[SOLVED] Random freezes

[davey]

Hi! I have experienced this same freezing issue both in both Cinnamon and XFCE versions. This was after ditched Ubuntu after using it for a year,freezing no end. I thought it was due to the memory usage or lack of it.

But having gone through Linux Mint XFCE which eats up the least memory, and it still froze repeatedly, then this may have nothing to do with memory usage. I ran HTOP on my 2nd monitor, and saw roughly 1.5G being used of my total 8G RAM when it froze, so the memory may have nothing to do with this issue. Could this be associated with CPU model? I am running on an Intel QuadCore N3700 that packs 1.6Ghz of speed.

I also tried Zorin OS but I got the same freezing experience. I have read from one of us here that it this issue occurs across all UBUNTU-based distros. The fact is that when it freezes, there really was no other way out but to reboot, and in some instances, it happens only within the first hour of running it. I also read that this started since Ubuntu 17.0.

This is one pretty big downer for me. I wanted to promote using Linux among my friends but this will surely fend them off.

Considering that this has been going on for quite a time now since Ubuntu 17.0, has there been any permanent fix on this that I was not aware of?
Apologies for barking out my frustration!

[SMG]

But having gone through Linux Mint XFCE which eats up the least memory, and it still froze repeatedly, then this may have nothing to do with memory usage. I ran HTOP on my 2nd monitor, and saw roughly 1.5G being used of my total 8G RAM when it froze, so the memory may have nothing to do with this issue. Could this be associated with CPU model? I am running on an Intel QuadCore N3700 that packs 1.6Ghz of speed.

Welcome to the forum, davey.

Your situation is different from the one in the other thread so, as per forum rules, I created a new topic for your post. We prefer you not piggy-back your questions on someone else's topic. It makes it confusing for those helping when there are multiple people with differing hardware in the same topic.

Having multiple screens attached to a computer increases the workload on the computer. Please give us information about your install by entering this command in a terminal: inxi -Fxxxrz
Click </> from the mini toolbar above the textbox where you type your reply and then place your cursor between the code markers and paste the results of the command between the code markers [code]Results[/code]. This will let us know how Mint sees your hardware.

[davey]

Hi SMG,

Yes I am new to this forum. Thanks for the kind reply and the warm welcome!
Note that I am just a plain user now after having left programming some 20 years ago.

"Your situation is different from the one in the other thread so, as per forum rules, I created a new topic for your post. We prefer you not piggy-back your questions on someone else's topic. It makes it confusing for those helping when there are multiple people with differing hardware in the same topic."

I agree with you, but I really did not intend to piggy-back with another's question but just wrongly thought that my situation was similar or the same. I even thought that creating another new thread would further clutter the forum. I was wrong! So thanks for calling my attention!

Having multiple screens attached to a computer increases the workload on the computer.

I do not disagree with you. But I can not accept the fact that my lowly Windows Home Edition is able to handle 2 screens simultaneously without the freezing experience, while LINUX Mint XFCE can not and freezes almost consistently. I actually went distro hopping from UBUNTU, Linux Mint Cinnamon, Xubuntu, Zorin Core, finally Mint XFCE thinking a low-memory hugging flavor will avoid the fridge. It did not! Sadly, the experience were consistent across all these distros. Hence, I can understand why you wanna take a peak at my device specifications!

I believe Mint XFCE can also handle this, albeit with some tweakings or an update from Mint or Ubuntu. This was why I finally decided to enter this forum.

Please give us information about your install by entering this command in a terminal: inxi -Fxxxrz
Click </> from the mini toolbar above the textbox where you type your reply and then place your cursor between the code markers and paste the results of the command between the code markers [code]Results[/code]. This will let us know how Mint sees your hardware.

Code: Select all

System:
  Kernel: 5.4.0-91-generic x86_64 bits: 64 compiler: gcc v: 9.3.0 
  Desktop: Xfce 4.14.2 tk: Gtk 3.24.13 info: xfce4-panel wm: xfwm4 
  dm: LightDM 1.30.0 Distro: Linux Mint 20.1 Ulyssa base: Ubuntu 20.04 focal 
Machine:
  Type: Laptop System: Acer product: Aspire ES1-431 v: V3.72 
  serial: <filter> 
  Mobo: Acer model: Magellan_BA v: Type2 - A01 Board Version 
  serial: <filter> UEFI: Insyde v: 1.07 date: 07/09/2015 
CPU:
  Topology: Quad Core model: Intel Pentium N3700 bits: 64 type: MCP 
  arch: Airmont rev: 3 L2 cache: 1024 KiB 
  flags: lm nx pae sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 ssse3 vmx bogomips: 12800 
  Speed: 486 MHz min/max: 480/2400 MHz Core speeds (MHz): 1: 480 2: 480 
  3: 480 4: 480 
Graphics:
  Device-1: Intel Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx 
  Integrated Graphics 
  vendor: Acer Incorporated ALI driver: i915 v: kernel bus ID: 00:02.0 
  chip ID: 8086:22b1 
  Display: x11 server: X.Org 1.20.11 driver: modesetting 
  unloaded: fbdev,vesa resolution: 1366x768~60Hz, 1920x1080~60Hz 
  OpenGL: renderer: Mesa DRI Intel HD Graphics 405 (BSW) v: 4.6 Mesa 21.0.3 
  compat-v: 3.0 direct render: Yes 
Audio:
  Device-1: Intel Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Series 
  High Definition Audio 
  vendor: Acer Incorporated ALI driver: snd_hda_intel v: kernel 
  bus ID: 00:1b.0 chip ID: 8086:2284 
  Sound Server: ALSA v: k5.4.0-91-generic 
Network:
  Device-1: Qualcomm Atheros QCA9565 / AR9565 Wireless Network Adapter 
  vendor: Lite-On driver: ath9k v: kernel port: 2040 bus ID: 02:00.0 
  chip ID: 168c:0036 
  IF: wlp2s0 state: up mac: <filter> 
  Device-2: Realtek RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet 
  vendor: Acer Incorporated ALI driver: r8169 v: kernel port: 1000 
  bus ID: 03:00.1 chip ID: 10ec:8168 
  IF: enp3s0f1 state: down mac: <filter> 
Drives:
  Local Storage: total: 465.76 GiB used: 246.70 GiB (53.0%) 
  ID-1: /dev/sda vendor: Western Digital model: WD5000LPVX-22V0TT0 
  size: 465.76 GiB speed: 6.0 Gb/s rotation: 5400 rpm serial: <filter> 
  rev: 1A01 scheme: GPT 
Partition:
  ID-1: / size: 142.31 GiB used: 20.94 GiB (14.7%) fs: ext4 dev: /dev/sda4 
Sensors:
  System Temperatures: cpu: 62.0 C mobo: N/A 
  Fan Speeds (RPM): N/A 
Repos:
  No active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list 
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/official-package-repositories.list 
  1: deb http://mirror.rise.ph/linuxmint ulyssa main upstream import backport
  2: deb http://mirror.rise.ph/ubuntu focal main restricted universe multiverse
  3: deb http://mirror.rise.ph/ubuntu focal-updates main restricted universe multiverse
  4: deb http://mirror.rise.ph/ubuntu focal-backports main restricted universe multiverse
  5: deb http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ focal-security main restricted universe multiverse
  6: deb http://archive.canonical.com/ubuntu/ focal partner
Info:
  Processes: 203 Uptime: 7m Memory: 7.69 GiB used: 1.18 GiB (15.3%) 
  Init: systemd v: 245 runlevel: 5 Compilers: gcc: 9.3.0 alt: 9 Shell: bash 
  v: 5.0.17 running in: xfce4-terminal inxi: 3.0.38 

I really trust you can help me!

Kind regards,
Davey

[SMG]

I removed the c tags you put around the code tags so the inxi output would retain its formatting. I had to do that in my example because that is the only way to get the tags to show so you would know what I meant (otherwise the tags would be used and you could not see them).

I do not disagree with you. But I can not accept the fact that my lowly Windows Home Edition is able to handle 2 screens simultaneously without the freezing experience, while LINUX Mint XFCE can not and freezes almost consistently. I actually went distro hopping from UBUNTU, Linux Mint Cinnamon, Xubuntu, Zorin Core, finally Mint XFCE thinking a low-memory hugging flavor will avoid the fridge. It did not! Sadly, the experience were consistent across all these distros.

Your computer was designed and optimized to run Windows. If all the Linux-bases distros are having issues, that might indicate something in the BIOS/UEFI might be a factor. Are you running the latest BIOS/UEFI version available? Each operating system uses the parameters in BIOS in slightly different manners. Sometimes BIOS updates have cleared issues in Linux-basd distros which were not showing when running Windows.

I believe Mint XFCE can also handle this, albeit with some tweakings or an update from Mint or Ubuntu.

Other than a possible BIOS change, the only other item I noticed in the inxi is your CPU temp is higher than what I would expect it to be. Random high temps could cause freeze issues.

Sensors:
System Temperatures: cpu: 62.0 C mobo: N/A
Fan Speeds (RPM): N/A

I would expect your computer to run well with the 5.4 kernel, but you could try running a newer kernel version to see if that helps.

Instructions for upgrading to the 5.11 kernel:

• Open Update Manager.
• Select View > Linux Kernels and click Continue.
• Make sure 5.11 is selected on the left panel and then click the top-most option on the right panel. An "Install" button will appear.
• Install the kernel and then reboot for it to become active.

[davey]

Apologies, as I am not familiar with c tags, and the way you format messages in this forum.

I just updated the BIOS of my Acer Laptop.

My Mint XFCE already uses the 5.4.0-82-generic Kernel which is supported until 2025.

Would it be safe to implement the 5.11.0-41 version that is supported ONLY until February 2022?

I also checked the unit's temperature but it does not seem warm enough to cause any issue. I will keep a watch though on this area.

I will get back to you if you suggestions had resolved the issue.

Thanks!

[SMG]

My Mint XFCE already uses the 5.4.0-82-generic Kernel which is supported until 2025.

It may have used that in the past, but the inxi info you posted indicates you are currently using the 5.4.0-91-generic kernel.

The 5.4 kernel series is an LTS (long-term-support) series. There are other kernels supported for shorter terms. Before those short terms expire, they can be replaced with other shorter term kernels.

Would it be safe to implement the 5.11.0-41 version that is supported ONLY until February 2022?

When that kernel stops receiving support, you would need to switch to a newer kernel which is receiving support.

I did not know if there was a newer BIOS available or if you would be able to update it if there was which is why I gave an alternate option to try of updating the kernel. I would suggest waiting to see if the BIOS update helps before considering changing the kernel.

[davey]

Hi SMG

I did not know if there was a newer BIOS available or if you would be able to update it if there was which is why I gave an alternate option to try of updating the kernel. I would suggest waiting to see if the BIOS update helps before considering changing the kernel.

I did exactly as you've expected. I proceeded to update the BIOS first to its latest version which was issued long ago in 2016 before I updated the Kernel. I may be using an old laptop, believing the possibility that low-end hardwares can run with a Linux version intended for low-specification hardwares, e.g. the XFCE versions regardless of distro label, and I would want to make this happen. BIOS Installation was a breeze, but still, I bumped into a frozen screen twice. So looks like it was not with the BIOS.

I then later proceeded to update the Kernel to version 5.11 later when the BIOS update failed to address the issue, although 5.11 was with a shorter term support.

I am going for another stress-testing later after work, and will provide you feedback.

Code: Select all

davey@davey-Aspire-ES1-431:~$ screenfetch
                                       davey@davey-Aspire-ES1-431
 MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMmds+.        OS: Linuxmint 20.1 ulyssa
 MMm----::-://////////////oymNMd+`     Kernel: x86_64 Linux 5.11.0-41-generic
 MMd      /++                -sNMd:    Uptime: 3m
 MMNso/`  dMM    `.::-. .-::.` .hMN:   Packages: 2070
 ddddMMh  dMM   :hNMNMNhNMNMNh: `NMm   Shell: bash 5.0.17
     NMm  dMM  .NMN/-+MMM+-/NMN` dMM   Resolution: 1920x1848
     NMm  dMM  -MMm  `MMM   dMM. dMM   DE: Xfce
     NMm  dMM  -MMm  `MMM   dMM. dMM   WM: Xfwm4
     NMm  dMM  .mmd  `mmm   yMM. dMM   WM Theme: Mint-Y-Dark
     NMm  dMM`  ..`   ...   ydm. dMM   GTK Theme: Mint-Y-Dark [GTK2]
     hMM- +MMd/-------...-:sdds  dMM   Icon Theme: Mint-Y-Dark
     -NMm- :hNMNNNmdddddddddy/`  dMM   Font: Ubuntu 10
      -dMNs-``-::::-------.``    dMM   Disk: 23G / 147G (16%)
       `/dMNmy+/:-------------:/yMMM   CPU: Intel Pentium N3700 @ 4x 2.4GHz
          ./ydNMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM   GPU: Mesa DRI Intel(R) HD Graphics 405 (BSW)
             \.MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM     RAM: 1318MiB / 7852MiB

Best Regards!
Davey

[davey]

Hi @SMG


After yesterday's stress testing, it seems you hit the nail by its head with the update of the kernel. I had observed on few occasions that my laptops 4 Core processor regions were getting filled up to about 98% especially when Firefox runs a video from a local newspaper's site, and yes also the 8Gb RAM getting used up to about 79%, but so far -- there no longer was any system freezing.

I am not sure if it will help that the Linux Mint installation process should include a hardware analysis
-- so that it automatically installs the appropriate kernel that runs well with the specific hardware.
-- or at least that Linux Mint automatically flashes out a screen warning that the current kernel must be altered to a version optimized for the hardware - similar to the warning it gives to packages or OS objects that need to be updated.

For Linux Mint to be better than Windows, issues like this that can be resolved, must be resolved from the start, preferably automatically during or after installation.

Just an additional observation: Web browsing and even MS Teams has significantly slowed down in response, sort of sluggish after the kernel update. But I will keep observing this, if this comes just at the start.


Thank you very much!

God bless you, SMB!

Davey

[Aztaroth]

For the record, solved a similar issue by disabling the Cinnamon restart when using too much memory in Settings / General, also suggested somewhere else by SMG.
I'll be a bit less religious and just thank her.

[davey]

Aztaroth » Thu Dec 09, 2021 4:31 pm
For the record, solved a similar issue by disabling the Cinnamon restart when using too much memory in Settings / General, also suggested somewhere else by SMG.
I'll be a bit less religious and just thank her.

Oh yes absolutely grateful to SMG!
But it's up to you to be less or none-religions, and I respect that!

My issue was not related to the memory nor the CPU getting drowned, but the incompatibility of my hardware with default kernel that was setup during installation. I descended from Mint Cinnamon to the Mint XFCE , thinking that it was my laptop's Memory or the CPU that were insufficient - that a low-resource hugging XFCE version will work. But still, the same freezing issue persisted, until SMG suggesed using a trying the latest version of the kernel.

Thanks nonetheless for the info on Cinnamon restart. I use Cinnamon on my other old Desktop, works quite fine, saved for the about-to-be used-up disk space. I may have alloted too little space for the Ubuntu partition.

[SMG]

After yesterday's stress testing, it seems you hit the nail by its head with the update of the kernel. I had observed on few occasions that my laptops 4 Core processor regions were getting filled up to about 98% especially when Firefox runs a video from a local newspaper's site, and yes also the 8Gb RAM getting used up to about 79%, but so far -- there no longer was any system freezing.

Glad to hear it is working. Give it another week or so and if all is still working well, please go to your first post in this topic, click the pencil icon, and add [SOLVED] to the title so others know you are no longer seeking help on this issue.

I am not sure if it will help that the Linux Mint installation process should include a hardware analysis

The ISO for Linux Mint is frozen in time at the time it was created. That means there is no way for it to know about newer kernels that would be released after the ISO was created. Also, one's use of the operating system can determine what kernel might be needed, so there are several factors to be considered.

Just an additional observation: Web browsing and even MS Teams has significantly slowed down in response, sort of sluggish after the kernel update. But I will keep observing this, if this comes just at the start.

Web browsers have been making a lot of changes recently, so it is possible there are settings changes you can make in the browser which might impact the results you are seeing. Check to see if hardware acceleration is turned on or off and experiment with other settings changes to see if they help. I personally have hardware acceleration turned off in Firefox and I know doing that has helped others as well, but I do not know if that might produce a different result for you.

Thank you very much!

God bless you, SMB!

Davey

You are welcome, Davey.

[Aztaroth]

But it's up to you to be less or none-religions, and I respect that!

Hi Davey,
It was not meant as an offense. I respect your beliefs too !

[motoryzen]

For Linux Mint to be better than Windows, issues like this that can be resolved, must be resolved from the start, preferably automatically during or after installation

There is no way for a distro-dev to know up front which hardware you will be running when you're trying to install any particular distro and desktop environment combo. There is only so many a distro-dev can account for across the span of multiple generations of hardware.

[davey]

Hellow Motoryzen

motoryzen » Fri Dec 10, 2021 10:34 am
There is no way for a distro-dev to know up front which hardware you will be running when you're trying to install any particular distro and desktop environment combo. There is only so many a distro-dev can account for across the span of multiple generations of hardware.

It is true that the variety of Hardware can be overwhelming, but I believe Linux distros must find a way in addressing this hardware specific issues, in the same manner some distros have a different ISO for normal graphic use and for those with NVIDIA graphics.

If a distro can do it over the terminal with the terminal command inxi -Fxxxrz, then there could be a way for a distro to snoop around through the hardware ecosystem and determine its number of processors, MHz processing speed, RAM
desktop type, CPU Topology. architecture, graphic card etc...and to evaluate them versus its Kernel version.

I was expecting at least a post-installation warning e.g. "Hey, dude your QuadCore Celeron aint good for kernel 4.5. We suggest upgrading to Kernel 4.11".

I am not saying you are wrong or that I do not believe you. But what I am saying is that there could be a way.

Merry Christmas!

[davey]

But it's up to you to be less or none-religions, and I respect that!

Hi Davey,
It was not meant as an offense. I respect your beliefs too !

No issues my friend! I didn't see it offensive.

I wish you all the best!

[davey]

SMB wrote:

Glad to hear it is working. Give it another week or so and if all is still working well, please go to your first post in this topic, click the pencil icon, and add [SOLVED] to the title so others know you are no longer seeking help on this issue.

@SMB,

I used it for over a month to perform an extended road test, and it looks like your solution worked. No more Freeze!
Thanks again!
I wish you and your family well!
Davey

[SMG]

I used it for over a month to perform an extended road test, and it looks like your solution worked. No more Freeze!
Thanks again!
I wish you and your family well!
Davey

Thanks and you're welcome.

[Foxy Stoat]

I know exactly what this issue is. I've got an Acer laptop with an Intel N3710 CPU very similar to yours, and there's a known bug in that CPU family that never got properly fixed until kernel 5.6. It's something to do with the i915 graphics driver and generally only happened when running Firefox (possibly something to do with GPU acceleration). I got complete system lock-ups until installing the 5.11 kernel. After that, no more system freezes at all, not one. So you did the right thing in switching kernels.

[SMG]

Moderator note: daviddd's issue can now be found here Random freezes because forum rules indicate to create new topics for new issues. Please do not add questions to someone else's SOLVED topic.