their real purpose, value, and identity for which they have been developed . . .(ie.perform work. .. save time and money). . . . Instead they use more time, cost more money and create more work (just keeping the software up to date despite the added expense).

Computers and software are now the new disposable throw away remnants of this generation. Money changes hands more quickly selling software and nothing is left to show for it after the money is all spent. . . .It all disappears into thin air like the computer code used to write it. . .What's here today is quickly obsolete tommorrow. . .. It's now time for the 'New and Improved Version or update. . .get ready to shell out the cash. . .

One thing I might add that I forgot to say about Microsoft. . . .and all those software profiteers (gangsters) who follow in Microsoft's footsteps, I will no longer be held hostage to their licensing schemes and agreements concerning my paid usage of their proprietary software. . .it's all crap and I realize it is obsolete from the day it is purchased because the newest version is already on the drawing board. . .

I hope 'Vista' begins to turn people's heads in the right direction toward 'free' unrestrictive software alternatives. And people begin to see that their disposable income doesn't have to become disposable when it comes to computer software and computer operational systems. . . .

Richard

Fragadelic · Post by **Fragadelic** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 3:32 am

I'm forced to use it at work. I know it about as well as I know Linux.

It has its place for sure.

I have XP Home on the kids PC for their games and such and I run Win2k and XP pro in a Virtual Box on my mint 2.2 system.

I hate its instability and quirkiness and I think its just ridiculous to have to pay to be a beta tester( the first year after they release it to public) like with Vista right now.

I won't be moving to Vista at home and my work laptop is still good for another 2.5 years so i don't even have to think about it for now.

I believe Linux is much easier to install and takes a lot less time but Windows is easier for your average joe to install software right now.

Synaptic is great and I've been explaining that really well to folks I recommend trying Linux. If they can get in the thinking of a single software installer that lets you search for and install what you want, they will actually see it is easier than windows.

900i · Post by **900i** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 12:05 pm

I hate M$ full stop, pile of SH?TE, way to go Richard my sentiments exactly.. (Got my Angry Head on now). GRRRRRRRrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

rlpw1011 · Post by **rlpw1011** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 9:32 pm

The problem with Windows I have is tinkering. I like to mess with my desktop features and questionable software. As a result I also have a problem with the Windows Verification System when I trash something. For instance my PC was acting buggy so I went and upgraded all the software and flashed my motherboard. When I flashed my motherboard Windows basically told me I was using stolen Software and I had to get a new number. Well that was the last straw for me so I leave my Windows partition alone now and mess with Linux.

the only good thing about Windows is that Amarok 2 will be able to run on it.

telic · Post by **telic** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 10:16 am

I would like to know what you guys think of Win?

MS Windows is a product of the most unethical of business practices. It's an example of bloated and aggressive incompetence that dominates by lack of competition, courtesy of cowardly greed from software and hardware vendors.

How's that?

----

gabhla · Post by **gabhla** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 11:11 am

I'm cool with Windows - as long as it's on someone else's pc.

scorp123 · Post by **scorp123** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 4:07 pm

manishk wrote:Most of the time I get the feeling that people using Linux just outrightly hate Win!

No ... I only hate the stupid people who use Microsoft products and then enforce their stupid broken standards upon the rest of us; e.g. all those stupid web pages which are "optimised" for Internet Explorer, a totally broken browser which has a horrible record of being a security nightmare and totally not compliant to many important web standards.

Linux is for serious work ... that's what I earn money with. Windows is for spreading viruses and playing games

scorp123 · Post by **scorp123** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 4:15 pm

Uncle Bob wrote:But hey, I'm not complaining; I'm just saying it as it is.

You are badly misinformed and a lot of what you say is plain FUD.

The reason some hardware doesn't work under Linux is that Microsoft has a strangehold on many hardware vendors, and so they don't release their specs so that someone could write a Linux kernel module. But if you are aware of this you can always buy hardware from vendors who 100% support Linux; on such hardware Linux works perfectly out of the box, way way way way better than Windows. No hunting for drivers, no downloading of some stupid setup.exe from somewhere somehow ... you just put in your Live CD or your Linux install CD and everything works out of the box.

scorp123 · Post by **scorp123** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:59 pm

Uncle Bob wrote: If I'm so misinformed why don't you inform me correctly then?

Here we go then

Uncle Bob wrote: My comments are based on my own experiences.

And so are mine.

Uncle Bob wrote: The problems I was hinting at I experienced on a Sony vaio s4xp, a compaq evo n600c, a hp compaq nc6000 and now a dell lattitude d620. With the evo I used a cisco aironet pcmcia wifi card. You then go on to say I mostly speak FUD.

I have a Sony Vaio C1 VFK here (works out of the box), I have a hp Omnibook 4150b here (works out of the box), I have a hp Omnibook 6200vt here (works out of the box), I have a Compaq Evo N610c here (works out of the box for the most parts; WLAN needs an additional driver: there is an automatic script; execute it and you're done, compiling and installing the driver happens automagically for you in the background!), I have a hp dv2108ea Laptop here (works out of the box with the exception of the webcam: the "UVC" drivers are not 100% finished yet but it's just a question of time; other than that this machine just works), I have a Compaq Evo 510 e-PC (works out of the box), I have multiple hp ProLiant ML-xxx servers (work perfectly!) with tons of memory and additional gadgets (SCSI, tape drives, SATA disks, storage libs, and and and ...), I helped many people to get various distros of Linux working on their machines (be that laptops, desktops or servers) .... All in all I am pretty sure I know what I am talking about.

Uncle Bob wrote: Do not make such comments if you cannot back it up with relevant facts.

See above.

Uncle Bob wrote: F and U, not at all;

Oh really?

Read your posting up there again please. You complained that Linux is kinda "harder" to learn (= Fear; because it's different than Windows?). And then you make statements such as "even though Linux is lightyears behind in the proper utilisation of all hardware components in any given PC" although you are apparently aware why this is like that in some cases ... And then the following statement "I will always keep Windows until such a day comes that I can do everything I can do in Windows with Linux. Besides Windows is a lot more user friendly to a novice user compared with that of Linux."

1. you can already do everything with Linux (and much more!)
2. Linux is easy!

So this is "U" = uncertainty for me. With your statements you are trying to imply that Linux won't work as expected on most hardware (clearly depends on the vendor!!) and that is "hard" to learn (I know from experience with total computer-illiterate people such as elderly people or small children that this is plain wrong! Give them GNOME or KDE, show them what they can do and they are happy! No spyware, no viruses, no malware to worry about. No reboots, no crashes, no bluescreens ...)

Uncle Bob wrote: D, maybe a little. However, if this is the case as you say. Why am I still here? Why am I still using Linux, or more importantly Mint?

And for this you deserve to be praised ... it's just the points above that bothered me there, OK?

Uncle Bob wrote: Out of curiosity; who are these vendors?

Take HP for example. Most of their printers should work with Linux, most of them even work "Perfectly". Most of their laptops work tip top too, with minor annoyances such as the webcam not working on the very newest model lines (e.g. my dv2108ea) or the soundcard not yet being 100% supported ... but these are minor things and just a question of time. The HP desktops and servers we have in our office work 100% with Linux. The first thing I can do when I unpack a new server is to throw away the Windows driver disks ... I will never need them. The current Linux kernels have all the drivers I need. The only thing I here and there have to download from the HP web site is some proprietary network management stuff (e.g. in case the server in question needs to be constantly monitored), but that's about it. (yes, I agree: I am totally biased pro-HP ... I work day-in and day-out with their hardware ...

)

Uncle Bob wrote: What about when buying individual components ie mobo's, procs, memory, graphics, wifi cards etc. Who should I avoid and who's OK to buy from when I build my next custom desktop?

There are plenty of websites around that will list what's compatible and what isn't. There are wikis such as this one: http://vendors.bluwiki.org/ ... or this: http://www.linux-drivers.org/

Uncle Bob wrote: That is debatable and I will take it with a pinch of salt until I experience that for myself.

Really depends on the hardware vendor and the hardware component in question. Believe me: I learned the hard way too

Uncle Bob wrote: scorp, you are forcing me ...

That's perfectly OK

... From time to time I use my stinger, yes.

How dare I call myself "scorp" otherwise??

And yes, from time to time I am cruel and an extremist, forcing people into conflicts they didn't even want to be involved in

... very sorry about that, but it is my nature

Haven't we all got our dark sides?

scorp123 · Post by **scorp123** » Mon Mar 26, 2007 7:03 am

Uncle Bob wrote: "I helped many people to get various distros of Linux working on their machines". If Linux was that easy, why did people require your expertise to get it done? They could have done in themselves.

Many of those actually did everything themselves for the most part, they just had minor issues they couldn't (yet) figure out. Other Windows-converts were a bit confused because they tried to apply some bad Windows-habits ... which of course didn't quite work so well. But once you show them how things are done correctly they find this stuff easy. All it takes is an open mind

Another problem often encountered is the misperception that applications are "missing" ... which is usually BS. You show these people what they can use instead and they're usually happy. And stuff like WINE or CrossOver Office or virtualisers such as VMware or VirtualBox may help in the rare cases where a certain Windows software really cannot be replaced. I have such a problem myself .... I have to use a certain highly proprietary database client which will not work under Wine or CrossOver (you can install it ... but it won't run) .. but VMware fixes this issue for me.

Also ... as I keep saying: Nobody is forcing anyone to use Linux. If anyone thinks that Windows is a better choice for them they are welcome to use that instead ... just spare me the brainwash about all the things I supposedly cannot do on my "too hard to learn" operating system, please

I mean I don't go to Windows forums and tell the people there how much their OS sucks because it has all the viruses and all that!? Nope, I don't do that. So I'd kind of expect some similar form of "respect" (or whatever we want to call this) from Windows people ... And I am saying this in general, not directed personally against you or anyone else here, OK?

scorp123 · Post by **scorp123** » Mon Mar 26, 2007 1:18 pm

veloct wrote:To each his own, too hard? Live and let live?

Where is the fun in that?

Just kidding ... you are in fact right

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