Mint on DVD - Use of extra space.

[Phaedrus]

Nice to see Mint available on DVD.
Seeing as there`s now 4.7 gigs available - Might I suggest the extra space be used primarily as a means of including as many graphic and network drivers as possible.

I`m sure we could all suggest useful and popular applications that could be included on the DVD, but I think priority should go to drivers in keeping with Mints "it-works-out-of-the-box" experience.

Mint could potentially work with every network adapter and every graphic card right out of the box.

[grimdestripador]

Call it the offline experience, for those who would like to be able to install a number of apps/games/drivers without internet connectivity.

[den1m]

Nice to see Mint available on DVD.
Seeing as there`s now 4.7 gigs available - Might I suggest the extra space be used primarily as a means of including as many graphic and network drivers as possible.

I`m sure we could all suggest useful and popular applications that could be included on the DVD, but I think priority should go to drivers in keeping with Mints "it-works-out-of-the-box" experience.

Mint could potentially work with every network adapter and every graphic card right out of the box.

This is great news. I suggested these apps preinstalled in another thread:

- Openshot video editor
- LMMS
- Mixxx
- Audacity
- Inkscape
- Kompozer
- Sunbird (to go with thunderbird and firefox) and GnuPG
- Calibre (ebook app)
- TOR
- OTR plugin enabled by default in pidgin

This without a doubt, should be installed by default.

MAYBE gftp, blender and xbmc too.

If they miss anything, like more music apps like ardour, hydrogen, rosegarden, more video editing like avidemux, kdenlive etc or prefer scribus to openoffice for creating something, i think they should get it from the web really, like now. But on this list i created here, you have the best to make your own music, videos, graphics, office work and do everything fun and creative on the level a normal consumer is at, up and running the second after they started. Within 10 minutes after install, they can have made theyre own video and put up on youtube, OR have made a song, OR have made a logo, OR some graphics with gimp AND put it in a homepage they have made with kompozer.

This is a noob distro, remember? With everything you need preinstalled and served on a silver plate for you. And the developers have done a damn good job so far!

Then theres google earth and stellarium plus more games (0 A.D will be an awsome game but its still not even on the alpha stage).

+ more fonts (for graphics apps like gimp, inkscape and openoffice), gimp plugins, open source VST's and sound effects for LMMS and LOTS of drivers for sure!

And they dont need to fill up the entire 4.7 gb of a DVD. Might save some bandwith to cut a gb or 2. Atleast, now theres room, lots of it!

[den1m]

Call it the offline experience, for those who would like to be able to install a number of apps/games/drivers without internet connectivity.

Then, choose debian or opensuse. I think that market is too small anyway. Linux mint's strenght is its simplicity, and i think, if the software is not preinstalled, it should be left out of a DVD and leave it up to the users to download it like now. Use the free space for other things.

Instead, preinstall good apps that cover all aspects a regular user might encounter like those i suggested, instead of sending people to google, forums etc so they get fed up and go back to win.

[grimdestripador]

I think that market is too small anyway.

Perhaps they are under-represented on the internet and need someone to call it out. Perhaps this market exits, just the Linux croud is blind to see it, as we are all connected to the internet, And we can't comprehend a need for a stand-alone Desktop linux. Usually when its stand alone, we have it in a server/stable configuration.

perhaps your right about being the wrong distro for an offline experience.
To me, it all depends on what someone would call 'simple'. I highly agree that a few easy to learn apps that cover almost all aspects of a desktop computer is the best solution for "easy". I don't see how that conflicts with having the LTS verion of LM capable of a Desktop Suite install, with the apps some-what pre-configured not just installed. I dislike the idea of having multiple install bases. I do like the idea of having a common base, and different addon modules. Like the Desktop editing module, or the web editing module. It seems too many times when I "simply" download and install packages I have to end up on forums looking for to finish the installation (making symbolic links to folder which have different naming schemes is too common). These add-on modules should fit on the DVD and would be used to finish the "easy" install, such that It is configured correctly for most users, and not having to hunt in the forums for solutions. I find it backwards how in the same paragraph you contrast the need for simply downloading, and the use of the forums, when they are the pain of the "connected" linux mint experiance.

[vincent]

I wouldn't mind seeing the DVD containing more drivers for network cards or some other files/modules/programs that would boost hardware compatibility, but I disagree with pre-installing a bunch of other software that the average Linux user may never even use. Most people don't need a bunch of advanced image/audio editing programs or multimedia programs besides the one that is already pre-installed in Mint, which work just fine, and I don't want a bunch of games that I'm never going to play and which I'm probably going to end up uninstalling anyways to save space (not to mention that a lot of people dual-boot Windows for their gaming needs anyways).

There's a difference between being ready to use out-of-the-box and having maximum compatibility, and being just plain bloated. In addition, when it comes to extra software, everybody's going to have different requests, and nobody's going to be satisfied with the default software selection in the end; so why not just let the user install the programs they want themselves?

[Phaedrus]

That was my initial point. As Vincent says we all have different ideas on what software could/should be added and its simple to add what we need with package manager and software centre.

Taking advantage of the extra available space to include more drivers would be of greater benefit, giving more users a better out of box experience and furthering Mints reputation as an "it just works" distro.

[turkka]

Most people don't need a bunch of advanced image/audio editing programs or multimedia programs besides the one that is already pre-installed in Mint, which work just fine, and I don't want a bunch of games that I'm never going to play and which I'm probably going to end up uninstalling anyways to save space (not to mention that a lot of people dual-boot Windows for their gaming needs anyways).

Well that could be solved by that the user could choose which programs he/she would like to install. Hardware drivers could be included too and installed as default drivers by probing the hardware (or of course letting user choose should the probing go wrong, which seemed to be the case in Sabayon Linux...).

Then the DVD could be used as a local repository, could be easier for the user to install from disc than over the net in the first place.

And on dvd there should be every home-brew tricks and stuff to get 3g devices working without some other network connection...
(Though I understand thats going to be in Isadora final version already).

[grimdestripador]

It looks like at least one member is drinking my coolade

[den1m]

Most people don't need a bunch of advanced image/audio editing programs or multimedia programs besides the one that is already pre-installed in Mint, which work just fine, and I don't want a bunch of games that I'm never going to play and which I'm probably going to end up uninstalling anyways to save space (not to mention that a lot of people dual-boot Windows for their gaming needs anyways).

Well that could be solved by that the user could choose which programs he/she would like to install. Hardware drivers could be included too and installed as default drivers by probing the hardware (or of course letting user choose should the probing go wrong, which seemed to be the case in Sabayon Linux...).

Then the DVD could be used as a local repository, could be easier for the user to install from disc than over the net in the first place.

And on dvd there should be every home-brew tricks and stuff to get 3g devices working without some other network connection...
(Though I understand thats going to be in Isadora final version already).

Ive modified my list:

On CD release if possible:

- Pidgin-otr
- Parcellite or glipper

DVD: Openshot video editor, cheese webcam app, inkscape, google earth, TOR, gimp plugins and some extra brushes and more fonts.

Do people agree or disagree?

[vincent]

Meh, I'm still of the opinion that both the CD and DVD release should be the least bloated as possible. I'd say that maybe extra hardware drivers or the like could possibly be included on the DVD, but nothing more than that.

Either way, there's no way the Mint devs can satisfy everybody's software choices. In the end, we'll all have our own set of preferred software and applications, and mine will probably be quite different from yours.

[thx1138]

I share vincent's point of view. Don't add software that's available in any software manager, add drivers that make new users crying out WooHoo. Hardware detection is much more important than individual software preferences.

[Carl]

I share vincent's point of view. Don't add software that's available in any software manager, add drivers that make new users crying out WooHoo. Hardware detection is much more important than individual software preferences.

I'm also of this opinion we don't need extra bloatware if people wan't it then they can install it, I'd love to have the b43 drivers installed or even the Broadcom STA driver (don't know how possible that is...)

[piratesmack]

The older versions of Mint used to have deb packages for things like build-essential, bcmwl-kernel-source (broadcom-sta driver), and b43-fwcutter on the CD. You could use the CD as a local repository and install these packages without an internet connection. The deb packages were removed in Mint 9. I can understand if there wasn't enough room on the CD, but why aren't they included on the DVD? Installing software without an internet connection on Linux is difficult, especially on the Debian-based distros that like to split their packages into many pieces.

Personally, I love bloat, so I mostly use the distros with a ton of software preinstalled like Slackware and Knoppix (btw, the Knoppix DVD comes with most of the software people suggested in this thread)
Give me everything and I'll remove what I don't need (only if I need the disk space.)

Most people don't feel the same way as me, that's understandable.

[chiefjim]

Can the DVD be both things at once? By that I mean the Live Disc as we've enjoyed for some time. Then another section with drivers and applications the user could access as a repository. Would have been particularly handy for me when I needed Kmymoney right away but instead needed to wait for a wired connection in order to activate the BCM4318 WiFi.

[Carl]

Personally, I love bloat, so I mostly use the distros with a ton of software preinstalled like Slackware and Knoppix (btw, the Knoppix DVD comes with most of the software people suggested in this thread)
Give me everything and I'll remove what I don't need (only if I need the disk space.)

Most people don't feel the same way as me, that's understandable.

Then how about an options menu? say it will auto install tons of stuff a new user will need and then have a little option at the bottom that says something like "Advanced Settings" and allows you to choose what to install and other things like mint search (with a guilt trip message), fortune, maybe disable mint menu (no idea why...just fishing for ideas)

[piratesmack]

Personally, I love bloat, so I mostly use the distros with a ton of software preinstalled like Slackware and Knoppix (btw, the Knoppix DVD comes with most of the software people suggested in this thread)
Give me everything and I'll remove what I don't need (only if I need the disk space.)

Most people don't feel the same way as me, that's understandable.

Then how about an options menu? say it will auto install tons of stuff a new user will need and then have a little option at the bottom that says something like "Advanced Settings" and allows you to choose what to install and other things like mint search (with a guilt trip message), fortune, maybe disable mint menu (no idea why...just fishing for ideas)

I kind of like the idea of keeping the live dvd and installed system the same, but include a local apt repository on the dvd with drivers and popular software.