Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

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Joe76000

Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Joe76000 »

Hello,

I have an issue not being able to upgrade the Kernel of my Mint 17.2!

Few months ago, my fresh install of Mint 17.1 Cinnamon 64-b was okay with Kernel 3.13.0-37-generic and nVidia driver 331.113.
Few days ago, successful upgrade to Mint 17.2 FR Cinnamon 64-b using this article: How to upgrade to Linux Mint 17.2.
* Additional info*
- Although Linux Mint 17.2 features a newer kernel, this upgrade does not change the kernel on your behalf. This is a decision only you should take. Should you decide to upgrade to 17.2’s recommended kernel you can do so by applying the “linux-kernel-generic” update, post-upgrade.
- Your grub menu won’t be automatically updated on your behalf. After you rebooted the computer, you can trigger that update with the following command: “sudo update-grub”.

So, few hours ago, seems to be a "successful" upgrade of the kernel to v.3.16.0-38-generic, but in fact after a reboot and a new sudo update-grub, still and only the old (current) version of the kernel is available!
I have checked in mintUpdate (4.9.3), View - Linux Kernel and v.3.16.0-38-generic (recommended) it's well installed but not charged!

So, I ran once again:

Code: Select all

joe@joe-lmdv8 ~ $ sudo update-grub
[sudo] password for joe: 
Création du fichier de configuration GRUB…
Found linux image: /boot/vmlinuz-3.16.0-38-generic
Found initrd image: /boot/initrd.img-3.16.0-38-generic
Found linux image: /boot/vmlinuz-3.13.0-37-generic
Found initrd image: /boot/initrd.img-3.13.0-37-generic
Found memtest86+ image: /boot/memtest86+.elf
Found memtest86+ image: /boot/memtest86+.bin
  No volume groups found
Windows 8 (loader) trouvé sur /dev/sda1
Windows 7 (loader) trouvé sur /dev/sda2
Ubuntu 14.04.2 LTS (14.04) trouvé sur /dev/sda5
fait
joe@joe-lmdv8 ~ $
BUT after a new reboot, I'am still stuck with only the old kernel v.3.13.0-37-generic!

What is wrong? Any idea?
Thanks. Joe

Laurent85
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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Laurent85 »

Grub update command output looks fine. Grub should automatically select new kernel by default. Can you open a terminal to check running kernel :

Code: Select all

uname -a
Image

Joe76000

Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Joe76000 »

Hello,

I'm answering to myself! I have a solution to my kernel upgrade issue, but not yet the explanation of why!

SOLUTION
As I have on this machine a Quad boot: Ubuntu 14.04.1 + Mint 17.2 Cinnamon + W7 + W8.1 - all 4 in 64-b, I decided to run the command sudo update-grub within Ubuntu. And guess what, after rebooting and login into Mint, I was under kernel v.3.16.0-38-generic. Yes! :D

This is now also confirmed by mintUpdate (4.9.3), View - Linux Kernel:
- v.3.16.0-38-generic charged + recommended + installed, and
- v.3.13.0-37-generic (only) installed,
which was the opposite until now.

So, for the time being, I can just comment: sudo update-grub command is not working properly under Mint 17.2. Merde! :!:

What is very strange, is that Mint is based on Ubuntu, isn't it? So, we can expect the same good behavior of Mint than we are used to have with Ubuntu. This is not the case here. What a big shame!

This is an area where the Mint distro must mandatory improve its behavior...

Joe76000

Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Joe76000 »

Laurent85 wrote:Grub update command output looks fine. Grub should automatically select new kernel by default. Can you open a terminal to check running kernel :

Code: Select all

uname -a
Hello Laurent,

No, Grub updater, in my case, is not doing its job properly! It seems, it's not able to handle properly a multi-boot, even with its parent!
Before finding my solution, the command you mentioned gave me v.3.13.0-37-generic 64-b and not the expected newer kernel version!

After upgrading from Mint 17.1 to 17.2, I have already noticed this strange behavior from the Linux Mint 17.1 entry in GRUB2 which was not updated to Linux Mint 17.2 even after several sudo update-grub and reboots.

The only one solution, I found, was to sudo update-grub but within Ubuntu for fixing it. So, my idea for updating once again Mint's Grub2 from within Ubuntu game from that.

It's very strange, yes indeed! But is like that on my quad boot machine!

Laurent85
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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Laurent85 »

In fact nothing working bad in this case. Actually it's a multiboot issue. Grub settings from Ubuntu system is installed on first sector of your drive, and that's the one loaded on each boot. When you update grub within Ubuntu system, it probes for any other installed system and adds a menu entry accordingly. By default it selects the most recent kernel installed in probed systems, the list is stored in Ubuntu system.

When you update grub in Linux Mint it does the same job and update its list of bootable systems accordingly, the list is stored in Linux Mint. So you expect updated grub to launch your new kernel. But Linux Mint grub settings are never loaded on boot, only Ubuntu grub settings are loaded.

So when you install a new kernel in LM you need to update grub settings loaded on boot. In your case master grub settings are handled by Ubuntu, your new kernel won't be taken into account until Ubuntu grub settings are updated.
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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Hendrick »

Joe,

I once had the same issue when running Mint13 and Mint17 on my pc. It took me not long to found out
that you cannot have two captains on one ship, so to speak. One of the distributions has to be in charge
for updating the Grub boot manager. Laurent85 is absolutely right concerning this matter.

Hendrick
Mint 19.3 Xfce

Joe76000

Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Joe76000 »

Laurent85 wrote:In fact nothing working bad in this case. Actually it's a multiboot issue. Grub settings from Ubuntu system is installed on first sector of your drive, and that's the one loaded on each boot. When you update grub within Ubuntu system, it probes for any other installed system and adds a menu entry accordingly. By default it selects the most recent kernel installed in probed systems, the list is stored in Ubuntu system.

When you update grub in Linux Mint it does the same job and update its list of bootable systems accordingly, the list is stored in Linux Mint. So you expect updated grub to launch your new kernel. But Linux Mint grub settings are never loaded on boot, only Ubuntu grub settings are loaded.

So when you install a new kernel in LM you need to update grub settings loaded on boot. In your case master grub settings are handled by Ubuntu, your new kernel won't be taken into account until Ubuntu grub settings are updated.
Hello Laurent,
Thanks for your reply but I don't share at all your analysis which is purely theoretical. And I will try explain why based on facts.

1. Before on the same machine, still with a quad boot, I was running Ubuntu 14.04 + Kubuntu 15.04 + W7 + W8.1.
And I never had issue when either Ubuntu or Kubuntu where updating their kernels or I was forcing the Grub update manually.
If Ubuntu or I was updating kernel, the right result was in Grub2 -> Ubuntu 1st entry with the right kernel and so on.
If Kubuntu or I was updating kernel, the right result was in Grub2 -> Kubuntu 1st entry with the right kernel and so on.
If I wanted to easily - quickly change who will be 1st in Grub2, a little Grub update in the given distro, and the given Linux distro went 1st.

This is to say your statement is not correct:
So when you install a new kernel in LM you need to update grub settings loaded on boot. In your case master grub settings are handled by Ubuntu, your new kernel won't be taken into account until Ubuntu grub settings are updated.


NO and no and no. There is NO Master GRUB! There is only ONE GRUB2 boot-loader! And the last Linux distro who writes its Grub is overwriting either its previous Grub or the Grub of the other distro. So, there is ONLY ONE Grub2 boot-loader with all the appropriate entries - settings at a given time.

2. Same PC, Mint 17.1 - upgraded to 17.2 - was replacing Kubuntu 15.04 still with a quad boot environment, 2 Linux + 2 W).
Its GRUB was written in the MBR at the root of my main HDD as it was the case for Kubuntu. My laptop is with a Legacy BIOS.
But, the behavior of Mint 17.2 when upgrading kernel is completely different, NO Grub update even if forced !

So, this is NOT an issue with Multi-Boot, but as I already wrote it, with how MINT, at least 17.2, is handling GRUB2 updates, badly !

I will continue to work on and I will find out the right explanation with the right fix based on facts and not on assumptions.

Have a nice day. Cheers. Joe

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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Laurent85 »

My statements are not theoretical. That's the way grub boot loader works.

According to your previous post, active grub loader was installed from Ubuntu system.
The only one solution, I found, was to sudo update-grub but within Ubuntu for fixing it
It was not a fix, that's the normal update for your setup.

So when you update grub within LM, only LM grub.cfg file is updated, but LM grub.cfg file is not loaded on boot. The one loaded is Ubuntu grub.cfg file.
Last edited by Laurent85 on Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joe76000

Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Joe76000 »

Laurent85 wrote:My statements are not theoretical. That's the way grub loader works.

According to your previous post, active grub loader was installed from Ubuntu system.
The only one solution, I found, was to sudo update-grub but within Ubuntu for fixing it
It was not a fix, that's the normal update for your setup.

So when you update grub within LM, only LM grub.cfg file is updated, but LM grub.cfg file is not loaded on boot. The one loaded is Ubuntu grub.cfg file.
Hello Laurent,

Just read again your latest answer and carefully all my messages to discover that your understanding is not at the right level. You are mixing what you are saying from one message to an other one.
This discussion is endless and brings nothing at all, just more confusion in our exchanges. Waste of time.

So, let's stop here as both of us will remain with our believes!

I'm seeing the Father Christmas, so I have to leave you... :wink:
Cheers. Joe

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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Hendrick »

Joe,

This is not a paid Helpdesk. You might want to show a little bit more respect and gratitude
for the volunteers who are willing and able to help you out.

Hendrick
Mint 19.3 Xfce

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Pjotr
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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Pjotr »

As Hendrick says. That's definitely no way to reward the time and effort Laurent has spent on this. :shock:

Moreover, Laurent gave good advice; his diagnosis is absolutely right and so is the cure he advises.
Tip: 10 things to do after installing Linux Mint 20 Ulyana
Keep your Linux Mint healthy: Avoid these 10 fatal mistakes
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Joe76000

Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Joe76000 »

Hello Guys,

I do believe you are mixing the things. I'm only talking about this topic; i.e. "Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!" and nothing else. So, don't put on my back whatever else regarding Laurent's contribution to this forum. This is your personal bad readings but not mine.

On my side, I don't like too how this topic has evolved, as already written. So, the best for me is just to forget this forum. I can leave without as you without me of course, not doubt about.

Good continuation.
Cheers. Joe.

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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by smithst »

I find myself in a similar position to Joe. I just updated from 17.1 to 17.2 today. Using the instructions provided on the LM blog page. All went well, I rebooted then I ran "sudo update-grub" from terminal and the screen output was similar to Joe's but only listed the original kernal 3.13.0-37. I ran the suggested "uname -a" in terminal and got the following output:

steven@steven-Dimension-4700 ~ $ uname -a
Linux steven-Dimension-4700 3.13.0-37-generic #64-Ubuntu SMP Mon Sep 22 21:30:01 UTC 2014 i686 i686 i686 GNU/Linux
steven@steven-Dimension-4700 ~ $

I checked in update manager and it shows the same 3.13.0-37 kernal installed. Is it possible to update the kernal from the update manager, sorry I'm a newbie so the warnings in Update Manager about updating kernals tends to scare me off.

Thanks, Steve

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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Pjotr »

smithst wrote:Is it possible to update the kernal from the update manager, sorry I'm a newbie so the warnings in Update Manager about updating kernals tends to scare me off.
Yes, it is possible:
https://sites.google.com/site/easylinux ... el-updates
(item 3, right column)

But why do you want a newer kernel at all? Are you having a problem, and do you think that a newer kernel will perhaps fix that problem?
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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Hendrick »

Joe,

It's clear that you haven't got a clue what this forum is all about. Perhaps it's indeed better for you
to try to find your luck someplace else. See you in a next life...

Hendrick / Amsterdam
Mint 19.3 Xfce

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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by kalomint »

Let me just add to the discussion... I also have issues with the 17.2 Recommended kernel. So some reason my laptop Acer 4820tg does not like 3.16. As soon as it boots, the mouse works for like 15 seconds and then freezes, same with the keyboard. So you cannot do anything but cold reboot. I then decided I will stick to the 17.1 kernel, booted holding the shift, selected 3.13.0.37 and had my Mint 17.2 fully operational. I then went to update manager and uninstalled 13.16. It is a pity I cannot use the new kernel, but probably I am not missing anything. The laptop works superb with 3.13.

Thanks to fellow mint forum members!

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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by Pjotr »

kalomint wrote:It is a pity I cannot use the new kernel, but probably I am not missing anything. The laptop works superb with 3.13.
No worries, when everything works well you're not missing anything. It's the applications that matter, not the system kernel. :)
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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by smithst »

Pjotr, Thanks for the input. I wanted to update to the recommended kernal for 17.2. I followed your links and everything went well. I also bookmarked the site for future reference, I appreciate your help. Again thank you.

Steve

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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by blue_bullet »

Hendrick wrote:Joe,

I once had the same issue when running Mint13 and Mint17 on my pc. It took me not long to found out
that you cannot have two captains on one ship, so to speak. One of the distributions has to be in charge
for updating the Grub boot manager. Laurent85 is absolutely right concerning this matter.

Hendrick
Late to the dance again as usual. Hendrick, thanks for your post. I have a multiboot system with Petra (LM16 KDE) as the 1st choice in the grub menu. I also have LM17.1 KDE (now LM 17.2 KDE), and Windows 8. Today I upgraded from 17.1 to 17.2 quite smoothly I might add. I installed the recommended kernel for 17.2, rebooted, and did the sudo update-grub, rebooted. Nothing changed in the grub menu. I did boot to 17.2 but the menu said 17.1 and uname -a said I was still at the old kernel. I had to log in to LM16 and issue the sudo update-grub. Next I rebooted into 17.2 (appeared correctly in the grub menu now) and uname -a shows the new recommended kernel.

Thanks for your tip. I now need to get rid of LM16 since I no longer use it. Can you tell me how you safely eliminated LM13 when running it with LM17? I want LM17.2 to be the captain.

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Re: Mint 17.2 Kernel upgrade issue!

Post by blue_bullet »

smithst wrote:Pjotr, Thanks for the input. I wanted to update to the recommended kernal for 17.2. I followed your links and everything went well. I also bookmarked the site for future reference, I appreciate your help. Again thank you.

Steve
I used this link as well. Thank you Pjotr.

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