KDE5 is still disaster

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RichardR
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Re: KDE5 is still disaster

Post by RichardR » Sat Jan 20, 2018 2:25 pm

RichardR wrote:
"... as I heard that KDE5 marks the end of the whole KDE desktop system anyway."

Link or source?
My apologies, I was rather imprecise. From what I read, Linux Mint will be dropping the KDE desktop as of release 19: https://itsfoss.com/linux-mint-drops-kde/
It appears that KDE kan still be installed on top of Mint 19, but there will no longer be a separate KDE version.

lmuserx4849
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Re: KDE5 is still disaster

Post by lmuserx4849 » Tue Jan 23, 2018 7:16 pm

I woudn't call it a disaster, but a disappointment that leads to the same result. Every time I think about upgrading to KDE5 (LM17.3/KDE4), I open a VM with a KDE5 desktop (from another distro) and I change my mind. I took the ride from 3 to 4. Just when it started getting stable, they went to 5. Is it worth investing time again? How many more years of instability. They had 5 different Desktop Views in kde4, 2 in kde5. I spent a lot of time trying to get Grouping Desktop and Groups to work. A number of features introduced in 4, don't exist in 5, so knowledge was nontransferable and time wasted. And now with a qt6 in the works. Are we in for a repeat? Qt6 and Wayland are going to make for some interesting times. It might be a great experimental desktop, but imho not a practical stable office desktop for use today. Just simple things that I have done for years can cause a crash. They have changed locations of config files multiple times. I just tried a script that uses kdialog, --caption is no longer supported. No problem, use --title. But the progress bar property wasCancelled doesn't work and the example at techbase works differently in kde5 than kde4. Someone worked really hard on the kde4 doc at techbase.kde.org, userbase.kde.org, community.kde.org. It got me through the kde4 learning curve, but it hasn't been updated to reflect kde5. The environment of support isn't as much fun and tempers are short.

I stopped using KDE's PIM in 4, but that also meant getting rid of little things like kalarm. I like konsole, dolphin, okular, k3b, kate. I have some code invested in kate. Little things are annoying, like renaming ksnapshot, Spectacle. Although I read something about replacing that with KScreenGenie. And I'm not a fan of the flat icons and a number of the new UI's. It just doesn't seem as intuitive and natural.

In some ways, I feel this is a decision between qt and gtk. I read once that while lxde was upgrading to gnome3 they decided to change to qt, thus lxqt. But it seems they both exist. lxde is gtk based and lxqt is qt based. kde is qt based, while cinnamon, mate, xfce gnome are gtk based. There seems to be a greater relationship disconnect between qt and kde, than there is between gtk and gnome/cinnamon/mate, so kde devs are more susceptible to what/when qt does things which amplifies the problems. If you work with vendors and other software, you begin to notice where they have problems and their preferences.

blue_bullet
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Re: KDE5 is still disaster

Post by blue_bullet » Thu Jan 25, 2018 2:13 pm

@lmuserx4849,
I stopped using KDE's PIM in 4, but that also meant getting rid of little things like kalarm.
Why did you stop using PIM? I had to switch to Kalarm to run jobs that cron could no longer run in Linux Mint 17.x KDE. google01103 solved my cron problem over on the KDE Forum when I got no help here.
https://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=119541

I appreciate your observations and insights as to what is going on in the latest KDE efforts. For many things it seems as though they ignored what was done in KDE4 and started anew. There may be good reasons for doing that but not at a loss of functionality. That is the reason I left Ubuntu for Linux Mint when the gnome devs dumbed down Natilus.

For now I continue to use LM 17.3 KDE and keep a version of 18.3 KDE updated on an old HP laptop to watch it. I cannot move there until they fix what they have ignored. LM 17.3 KDE is supported until April 2019 so I have some time.

o-l-d
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Re: KDE5 is still disaster

Post by o-l-d » Fri Feb 02, 2018 5:12 pm

Just upgraded today and everything is still working flawlessly :D

@lastmintkde ~ $ inxi -Fxz
System: Host: lastmintkde Kernel: 4.13.0-32-generic x86_64 (64 bit gcc: 5.4.0)
Desktop: KDE Plasma 5.12.0 (Qt 5.9.3) Distro: Linux Mint 18.3 Sylvia

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noc
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Re: KDE5 is still disaster

Post by noc » Sun Feb 04, 2018 2:41 pm

I have a somewhat different experience with KDE. Apart of having to disable baloo because of it eating up all my system's resources, most things went smoothly until it completely broke itself for no reason.

After using KDE periodically for years, I have to say that it's more unstable/complicated than what I like. The best DEs between modern and useful are Cinnamon, Budgie and MATE for me. (Well I wish that Cinnamon's menu effects could revert back to the non-choppy ones, but still a great Desktop)

Anyway, if you still need to run KDE I would recommend you to give Manjaro a chance instead of building up an unstable dependency hell.
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Jim Hauser
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Re: KDE5 is still disaster

Post by Jim Hauser » Sun Feb 04, 2018 5:24 pm

o-l-d wrote:Just upgraded today and everything is still working flawlessly :D

@lastmintkde ~ $ inxi -Fxz
System: Host: lastmintkde Kernel: 4.13.0-32-generic x86_64 (64 bit gcc: 5.4.0)
Desktop: KDE Plasma 5.12.0 (Qt 5.9.3) Distro: Linux Mint 18.3 Sylvia
Same here, same kernel, same desktop, same distro edition... no problems.

Hoser Rob
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Re: KDE5 is still disaster

Post by Hoser Rob » Mon Feb 05, 2018 9:16 am

Jim Hauser wrote:
o-l-d wrote:Just upgraded today and everything is still working flawlessly :D

@lastmintkde ~ $ inxi -Fxz
System: Host: lastmintkde Kernel: 4.13.0-32-generic x86_64 (64 bit gcc: 5.4.0)
Desktop: KDE Plasma 5.12.0 (Qt 5.9.3) Distro: Linux Mint 18.3 Sylvia
Same here, same kernel, same desktop, same distro edition... no problems.
Same here. I actually found Cinnamon and Xfce buggier.

jack rooster
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Re: KDE5 is still disaster

Post by jack rooster » Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:07 pm

I sadly have to agree. I switched to Linux full-time in 2012 with Mint KDE. Ever since Mint announced that they were dropping the KDE edition I've been looking for a replacement distro. I've tried Mint KDE 18.x, OpenSUSE, Manjaro, Maui, Kubuntu and Neon and have had MAJOR problems with all of them. Maybe in a year or so it'll be stable enough to use. Right now I'm using Cinnamon and Mate but it's like going from a brand new, deluxe Mercedes to an old-style VW Beetle.
Lenovo T430U laptop, 4GB RAM, 250GB Samsung SSD, Linux Mint 17.3 KDE 64-bit

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tovian
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Re: KDE5 is still disaster

Post by tovian » Thu Feb 15, 2018 6:45 pm

FYI:

Because there did not already seem to be one... I started a new thread for those of us who use and like KDE to discuss alternatives given that Mint intends to drop the KDE distro.

THIS THREAD is where I hope we can exchange information on alternatives. I am currently trying several different distro's, but I'm interested in the ideas and experiences that other folks have.


BTW: My main gripe with KDE-5 vs KDE-4 is that with "5" I can no longer specify the desktop font. I prefer a light, plain-color desktop background - which REQUIRES a dark font. The white font, even shadowed, is totally unusable by my old eyes. KDE-4 allows the user to change the typeface (group), the color, and some other characteristics (and not have to jump through hoops to do it). I joined the KDE forum and submitted a question about the fonts in KDE-5, but they basically ignored me. Linux (and the DE publishers) had an opportunity to give disgruntled Windows users a SUPER excuse to use Linux, but it seems everybody is running away from this opportunity instead of running WITH it.
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lotech
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Re: KDE5 is still disaster

Post by lotech » Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:49 am

+1, I tried to like KDE but couldn't, I gave it up few years ago and never return. To me it is just another m$ win, too much of eyes candies, I disable the bouncing flashy thingy and the wallet after installation, and the taskbar acting weird whenever I put things to it, can never align properly, I like Gnome and Cinnamon/Mate more, sorry to say but I am glad that Mint dump KDE !
Pepi wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:13 am
I gave up on KDE around 6 months ago. Just too many weird things happening.
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