Linux Mint signs a partnership with Mozilla

[karlchen]

Hello, SMG.

Thunderbird 91.5 just came through in normal updates in Update Manager for me this morning in LM20.3 so a PPA is no longer needed to use it.

Just to clarify: Thunderbird 91.5.0 is not only available to LM 20.x users from the normal Ubuntu repositories.
It is also available from the normal Ubuntu repositories to poor underdogs , who are stuck on LM 19.3.

Code: Select all

$ apt-cache policy thunderbird
thunderbird:
  Installed: 1:91.5.0+build1-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
  Candidate: 1:91.5.0+build1-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
  Version table:
 *** 1:91.5.0+build1-0ubuntu0.18.04.1 500
        500 http://de.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu bionic-updates/main amd64 Packages <======
        500 http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu bionic-security/main amd64 Packages <=======
        500 http://ppa.launchpad.net/ubuntu-mozilla-security/ppa/ubuntu bionic/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
     1:52.7.0+build1-0ubuntu1 500
        500 http://de.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu bionic/main amd64 Packages

But is this really still on-topic with respect to "Linux Mint signs a partnership with Mozilla"?

Cheers,
Karl

[SMG]

But is this really still on-topic with respect to "Linux Mint signs a partnership with Mozilla"?

Clem did mention Thunderbird at the top of the blog post,

Mozilla develops two of the most important software applications in our distribution:

The Firefox Web Browser
The Thunderbird Email and Calendar application

but I see this (quoted below) in the comments section from him when asked "The above article is the news about Mozilla Firefox and Thunderbird. But I read only news about Firefox. What about Thunderbird. When comes the newest version of Thunderbird"

It’s currently maintained by Ubuntu and only getting security fixes (like most software, we’re a frozen distribution not a rolling one). We should be able to ship Thunderbird the same way we do with Firefox though. It’s not something we looked into yet but we can consider it in the future.

Then later he says:

Thunderbird isn’t affected by this partnership.

So I guess the answer to your question is no.

[karlchen]

Nonetheless, it is good news that Mint 20.x and 19.x users can update (Mozilla) Thunderbird to version 91.5.0 from the normal software repositories.

[momist]

EDIT: Post removed, as cross posted. Sorry.

[SMG]

...Does anyone have any ideas what I need to do? Thanks.

Please do not add new questions to existing topics. You already have a topic open about this issue so this post is considered a cross-post. From the forum rules: [8] Do Not Cross-Post

[jwiz]

I really wonder why nobody's been bashing them for selling out to Mozilla.
Mozilla is a horrible company that has and is disrespecting user privacy by default in much the same way as Google et al. do.
That completely clashes with the alleged rules of Linux Mint of not collecting user data, unless that attitude is just lip-service and being dropped as soon as convenience gets in the way.
I almost hope that Linux Mint chokes on that deal.
For me that's coming close to a deal-breaker for using Linux Mint in the future.

[SMG]

Mozilla is a horrible company that has and is disrespecting user privacy by default in much the same way as Google et al. do.
That completely clashes with the alleged rules of Linux Mint of not collecting user data, unless that attitude is just lip-service and being dropped as soon as convenience gets in the way.

Mozilla is telling you what is set and then letting you change those settings if you do not like them. They are being open and transparent about what they are doing and your ability to change what they have set up.

Additionally, this change by Linux Mint was announced ahead of time so one would know what to expect and how to make changes if what happened was not what one wanted. You have the option of using a different browser and not Firefox if you do not like Mozilla's policies.

What about being open and transparent, and giving you the option to make changes bothers you so much?

[Infidelus]

Additionally, this change by Linux Mint was announced ahead of time ...

While I agree with most of your comments above and have no particular issue with Firefox, the above statement is not technically true. The changes were made before Clem announced them (for those that updated to 20.3 straight away), which resulted in a bunch of queries by users on this forum. The announcement actually came a good few days later.

That said, it wasn't difficult to change the preferences.

[JoeFootball]

... for those that updated to 20.3 straight away ...

LM 20.3 didn't initially have Firefox 96, as Mozilla had yet to release it to the public.

The announcement actually came a good few days later.

The announcement was made January 10, and Firefox 96 was added to the LM repos January 14.

[jwiz]

I don't have much of an issue with Firefox after been hardened and Mozilla telemetry and pocket garbage turned off.
The issue is that Mozilla as a company are rather keen on collecting (and misusing?) user data and by default have all their collecting features turned on.
This doesn't fit well with Linux Mint' self-proclaimed concern about user privacy.
You can't say one thing and do the opposite without being called a cheat.
Just my 2c.

[karlchen]

The issue is that Mozilla as a company are rather keen on collecting (and misusing?) user data and by default have all their collecting features turned on. This doesn't fit well with Linux Mint' self-proclaimed concern about user privacy.

Well, I understand why Mozilla's practice seems to be in conflict with caring about and respecting privacy.
Opt-in to telemetry, instead of opt-out of it might make more people trust in Mozilla's words that they do respect their users' privacy.
On the one hand.
On the other hand, I also understand that the anonymized data, which Mozilla collects, helps them improve Firefox. If they changed telemetry from opt-out to opt-in, it is not totally unlikely that only a very small minority of users would opt-in.
Hm, but does the majority now not take the time to opt-out?!
Slippery ground, this is.

[GELvdH]

In the olden days (IBM 360, UNIVAC 1050) we had to rely on the customers feedback or personal interviews to get usage information. This was very time consuming and not always accurate. The modern way of tracking the software usage via telemetry is of course much more accurate and easier even though it seems to infringe on our privacy.

[Infidelus]

... for those that updated to 20.3 straight away ...

LM 20.3 didn't initially have Firefox 96, as Mozilla had yet to release it to the public.

The announcement actually came a good few days later.

The announcement was made January 10, and Firefox 96 was added to the LM repos January 14.

Hate to disagree, but here's a post from 07/01/2022 - three days before Clem's announcement where people have also seen the telemetry changes, including me on 08/01/2022.

[cliffcoggin]

The modern way of tracking the software usage via telemetry is of course much more accurate and easier even though it seems to infringe on our privacy.

Easier no doubt, but more accurate? I disagree. Failure by the user to disable the telemetry, because he has not read the release notes or understood the issues involved, should not be taken taken as approval of the principle of telemetry.