[SOLVED in 17.3] Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by kmb42vt » Sun Sep 13, 2015 12:39 pm

Its good to hear this trick is working for others as well. I have also tried the setting as 1 and for me seems a bit smoother for scrolling in Firefox so worth experimenting. It can only be 0-4 but I'm guessing higher numbers may make it worse.

Its worth noting though that if this does work for you and you run the Nvidia settings program the entry will be removed as the .nvidia-settings-rc file is over written on quitting the program, you will have to remember to re-insert the line manually or the old problem will come back.

I'm not sure if this only effects earlier Nvidia chips. I have a 460se which is now the lowest the new drivers cover and I'm wondering if anyone is experiencing the problem with the newer 800 or 900 series chips, I'm thinking of upgrading some time in the future.
Yah, worked for me as well although I'll try setting to 1 instead of 0 and see if it makes things smoother for me.

Oh, and I installed the brand new "Graphic Drivers" PPA so I could upgrade to the latest 355 driver and just to make sure, I checked the driver compatibility list at the Nvidia drivers site and this driver covers all the 400 series from 400 on up. This is good because I have the GT 430 Media card installed. Looks like I'll have to look into a newer video card in the next few months.
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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by kmb42vt » Mon Sep 14, 2015 10:56 am

UPDATE:

After a day of use, the Cinnamon DE as well as Firefox began acting worse than before modifying the ".nvidia-settins-rc" file. I won't go into all the details of troubleshooting I've done since then but in the end I had to revert to the open source "Nouveau" driver to power my Nvidia video card. All I know for a fact that everything was working fine until the latest update to Cinnamon came through which updated Cinnamon to 2.6.13. This update also coincided with the update to Firefox 40 from 39.03 by the way.

Then there's the long standing bug with Gnome 3's "mutter" engine that causes this exact same problem with Nvidia cards/drivers which has just recently been fixed with the upcoming release of 3.18. Cinnamon's "muffin" engine is based on "mutter" so that might also have something to do with this problem since it was most likely updated along with Cinnamon 2.6.13.

Also:

Intel GPUs/drivers do not exhibit this problem.

AMD GPUs/drivers do not exhibit this problem.

The DEs that do not require that 3D be enabled (MATE, XFCE, LXDE, KDE, etc) do not exhibit this problem when using Nvidia GPUs/drivers.

The work around by adding "0/InitialPixmapPlacement=0" to the ".nvidia-settins-rc" file may work for some folks but not for others simply because of all the myriads of different hardware combinations, meaning MBs and different types of Nvidia GPUs (onboard or separate video card vs how old the equipment/card).

This problem may very well have to do with the "muffin" engine as anything else and it was just by coincidence that Cinnamon and Firefox were updated at the same time (I've actually seen the "tearing" problem blamed on the update to Firefox 40 as well).

For now, I'll stick with the "Nouveau" driver as I'm not a gamer or graphics artist. So far, the temps of the GPU hover around 32C even under a load which is far below critical (70C). I'm hoping the update to Cinnamon 2.8 solves this problem as it should include an update to "muffin" as well.

Well see? :D
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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by LeBoy » Mon Sep 21, 2015 4:54 pm

I think you nailed it. I did a similar research today and the problem seems to come down to a NVidia + Cinnamon bad marriage. I just saw your post now but our findings totally check. Both "Cinnamon" and "Mate" variations of Mint come from the GNOME desktop in their specific flavours "Muffin" and "Mutter", respectively. The NVidia problem seems to plague both versions but a patch was already written for Mutter and the issue is considered resolved - See here: https://devtalk.nvidia.com/default/topi ... roblems-in. Unfortunately for Cinnamon I believe there is no patch yet :-(

Since I don't want to use the Nouveau drivers I applied a little workaround that at least for now solved the problem for me. It basically consists in forcing the GPU to run at full throttle all the time. Apparently the Adaptive Clocking feature of the NVidia driver causes all sorts of redrawing issues in the Cinnamon environment. To bypass Adaptive Clocking do the following:

Edit following file:

Code: Select all

/etc/X11/xorg.conf
Add following lines:

Code: Select all

Section "Device"
    Identifier     "Device0"
    Driver         "nvidia"
    VendorName     "NVIDIA Corporation"
    Option         "RegistryDwords" "PowerMizerEnable=0x1; PerfLevelSrc=0x2222; PowerMizerDefaultAC=0x1"
EndSection
Of course this could have a negative impact on your system power consumption and temperatures in the long run. So if you have a notebook or is already on the limit or your temperatures please use this with care.

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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by kmb42vt » Thu Sep 24, 2015 11:54 am

LeBoy wrote:I think you nailed it. I did a similar research today and the problem seems to come down to a NVidia + Cinnamon bad marriage. I just saw your post now but our findings totally check. Both "Cinnamon" and "Mate" variations of Mint come from the GNOME desktop in their specific flavours "Muffin" and "Mutter", respectively. The NVidia problem seems to plague both versions but a patch was already written for Mutter and the issue is considered resolved - See here: https://devtalk.nvidia.com/default/topi ... roblems-in. Unfortunately for Cinnamon I believe there is no patch yet :-(

Since I don't want to use the Nouveau drivers I applied a little workaround that at least for now solved the problem for me. It basically consists in forcing the GPU to run at full throttle all the time. Apparently the Adaptive Clocking feature of the NVidia driver causes all sorts of redrawing issues in the Cinnamon environment. To bypass Adaptive Clocking do the following:

Edit following file:

Code: Select all

/etc/X11/xorg.conf
Add following lines:

Code: Select all

Section "Device"
    Identifier     "Device0"
    Driver         "nvidia"
    VendorName     "NVIDIA Corporation"
    Option         "RegistryDwords" "PowerMizerEnable=0x1; PerfLevelSrc=0x2222; PowerMizerDefaultAC=0x1"
EndSection
Of course this could have a negative impact on your system power consumption and temperatures in the long run. So if you have a notebook or is already on the limit or your temperatures please use this with care.
This worked for me, thanks much. I'm actually a bit surprised why I overlooked this during my troubleshooting. I'm also wondering why this work-around solves the problem meaning, the adaptive clocking feature has never caused a problem in Mint's Cinnamon DE since it's inception as a DE (version 2.0) and the problem only showed up when Cinnamon (and it's dependencies) was updated to 2.6.13. What changed? the "cinnamon-muffin" packages? And how? That's what I can't determine.

Anyway, I didn't need to directly change "xorg.conf" file after all. All I did was bring up the Nvidia Settings GUI and set adaptive clocking to "High Performance" (whatever it's called) which effectively disables adaptive clocking. Problem solved and I don't believe it can be overwritten during an update. Since this is on my desktop system and not a laptop, I'm not too worried about increased energy consumption or video card GPU temperature since it 's been staying around 36C or below under a load so all is well there.

Still, the "whys" of this problem still bother me.
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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by LeBoy » Sun Sep 27, 2015 5:12 pm

Glad to see that my post could help :-)

My first guess was also to try to change this option directly in the NVIDIA X Server Settings: PowerMizer > PowerMizer Setting > Preferred Mode: "Prefer Maximum Performance." But for me the change was not persistent. It reverted to "Auto" after every reboot. That's why I had to create the xorf.conf file. But good to know that it works for you.

As for finding the real cause of this issue I think it will be really tough. The bug is ancient and it was most probably introduced around March 2014 after NVidia driver 331.89 update - allegedly the last version without the issue. The problem is also certainly related to the combination: GeForce Card + NVidia driver + GNOME Desktop. Although I also found posts of people using this exact combo and NOT having the issue. Maybe there are more parameters involved that we don't know of: motherboard specs? BIO settings? And to make matters worse it is a rather difficult problem to identify. Maybe there are hundreds of thousands of affected users out there but if they just stick to the Nouveau drivers, or simply are not too sensitive to input lag they will never notice anything wrong.

Actually I'm not even sure if the Mint development team is aware of this issue. It's been around for over a year without a fix and there are many threads in this forum related to the issue with no concrete reply from anyone. For example:
http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.p ... 8&t=171086
http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=202832

Let's just hope that Rosa (17.3) will finally bring this long saga to an end :-)

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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by kmb42vt » Tue Oct 20, 2015 3:14 pm

@LeBoy and others - After trying the "xorg.conf" solution and running the system for a good while, I found the problem (laggy windows controls, etc) was diminished but not completely eliminated. Going into the "Nvidia X server" application and setting "Performance levels" under "PowerMizer" to "Prefer maximum performance" was still the only way to eliminate the problem entirely. Of course, the setting is not persistent over restarts, etc.

I'm even more convinced that the problem occurred with the "muffin" window manager (actually called "cinnamon-muffin" in the repos) when Cinnamon was updated from 2.6.11 (which had no problems) to 2.6.13. During this update, the "cinnamon-muffin" package was also updated and the problem showed up.

Now the good news.

As a test, I added the "Cinnamon Nightly PPA" which now has most of the 2.8 packages that will be included in the Linux Mint/Cinnamon 17.3 update later this month. The interesting thing about this is that although the actual "cinnamon" package remains at 2.6.13 (+build number), the "cinnamon-muffin" package is now at 2.8 (+build number).

After 3 days of testing with the PPA enabled and the system updated on a regular basis, the problem seems to have been eliminated. I removed the "xorg-conf" entirely and I've left the "Nvidia X server settings" application at the defaults. I'm not saying anything definite at this point as I'll continue to test but I'll post back here in a few days as to whether things remain "fixed".

It will be grand if version 2.8 does indeed solve this problem.
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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by LeBoy » Wed Oct 21, 2015 4:30 am

That's indeed very good news! We should then expect the issue to be finally addressed with the Mint 17.3 update :D Do we have a release date already? I thought Rosa (17.3) was only due by the end of the year.

Anyway from my side it's probably the end of the line for this issue since I'm upgrading my rig entirely next week with new MoBo and GPU:
------------------------
MSI X99S MPower
Gainward Geforce GTX 970
------------------------

I assume the problem will no longer happen with the new high-end equipment. I'll keep you guys posted :wink:

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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by kmb42vt » Wed Oct 21, 2015 10:17 am

LeBoy wrote:That's indeed very good news! We should then expect the issue to be finally addressed with the Mint 17.3 update :D Do we have a release date already? I thought Rosa (17.3) was only due by the end of the year.

Anyway from my side it's probably the end of the line for this issue since I'm upgrading my rig entirely next week with new MoBo and GPU:
------------------------
MSI X99S MPower
Gainward Geforce GTX 970
------------------------

I assume the problem will no longer happen with the new high-end equipment. I'll keep you guys posted :wink:
I believe the 17.3 release is due sometime early November which makes sense since Clem announced sometime back when it was decided to change to the Ubuntu LTS base, that point releases will still follow the old schedule (May, November, May, etc)

And good luck with the upgrade. I'm sticking with my old desktop PC (Intel Core 2 Quad, 8 GB DDR2, Nvidia GT 430) until the tech police force me to upgrade or go to prison. :D Then it will be a new(er) machine entirely. My days of upgrading the hardware from scratch are long over--my eyesight ain't so good these days.

Yes, I'm old(er). 8)
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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by LeBoy » Mon Oct 26, 2015 9:02 am

You put a smile on my face because with the age I'm slowly getting there myself. When setting up this new rig I certainly felt my eyes beginning to strain. They keep on printing the labels and manuals smaller and smaller it seems :wink:

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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by kmb42vt » Mon Oct 26, 2015 10:50 am

LeBoy wrote:You put a smile on my face because with the age I'm slowly getting there myself. When setting up this new rig I certainly felt my eyes beginning to strain. They keep on printing the labels and manuals smaller and smaller it seems :wink:
By the way, I disabled the Cinnamon Nightly PPA (Cinnamon 2.8 was still working fine) and used Mint's "Software sources" tool to downgrade back to the official 2.6.13 packages. Something I wouldn't recommend anyone to do since although it works it left broken packages and I had to use the command line "aptitude" GUI to fix them/update before I could log in.

Once that was accomplished, I enabled Mint's "Romeo" repository via the same "Software sources" app which now included the pre-release (developer) 17.3 "Rosa" packages. I updated the system to 2.8 (now at 2.8.1) and everything is running fine. So, for those that are having this Nvidia driver vs Cinnamon problem it looks like 17.3 will fix it. More testing in store.

So, you're hardware upgrade went okay despite the small printing?
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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by JosephM » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:06 am

Just for general information, a similar fix for this problem in mutter was done for muffin/cinnamon. It is in 2.8 if you are using it already from Romeo or the cinnamon nightly builds ppa.
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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by kmb42vt » Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:25 pm

JosephM wrote:Just for general information, a similar fix for this problem in mutter was done for muffin/cinnamon. It is in 2.8 if you are using it already from Romeo or the cinnamon nightly builds ppa.
Thanks for the info. It's always good to get confirmation on what you suspected was wrong. Especially when you're not programmer. :D
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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by LeBoy » Wed Nov 04, 2015 10:37 am

kmb42vt wrote:By the way, I disabled the Cinnamon Nightly PPA (Cinnamon 2.8 was still working fine) and used Mint's "Software sources" tool to downgrade back to the official 2.6.13 packages. Something I wouldn't recommend anyone to do since although it works it left broken packages and I had to use the command line "aptitude" GUI to fix them/update before I could log in.

Once that was accomplished, I enabled Mint's "Romeo" repository via the same "Software sources" app which now included the pre-release (developer) 17.3 "Rosa" packages. I updated the system to 2.8 (now at 2.8.1) and everything is running fine. So, for those that are having this Nvidia driver vs Cinnamon problem it looks like 17.3 will fix it. More testing in store.

So, you're hardware upgrade went okay despite the small printing?
Thanks for the testing! I'm looking forward to a NVIDIA-bug free world with the Rosa upgrade - 17.3

BTW: My new installation is going much slower than I could hope for. I am trying to install Mint on a SSD Raid0 array and this is proving to be a hard and tortuous way since Linux doesn't support hardware Raid and the software alternatives out there are very difficult to setup in a boot partition. On top of that my old PSU died yesterday. Waiting for the new PSU to arrive at the moment... :roll:

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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by kmb42vt » Wed Nov 04, 2015 1:09 pm

LeBoy wrote:Thanks for the testing! I'm looking forward to a NVIDIA-bug free world with the Rosa upgrade - 17.3

BTW: My new installation is going much slower than I could hope for. I am trying to install Mint on a SSD Raid0 array and this is proving to be a hard and tortuous way since Linux doesn't support hardware Raid and the software alternatives out there are very difficult to setup in a boot partition. On top of that my old PSU died yesterday. Waiting for the new PSU to arrive at the moment... :roll:
Bummer on the PSU but it happens, yes? Did you up the wattage on the new one you ordered just to say you did? :D

As far as your installation goes, the only thing I could find out was this bit of information:

http://superuser.com/questions/881202/h ... id-0-array

Okay, so you might not use encryption but this little bit of a suggestion might help you out?
...you MUST to create a small partition out of the raid0 for /boot.Grub will be installed there and define the root partition as MD
Otherwise, I have Linux Mint 17 series/Cinnamon installed onto and Samsung 128 GB Samsung EVO 850 on an older Lenovo Thinkpad (Intel Core2 Dual/4 GB DDR2/all Intel chipsets), albeit not in a RAID setup, and it flies. Anyway, check out the link and see if it helps any. It might take a complete re-install?
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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by LeBoy » Fri Nov 06, 2015 11:15 am

@All: Sorry for going totally off topic here.

About my bootable Raid0 setup: I created a new thread for it: (http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=208835)

About my PSU blowing up: It was already over 6 years old but I suspect it was partially my fault because I had to turn it on and off so many times in order to reinstall the water-cooling system and also to perform all the Raid0 tests. On top of that my new MSI motherboard has a special USB3 extension port with some extra changing functionalities for mobile devices. I was not aware that this was activated by default and one day I went to work and forgot USB stick in that very port. When I got home in the evening the USB stick was very hot and PSU basically just died after that :-( When I’m done with the whole new PC setup I should take a closer look into this and maybe contact MSI.

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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by ainurakne » Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:30 pm

JosephM wrote:Just for general information, a similar fix for this problem in mutter was done for muffin/cinnamon. It is in 2.8 if you are using it already from Romeo or the cinnamon nightly builds ppa.
I got the 17.3 update today, and indeed, the new Cinnamon seems to have fixed the problem. At least on my machine.

Actually 17.3 seems to be better in every way. Everything seems smoother, and ram and processor usage seems smaller than before.
So far looks like a really great update.

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Re: Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDIA)

Post by LeBoy » Fri Dec 11, 2015 6:00 am

ainurakne wrote:Actually 17.3 seems to be better in every way. Everything seems smoother, and ram and processor usage seems smaller than before.
So far looks like a really great update.
Cool, I can't wait for upgrade. On the weekend probably 8-)

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Re: [SOLVED in 17.3] Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDI

Post by Dave B » Fri Dec 11, 2015 10:47 pm

As mentioned by JosephM, this issue is indeed fixed. Should also be no more frequent random lock-ups while using the NVIDIA card on an Optimus laptop. :)

mtwebster is the developer to thank, he's the one who ported the previously linked Mutter fix to Muffin. Thanks again Michael, you've made many Mint Cinnamon users very happy! :)

David

Edit: Fix typo
Last edited by Dave B on Mon Feb 08, 2016 3:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: [SOLVED in 17.3] Laggy window controls (Cinnamon + NVIDI

Post by ddeo » Tue Jan 19, 2016 10:28 am

Since update to 17.3 and Cinnamon I started seriously thinking about switching DE, I love how Cinnamon works and looks but it is horribly laggy right now. Tried both open source and propietary drivers for AMD, window manager (mutter/muffin) is laggy after using Cinnamon for some time. CTRL + ALT + ESC to restart Cinnamon helps and windows are working smooth for another 15 minutes, but after that... again... ehh :/ If I wouldn't be using my laptop for work, I would be right now checking out alternative DE or at least would try to reinstall OS. Today I wanted to install another DE for Mint, but I read that it might end up with system and applications compatibility issues. I am stuck for some time. Went to Mint irc, people asked me for my system info. The only suggestion was to reinstall whole system and see if problem occurs on clear installation. No-Can-Do!

video of problem (notice chromium): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ec99EYj ... e=youtu.be
github issue I've commented: https://github.com/linuxmint/Cinnamon/i ... -168966763

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