My criticisms of Cinnamon

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yeehawwww
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My criticisms of Cinnamon

Post by yeehawwww »

I have used LM Cinnamon for a couple months now and I'd like to outline some of my complaints in hopes that this DE and distro grow to be even better. Most of them are about Nemo.

1. Nemo has a problem with thumbnail generation. If I torrent a video file and have Nemo open in the download directory, it will see that the file is incomplete and won't generate a thumbnail for it, which is expected, however once the download completes it will still not generate the thumbnail. If I only open the download directory after the download is finished, then it will generate the thumbnail normally.
Another example with what looks like this same shortcoming is copying files from a different drive, if I connect my hard drive and copy a video that is several gigabytes large to my OS drive, the same principle seems to apply. Nemo detects the incomplete video file being copied, decides that it can't have a thumbnail and doesn't generate the thumbnail when it finishes copying. The only way I found to get around this is moving the file to a different directory, then it gets the thumbnail generated.
2. Nemo's thumbnail size setting goes in large increments. I find that one increment is slightly too small and the next one is slightly too large for my taste, I would like smaller increments like in KDE's Dolphin.
3. Nemo is sluggish with loading large directories containing many files and folders. I have a large media directory with several dozen folders and a few thousand files and whenever I open it, Nemo takes several seconds to list all the folders that exist in the directory. Comparatively, Dolphin loads them fast. (I have an SSD)
4. Nemo lacks a few nice quality of life features that Dolphin has. I would love to see the following:
-an info panel or tooltip that shows a file's resolution, length, metadata and so on
-previews on folders (folder icons with thumbnails of files that are inside)
-being able to calculate checksums for any file under properties
5. The progress bar in the tree view under a drive representing how full it is doesn't update accordingly in Nemo. If I copy 400gb to an empty 500gb drive, that progress bar will remain empty until Nemo is restarted.
6. I would like a way to disable Nemo's precise scrollbar option, where you hold click on a scrollbar and it turns thin with low sensitivity until you release the mouse. If there is a way to disable it, please correct me.
7. Mouse sensitivity is freeform and has no reference. When I try a new KDE distro, I know the exact mouse sensitivity setting I am used to because it has increments, but for Cinnamon I have to vaguely guess where it was.
8. The favorites bar in the menu isn't as good as a favorites tab like other DEs and Windows have.
9. I would like a more intuitive way of auto mounting devices. In KDE you simply click a checkbox to auto mount on login or when attached, but in Cinnamon you have to go to Disks > additional partition options > edit mount options and then get a window with a bunch of confusing looking options to edit fstab.
10. By default, pressing print screen should bring up the screenshot utility so you can choose what kind of screenshot you want, instead of assuming you want a screenshot of your entire screen. It would be more sensible to assume you want the selection option since you can drag that across a small area or your entire screen for the same effect.

Unrelated, but I would absolutely love it if Linux Mint had a Plasma LTS flavor, that would hands down be the perfect distro. As far as I'm aware, only Kubuntu ships Plasma LTS right now, and that's a problem because it forces Snap on you.
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AZgl1800
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Re: My criticisms of Cinnamon

Post by AZgl1800 »

yeehawwww wrote:
Fri Nov 11, 2022 1:40 pm
I have used LM Cinnamon for a couple months now and I'd like to outline some of my complaints in hopes that this DE and distro grow to be even better. Most of them are about Nemo.

1. Nemo has a problem with thumbnail generation. If I torrent a video file and have Nemo open in the download directory, it will see that the file is incomplete and won't generate a thumbnail for it, which is expected, however once the download completes it will still not generate the thumbnail. If I only open the download directory after the download is finished, then it will generate the thumbnail normally.
Another example with what looks like this same shortcoming is copying files from a different drive, if I connect my hard drive and copy a video that is several gigabytes large to my OS drive, the same principle seems to apply. Nemo detects the incomplete video file being copied, decides that it can't have a thumbnail and doesn't generate the thumbnail when it finishes copying. The only way I found to get around this is moving the file to a different directory, then it gets the thumbnail generated.
you expect too much.... Windows does not do any better, not that I would go back to MSloth anyway
2. Nemo's thumbnail size setting goes in large increments. I find that one increment is slightly too small and the next one is slightly too large for my taste, I would like smaller increments like in KDE's Dolphin.
it is the way it is, because that is the way it has always been.
Clem in his blog, says that NEMO is being worked on, so wait for LM22
3. Nemo is sluggish with loading large directories containing many files and folders. I have a large media directory with several dozen folders and a few thousand files and whenever I open it, Nemo takes several seconds to list all the folders that exist in the directory. Comparatively, Dolphin loads them fast. (I have an SSD)
I have to agree, but I solved that by only looking at one Directory at a time.
4. Nemo lacks a few nice quality of life features that Dolphin has. I would love to see the following:
-an info panel or tooltip that shows a file's resolution, length, metadata and so on
-previews on folders (folder icons with thumbnails of files that are inside)
-being able to calculate checksums for any file under properties
again, Clem is looking at NEMO

have you read Clem's blog?
I keep a Tab open for it.
https://blog.linuxmint.com/
5. The progress bar in the tree view under a drive representing how full it is doesn't update accordingly in Nemo. If I copy 400gb to an empty 500gb drive, that progress bar will remain empty until Nemo is restarted.
agree
6. I would like a way to disable Nemo's precise scrollbar option, where you hold click on a scrollbar and it turns thin with low sensitivity until you release the mouse. If there is a way to disable it, please correct me.
not an issue with me
7. Mouse sensitivity is freeform and has no reference. When I try a new KDE distro, I know the exact mouse sensitivity setting I am used to because it has increments, but for Cinnamon I have to vaguely guess where it was.
the mouse is controlled by the Mouse function for the OS, not for each app
8. The favorites bar in the menu isn't as good as a favorites tab like other DEs and Windows have.
don't like the Favorites bar, never use it

9. I would like a more intuitive way of auto mounting devices. In KDE you simply click a checkbox to auto mount on login or when attached, but in Cinnamon you have to go to Disks > additional partition options > edit mount options and then get a window with a bunch of confusing looking options to edit fstab.
yup, that is just the way it is
10. By default, pressing print screen should bring up the screenshot utility so you can choose what kind of screenshot you want, instead of assuming you want a screenshot of your entire screen. It would be more sensible to assume you want the selection option since you can drag that across a small area or your entire screen for the same effect.
Hold down the Shift Key, then use the mouse to outline the area you want,
I do that for every screenshot that I take, super easy......
very rare, that I just take a Full Screen shot
Unrelated, but I would absolutely love it if Linux Mint had a Plasma LTS flavor, that would hands down be the perfect distro. As far as I'm aware, only Kubuntu ships Plasma LTS right now, and that's a problem because it forces Snap on you.
I don't like Plasma, that is a personal preference
Last edited by Moem on Sat Nov 12, 2022 3:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Fixed the quotes, so that every line that is not part of the quote, is outside of the quote tags.
LM21.x upgraded from 20.3 Cinnamon on an ASUS FX705GM laptop
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motoryzen
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Re: My criticisms of Cinnamon

Post by motoryzen »

I'd be happy if the following things would be corrected:

1. Nemo could speed up some on launching any folders ( sorry but couldn't help but notice PcmanFm is noticeably faster..BUT impossible for me to get to working " open in terminal" and " open as root" right click options within Linux Mint ...so ..sticking to Nemo)

2. Sound - when I do ctrl +alt + backspace...and log back in...I ALWAYS have to toggle in my Sound settings changing the speaker type setup for my "Line Out Starship/- Matisse HD Audio Controller" to get my sound back. Alsa audio with PAVU control installed.

=== I have an Asrock x570 taichi mobo with 2nd newest bios ..not even 4 months old yet on that bios and no external or other sound devices in between the 3.5mm correct jack on the mobo to my simple desktop speakers.

I'm not 100% sure if this is a settings or other issue with my stuff..OR if it's an odd bug within Cinnamon.

Regardless, Clem and the team are STILL refining this OS experience overall better and better each and every year like a boss. I'd be very hard pressed to want to quit LM to switch to another distro.

== Speaking of at least one reason to compliment Clem and the rest of the LM team...
Synaptic and the Update Manager will now also ask pkexec to remember your password so you won’t have to enter it every single time if you perform multiple operations
Niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice :D job peeps!
Primary rig:
asrock x570 taichi
ryzen 5900x
128GB of kingston fury at 3600mhz 1.44 volts 20-20-20 ( I forgot the rest) 1T timings
corsair mp600 pro xt NVME ssd 4TB
8GB rx580 sapphire nitro+ video card
Viewsonic Elite UHD 32" 144hz monitor
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AZgl1800
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Re: My criticisms of Cinnamon

Post by AZgl1800 »

motoryzen wrote:
Sat Nov 12, 2022 1:53 am
I'd be happy if the following things would be corrected:

1. Nemo could speed up some on launching any folders ( sorry but couldn't help but notice PcmanFm is noticeably faster..BUT impossible for me to get to working " open in terminal" and " open as root" right click options within Linux Mint ...so ..sticking to Nemo)
I just now checked to see how 'slow' NEMO is to open a folder, about 1 second clicking on an Icon;
about 1.25 seconds if you use SuperKey E
..... sorry, but that is NOT slow.

2. Sound - when I do ctrl +alt + backspace...and log back in...I ALWAYS have to toggle in my Sound settings changing the speaker type setup for my "Line Out Starship/- Matisse HD Audio Controller" to get my sound back. Alsa audio with PAVU control installed.
I have no reason to ever do that, so for me, that is totally irrelevant,
but, since I am always switching between the speakers and Bluetooth headsets,
I keep the Sound Icon on the Task Bar or Panel if you prefer
=== I have an Asrock x570 taichi mobo with 2nd newest bios ..not even 4 months old yet on that bios and no external or other sound devices in between the 3.5mm correct jack on the mobo to my simple desktop speakers.

I'm not 100% sure if this is a settings or other issue with my stuff..OR if it's an odd bug within Cinnamon.

Regardless, Clem and the team are STILL refining this OS experience overall better and better each and every year like a boss. I'd be very hard pressed to want to quit LM to switch to another distro.

== Speaking of at least one reason to compliment Clem and the rest of the LM team...
Synaptic and the Update Manager will now also ask pkexec to remember your password so you won’t have to enter it every single time if you perform multiple operations
Niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice :D job peeps!
This is my laptop:

Code: Select all

System:
  Kernel: 5.15.0-52-generic x86_64 bits: 64 compiler: gcc v: 11.2.0 Desktop: Cinnamon 5.4.12
    tk: GTK 3.24.33 wm: Mutter dm: LightDM Distro: Linux Mint 21 Vanessa base: Ubuntu 22.04 jammy
Machine:
  Type: Laptop System: ASUSTeK product: TUF Gaming FX705GM_FX705GM v: 1.0
    serial: <superuser required>
  Mobo: ASUSTeK model: FX705GM v: 1.0 serial: <superuser required> UEFI: American Megatrends
    v: FX705GM.307 date: 05/25/2020
Battery:
  ID-1: BAT0 charge: 49.5 Wh (98.0%) condition: 50.5/64.1 Wh (78.7%) volts: 16.2 min: 15.6
    model: Simplo SDI ICR18650 serial: <filter> status: N/A
  Device-1: hidpp_battery_0 model: Logitech Wireless Mouse M510 serial: <filter>
    charge: 55% (should be ignored) status: Discharging
CPU:
  Info: 6-core model: Intel Core i7-8750H bits: 64 type: MT MCP arch: Coffee Lake rev: A cache:
    L1: 384 KiB L2: 1.5 MiB L3: 9 MiB
  Speed (MHz): avg: 800 min/max: 800/4100 cores: 1: 800 2: 800 3: 800 4: 800 5: 800 6: 800
    7: 800 8: 800 9: 800 10: 800 11: 800 12: 800 bogomips: 52799
  Flags: avx avx2 ht lm nx pae sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 ssse3 vmx
Graphics:
  Device-1: Intel CoffeeLake-H GT2 [UHD Graphics 630] vendor: ASUSTeK driver: i915 v: kernel
    ports: active: eDP-1 empty: none bus-ID: 00:02.0 chip-ID: 8086:3e9b
  Device-2: NVIDIA GP106M [GeForce GTX 1060 Mobile] vendor: ASUSTeK driver: nvidia v: 515.65.01
    pcie: speed: 2.5 GT/s lanes: 16 ports: active: none empty: HDMI-A-1 bus-ID: 01:00.0
    chip-ID: 10de:1c20
  Device-3: IMC Networks USB2.0 HD UVC WebCam type: USB driver: uvcvideo bus-ID: 1-11:4
    chip-ID: 13d3:56a2
  Display: x11 server: X.Org v: 1.21.1.3 driver: X: loaded: modesetting,nvidia
    unloaded: fbdev,nouveau,vesa gpu: i915 display-ID: :0 screens: 1
  Screen-1: 0 s-res: 1920x1080 s-dpi: 98
  Monitor-1: eDP-1 model: AU Optronics res: 1920x1080 dpi: 128 diag: 438mm (17.3")
  OpenGL: renderer: Mesa Intel UHD Graphics 630 (CFL GT2) v: 4.6 Mesa 22.0.5 direct render: Yes
Audio:
  Device-1: Intel Cannon Lake PCH cAVS vendor: ASUSTeK driver: sof-audio-pci-intel-cnl
    bus-ID: 00:1f.3 chip-ID: 8086:a348
  Device-2: NVIDIA GP106 High Definition Audio driver: snd_hda_intel v: kernel pcie:
    speed: 2.5 GT/s lanes: 16 bus-ID: 01:00.1 chip-ID: 10de:10f1
  Sound Server-1: ALSA v: k5.15.0-52-generic running: yes
  Sound Server-2: PulseAudio v: 15.99.1 running: yes
  Sound Server-3: PipeWire v: 0.3.48 running: yes
Network:
  Device-1: Intel Cannon Lake PCH CNVi WiFi driver: iwlwifi v: kernel bus-ID: 00:14.3
    chip-ID: 8086:a370
  IF: wlo1 state: up mac: <filter>
  Device-2: Realtek RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet vendor: ASUSTeK driver: r8169
    v: kernel pcie: speed: 2.5 GT/s lanes: 1 port: 3000 bus-ID: 03:00.0 chip-ID: 10ec:8168
  IF: enp3s0 state: down mac: <filter>
  IF-ID-1: virbr0 state: down mac: <filter>
Bluetooth:
  Device-1: Intel Bluetooth 9460/9560 Jefferson Peak (JfP) type: USB driver: btusb v: 0.8
    bus-ID: 1-14:5 chip-ID: 8087:0aaa
  Report: hciconfig ID: hci0 rfk-id: 1 state: up address: <filter> bt-v: 3.0 lmp-v: 5.1
    sub-v: 100
Drives:
  Local Storage: total: 1.38 TiB used: 392.28 GiB (27.9%)
  ID-1: /dev/nvme0n1 vendor: Intel model: SSDPEKNW512G8 size: 476.94 GiB speed: 31.6 Gb/s
    lanes: 4 serial: <filter> temp: 27.9 C
  ID-2: /dev/sda vendor: Samsung model: SSD 860 EVO 1TB size: 931.51 GiB speed: 6.0 Gb/s
    serial: <filter>
Partition:
  ID-1: / size: 43.33 GiB used: 18.45 GiB (42.6%) fs: ext4 dev: /dev/sda2
  ID-2: /boot/efi size: 256 MiB used: 30.3 MiB (11.8%) fs: vfat dev: /dev/nvme0n1p1
  ID-3: /home size: 409.83 GiB used: 179.05 GiB (43.7%) fs: ext4 dev: /dev/sda4
Swap:
  Alert: No swap data was found.
USB:
  Hub-1: 1-0:1 info: Hi-speed hub with single TT ports: 16 rev: 2.0 speed: 480 Mb/s
    chip-ID: 1d6b:0002
  Device-1: 1-2:2 info: Logitech Unifying Receiver type: Keyboard,Mouse,HID
    driver: logitech-djreceiver,usbhid rev: 2.0 speed: 12 Mb/s chip-ID: 046d:c52b
  Device-2: 1-6:3 info: Holtek Keyboard LKS02 type: Keyboard,HID driver: hid-generic,usbhid
    rev: 1.1 speed: 1.5 Mb/s chip-ID: 04d9:1702
  Device-3: 1-11:4 info: IMC Networks USB2.0 HD UVC WebCam type: Video driver: uvcvideo rev: 2.0
    speed: 480 Mb/s chip-ID: 13d3:56a2
  Device-4: 1-14:5 info: Intel Bluetooth 9460/9560 Jefferson Peak (JfP) type: Bluetooth
    driver: btusb rev: 2.0 speed: 12 Mb/s chip-ID: 8087:0aaa
  Hub-2: 2-0:1 info: Super-speed hub ports: 8 rev: 3.1 speed: 10 Gb/s chip-ID: 1d6b:0003
Sensors:
  System Temperatures: cpu: 43.0 C pch: 44.0 C mobo: 27.8 C
  Fan Speeds (RPM): cpu: 0
Repos:
  Packages: 2552 apt: 2536 flatpak: 16
  No active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list
  No active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/jeanslack-videomass-focal.list
  No active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/kelebek333-mint-tools-focal.list
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/megasync.list
    1: deb [signed-by=/usr/share/keyrings/meganz-archive-keyring.gpg] https: //mega.nz/linux/repo/xUbuntu_22.04/ ./
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/official-package-repositories.list
    1: deb http: //packages.linuxmint.com vanessa main upstream import backport
    2: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu jammy main restricted universe multiverse
    3: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu jammy-updates main restricted universe multiverse
    4: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu jammy-backports main restricted universe multiverse
    5: deb http: //security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ jammy-security main restricted universe multiverse
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/opera-stable.list
    1: deb https: //deb.opera.com/opera-stable/ stable non-free
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/teamviewer.list
    1: deb [signed-by=/usr/share/keyrings/teamviewer-keyring.gpg] https: //linux.teamviewer.com/deb stable main
  No active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/teejee2008-timeshift-focal.list
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/teejeetech-aptik.list
    1: deb [arch=amd64 signed-by=/usr/share/keyrings/teejeetech-aptik-keyring.gpg] https: //packages.teejeetech.com/aptik/0/JcbCJmMm7k/ubuntu/focal/amd64 stable main
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/vivaldi.list
    1: deb [arch=amd64] https: //repo.vivaldi.com/stable/deb/ stable main
Info:
  Processes: 333 Uptime: 1d 22h 54m Memory: 15.48 GiB used: 4.42 GiB (28.6%) Init: systemd v: 249
  runlevel: 5 Compilers: gcc: 11.3.0 alt: 11/9 Client: Unknown python3.10 client inxi: 3.3.13
Last edited by Moem on Sat Nov 12, 2022 4:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Fixed the quotes, so that every line that is not part of the quote, is outside of the quote tags.
LM21.x upgraded from 20.3 Cinnamon on an ASUS FX705GM laptop
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motoryzen
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Re: My criticisms of Cinnamon

Post by motoryzen »

I just now checked to see how 'slow' NEMO is to open a folder, about 1 second clicking on an Icon;
about 1.25 seconds if you use SuperKey E
..... sorry, but that is NOT slow
Maybe not to you, but for a performance junkie like me...a full second is fairly slow and definitely anything slower than a full second kinda sucks..IF...we're talking loading a folder from with a sata or especially a good nvme pci express based ssd.

If we're talking from spinning rust, ...if it's basically alittle less 7 seconds for loading it the first time if you're like me and it contains a crap ton of movie files..I'm cool with that ( especially given my movie file icon labeling project replaced the default emblems or whatevers for actual 1280x720p or 1080p pictures of the movie wallpaper/titles ;)

Regardless, it's speed difference isn't enough for me to ditch Nemo unless it get noticeably worse..to the point of ridiculousness..AND there is no way to resolve it.
Primary rig:
asrock x570 taichi
ryzen 5900x
128GB of kingston fury at 3600mhz 1.44 volts 20-20-20 ( I forgot the rest) 1T timings
corsair mp600 pro xt NVME ssd 4TB
8GB rx580 sapphire nitro+ video card
Viewsonic Elite UHD 32" 144hz monitor
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Re: My criticisms of Cinnamon

Post by Hoser Rob »

yeehawwww wrote:
Fri Nov 11, 2022 1:40 pm
... As far as I'm aware, only Kubuntu ships Plasma LTS right now, and that's a problem because it forces Snap on you.
Kubuntu is NOT the only distro that ships LTS PLasma.

And Ubuntu does not force snaps on you, they can be disabled easily.
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MiZoG
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Re: My criticisms of Cinnamon

Post by MiZoG »

We have to be realistic and have realistic demands from Clem n co.
Nemo should aim parity of features, QoL enhancements and comparative advantages in comparison to mainstream GTK-based file managers, namely Nautilus from which it was forked.
Dolphin will be Dolphin, feature-rich, ultra-customizable, self-destructive :lol: .
Let's hope Nemo will be Nemo, boring, conservative, receiving incremental but steady improvements and never getting in our way like some above mentioned file managers :lol:
Last edited by MiZoG on Mon Nov 14, 2022 6:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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AZgl1800
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Re: My criticisms of Cinnamon

Post by AZgl1800 »

MiZoG wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 1:06 am
We have to be realistic and have realistic demands from Clem n co.
.......
Let's hope Nemo will be Nemo, boring, conservative, receiving incremental but steady improvements and never getting in our way like some above mentioned file managers :lol:
HipHip Hooray!

Bravo Clem and associate developers
LM21.x upgraded from 20.3 Cinnamon on an ASUS FX705GM laptop
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Re: My criticisms of Cinnamon

Post by yeehawwww »

yeehawwww wrote:
Fri Nov 11, 2022 1:40 pm
The only way I found to get around this is moving the file to a different directory, then it gets the thumbnail generated.
I found another workaround for this, View > Reload. It'd be nice to have this in the context menu or as a button on Nemo.
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Re: My criticisms of Cinnamon

Post by blueberrymint »

yeehawwww wrote:
Sat Nov 19, 2022 6:58 pm
yeehawwww wrote:
Fri Nov 11, 2022 1:40 pm
The only way I found to get around this is moving the file to a different directory, then it gets the thumbnail generated.
I found another workaround for this, View > Reload. It'd be nice to have this in the context menu or as a button on Nemo.
Go to Edit > Preferences > Toolbar and select "Refresh" button, and the reload button will appear. Reload also has a shortcut: Ctrl+R.
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Re: My criticisms of Cinnamon

Post by Drugwash »

Try Double Commander instead of Nemo. Make sure you also search (on GitHub) and install whatever appropriate plug-ins you might desire. Pay attention on which DC version - Gtk or Qt - each plug-in is compatibile with.

Items 2, 4, 5, 6 would be solved right off the bat.
Items 1 and 3 might also be solved but can't vouch for that since I never paid attention to those issues.
Item 8 may be replaced by tabs which are remembered between sessions; some can also be locked, with or without allowing temporary directory change.
Item 10 could be solved by installing the applet ScreenShot+Record Desktop but it may require slight changes/improvements.

Item 7 doesn't really depend on the Nemo file manager; it could be improved if they made a tiny change to the slider and/or scale code to add multiple markers. Actually that is entirely a GTK problem. I did that as a proof of concept in one of my applets but it's not currently enabled.

Item 9 is also a general OS problem unrelated to Nemo. An OS needs vision and a good eye for design, combined with fine knowledge of people's psychology, ergonomics and a few other factors. Today's world sorely lacks people of vision, unless they are well hidden in some underground military facilities without any contact whatsoever with the external world. :roll:
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