Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

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Rtep
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Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by Rtep » Thu Dec 27, 2018 1:14 pm

Do anyone know how to make sliders (scroll bars) in LM 19.1 Tessa Mate sane again? Not everybody after 60 have 20/20 vision. These scroll bars are about 1/16" wide and drop down arrows are missing.This problem is ignored by LM developers for months. I'm still ruining LM 18.3 Sylvia Mate on my desktop machine and testing Tessa on laptop and with all those updates, it happens on LM 18.3 too. Please if anyone know how to do it, post step by step info here. I'm using Mint Y theme.Thanx for any info in advance.

gm10
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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by gm10 » Thu Dec 27, 2018 2:24 pm

You mean how thin they are? That's a theme-specific thing. You can override it for all themes by creating or editing this file in your favourite text editor:

Code: Select all

~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css
To override scrollbar thickness, add/change this, with a width/height of your liking:

Code: Select all

scrollbar.vertical slider,
scrollbar.slider.vertical
{
    min-width: 8px;
}
scrollbar.horizontal slider,
scrollbar.slider.horizontal
{
    min-height: 8px;
}
If you want to force the buttons at the end of the scrollbar, add this, although depending on the theme this can require further tweaking:

Code: Select all

scrollbar,
.scrollbar
{
    -GtkScrollbar-has-backward-stepper: TRUE;
    -GtkScrollbar-has-forward-stepper: TRUE;
}
Last edited by gm10 on Thu Dec 27, 2018 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Rtep
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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by Rtep » Thu Dec 27, 2018 6:09 pm

I'm not sure how/ where to create that file ~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css. When I tried to name that file ~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css, this sign pop up: Sorry, could not rename "untitled folder" to "~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css": Slashes are not allowed in filenames. So if you please give me step by step instruction "for Dummies" I'll appreciate that very much. Thanx.

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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by gm10 » Thu Dec 27, 2018 6:16 pm

Rtep wrote:
Thu Dec 27, 2018 6:09 pm
I'm not sure how/ where to create that file ~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css. When I tried to name that file ~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css, this sign pop up: Sorry, could not rename "untitled folder" to "~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css": Slashes are not allowed in filenames. So if you please give me step by step instruction "for Dummies" I'll appreciate that very much. Thanx.
That's path plus name. Anyway, to simplify things, from a terminal window, run:

Code: Select all

xed ~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css
and then just copy & paste what I posted above.
Last edited by gm10 on Thu Dec 27, 2018 9:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

cliffcoggin
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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by cliffcoggin » Thu Dec 27, 2018 9:15 pm

Thank you gentlemen for asking the question and supplying the answer. Miniscule, or even hidden, scroll bars are one of the irritating aspects of all modern operating systems that I despise, along with flat bland icons that are indistinguishable from each other at more than 18" from the screen.
Cliff Coggin
Mint 18.3 Cinnamon

Rtep
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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by Rtep » Fri Dec 28, 2018 12:47 pm

gm10, thanx for your input....but...this is terminal error: (xed:12611): WARNING **: Error when getting information for file '/home/rtep/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css': No such file or directory

(xed:12611): Gtk-WARNING **: Theme parsing error: <data>:1:0: Expected a boolean value

Now what? Sorry for my empty head. LOL.

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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by gm10 » Fri Dec 28, 2018 1:08 pm

Rtep wrote:
Fri Dec 28, 2018 12:47 pm
gm10, thanx for your input....but...this is terminal error: (xed:12611): WARNING **: Error when getting information for file '/home/rtep/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css': No such file or directory

(xed:12611): Gtk-WARNING **: Theme parsing error: <data>:1:0: Expected a boolean value

Now what? Sorry for my empty head. LOL.
lol, is that on 18.3? and you could not create the file (it's just a warning)? xed is a terrible pos software, anyway, but it's got no trouble with the command I gave on 19.1.

Anyway, we can always do it without the fancy GUI: :P

Code: Select all

nano ~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css
Last edited by gm10 on Sat Dec 29, 2018 11:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

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pbear
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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by pbear » Sat Dec 29, 2018 1:25 am

Rtep wrote:
Thu Dec 27, 2018 6:09 pm
I'm not sure how/ where to create that file ~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css.
Try this. Open Terminal. Type in (or, better, copy-and-paste) touch .config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css. This will create the file, albeit empty. Now enter xed .config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css. That will open the blank document in xed. Copy in gm10's text. Save and quit. By the way, you also can access the document from File Manager, but first you have to select View: Show Hidden Files, which is what the dot in front of config means. Speaking of what things mean, the ~ means "starting here," in this context your home folder, which is where you are by default when you open Terminal.

This is a wizard solution, much easier than editing the theme config files, which is what I've been doing up till now (based on advice in older threads). One tip. You might find you want more than 8px, but that's easily modified. Also, I'm finding no way of enabling scroll arrows (aka steppers) which works with Firefox in LM 19.1. I don't know why, as it does work in 18.3, both running the same version (at this writing, FF64).

Hope that helps. Good luck.
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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by gm10 » Sat Dec 29, 2018 2:38 am

pbear wrote:
Sat Dec 29, 2018 1:25 am
Also, I'm finding no way of enabling scroll arrows (aka steppers) which works with Firefox in LM 19.1. I don't know why, as it does work in 18.3, both running the same version (at this writing, FF64).
Try a different theme. As I wrote initially, the steppers may require more effort depending on the theme. I just tried (I prefer them disabled myself) and I see them in FF65 with the default Mint-Y theme.

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pbear
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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by pbear » Sat Dec 29, 2018 4:17 am

Steppers are important if one doesn't have a scroll wheel, which I do not as I use a trackball. Anyhoo, yes, switching to a Y theme (tested several) solves the problem on my system also. Thank you. I've been stumped by this one for more than a week.
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If your problem has been solved, please edit the thread title.

gm10
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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by gm10 » Sat Dec 29, 2018 5:21 am

pbear wrote:
Sat Dec 29, 2018 4:17 am
Steppers are important if one doesn't have a scroll wheel, which I do not as I use a trackball. Anyhoo, yes, switching to a Y theme (tested several) solves the problem on my system also. Thank you. I've been stumped by this one for more than a week.
Are you aware you can just click the bar directly or drag the slider? For line-by-line scrolling you can just use the keyboard's cursor keys. Mind you, I'm not arguing, if you prefer the steppers then by all means use them, that's why I included the code above.

But regarding the theme, there's various ways certain themes are problematic with the steppers. It's usually easier to see what the theme does wrong and then override only that, and if you like to use other themes as well, then it's best to only fix the theme css itself rather than override all themes.

To give you an example of what may be wrong, my usual Arc-Dark theme defines the stepper icons, but for the horizontal scrollbars with invalid icon names, resulting in them not showing up. In addition, I don't like the default icons GTK uses. So I added this to my global override above:

Code: Select all

scrollbar.vertical button.down   { -gtk-icon-source: -gtk-icontheme("pan-down-symbolic"); }
scrollbar.vertical button.up     { -gtk-icon-source: -gtk-icontheme("pan-up-symbolic"); }
scrollbar.horizontal button.down { -gtk-icon-source: -gtk-icontheme("pan-end-symbolic"); }
scrollbar.horizontal button.up   { -gtk-icon-source: -gtk-icontheme("pan-start-symbolic"); }
But the thing is, you may be using a theme where you actually like the icon choice and don't want to override it, and the issue why it doesn't show the icons may be something else entirely, that's why it's hard to give a general-purpose suggestion on how to handle steppers.
Last edited by gm10 on Sat Dec 29, 2018 5:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Moem
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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by Moem » Sat Dec 29, 2018 5:27 am

pbear wrote:
Sat Dec 29, 2018 4:17 am
Steppers are important if one doesn't have a scroll wheel, which I do not as I use a trackball.
I use a trackpoint and do most of the scrolling with my arrow keys. So many options! :D
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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by Raycoupe » Sat Dec 29, 2018 8:27 am

Thanks for asking this question Rtep, I'm having the same problem here, there too small to use (for my coordination and eyesight :lol: ).

Hope things like these will be added to the GUI, so everybody can easily customize LM for there needs without terminal commands.
Hardware, operating systems, software and networking are are nothing else than necessary, cumbersome and easily replaceable evils to store and provide data. Triple backup your data at least, twice on-site, and another copy off-site.

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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by Moem » Sat Dec 29, 2018 10:59 am

Raycoupe wrote:
Sat Dec 29, 2018 8:27 am
Hope things like these will be added to the GUI, so everybody can easily customize LM for there needs without terminal commands.
Same advice stands: Try a different theme.
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If your issue is solved, kindly indicate that by editing the first post in the topic, and adding [SOLVED] to the title. Thanks!

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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by pbear » Sat Dec 29, 2018 12:51 pm

Hey gm10 and Moem. Sure, I know how to use arrow keys and drag-the-slider. Those work fine for some things, not so well for others.

As mentioned, till now, I've been enabling steppers by editing theme config files. Anyone interested can see how that's done here. One thing I like about the master config file solution is that once I've created the file, I can copy it into new installations (e.g., in VBox) rather than edit or create from scratch. Also, easier to switch themes, though I generally stick with just one. So I'll try this for a while, maybe tweaking a bit to suit. Worst that happens is that I go back to the other method, now knowing how to make it work with Firefox.

Anyhoo, as Moem says, hurray for options. And always interesting to learn something new.
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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by MSt1982 » Sun Dec 30, 2018 4:15 am

Same problem here.
Its a pure horror!!!!!! Fix this, devs, please! Please add a normal theme for everyone.

Since update to 19.1 the Mint-X-themes are unusable for me (-> wrong colors in the taskbar at the bottom) - so now I need a solution to fix it for the Y-Themes / GTK 3.

I already tried to edit

Code: Select all

sudo nano /usr/share/themes/Mint-Y-Aqua/gtk-3.0/gtk.css
and changed -GtkScrollbar-has-forward/backward-stepper to TRUE - that works, but then the buttons and scrollbar have a size of ~60-100 pixels which is a bit too much :roll:

How do I change the size of the steppers? And this just affects many menus, but not the browser. How do I add the steppers to Firefox and adjust its size there?
gm10 wrote:
Thu Dec 27, 2018 2:24 pm
You mean how thin they are? That's a theme-specific thing. You can override it for all themes by creating or editing this file in your favourite text editor:

Code: Select all

~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css
...
Done, but it does not seem to work for me...I made no restart, but just changing the theme after creating the file at that location does not add the steppers for me. However, I also could edit the file in user/share/theme...but how exactly, how to resize the stepper? And how to add them to Firefox?


Furthermore, the taskbar at the bottom is also a mess...just compare the X and Y-themes for yourself...Y has no padding between all the tasks, no padding between the clock and the border...Y-themes are just horrible.

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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by gm10 » Sun Dec 30, 2018 5:40 am

MSt1982 wrote:
Sun Dec 30, 2018 4:15 am
Done, but it does not seem to work for me...I made no restart, but just changing the theme after creating the file at that location does not add the steppers for me.
It does work. You do not need to change the theme or restart the system, but you do need to restart the application you want the steppers to show in.

As to the rest, I already said initially that steppers will be more work depending on the theme. I'm not going to walk you through fixing every theme, maybe somebody who already modified that specific theme can help you out. However, given the number of things you dislike about the theme I would suggest to simply find another one. Either in Software Manager or have a look at e.g. https://www.opendesktop.org/.

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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by MSt1982 » Sun Dec 30, 2018 5:52 am

gm10 wrote:
Sun Dec 30, 2018 5:40 am
MSt1982 wrote:
Sun Dec 30, 2018 4:15 am
Done, but it does not seem to work for me...I made no restart, but just changing the theme after creating the file at that location does not add the steppers for me.
It does work. You do not need to change the theme or restart the system, but you do need to restart the application you want the steppers to show in.
Seems youre right, actually I am messing around with downloaded (not working) themes...however, and how do I change the size of the stepper-arrows?
They are much too large if I just activate them. I can change the bar, but how do I change the stepper-size?

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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by Rtep » Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:24 pm

Hello all. Thanx for your excellent help. I tried your advices and now I have SANE (LOL) sliders in LM Mate 19.1 Tessa.
Unfortunately same procedure didn't made any changes to LM Mate 18.3 Sylvia. I did not tried doing anything with "steppers", maybe later....
Again thanx a lot!!!
Update: It is not working with Synaptic Package Manager. Sliders there are still "Insane".

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Re: Insane sliders in LM 18.3 and LM 19.1

Post by Raycoupe » Wed Jan 30, 2019 8:53 pm

Rtep wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:24 pm
Hello all. Thanx for your excellent help. I tried your advices and now I have SANE (LOL) sliders in LM Mate 19.1 Tessa.
Unfortunately same procedure didn't made any changes to LM Mate 18.3 Sylvia. I did not tried doing anything with "steppers", maybe later....
Again thanx a lot!!!
Update: It is not working with Synaptic Package Manager. Sliders there are still "Insane".
I hope you find a solution which is more applicable to all versions of the desktop environment of Linux Mint itself. Subscribed to this topic.

Also experiencing here that Linux Mint seems to be setup for under 40 only, with perfect 20/20 vision and excellent dexterity and a brand spanking new 2500 dpi mouse. :lol:

Sliders, minimize, maximize, close button in the windows, not easily configured for a persons needs. Customizability just using GUI tools limited and scattered in too much different windows. Playing around I even managed to rainbows up the windows configuration on the taskbar, open window icons on the right, hugging the systemtray, instead of big labels on the left next to the Menu button for open windows. Could not correct this, but opening the Welcome Screen again and activating ' Modern' and then 'Traditional' restored normal settings.

Probably it's all customizable if I just knew how to edit the parts that make up the desktop environment, but that's pretty complex shit, multiple parts, lots of variables and dependencies.

We should file a request with Mint's devellopers to make a setting for 40+ people, Making it just a bit easier to navigate and operate by mouse clicks, which ofcourse would be a bit less efficient in use of the available screen space, in which Linux Mint excels over Windows. I know the keyboard is more powerful and you just have to learn it's use, but when I'm watching TV (via pc), playing music or movies I just want to have a remote mouse to control basic functions. VLC is great too, but having the same problem, very thin slider to click and move through a video, plenty of wasted space to make it easier.
Hardware, operating systems, software and networking are are nothing else than necessary, cumbersome and easily replaceable evils to store and provide data. Triple backup your data at least, twice on-site, and another copy off-site.

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