First time user Install 18.2 - Not Fun [SOLVED]

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Aoresteen
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Re: First time user Install 18.2 - Not Fun [SOLVED]

Postby Aoresteen » Tue Oct 10, 2017 12:49 pm

PoetApe wrote:With regards to your monitor size, the release notes (https://linuxmint.com/rel_sonya_cinnamon.php) for the current version do note that this can happen and also mention a simple solution (hold ALT to move the window); did you try that out by any chance?


Thanks. I did try the ALT key (and a lot of others) Did not work. It would only move the screen left to right a bit. There was a slight up & down movement but the continue button was never exposed.

I also read the Cinnamon 18 user guide (.PDF). https://www.linuxmint.com/documentation ... h_18.0.pdf

Nothing is mentioned in it as to screen size needed for installation (page 13 onward).

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Re: First time user Install 18.2 - Not Fun [SOLVED]

Postby Moem » Tue Oct 10, 2017 1:25 pm

The way to do it is to hold the ALT key and then drag the window with your mouse, by grabbing it anywhere. Is that what you tried?
Image

If your issue is solved, kindly indicate that by editing the first post in the topic, and adding [SOLVED] to the title. Thanks!

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Re: First time user Install 18.2 - Not Fun [SOLVED]

Postby Aoresteen » Tue Oct 10, 2017 1:52 pm

jglen490 wrote:1) Apology accepted.


Thank you.


jglen490 wrote: 2) Everyone is entitled to an opinion. An educated opinion is more valuable. The installer places the Grub loader data exactly where it is told to do so. The installer will select a default; that being the MBR of the first detected drive. You can tell it to install wherever you want it to go, but must do so in the correct input box in the Mint installer.


Well, you are implying that my opinion is not valuable. Fine, but you don't know my background as I haven't revealed it as I don't think it's necessary to do so. If you really want to know my credentials send me a PM and I will tell you. The issue is with the installer. I did not see an option where to tell the installer to place the boot code. If I missed it (and that is very possible) please post a screen shot from the installer showing where I should have specified where the boot code should go. Not only will it help me, it will help other new users not make the same mistake that I might have done.

jglen490 wrote:3) You just said that the boot loader was installed on the IDE drive, and it booted from there. Why would that be weird?


It's very weird as I specified that the Mint installer was to use the SATA drive and nowhere else. I wanted the IDE drive left alone. How was I to know that Mint would treat the boot code differently from the main O/S code? If that is normal for Mint then there should be a separate install screen with options for placing the boot code on different drives.

jglen490 wrote: 4) As stated here and by others, it put the boot loader exactly where it was told to - even if that wasn't your intent.


I believe I never told the installer *WHERE* to place the boot code. Perhaps I'm wrong but the installer made it's own decision to place the boot code on the first drive that it found - without asking me if it was ok. If this is the case then I maintain that this logic is wrong. If the installer is going to place code on a different drive that what it was told to use, then it should *ASK* if it's OK to put it on a different drive.

jglen490 wrote: 5) I have installed Slackware a long time ago via the command line. A tremendous PITA. I've used a GUI of some sort and the only screw ups have been because I didn't pay attention to what was in front of me. But I did try again, and I did ask for help, until I got it right.


I understand and agree. I just don't know where the installer placed the boot code location option in front of me and I missed it. Where is it?


jglen490 wrote: 7) Double comment. It has worked fine on an awful lot of platforms until it you tried it. Unless there was a problem with burning the .iso or with the actual .iso download, it works all the time. Possible that the .iso didn't checkout in either case or both cases. Try running sha256 against the downlaod and against the install medium. The instructions were on the download page.


I did check the .iso as stated on the download page. I use the Windows app HashCalc to check the iso;' the SHA256 values matched. The iso I used is a good iso. As to my platform being an outsider, I can't comment but I don't think it is unique by any measure. If it is then I'd be happy to test new versions on the Mint installer.


jglen490 wrote: 8) The first time is usually painful for a lot of people. Ask for help instead thumping your chest and blaming Mint.


I apologize for the chest thumping as you characterize it. My expectations were very high given the reputation that Mint has and it was version 18.2. Had it been version 1.0.0 my expectations would have been a lot lower.

jglen490 wrote: 9) That's a decent spec on your Mint machine. very much like my Kubuntu desktop, and a step or so above my Toshiba Mint laptop. Both of which run Linux smoothly.


Thank you. My installation of Mint 18.2 is running very smoothly and I have started the migration process. Some things still have me worried such as SCSI devices, my Dymo label printer, Canon scanner ect.

jglen490 wrote: Bottom line, if this is your first run at Linux, don't be surprised - or thrown - by the newness. We've all been there. Once you've done it successfully, it's an easy process.


Thank you - that is good advice.

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Re: First time user Install 18.2 - Not Fun [SOLVED]

Postby Moem » Tue Oct 10, 2017 2:05 pm

During the installation, did you see a screen that looked a bit like this screenshot?

Image

The dropdown list where you choose the location for the boot loader is at the bottom of the screen, just above the buttons [Quit] [Back] [Install Now].
Image

If your issue is solved, kindly indicate that by editing the first post in the topic, and adding [SOLVED] to the title. Thanks!

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Re: First time user Install 18.2 - Not Fun [SOLVED]

Postby Aoresteen » Tue Oct 10, 2017 4:50 pm

Moem wrote:During the installation, did you see a screen that looked a bit like this screenshot?

Image

The dropdown list where you choose the location for the boot loader is at the bottom of the screen, just above the buttons [Quit] [Back] [Install Now].



I honestly do not not remember the screens from the first instalation. If it is there then I must have missed it. The 2nd time I did the installation I had only one drive in the computer so the only possible drive was the SATA drive.


Is it safe to load the iso CD again to check but actually not make any changes?

Thanks!

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Re: First time user Install 18.2 - Not Fun [SOLVED]

Postby jimallyn » Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:23 pm

Moem wrote:The dropdown list where you choose the location for the boot loader is at the bottom of the screen, just above the buttons [Quit] [Back] [Install Now].

Well, I just learned something. I also didn't notice that dropdown list, and have just always assumed the installer would know how to do it. (And it always has.) But I think most of the installs I have done were on machines with only one hard drive.
Image

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Re: First time user Install 18.2 - Not Fun [SOLVED]

Postby bob466 » Tue Oct 10, 2017 8:45 pm

Moem wrote:
The dropdown list where you choose the location for the boot loader is at the bottom of the screen, just above the buttons [Quit] [Back] [Install Now].


An even easier way...only have the HDD that you want to install the OS plugged into the Motherboard...works every time. Years ago I tried to install Windoze XP...kept getting a message on a black screen saying "Can't find the HDD" or something like that as it's been many years now.

Being no expert took a little while to realize that I should only have the HDD I'm going to install the OS connected...so I disconnected my storage HDD and it worked fine...have done the same ever since.

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Re: First time user Install 18.2 - Not Fun [SOLVED]

Postby MrEen » Tue Oct 10, 2017 8:51 pm

bob466 wrote:An even easier way...only have the HDD that you want to install the OS plugged into the Motherboard...works every time. Years ago I tried to install Windoze XP...kept getting a message on a black screen saying "Can't find the HDD" or something like that as it's been many years now.

Being no expert took a little while to realize that I should only have the HDD I'm going to install the OS connected...so I disconnected my storage HDD and it worked fine...have done the same ever since.


When I first tried to install alongside XP, the device for bootloader defaulted to the live USB (and no option to change it.) Once I shrunk XP to make room for Mint, it worked properly.

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Re: First time user Install 18.2 - Not Fun [SOLVED]

Postby jglen490 » Tue Oct 10, 2017 11:54 pm

Aoresteen wrote:
jglen490 wrote:1) Apology accepted.


Thank you.


jglen490 wrote: 2) Everyone is entitled to an opinion. An educated opinion is more valuable. The installer places the Grub loader data exactly where it is told to do so. The installer will select a default; that being the MBR of the first detected drive. You can tell it to install wherever you want it to go, but must do so in the correct input box in the Mint installer.


Well, you are implying that my opinion is not valuable. Fine, but you don't know my background as I haven't revealed it as I don't think it's necessary to do so. If you really want to know my credentials send me a PM and I will tell you. The issue is with the installer. I did not see an option where to tell the installer to place the boot code. If I missed it (and that is very possible) please post a screen shot from the installer showing where I should have specified where the boot code should go. Not only will it help me, it will help other new users not make the same mistake that I might have done.

jglen490 wrote:3) You just said that the boot loader was installed on the IDE drive, and it booted from there. Why would that be weird?


It's very weird as I specified that the Mint installer was to use the SATA drive and nowhere else. I wanted the IDE drive left alone. How was I to know that Mint would treat the boot code differently from the main O/S code? If that is normal for Mint then there should be a separate install screen with options for placing the boot code on different drives.

jglen490 wrote: 4) As stated here and by others, it put the boot loader exactly where it was told to - even if that wasn't your intent.


I believe I never told the installer *WHERE* to place the boot code. Perhaps I'm wrong but the installer made it's own decision to place the boot code on the first drive that it found - without asking me if it was ok. If this is the case then I maintain that this logic is wrong. If the installer is going to place code on a different drive that what it was told to use, then it should *ASK* if it's OK to put it on a different drive.

jglen490 wrote: 5) I have installed Slackware a long time ago via the command line. A tremendous PITA. I've used a GUI of some sort and the only screw ups have been because I didn't pay attention to what was in front of me. But I did try again, and I did ask for help, until I got it right.


I understand and agree. I just don't know where the installer placed the boot code location option in front of me and I missed it. Where is it?


jglen490 wrote: 7) Double comment. It has worked fine on an awful lot of platforms until it you tried it. Unless there was a problem with burning the .iso or with the actual .iso download, it works all the time. Possible that the .iso didn't checkout in either case or both cases. Try running sha256 against the downlaod and against the install medium. The instructions were on the download page.


I did check the .iso as stated on the download page. I use the Windows app HashCalc to check the iso;' the SHA256 values matched. The iso I used is a good iso. As to my platform being an outsider, I can't comment but I don't think it is unique by any measure. If it is then I'd be happy to test new versions on the Mint installer.


jglen490 wrote: 8) The first time is usually painful for a lot of people. Ask for help instead thumping your chest and blaming Mint.


I apologize for the chest thumping as you characterize it. My expectations were very high given the reputation that Mint has and it was version 18.2. Had it been version 1.0.0 my expectations would have been a lot lower.

jglen490 wrote: 9) That's a decent spec on your Mint machine. very much like my Kubuntu desktop, and a step or so above my Toshiba Mint laptop. Both of which run Linux smoothly.


Thank you. My installation of Mint 18.2 is running very smoothly and I have started the migration process. Some things still have me worried such as SCSI devices, my Dymo label printer, Canon scanner ect.

jglen490 wrote: Bottom line, if this is your first run at Linux, don't be surprised - or thrown - by the newness. We've all been there. Once you've done it successfully, it's an easy process.


Thank you - that is good advice.


Good, now we have a conversation!

As you will find out there are many ways that Linux works really well, and ways that are not so great. Usually Linux has a driver readily available for a given peripheral, and honestly sometimes not. As for SCSI devices, or very often devices that are interpreted and handled as SCSI they are usually pretty easy. SCSI is an old interface, well proven, and been used for a long time. Some devices have more than one way to be viewed and managed. HP printers for instance. Out of the box, most Linux distros handle HP printers quite well, but at the same time HP provides a (free) management application - or more correctly "applications". Canon and Epson printers are less broadly supported, but improving. Specialized things like label printers, I personally don't know, but I bet someone has experience with such things. At the worst, Google is your friend.

I've found that over time Linux has done better at simply recognizing, having, and installing drivers for a wide variety of peripherals. As you will also find, since most distros are available online as downloadable .iso files. Trust but verify. Look for the MD5, SHA256, or SHA512 sum value somewhere in the vicinity of the download. After the download run the appropriate sum generator against the .iso and compare to the published value. If any digit is wrong, the download failed. Don't waste your time, just download it again. You might be able to fix a bad download during install, but don't count on it. To be double sure check the CD/DVD after burning the .iso image, the sum should be the same. Some burners may produce a sum for you.

look for basic install instructions, selection of file system(s), use of swap space, formatting drives ,etc. And ask questions at the community forum that best fits your distro, although there are some really good general Linux sites out there. Someone will give you an answer. Again, trust but verify! Linux will give lots of choices for how you do your work and your fun.

And welcome to Linux and Linux Mint ...
I feel more like I do than I did when I got here.
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Re: First time user Install 18.2 - Not Fun [SOLVED]

Postby JerryF » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:03 am

Aoresteen wrote:Is it safe to load the iso CD again to check but actually not make any changes?

Thanks!

Yes, it is safe to do that. That screen is one step before the installation. If your machine is the way it was when you first tried to install Mint, you'll find that the bootloader option will give you a choice on which drive you want.
Don't forget to edit your original post and add [SOLVED] to the beginning of the Subject line if your problem has been fixed.
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