Firefox 89.0 update last night and ugh!!!

[Grateful4Linux]

Also, I read a post on Reddit that mentioned "Restore Previous Session" has been removed from the application menu, and unfortunately I don't see it in the menu. Is that hidden somewhere? I depend upon that feature quite often and liked that it was easy to access.

Firefox has been my primary browser for almost 20 years now, but I am so frustrated by these terrible changes that I am seriously considering dropping it and going with Chromium, Vivaldi or Brave instead. I already have Chromium and Vivaldi installed, and I used Brave occasionally on a previous computer (although at the time it was still pretty new and they had almost no extensions available back then).

From what I've read, Mozilla received a ton of negative feedback during development/beta of 89 but ignored their users input. Between that and having to waste a lot of time fixing their regressions every time they do a big update, I have lost my trust in Mozilla and Firefox. No wonder they've been losing market share.

[JoeFootball]

For those interested, here's the detailed list of changes for 89.0.

[AZgl1800]

I saw the query about the themes when I restarted Firefox 89, but I declined and kept my previous theme. The frustrating thing is that the contrast is much poorer with this new version, and I'm not sure how to fix it. (The folder icons in the bookmark toolbar also changed.)

Contrast is my main vision issue, so this is a big downgrade for me. It is also much more difficult to see which tab is active now because it no longer has the dark line above it to make it standout.

Below are comparisons with a screencap I made a while back:

Firefox 89 comparison 1-70.jpeg
Firefox 89 comparison 2.jpeg

yeah, Maria, that is why I chose a Light Blue background with the OEM Firefox globe on the right side.
I do NOT like their so called Improvements at all.

here is how the tabs look FF89 with the blue background

[DAMIEN1307]

I used Brave occasionally on a previous computer (although at the time it was still pretty new and they had almost no extensions available back then).

I gave up on Firefox years ago because of constant changes and bloat...I see that according to this thread, that they have not gotten any better but have even gotten worse if thats possible...Glad i went to Brave Browser when i did a few years back...By the way, No problems any longer about extensions...They got all you will ever need...And Brave doesn't keep changing your preferences either with each updated version...DAMIEN

[DAMIEN1307]

Heres more of what Mozilla has done with, (or to), Firefox...lol...After reading this, I think thats all i personally need to know about Firefox and its future...lol...DAMIEN

https://www.theregister.com/2021/06/01/ ... _redesign/

Mozilla said that its redesign is based on telemetry showing that 43 per cent of clicks go to the tab bar, 33 per cent to the navigation bar below it, and 5 per cent to the bookmark bar.

Perhaps more interesting is the matter of privacy and business model. Mozilla is pitched as a privacy-preserving browser though not to the same extent as Brave; it has a ton of strong features for blocking trackers yet it is compromised by the importance of Google to its business model. In 2019, a financial report [PDF] showed that royalties, paid for setting Firefox's default search engine and understood to be largely from Google, make up the bulk of Moz's regular revenue.

[Grateful4Linux]

yeah, Maria, that is why I chose a Light Blue background with the OEM Firefox globe on the right side.
I do NOT like their so called Improvements at all.

here is how the tabs look FF89 with the blue background

contrast.png

The contrast is poor, but at least you have a pretty decent solid black line at the top of the active tab. I wish I still had that - I think it helps quite a bit. I tend to have a ton of tabs open so they're usually quite small to begin with and I need all the help I can get to quickly distinguish the active one.

I gave up on Firefox years ago because of constant changes and bloat...I see that according to this thread, that they have not gotten any better but have even gotten worse if thats possible...Glad i went to Brave Browser when i did a few years back...By the way, No problems any longer about extensions...They got all you will ever need...And Brave doesn't keep changing your preferences either with each updated version...DAMIEN

Truthfully, one of the main reasons I have stuck with Firefox the last few disappointing years has been to support a browser that does not use the Google (Blink?) engine. Also, I have most of my SSBs set up to use Firefox and I don't think the ICE app I use supports Brave. (Although it does support Vivaldi.)

I'm still using Mint 19.3, but I think the built-in site specific browser application in Mint 20+ supports Brave. When I do finally switch, it will take some time to get comfortable, I suppose... but since Mozilla keeps making nonsensical changes to the Firefox UI, I end up wasting time fixing and fiddling with things now anyway, and it takes a while to get used to their unwelcome forced changes. I might as well use a browser like Brave that respects its users and doesn't force regressive changes.

[palo]

I was looking forward to the release of 89 because the View Image Info in the context menu that was removed a couple versions ago was returned - they do listen when enough users complain. The new tab bar was disappointing though and I am glad it could be reverted with an about:config change. I actually like the smaller icons and scroll bar though.

[trytip]

if you still need to fix scrollbar here is solution, i pick 30 pt but you may pick whoever
about:config or about:about <<< for all :config menu
in search use scrollbar or scrollbar.size (not to be mistaken with scrollbar-size)
be sure to ENTER after selecting your size and restart FF

Code: Select all

widget.non-native-theme.scrollbar.size

ps: unfortunately the small space left and right of the scrollbar is exponential according to the size so the placeholder for scrollbar is larger. did not want to pursure if possible to have size exact 30. as it stands size is 30+2
stupid human developers are clueless as always

[AZgl1800]

if you still need to fix scrollbar here is solution, i pick 30 pt but you may pick whoever
about:config or about:about <<< for all :config menu
in search use scrollbar or scrollbar.size (not to be mistaken with scrollbar-size)
be sure to ENTER after selecting your size and restart FF

Code: Select all

widget.non-native-theme.scrollbar.size

ps: unfortunately the small space left and right of the scrollbar is exponential according to the size so the placeholder for scrollbar is larger. did not want to pursure if possible to have size exact 20. as it stands size is 30+2
stupid human developers are clueless as always

Thanks for that find, I have been changing stuff right and left, I think I exceeded the limit with my efforts, because I had changed that before w/o good results.
" 30 " is work just right for me now.

[Grateful4Linux]

if you still need to fix scrollbar here is solution, i pick 30 pt but you may pick whoever
about:config or about:about <<< for all :config menu
in search use scrollbar or scrollbar.size (not to be mistaken with scrollbar-size)
be sure to ENTER after selecting your size and restart FF

Code: Select all

widget.non-native-theme.scrollbar.size

ps: unfortunately the small space left and right of the scrollbar is exponential according to the size so the placeholder for scrollbar is larger. did not want to pursure if possible to have size exact 20. as it stands size is 30+2
stupid human developers are clueless as always

I settled on the same size last night, and it seems like a nice compromise:

Update: I changed only the widget.non-native-theme.scrollbar.size to "30" and now it's a very nice size for me. Thanks again!

The narrow scrollbar on Firefox has bothered me since I've been using Linux Mint, actually. I changed the system scrollbar size a long time ago, but Firefox scrollbar remained much too narrow for me. It wasn't until it became virtually invisible with Firefox 89 that I was motivated to change it. So that's one positive thing that came out of this mess.

One thing I don't think has been mentioned here: the Firefox mod over on Reddit said that the developers plan to remove the ability to revert the Proton changes (in about:config) with the next update - expected to be in about four weeks.

[Bolle1961]

Update manager pushed thru an update for Firefox that really ticked me off.

All of my special settings for themes and screen background colors are gone, it is just STARK WHITE on the new tabs page and other general pages.... I am having to wade through and fix each of them as I notice something is not right.

The good part of this update is I still have all my settings.
The bad part is, it's buggy as hell

[Bob M]

One thing that all of us have failed to mention.

Screen Size:

My laptop is a 17" screen in Hi-Res mode

typical fonts are so tiny I cannot see them, I use a Zoom level of 200% just to read this forum.

For what it's worth I updated my 13" Laptop and no change there either?????????

The versions of Mint 19.3 Cinnamon were installed from the same Thumb Drive and the update was installed by the Update Manager.

Really odd because it doesn't seem to be effecting everyone.

[mikeflan]

the developers plan to remove the ability to revert the Proton changes (in about:config) with the next update - expected to be in about four weeks.

I've been using FF for more than 20 years, but it looks like that is coming to an end. In the meantime I have my FF browser locked in at ver 87 (actually ver 82 on this machine). Perhaps I will move to Brave, especially if I can find a replacement for NoScript on Brave.

[AZgl1800]

the developers plan to remove the ability to revert the Proton changes (in about:config) with the next update - expected to be in about four weeks.

I've been using FF for more than 20 years, but it looks like that is coming to an end. In the meantime I have my FF browser locked in at ver 87 (actually ver 82 on this machine). Perhaps I will move to Brave, especially if I can find a replacement for NoScript on Brave.

I tried Brave last night, even got a phone call from Damien to show me how to get around it in, and sadly it is no where near as good as Firefox for the features that I use all the time.

The Bookmark Library especially, and you can't customize the Task bar / URL line..
those two are Deal Breakers for me...

I've using FF since it was called Navigator in the last '80s

[jazz pigeon]

Clearly I'm doing better than some of you on this, which is not going to help. (Though Thunderbird is a slightly different issue. Sigh.) That themes are partially broken is not great, but I've gone for a dark theme (maybe included) and it's made the settings pages easier to read. Using the theme I did have, they looked blurred ??? And I like toolbars, so I'm glad I managed to find a way of getting them back on in the last major change.

[karlchen]

Hi, folks.

After having expressed my doubts whether the changes brought by Proton were really severe in a previous post , by now, I have had the doubtful pleasure of finding out what Firefox 89.0 will look like, in case you accept to use the Alpenglow theme and in case you do not disable most of the Proton changes on first startup, by applying browser.proton.enable=false.

All the details actually can be found on Github on page, which someone had thankfully linked to before: Firefox-UI-Fix.

Whichever aspects of the visual Firefox design may have really been improved in the new Proton design, the overall user experience is definitely spoilt by

• tab headers being no longer connected to the tab panel, to which they belong.
• the excessive padding done in several areas of the application, which simply wastes a lot of space for no good reason at all and results in a clunky appearance.
  Tab headers use more space than before. The addressbar uses more space than before. The bookmark iconbar uses more space than before.
  The bookmark drop down menus waste a lot of vertical space.
• the icons, which only consists of a very thin outline, are harder to recognize than before, in particular on lighter backgrounds (lighter than dark blue or dark gray e.g.) So the overall contrast is worse than before.
• removing all icons from the hamburger menus simply looks as if they have been forgotten or as if the pencil had been consumed.
• hiding the setting "browser.compactmode.show" in about:config only, whereas it had been simply enabled by a mouse click in the past, is a very foolish decision. Enabling compact mode is one way of reducing the wasted screen space, wasted by excessive padding.

All in all I am not looking forward to Firefox 90, when the switch "browser.proton.enable=false" may be removed.

I am afraid that applying black7375's style sheets may become the only way then of giving back Firefox an acceptable visual appearance.

The thing which annoys me most is that the Mozilla developers had received negative feedback on all the details, which have been criticized in this thread, too, and on more details, which Firefox 89.0 was still in alpha and beta state. Yet, they do not seem to be impressed by (constructive) criticism. This at least is my impression, when reading all of this bug discussion here: Bug 1701266.

I am still aware that developers cannot please everybody. But this does not imply that pleasing no-one at all were the way to success.

Best regards,
Karl

[absque fenestris]

I've using FF since it was called Navigator in the last '80s

Whatever you used in the 80s, it wasn't the Navigator.

Developer(s) Netscape
Initial release 15 December 1994
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netscape_Navigator

As for a current Firefox, you could easily install the ESR version - this eliminates the constant stupid update hops and keeps unpleasant surprises within narrow limits.

Incidentally, this also applies to Mint LMDE (Debbie) as a whole: Firefox ESR in the basic configuration, generally very few updates, no nasty surprises ...

[karlchen]

Hi, absque fenestris.

I am pretty certain that I do not really have to you remind you that roughly once a year, the Firefox ESR release will make the "big leap forward" and catch up with the normal "release" channel.
This last happened, when Firefox ESR 68.x made the big leap forward to Firefox ESR 78.0.
So even Firefox ESR users will be affected by all the "UI improvements", which the Mozilla developers have implemented during the past months, even though it may be just once every 12 months roughly. This will make the shock only more shocking, I assume.

Actually Firefox ESR does not really receive updates less frequently than the normal Firefox release. Only most of the Firefox ESR updates are limited to fixing newly found security vulnerabilities. But remember the "big leap forward" once a year or so. No year will last longer than 12 months.

Cheers,
Karl

[absque fenestris]

Well, just today an ESR update didn't bring any funny surprises. As for the next big jump then - let's see what has become of the Alpenglow by then.

So far I know said thing like this:

[cliffcoggin]

I delayed updating to 89.0 until today because of all the adverse comments here. Having now updated I am pleasantly surprised, because the only visible changes are the better visibility of the active tab with the coloured outline, and the narrower scroll bar which I shall alter following trytip's advice. Everything else, including my settings, appear at first glance to be unchanged.

Note that I have always had a blank white new tab page and a blue coloured header bar (if that is the right term). Overall I am pleased with the changes.