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[SOLVED] how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2020 10:57 am
by sadhu
also, is it possible to remove systemd from lm19.3?

I have discovered that many of the annoyances Ive been experiencing, the most recent being the fact that /etc/resolv.conf keeps getting overwritten -- are the direct result of systemd 'balancing' or whatever it is said to do.

1. How do I remove systemd from lm19.3?
2. Or how can I install lm20 without it

Or must I go revert to to LM18.3?


Thanks
Sadhu

Re: how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2020 11:08 am
by karlchen
sadhu wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 10:57 am
1. How do I remove systemd from lm19.3?
2. Or how can I install lm20 without it
Ad 1.: You cannot do so.
Ad 2.: You cannot do so.
sadhu wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 10:57 am
Or must I go revert to to LM18.3?
This decision is up to you. You can revert to Mint 18.3. You can also find out how to achieve your goal on a system using systemd.

Re: how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2020 1:09 pm
by sadhu
does 18.3 use systemd??

Re: how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2020 3:28 pm
by karlchen
Yes, it does by default.
The Grub menu should offer to launch Linux Mint 18.3 (upstart) as well.
Upstart was what Ubuntu and therefore the Ubuntu based Mint used, before systemd took over.
Ubuntu decided to give up on Upstart, because bigger players like Redhat pushed Systemd strongly.

Re: how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2020 5:52 pm
by karlchen
Hi, sadhu.
sadhu wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 10:57 am
I have discovered that many of the annoyances Ive been experiencing, the most recent being the fact that /etc/resolv.conf keeps getting overwritten -- are the direct result of systemd 'balancing' or whatever it is said to do.
Strictly speaking, it is not a new feature, introduced by systemd, that the file /etc/resolv.conf itself actually is merely a symbolic link.
Here on my (systemd-free) system, where I am typing right now, /etc/resolv.conf points to /run/resolvconf/resolv.conf.
The first 2 lines of the file read:

Code: Select all

$ cat /run/resolvconf/resolv.conf 
# Dynamic resolv.conf(5) file for glibc resolver(3) generated by resolvconf(8)
#     DO NOT EDIT THIS FILE BY HAND -- YOUR CHANGES WILL BE OVERWRITTEN
Suggests that the command man 8 resolvconf may tell how to modify the content of /run/resolvconf/resolv.conf correctly.
Just a very brief extract from its output:

Code: Select all

      /etc/resolvconf/resolv.conf.d/base
              File  containing  basic  resolver  information.  The lines in this file are included in the resolver configuration
              file even when no interfaces are configured.

       /etc/resolvconf/resolv.conf.d/head
              File to be prepended to the dynamically generated resolver configuration file.  Normally this is  just  a  comment
              line.

       /etc/resolvconf/resolv.conf.d/tail
              File  to  be  appended  to the dynamically generated resolver configuration file.  To append nothing, make this an
              empty file.  This file is a good place to put a resolver options line if one is needed, e.g.,
So depending on what you really need to achieve the file "head" or "tail" may be the right place for lines, which will not change dynamically.

Best regards,
Karl

Re: how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 12:49 am
by pbear
Bear in mind, 18.x doesn't have much support left. Solving the systemd problem will be a better long term solution.

Re: how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:19 am
by sadhu
Thanks to all. I'll keep researching. Right now it looks like changing network connections > [device] > IPv4 Settings Method: Automatic (DHCP) and Additional DNS Servers: [to desired ones] seems to do the trick.

It wasn't before, but seems to be working now. Perhaps there was a type in my original setup.

Re 18.3, yes I see that support runs out next year.

(I'm also looking around for a non-systemd linux distro.)


Thanks to all, and I'll mark this SOLVED.

-Sadhu

Re: SOLVED how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:19 am
by antikythera
Devuan is devoid of systemd. No prizes for guessing what it was forked from :D

Re: SOLVED how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:47 am
by sadhu
already downloaded it, but not yet installed! :D

I have a partition, now occupied by a malfunctioning LM19.3, ready and waiting for it.

Re: [SOLVED] how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:55 am
by antikythera
I should try it too at some point. What is slightly putting me off is the statement on their website about using only packages from their repositories because others are not compatible but you can use appimage and flatpak if necessary.

Re: [SOLVED] how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:59 am
by pnin
antikythera wrote: Devuan is devoid of systemd. No prizes for guessing what it was forked from.

Quick note with a pointer to a comprehensive resource about non-systemd distros: https://nosystemd.org/. :idea:

Re: [SOLVED] how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:49 pm
by Shadow in Fire
sadhu wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:47 am
already downloaded it, but not yet installed! :D

I have a partition, now occupied by a malfunctioning LM19.3, ready and waiting for it.
antikythera wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:55 am
I should try it too at some point. What is slightly putting me off is the statement on their website about using only packages from their repositories because others are not compatible but you can use appimage and flatpak if necessary.
I used GNU/Linux Mint 18.3 for as long as I could because I hated how badly done Systemd was as a service manager. Nothing but crashes and other unstable problems. Upstart was just a bandage, while Systemd still lurked. Decided it was time and just installed Refracta (it's Devuan customized for personal home use, including useful snapshot tools allowing you to create your own live ISO out of your Debian or Devuan install, on top of being more lightweight in packages) and didn't regret it one bit.

Would be nice to see GNU/Linux Mint Debian Edition being prioritized more, because Canonical has made a lot of very unprofessional, unethical computing decisions. As well, basing the kernel on Devuan AND allowing inits other than Systemd to be used on a new install would honestly be the best of both worlds. Have the developers ever considered this?

Re: [SOLVED] how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:45 am
by sadhu
Folks, I think we're beginning to gossip or complain about LM, and I'm not sure that this is the proper forum for it.

BTW antikythera , I tried to send you a PM regarding the issue of non-systemd OSs, but you're not receiving any... I feel snubbe4d :cry:

Karichen gave the complete answer for me here...
karlchen wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 5:52 pm

Strictly speaking, it is not a new feature, introduced by systemd, that the file /etc/resolv.conf itself actually is merely a symbolic link.
Here on my (systemd-free) system, where I am typing right now, /etc/resolv.conf points to /run/resolvconf/resolv.conf.
The first 2 lines of the file read:
so the issue is solved.

-sadhu

Re: [SOLVED] how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:04 am
by antikythera
I have pm turned off for all members, it's nothing personal to you ;)

Re: [SOLVED] how to install lm20 WITHOUT systemd, or remove it from LM 19

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:57 am
by pbear
sadhu wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:45 am
Folks, I think we're beginning to gossip or complain about LM, and I'm not sure that this is the proper forum for it.
As the thread is marked Solved, I doubt the mods care. Alternatively, you could open a thread in Chat about Linux, post a link here, and carry on. That's very definitely okay.
BTW antikythera , I tried to send you a PM regarding the issue of non-systemd OSs, but you're not receiving any... I feel snubbe4d :cry:
FWIW, I have PM disabled also.