Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

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neversaynever
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Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by neversaynever » Fri Feb 09, 2018 11:06 am

Hi. I’m a “newbie” in Linux.
In autumn 2016 I tried to install Linux Mint 18 64-bit and, alternatively Ubuntu 16.04 64-bit on a PC Acer TravelMate 8573, with BIOS v1.31.
I rightly created either a USB-key or a dvd live. The prove of the correctness is that they worked on an older PC Acer TravelMate 6592 (same BIOS versione v1.31): booting occurred regularly and, after few minutes, the screen showed the menu with the choice between ‘Try Linux’ or ‘Install Linux’.
Unfortunately, when I tried to boot my TM8573 by the 64-bit version of dvd live or USB-key, after one blink of the prompt, the screen remained total black … “forever”; no beeps, no Grub visualisation, nothing. It didn’t boot and the only thing I could do was clicking on “Power-off” key.
Nobody was able to advise me how to solve the problem.
The settings of the BIOS of TM6592 and the BIOS of TM8573 were (and are) the same. But TM8573 doesn’t boot.
I bypassed the problem because I found that on TM8573 I could install the 32-bit version. So now I’m using Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 32-bit.
Meltdown-Spectre brushed-up the problem because no patches exist for 32-bit version yet, and I’d like to install definetly LM 18.0 64-bit version.
On the web I found these two threads (thanks also to “michael louwe”):
https://www.linuxquestions.org/question ... 175496131/
https://askubuntu.com/questions/469199/ ... -wont-boot
According to those links, it could be a Linux kernel bug present from kernel 3.13 onward (= LM 17.x onward). Maybe, my Acer TravelMate 8573T cannot run 64bit Linux due to the kernel bug.
It would seem like it tried to boot in UEFI mode … But I don’t have UEFI: I have BIOS instead.
Is there anybody that may help me to find a solution (suitable for a newbie)?
Thanks in advance.

My OS: Windows 7 Pro Sp1 64-bit + LM 18.0 Cinnamon 32-bit (on a bootable extern HD)
My Hardware:
Acer TravelMate 8573TG - Intel Core i7-2640M CPU@2.80GHz RAM 4GB
Graphics controller: "UMA Integrated in Intel Core" + "discrete nVidia GeForce GT540M (optimus)"
WLAN: "Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6205, 802.11/a/b/g/n" + "Acer InviLink Nplify 802.11/b/g/n"
BIOS: Phoenix v1.31
The only differences between BIOS of TM8573 and TM6592 are:
- on “Main” form of TM8573 there is “ the “Graphic mode” set on "Switchable" (by default, only alternative: "Discrete").
- CD/DVD reader: "ATAPI MATSHITADVD - RAM UJ&A 2AS" in TM8573, "ATAPI HL-DT-ST DVDRAM GSA-T20N-(PS)" in TM6592
- Hard Disk: "TOSHIBA MK7559GSXP" in TM8573, "WDC WD2500BEVS-22UST0-(S1)" in TM6592.
SATA Mode “AHCI” for both.

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michael louwe
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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by michael louwe » Fri Feb 09, 2018 12:43 pm

@ neversaynever, .......
neversaynever wrote:...
.
Try the fix at this German link ... https://translate.google.com/translate? ... stecken%2F , ie set boot option to acpi=off

... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/KernelBootParameters

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BootOptions (other boot options you can try)

neversaynever
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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by neversaynever » Fri Feb 09, 2018 3:35 pm

@ michael louwe, ....
michael louwe wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 12:43 pm

Try the fix at this German link ... https://translate.google.com/translate? ... stecken%2F , ie set boot option to acpi=off

... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/KernelBootParameters

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BootOptions (other boot options you can try)
Thanks Michael for your advise.
Unfortunately I have no possibility to set boot options, simply because i can't see the screen of Grub, not even if I press the F2 key. I can't do anything.
With Ubuntu i know that "... as the CD boots, the user can gain access to the advanced page and its options by pressing any key when the small logo appears at the bottom of your screen: ..." . No logo for me. Absolutely nothing. I could do it for TM6592, but not for TM8573.
Sorry

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michael louwe
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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by michael louwe » Fri Feb 09, 2018 3:47 pm

@ neversaynever, .......
neversaynever wrote:...
.
Try to access the Grub menu by repeatedly pressing the SHIFT or ESC key during startup.

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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by neversaynever » Sat Feb 10, 2018 9:11 am

@ michael louwe, ...
michael louwe wrote...
Try to access the Grub menu by repeatedly pressing the SHIFT or ESC key during startup.
Sorry Michael, yesterday evening I was wrong: I meant ..."Shift key" and not "F2 key". But also with Esc it doesn't work.
A very absurd proposal suggested by my incompetence an dejection (don't laugh too loud): apparently, the only macro-difference between 32-bit live CD and 64-bit live CD is the presence of UEFI directory. Is this directory essential (I don't have UEFI)?

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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by michael louwe » Sat Feb 10, 2018 1:46 pm

@ neversaynever, .......
neversaynever wrote:...
.
From this link ... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+sour ... bug/519123 , seems like a kernel bug introduced by Debian. Try a non-Debian-based Live DVD/USB, eg Slax puppy.

fabien85
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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by fabien85 » Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:08 pm

neversaynever wrote:
Sat Feb 10, 2018 9:11 am
apparently, the only macro-difference between 32-bit live CD and 64-bit live CD is the presence of UEFI directory. Is this directory essential (I don't have UEFI)?
It's only apparent. You will indeed have the same filenames between the content of a 32-bit and a 64-bit live USBs, but the file content will be different. For example you could compare the size of the kernels (/casper/vmlinuz) and they should be different.

A workaround with a USB stick (wont work with a DVD since you cant modify it after burning) :
What you can do is to tweak the live USB by hand : after burning it, unplug it and plug it back and it should appear on the desktop, open it and go to /boot/grub, open grub.cfg with a text editor, you will see something like this

Code: Select all

if loadfont /boot/grub/font.pf2 ; then
	set gfxmode=auto
	insmod efi_gop
	insmod efi_uga
	insmod gfxterm
	terminal_output gfxterm
fi

set menu_color_normal=white/black
set menu_color_highlight=black/light-gray

menuentry "Start Linux Mint 18.2 Cinnamon 64-bit" {
	set gfxpayload=keep
	linux	/casper/vmlinuz  file=/cdrom/preseed/linuxmint.seed boot=casper iso-scan/filename=${iso_path} quiet splash --
	initrd	/casper/initrd.lz
}
menuentry "Start Linux Mint 18.2 Cinnamon 64-bit (compatibility mode)" {
	linux	/casper/vmlinuz  file=/cdrom/preseed/linuxmint.seed boot=casper xforcevesa iso-scan/filename=${iso_path} ramdisk_size=1048576 root=/dev/ram rw noapic noacpi nosplash irqpoll --
	initrd	/casper/initrd.lz
}
menuentry "OEM install (for manufacturers)" {
	set gfxpayload=keep
	linux	/casper/vmlinuz  file=/cdrom/preseed/linuxmint.seed oem-config/enable=true only-ubiquity boot=casper iso-scan/filename=${iso_path} quiet splash --
	initrd	/casper/initrd.lz
}
menuentry "Check the integrity of the medium" {
	linux	/casper/vmlinuz  boot=casper integrity-check iso-scan/filename=${iso_path} quiet splash --
	initrd	/casper/initrd.lz
}
(here it's an example with CInnamon 18.2)
In the first menuentry, replace "quiet splash" by "acpi=off"

Now it will also boot verbosely, so if there is any other error you should see it.

neversaynever
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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by neversaynever » Sun Feb 11, 2018 3:21 pm

@ michael louwe, ...
michael louwe wrote:
Sat Feb 10, 2018 1:46 pm
From this link ... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+sour ... bug/519123 , seems like a kernel bug introduced by Debian. Try a non-Debian-based Live DVD/USB, eg Slax puppy.
It could be a bug, but the behavior is quite different from mine. It boots and the black screen is after booting. I don't boot instead.
However I'll look into the thread.
Thanks

@ fabien85, ...
fabien85 wrote:
Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:08 pm

A workaround with a USB stick (wont work with a DVD since you cant modify it after burning) :
What you can do is to tweak the live USB by hand : after burning it, unplug it and plug it back and it should appear on the desktop, open it and go to /boot/grub, open grub.cfg with a text editor, you will see something like this

Code: Select all

if loadfont /boot/grub/font.pf2 ; then
	set gfxmode=auto
	insmod efi_gop
	insmod efi_uga
	insmod gfxterm
	terminal_output gfxterm
fi

set menu_color_normal=white/black
set menu_color_highlight=black/light-gray

menuentry "Start Linux Mint 18.2 Cinnamon 64-bit" {
	set gfxpayload=keep
	linux	/casper/vmlinuz  file=/cdrom/preseed/linuxmint.seed boot=casper iso-scan/filename=${iso_path} quiet splash --
	initrd	/casper/initrd.lz
}
menuentry "Start Linux Mint 18.2 Cinnamon 64-bit (compatibility mode)" {
	linux	/casper/vmlinuz  file=/cdrom/preseed/linuxmint.seed boot=casper xforcevesa iso-scan/filename=${iso_path} ramdisk_size=1048576 root=/dev/ram rw noapic noacpi nosplash irqpoll --
	initrd	/casper/initrd.lz
}
menuentry "OEM install (for manufacturers)" {
	set gfxpayload=keep
	linux	/casper/vmlinuz  file=/cdrom/preseed/linuxmint.seed oem-config/enable=true only-ubiquity boot=casper iso-scan/filename=${iso_path} quiet splash --
	initrd	/casper/initrd.lz
}
menuentry "Check the integrity of the medium" {
	linux	/casper/vmlinuz  boot=casper integrity-check iso-scan/filename=${iso_path} quiet splash --
	initrd	/casper/initrd.lz
}
(here it's an example with CInnamon 18.2)
In the first menuentry, replace "quiet splash" by "acpi=off"

Now it will also boot verbosely, so if there is any other error you should see it.
Thankyou very much Fabien for your advise.
Sure I'll do it asap in the next week and I'll let you know.
Thanks

neversaynever
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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by neversaynever » Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:05 am

@ michael louwe, ...
@ fabien85, ...
neversaynever wrote:
Sun Feb 11, 2018 3:21 pm
fabien85 wrote:
Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:08 pm
..
A workaround with a USB stick (wont work with a DVD since you cant modify it after burning) :
Open /boot/grub/grub.cfg ... In the first menuentry, replace "quiet splash" by "acpi=off"
Now it will also boot verbosely, so if there is any other error you should see it.
Thankyou very much Fabien for your advise.
Sure I'll do it asap in the next week and I'll let you know.
Thanks
Hi 'fabien85' and 'michael louwe'.
I did the workaround of Fabien, but... without success.
I confirm that the PC doesn' boot; only a black screen (I also waited for twenty minutes to see if something happened). It means that Grub doesn't start and it's neither a Grub problem, nor any compatibility problem about driver. The problem is upstream ...
Maybe a bug ??
Is there something else that I can test tweaking the live USB ?
Is there someone else that can give me other tips or suggestions ?
Is there a possibility to install Linux Mint without live USB or CD ?
Thanks in advance

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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by michael louwe » Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:33 pm

@ neversaynever, .......
neversaynever wrote:...
.
Have you tried booting a non-Debian/Ubuntu-based Live Linux distro or a Live LM 16.?

Possibly, one of the Acer preinstalled apps/programs messes the BIOS firmware = has conflicts with the Linux kernel, eg the preinstalled Acer Pro Shield AV ... https://community.acer.com/en/discussio ... -uninstall (non-responsive-usb-ports-and-acer-pro-shield-install-and-uninstall)
https://translate.google.com/translate? ... rev=search

If so, the workaround is to clean reinstall Win 7 without all the Acer bloatware.

Others have tried the workaround by removing the internal hard-drive from the Acer TM8573, use another working computer to install LM on that hard-drive and then replug it back into the Acer TM8573.

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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by neversaynever » Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:06 pm

@ michael louwe,...
Hi Michael and thankyou for answering.
I have some preinstalled Acer programs and yes, this could be the reason-why. However I don't have ProSheld.
No, I didn't try to install a non-Debian/Ubuntu-based Live Linux: too time-consuming for a newbie like me.
But you gave me an interesting idea.
I could buy an external USB HD (WD MyPassport for example - 60,00€ for 1TB) and try to install Linux Mint 18.3 Cinnamon 64-bit on it, using Acer TM6592 where the Live version can boot. Then I'll plug the USB-HD in the TM8573 and I think that it should work.
I know I'll loose speed ... but it could be a low time-consuming and non-invasive workaround. On TM8573 I'll modify the boot-order in BIOS (USB fisrt) and I should have the problem solved, while waiting 1 or 2 years for a new PC.
Boot in Windows without USB HD and boot in Linux with USB HD plugged-in.
What do you think about that? Do you see contra-indications?
Alternatively I'll stick to 32-bit that, apart from Meltdown-Spectre problem, works very well. And, who knows, in some months we'll have the kernel patch also for Linux 32-bit systems ...

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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by michael louwe » Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:36 pm

@ neversaynever, .......
neversaynever wrote:...
.
Yes, the external USB HDD idea will likely work. Ensure that there are no proprietary drivers installed(for the initial install using TM6592), eg for graphics cards or Wifi, unless both laptops use the same device model.

For only US$30, I bought a used 160GB laptop hard-drive to put into a new external USB 2.0 HDD enclosure/casing for the install of LM 17.3 in Legacy BIOS mode. I had to use GParted to realign the disk/drive, ie by just repartitioning it to / or Root, Home and Swap. Realignment may not be needed for LM 18.x.
... For a large 1TB external USB HDD, separate /, Home and Swap partitions should be created.

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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by fabien85 » Wed Feb 14, 2018 5:37 pm

No, I didn't try to install a non-Debian/Ubuntu-based Live Linux: too time-consuming for a newbie like me.
Try fedora : https://getfedora.org/. It's exactly the same process as Ubuntu/Mint (i.e. burn to USB, boot the live USB and see whether you like it, then launch the graphical installer), but has a different package base.

For an external HD, I recommend using USB 3. USB 2 will work but it will be a bit slow.
Only thing is that it's not always practical to carry your laptop with a drive attached.

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Re: Linux Mint 18.0 Cinnamon 64-bit DVD Live (or USB-key) on Acer TM 8573: Black screen and no boot

Post by neversaynever » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:14 pm

Hi. It's a period that I don't have time to dedicate to my problem: so I'm to a stanstill.
However I noticed a thing that could be useful to experts.
As you know I have BIOS. So, when I launch my working 32-bit version of Linux Mint 18, I should expect to see the BIOS version of GRUB.
But, regarding Linux Mint documentation, I realised that the GRUB version I see on the screen is the EFI one ...
That is the reason why I said that "it would seem like it tried to boot in UEFI mode".
May this information be useful to understand more about my problem ?

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