Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

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speedyx
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by speedyx »

Yes! Great! I haven't read something about this. Thank you monkeyboy.
Of course is only the response from the forum. I think many people that haven't problem with mint that just works, don't use so often the forum.
I understand very well that a little team can't focus on mint-gnome AND mint-64bits AND mint-KDE AND ... One should be enough!
But my thoughts are for the future, considering the growing interests for KDE, the newbie background from Windows, the better quality of ubuntu instead of kubuntu... and some other things that show the need of an ubuntu based distro with KDE to became the main distro for some team.
I hope a growing money contributions for Mint that will permit a bigger team to focus on a KDE distro too.
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by Steely »

Although I primarily use the KDE desktop with Mint, my only real concern is the quality of the Mint KDE release which have always proved to be worth the wait. Boo has an uncanny ability to iron out a lot of the problems with the Kubuntu base.

Spend some time on the Mint IRC channels and you will see the cart before the horse mentality.

Day 1 ... They join the channel to ask for assistance with getting their sound working ( Intel ) or wondering what driver to install for their ATI card. Most of those questions are answered and resolved when possible.

Day 2 ... They spend a day surfing the net and checking for the version # of almost every application on their system. They also compile a list of " must have games and applications ".

Day 3 ... They are back on the irc channel wondering why they can't install a game or other software from source. Also, why are the versions of firefox not already at 3.6 and so on.

Day 4, 5, and 6 ( and occasionaly more ) they are still trying to get game x or app x installed from source.

Day 7 When asked if they had searched for the application or equivalent in Synaptic its not uncommon to get the response , what's synaptic ?.

I can understand the new user being eager to learn and may not know what certain things are on their system. Also not being aware of the reason for code / apps being frozen during the development cycle in order to increase the stability of the release. Maybe a sticky on Mint's main page and at the top of the forum page explaining these concepts as well as the pros and cons of installing software from outside of the repos used by synaptic and the software manager would help some of these users. Although the Mint User Guide does cover some of this many do not read it and turn to the forums and irc first.
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by MALsPa »

monkeyboy wrote:The list below is from the Linux Mint Community page, where users are asked to list the edition they are using. It looks like the developers are doing a fine job meeting the needs and wishes of those users with the current Main Edition as it is now. JMO

# Main Edition (683 people)
# x64 Edition (247 people)
# KDE Community Edition (56 people)
# Universal Edition (39 people)
# Xfce Community Edition (19 people)
# Fluxbox Community Edition (5 people)

If I'm asked which Mint edition I'm using, the answer is the Main (GNOME) edition. I use it because it's the main edition, and because the Mint team does a good job with it -- not because I prefer to use GNOME.

If I'm asked which desktop environment or window manager I wish was the default for Mint, the answer is KDE -- if the Mint team can do a good job with KDE4.
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by monkeyboy »

MALsPa wrote:
monkeyboy wrote:The list below is from the Linux Mint Community page, where users are asked to list the edition they are using. It looks like the developers are doing a fine job meeting the needs and wishes of those users with the current Main Edition as it is now. JMO
KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10
# Main Edition (683 people)
# x64 Edition (247 people)
# KDE Community Edition (56 people)
# Universal Edition (39 people)
# Xfce Community Edition (19 people)
# Fluxbox Community Edition (5 people)

If I'm asked which Mint edition I'm using, the answer is the Main (GNOME) edition. I use it because it's the main edition, and because the Mint team does a good job with it -- not because I prefer to use GNOME.

If I'm asked which desktop environment or window manager I wish was the default for Mint, the answer is KDE -- if the Mint team can do a good job with KDE4.
So what percent of the user base fits into the your category? Is it significant enough to justify the changes the OP suggested with "Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10" or is an insignificant number?
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by rec9140 »

MALsPa wrote:
monkeyboy wrote:If I'm asked which desktop environment or window manager I wish was the default for Mint, the answer is KDE -- if the Mint team can do a good job with KDE4.
I don't understand this?????

You prefer a KDE X WM? but yet download and install a non KDE one??? WHY???

There is a KDE Version of Mint. I call it KMint, and there is only this version as far as *I* am concerned...

If you want KDE then download the KDE version... I am not getting why you wouldn't do this if you prefer and want KDE.

As side from the KDE 4.x issues, not relevant here, KMint is the PREMIER KDE distro... ABOVE ALL, BAR NONE. KMint works, works great....

So I am not following why you would install a non KDE version.... :?
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by MALsPa »

monkeyboy wrote:
MALsPa wrote:
monkeyboy wrote:The list below is from the Linux Mint Community page, where users are asked to list the edition they are using. It looks like the developers are doing a fine job meeting the needs and wishes of those users with the current Main Edition as it is now. JMO
KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10
# Main Edition (683 people)
# x64 Edition (247 people)
# KDE Community Edition (56 people)
# Universal Edition (39 people)
# Xfce Community Edition (19 people)
# Fluxbox Community Edition (5 people)

If I'm asked which Mint edition I'm using, the answer is the Main (GNOME) edition. I use it because it's the main edition, and because the Mint team does a good job with it -- not because I prefer to use GNOME.

If I'm asked which desktop environment or window manager I wish was the default for Mint, the answer is KDE -- if the Mint team can do a good job with KDE4.
So what percent of the user base fits into the your category? Is it significant enough to justify the changes the OP suggested with "Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10" or is an insignificant number?
I have no idea what percentage fits into my category, monkeyboy. I just replied to your post to show that those statistics don't say anything at all about which default desktop environment Mint users would prefer.

Doesn't matter to me, I will use Mint whether GNOME or KDE is is the default, just as I do with Ubuntu. I'll continue to use the main GNOME version of Mint, and I'll continue to use Ubuntu instead of Kubuntu.

I use both KDE and GNOME regularly, and have for some years now. I've always thought that KDE was the better DE, overall. KDE4 might change that opinion, as it has for others.
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by MALsPa »

rec9140 wrote:
MALsPa wrote:
monkeyboy wrote:If I'm asked which desktop environment or window manager I wish was the default for Mint, the answer is KDE -- if the Mint team can do a good job with KDE4.
I don't understand this?????

You prefer a KDE X WM? but yet download and install a non KDE one??? WHY???

There is a KDE Version of Mint. I call it KMint, and there is only this version as far as *I* am concerned...

If you want KDE then download the KDE version... I am not getting why you wouldn't do this if you prefer and want KDE.
Just because that's what you would do doesn't meant that's what everyone else should do.

My reasons are quite simple. I already use Mepis, which uses KDE. Mepis is usually my primary distro. Sometimes my primary distro has been the KDE version of Debian Stable.

I also like GNOME, and so it's no problem to me to install a second or third distro that comes with GNOME.

Also, when it comes to Mint, the default environment is GNOME, and I feel that it's the environment that the developers prefer. It comes out first. I figure that it's probably the best Mint version. Perhaps I'm wrong about that, but generally speaking the version that a distro's developers focus on first is probably going to be the best version of that distro, wouldn't you say?

One more point is that while I like using GNOME, I always include a few KDE applications in a GNOME installation, like Konqueror and/or Krusader, Amarok, a few others. I don't think there's any law against using GNOME with a few KDE applications, though.
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by rec9140 »

MALsPa wrote:Just because that's what you would do doesn't meant that's what everyone else should do.

Also, when it comes to Mint, the default environment is GNOME, and I feel that it's the environment that the developers prefer. It comes out first. I figure that it's probably the best Mint version. Perhaps I'm wrong about that, but generally speaking the version that a distro's developers focus on first is probably going to be the best version of that distro, wouldn't you say?
No. I wouldn't.... I don't consider any distro that uses g**censored**e, thats why I don't use Ubuntu...only KDE based derivatives I only look at or consider distros which are KDE based. Always have, and always will, so long as KDE 4.x gets its act together, other wise will move to xfce or something, but g**censored**e, never.

Linux Mint was around for while, got rave reviews, I looked them over and each time had to move on as it was g**censored*e, then a KDE version was released... I've not looked back since... up to Elyssa (*I* have issues with KDE 4.x, and its not past being a test, which will be outlined in its proper time and place).

So if you **prefer** KDE, I don't get why you would like at something other than a KDE distro...

The Linux Mint and KMint teams are not really the same... so KMint comes out when its devs which is Boo and the KMint team determine its ready... from what I know and see the Linux Mint devs Clem and Team don't have any involvement in the KMint dev.. so the KMint Team PREFERS KDE based on your comment...
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by MALsPa »

rec9140 wrote:So if you **prefer** KDE, I don't get why you would like at something other than a KDE distro...
I prefer KDE but I also like GNOME, Xfce, Fluxbox, Openbox, Enlightenment...

I prefer not to stick with only one environment or one distro.

If you want to use only KDE and only KDE distros, that's fine.

I really don't see why it has to be one way or the other. It isn't uncommon for me to have both KDE and GNOME installed on the same distro, along with a Xfce and Openbox, something like that. I just like having different things to log into on different days. I get bored with just one desktop environment all the time.
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by deleted »

if there was an x64 KDE version of Mint, I'd run that. Right now there's not. I know I could install KDE, etc, and weed out the Gnome apps I don't like... But it's really not a problem. I've been x64 now for 6 years (on different distros), but right now I'd rather enjoy the "out of the box" experience that Mint x64 main offers.
-Hinto
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by satya164 »

If Mint uses KDE, then it will be a DVD! My only complain.(Though I prefer Gnome)
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by deleted »

CD vs DVD is irrelevant now (at least with newer hardware).
But also a KDE version could be a "network" install or trimmed down.
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by rec9140 »

satya164 wrote:If Mint uses KDE, then it will be a DVD! My only complain.
My only -1 is there is 3GB of space wasted... FILL THAT SPACE UP WITH SOFTWARE ! ! ! ! ! ! :D :D
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by manny »

I run Helena Main Edition on one partition and installed KDE Helena in a different one. This is the beauty of the Linux Mint community, we have the privilege to use different environments and enjoy evry one of them. Which one should be Main? I believe that will be up to the devs. to decide. I moved to the KDE enviroment because is beautiful and robust, we have the privilege to choose which one suits our needs best. One thing I noticed is the lack of KDE8 reviews on the web, is to bad that such a great OS is not promotioned as deserve.
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by phd7 »

[quote="manny"One thing I noticed is the lack of KDE8 reviews on the web, is to bad that such a great OS is not promotioned as deserve.[/quote]

I don't know about the net, but Helena(Gnome) is reviewed in the latest issue of Linux Format magazine. The included a live disk in the mag, and gave it 9 out of 10 and mentioned it is up to no.2 on the latest distrowatch list.
I checked out the live disk which confirmed to me that I am NOT a gnome fan, hence my current downloading of the x64 KDE torrent. Of course, now my ISP decides to collapse and I am only getting 20kb/s after midnight. Feckin' typical!
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by manny »

phd7. You are correct, Main Edition was covered very well by the Linux Media after release, it is all over the place with excellent reviews. Unfortunately KDE 8 Helena is not getting the same treatment. This is disappointing because people tries new OSs based on what they read and in my opinion this community would grow tremendously if KDE was promotioned as it deserves. Not many people would go back to their original distros after trying this one.
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by hunkirdowne »

hinto wrote:if there was an x64 KDE version of Mint, I'd run that. Right now there's not. I know I could install KDE, etc, and weed out the Gnome apps I don't like... But it's really not a problem. I've been x64 now for 6 years (on different distros), but right now I'd rather enjoy the "out of the box" experience that Mint x64 main offers.
-Hinto
I'm not sure of the timing but about the time you were posting the above the following came out:
http://www.linuxmint.com/blog/?p=1275

The above states (and I've torrented the ISO) that there is indeed an x64 KDE. Even before I saw this thread I was wondering about KDE4. I have used Gnome for years and have no major problems with it. But I have recently been "living" with KDE to see what it's like and it has some advantages over Gnome, IMO. But my experience with KDE is primarily with Debian Stable and thus v3.5.10, not v4.x. I had some difficulty with KKK and ditched it in favor of Mint8 (Gnome). I then tried Helena KDE CE and it didn't fly well on my aging architecture but I have a newer (one year old) laptop to try it out on if only via Live CD (install not currently an option because it's the equivalent of a production computer -- no testing here.

But here's my bottom line. I use Debian / Stable for it's rock-solid stability. I use Ubuntu (and now Mint) for it's ability to handle multimedia (but Debian is catching up with Lenny and might actually be there if I went to Testing) and because I like the DE interface better. Regardless of whether Mint is based on Ubuntu or Debian and regardless of whether or not KDE obtains equality or prominence, it is worth the wait to me (in the long run) to have a stable environment to run in (which is why I will most certainly have at least two distros on my HDD at any one time).

Don't get me wrong. I get ants-in-my-pants as much as anyone, but I appreciate the code vetting that gets done by dedicated professionals (OK, they're volunteers, but professional quality). This means that I don't have to take the time to monkey around with the system when I get home from work and I know my children aren't going to muck up the innards of the operating system (which is why they do not get net access in Windows) and cost me an evening or a weekend fixing what they broke! :-)

Personally, I like the proposal to base Mint on Debian (Testing, probably) and KDE (if they don't crater the DE) but I will take things as they are if it's the way it needs to be. My personal dream would be a Qt-based browser that is superior to Firefox but the sun doesn't shine much these days. :-D
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by deleted »

hunkirdowne:
That was a coincidence. I didn't know a 64 bit KDE version was in the works. I now have it downloaded and running in a VM (Hosted my Mint main).
I'm trying to decide if the gtk apps look native enough. I also miss nautilus-open-terminal. Is there a KDE equivalent (or can I edit the desktop context menu).

I also backed off of SID, and landed on Mint, since at the end of the day, I have to produce code.

Keeping a close watch on this distro.
-Hinto
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by Rank0 »

hinto wrote:I also miss nautilus-open-terminal. Is there a KDE equivalent (or can I edit the desktop context menu).
Sure. In Dolphin, the default file browser, you can press F4 which opens a small terminal for the current directory at the bottom of the program, or you can right click on a folder and choose the option to open up a terminal (I don't know what the option is precisely in English as I'm using a localised version of KDE). The option can anyway be found in a submenu.
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Re: Marketing proposal: KDE to became the default DE for Mint 10

Post by deleted »

What about from the Desktop, not in Dolphin?
-Hinto
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