How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

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B2WJ
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How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by B2WJ »

I'm deeply relating to a regular flow of negative technical board comments about Mint's File Manager, like this one just hours ago on Reddit:

"Default file manager is a bit laggy with large folders, so I typically have second file manager installed for those situations."

Well, for me, "bit laggy" a gargantuan understatement: 59 minutes to transfer 20GB to a USB 3.0 drive. Easily 15 minutes to transfer a meagre 2.5GB to 3.5GB onto an "extreme transfer" SD card. Whatever the receiving device, megabyte per second speeds average roughly 8MB/s, with occasional brief rises to 12.5MB/s -- never higher. Theoretically the USB 3.0 device would see write speed approaching 625MB/s and the extreme transfer SD would see write speed approaching 90MB/s. The excruciating slowness affects ONLY OUTGOING file/data transfers; incoming transfer speeds remain excellent. With two different specification Mint 19.3-only PCs equally affected, a PC issue is ruled out. And with connections involving not only USB but the circuit boards, the culprit must be the File Manager.

Reportedly there are some optimizations coming that are being experimented with this month. While hoping that's true, I'm trying the following:

1. Seeking suggestions per this post's heading, "How Do I Replace Mint's Highly 'Laggy' File Manager -- and With What?" I find alternative file manager references, but no strong endorsements.
2. Installing a dual boot with Ubuntu or Intel's Clear Linux (both PCs are Intel) in hopes those operating systems support better write speeds.
3. The -- ugh -- tricky solutions of using my two Android devices for transfers while performing the fairly arduous task of dual booting Mint with Android x86.

Obviously, any and all thoughts, suggestions, very, very, very welcome.

Thanks,
Bill
Last edited by B2WJ on Sun Jan 19, 2020 1:23 pm, edited 21 times in total.

Kadaitcha Man
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Re: Outgoing Mint 19.3 Data Transfers Disastrously Slow

Post by Kadaitcha Man »

B2WJ wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:31 pm
So rather than share numerous and likely pointless command results...
Not enough information. Please post the output of inxi -Fxz, enclosed in code markers, which you can select using the </> icon when you are replying.
It's pronounced kad-eye-cha, not kada-itcha.

B2WJ
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Re: Outgoing Mint 19.3 Data Transfers Disastrously Slow

Post by B2WJ »

Okay, @Kadaitcha Man. First the 2012 system. Note that this unit, given the manufacture date, uses a hybrid "BIOS" system that switches to EFI as warranted by an installation.

Code: Select all

wj2bartman@wj2bartman-Aspire-Z1620:~$ inxi -Fxz
System:
  Host: wj2bartman-Aspire-Z1620 Kernel: 5.0.0-37-generic x86_64 bits: 64 
  compiler: gcc v: 7.4.0 Desktop: Xfce 4.14.1 Distro: Linux Mint 19.3 Tricia 
  base: Ubuntu 18.04 bionic 
Machine:
  Type: Desktop System: Acer product: Aspire Z1620 v: P01-A2 
  serial: <filter> 
  Mobo: Acer model: Aspire Z1620 serial: <filter> BIOS: American Megatrends 
  v: P01-B0 date: 01/13/2012 
CPU:
  Topology: Dual Core model: Intel Celeron G530 bits: 64 type: MCP 
  arch: Sandy Bridge rev: 7 L2 cache: 2048 KiB 
  flags: lm nx pae sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 ssse3 vmx bogomips: 9579 
  Speed: 1597 MHz min/max: 1600/2400 MHz Core speeds (MHz): 1: 1596 2: 1596 
Graphics:
  Device-1: Intel 2nd Generation Core Processor Family Integrated Graphics 
  vendor: Acer Incorporated ALI driver: i915 v: kernel bus ID: 00:02.0 
  Display: x11 server: X.Org 1.19.6 driver: modesetting unloaded: fbdev,vesa 
  resolution: 1600x900~60Hz 
  OpenGL: renderer: Mesa DRI Intel Sandybridge Desktop v: 3.3 Mesa 19.0.8 
  direct render: Yes 
Audio:
  Device-1: Intel 6 Series/C200 Series Family High Definition Audio 
  vendor: Acer Incorporated ALI driver: snd_hda_intel v: kernel 
  bus ID: 00:1b.0 
  Sound Server: ALSA v: k5.0.0-37-generic 
Network:
  Device-1: Realtek RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet 
  vendor: Acer Incorporated ALI driver: r8169 v: kernel port: e000 
  bus ID: 03:00.0 
  IF: enp3s0 state: down mac: <filter> 
  Device-2: Ralink RT3090 Wireless 802.11n 1T/1R PCIe vendor: Lite-On 
  driver: rt2800pci v: 2.3.0 port: e000 bus ID: 05:00.0 
  IF: wlp5s0 state: up mac: <filter> 
Drives:
  Local Storage: total: 465.76 GiB used: 76.67 GiB (16.5%) 
  ID-1: /dev/sda vendor: Seagate model: ST3500413AS size: 465.76 GiB 
Partition:
  ID-1: / size: 457.45 GiB used: 76.67 GiB (16.8%) fs: ext4 dev: /dev/sda1 
Sensors:
  System Temperatures: cpu: 39.0 C mobo: N/A 
  Fan Speeds (RPM): N/A 
Info:
  Processes: 161 Uptime: 40m Memory: 1.82 GiB used: 773.7 MiB (41.6%) 
  Init: systemd runlevel: 5 Compilers: gcc: 7.4.0 Shell: bash v: 4.4.20 
  inxi: 3.0.32 
wj2bartman@wj2bartman-Aspire-Z1620:~$ 
Now, the 2014 unit, a pure EFI system.

Code: Select all

wj2bartman@wj2bartman-Aspire-E1-731:~$ inxi -Fxz
System:
  Host: wj2bartman-Aspire-E1-731 Kernel: 5.0.0-37-generic x86_64 bits: 64 
  compiler: gcc v: 7.4.0 Desktop: Xfce 4.14.1 Distro: Linux Mint 19.3 Tricia 
  base: Ubuntu 18.04 bionic 
Machine:
  Type: Laptop System: Acer product: Aspire E1-731 v: V2.30 serial: <filter> 
  Mobo: Acer model: EA70_HC v: Type2 - Board Version serial: <filter> 
  UEFI: Insyde v: 2.30 date: 04/23/2014 
Battery:
  ID-1: BAT0 charge: 44.1 Wh condition: 44.1/48.4 Wh (91%) model: AS10D31 
  status: Full 
CPU:
  Topology: Dual Core model: Intel Pentium 2020M bits: 64 type: MCP 
  arch: Ivy Bridge rev: 9 L2 cache: 2048 KiB 
  flags: lm nx pae sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 ssse3 vmx bogomips: 9577 
  Speed: 1198 MHz min/max: 1200/2400 MHz Core speeds (MHz): 1: 1197 2: 1197 
Graphics:
  Device-1: Intel 3rd Gen Core processor Graphics 
  vendor: Acer Incorporated ALI driver: i915 v: kernel bus ID: 00:02.0 
  Display: x11 server: X.Org 1.19.6 driver: modesetting unloaded: fbdev,vesa 
  resolution: 1600x900~60Hz 
  OpenGL: renderer: Mesa DRI Intel Ivybridge Mobile v: 4.2 Mesa 19.0.8 
  direct render: Yes 
Audio:
  Device-1: Intel 7 Series/C216 Family High Definition Audio 
  vendor: Acer Incorporated ALI driver: snd_hda_intel v: kernel 
  bus ID: 00:1b.0 
  Sound Server: ALSA v: k5.0.0-37-generic 
Network:
  Device-1: Qualcomm Atheros QCA9565 / AR9565 Wireless Network Adapter 
  vendor: Wistron NeWeb driver: ath9k v: kernel port: 4040 bus ID: 07:00.0 
  IF: wlp7s0 state: up mac: <filter> 
  Device-2: Qualcomm Atheros AR8151 v2.0 Gigabit Ethernet 
  vendor: Acer Incorporated ALI driver: atl1c v: 1.0.1.1-NAPI port: 2000 
  bus ID: 08:00.0 
  IF: enp8s0 state: down mac: <filter> 
  Device-3: Atheros AR3012 Bluetooth 4.0 type: USB driver: btusb 
  bus ID: 2-1.6:4 
Drives:
  Local Storage: total: 473.31 GiB used: 77.11 GiB (16.3%) 
  ID-1: /dev/sda vendor: Seagate model: ST500LT012-1DG142 size: 465.76 GiB 
  ID-2: /dev/sdb type: USB vendor: PNY model: USB 2.0 FD size: 7.55 GiB 
Partition:
  ID-1: / size: 456.96 GiB used: 77.10 GiB (16.9%) fs: ext4 dev: /dev/sda2 
Sensors:
  System Temperatures: cpu: 36.0 C mobo: N/A 
  Fan Speeds (RPM): N/A 
Info:
  Processes: 173 Uptime: 44m Memory: 3.73 GiB used: 1.02 GiB (27.3%) 
  Init: systemd runlevel: 5 Compilers: gcc: 7.4.0 Shell: bash v: 4.4.20 
  inxi: 3.0.32 
wj2bartman@wj2bartman-Aspire-E1-731:~$ 

ajgreeny
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Re: How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by ajgreeny »

In relation to your comments about the transfer speed for files using a file-manager
59 minutes to transfer 20GB to a USB 3.0 drive. Easily 15 minutes to transfer a meagre 2.5GB to 3.5GB onto an "extreme transfer" SD card.
I have always found that transfer speed is much faster using a terminal command rather than drag/drop with file-manager.

I think I read of the reason for this some time ago but I do not have a reference to link you to; a search may give you more info.

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Re: How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by gm10 »

ajgreeny wrote:
Sun Jan 19, 2020 4:17 pm
I think I read of the reason for this some time ago but I do not have a reference to link you to; a search may give you more info.
The only thing I can think of is that if you've got the destination open in the file manager, then it will constantly try to update the directory contents for every chunk of data written, which slows things down.
Tune up your LM 19+: ppa:gm10/linuxmint-tools

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Re: How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by gittiest personITW »

It does also sound as if it is transferring at about USB2 speed.
Your card reader - - - it is USB2?

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Re: How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by B2WJ »

gittiest personITW wrote:
Sun Jan 19, 2020 5:19 pm
It does also sound as if it is transferring at about USB2 speed.
Your card reader - - - it is USB2?
Two computers using different internal card readers. So there's no USB connection as with a portable USB hub but instead direct connection through the computers' circuit boards:
  • Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTS5209 PCI Express Card Reader (rev 01), Realtek version 6.3.9600.28156
  • JMicron Technology Corporation x64 "multi-in-1 media card reader," version 1.0.71.1
Maximum read/write speeds depend on the SD card class and brand. That said, even "Extreme" class SD cards like mine are not only no where close to USB 3.0 speed but can't even match USB 2.0. The USB 2.0 standard offers a theoretical maximum signaling rate of 480 megabits per second. By contrast my cards theoretically max out at 170MB/s read and 90MB/s write. Even allowing for real world factors including a potentially non-stellar card reader, there's no way I should be seeing speeds no better than 12.5MB/s. However, I've noted with interest the @ajgreeny and @gm10 discussion regarding a problem from leaving the transfer destination folder open.

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Re: How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by B2WJ »

ajgreeny wrote:
Sun Jan 19, 2020 4:17 pm
I have always found that transfer speed is much faster using a terminal command rather than drag/drop with file-manager.
So, @ajgreeny, @gm10, and @gittiest personITW, a good discussion that's gotten me to calm down over the speed collapse. I'll give moving files via terminal a try. Believe it would be

Code: Select all

mv [file] [directory]
though very likely requiring "sudo" in front. If it helps at least somewhat, I'll mark post "SOLVED."

However, I do suspect there may be something to the rumours, followed on Reddit, that file manager optimizations are being experimented with this month and may be coming to Mint. The reason I suspect the rumours to be true is because my problem seems to have worsened over time. As I transitioned over much of 2019 from MS Windows 10 to Mint 19.1 Tara, I had many files to transfer and no complaints about Mint's speed. As I prepared to fully eliminate Windows 10 in August, I sensed transfers were moving faster in Microsoft than with Mint. But the perceived difference wasn't enough to prompt a close check of transfer rates. Then in the fall came the stunning 59 minutes to transfer 20GB. That nearly had me returning two USB 3.0 drives under warranty until I realized the problem involved not only every other of my USB drives, but also my SD cards. And two by then Mint-only PCs with fairly different specifications shared the same problem.
Last edited by B2WJ on Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Kadaitcha Man
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Re: How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by Kadaitcha Man »

B2WJ wrote:
Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:14 am
Believe it would be

Code: Select all

mv [file] [directory]
though very likely requiring "sudo" in front.
I wouldn't do that. Use cp, not mv. You can delete the source files later if that's what you want.
It's pronounced kad-eye-cha, not kada-itcha.

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Re: How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by smurphos »

B2WJ wrote:
Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:14 am
However, I do suspect there may be something to the rumours, followed on Reddit, that file manager optimizations are being experimented with this month and may be coming to Mint.
Just for clarity be aware that Mint per se doesn't have a File Manager.

The specific Desktop Environments do - i.e you are using XFCE which has Thunar as it's File manager, MATE has Caja as a file manager and Cinnamon has Nemo. Only the latter is directly developed by Mint. All have strengths and weaknesses. None are perfect. But it's helpful to be specific and can also narrow down the real cause of the issue - the File manager itself, upstream libraries it uses etc etc.

Don't be chucking a random sudo in front of your commands unless you want the files on the destination to be owned by root.
For custom Nemo actions, useful scripts for the Cinnamon desktop, and Cinnamox themes visit my Github pages.

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Re: How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by B2WJ »

Kadaitcha Man wrote:
Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:24 am
I wouldn't do that. Use cp, not mv. You can delete the source files later if that's what you want.
Oh my. Big thank you. Copy the safe way to go. By the way, right-clicking a file or folder provides the option to move or copy it somewhere. Would that not activate the same process as using the terminal commands mv and cp?

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Re: How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by B2WJ »

smurphos wrote:
Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:31 am
Just for clarity be aware that Mint per se doesn't have a File Manager.
Learning so much. Thanks. As it happens, I clean-installed 19.3 Mate on both affected systems after 19.3 Xfce upgrades created problems including very jittery HDDs, disappearing or transparent windows, dysfunctional touch pad supposedly having a fix. By doing so (pjotr may be irked; he warns not to clean install within a series) I unknowingly switched from Thunar to Caja and saw no speed improvement. None. So I'm prompted to continue experimenting, beginning with dual boots of Xubuntu and perhaps MX Linux. What would you think of trying Cinnamon in a Pentium-powered, 4GB DDR3 RAM system? I know it wouldn't be ideal, but I have 19.3 Mate running perfectly in a Celeron-powered 2GB DDR3 system, even though it theoretically should not be installed in that ACER oldie-but-goodie.
smurphos wrote:
Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:31 am
But it's helpful to be specific and can also narrow down the real cause of the issue - the File manager itself, upstream libraries it uses etc etc.
As I proceed, I'm beginning to suspect the File Manager as culprit may be ruled out. Indexing, perhaps? Many of my files have been repeatedly moved around and/or renamed post Microsoft. Likewise your reference to upstream libraries and, yes, etc., etc.
smurphos wrote:
Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:31 am
Don't be chucking a random sudo in front of your commands unless you want the files on the destination to be owned by root.
Thanks. I was guessing there. I'll only use SUDO when one of the major, trustworthy Linux/Ubuntu/Mint "bibles" -- such as the excellent Linux Tips Project -- instructs me to do so. Learned to be very, very, very careful with terminal commands overall after fortunately only slightly messing up the 19.1 cache due to poor command syntax. :oops:
Last edited by B2WJ on Mon Jan 20, 2020 3:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by Moem »

B2WJ wrote:
Mon Jan 20, 2020 3:25 pm
As it happens, I clean-installed 19.3 Mate on both affected systems after 19.3 Xfce upgrades created problems including very jittery HDDs, disappearing or transparent windows, dysfunctional touch pad supposedly having a fix. By doing so (pjotr may be irked; he warns not to clean install within a series) I unknowingly switched from Thunar to Caja
I don't think Pjotr has ever expressed the opinion that one should not use a clean installation to switch from one desktop environment to another, in the same version. The expression 'within a series' implies an upgrade; what you did is not an upgrade. Mate and Xfce are equal alternatives, there's no 'up' or 'down' here. You could call it a 'sidegrade'...
Image

If your issue is solved, kindly indicate that by editing the first post in the topic, and adding [SOLVED] to the title. Thanks!

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Re: How Do I Replace Mint's Highly "Laggy" File Manager -- and With What?

Post by B2WJ »

Moem wrote:
Mon Jan 20, 2020 3:31 pm
I don't think Pjotr has ever expressed the opinion that one should not use a clean installation to switch from one desktop environment to another, in the same version. The expression 'within a series' implies an upgrade; what you did is not an upgrade. Mate and Xfce are equal alternatives, there's no 'up' or 'down' here. You could call it a 'sidegrade'...
"Side-grade," yeah. Thanks, Moem, for the speedy rescue. Didn't think that through very clearly. So another ... :oops:.

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