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Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 11:07 am
by kmb42vt
craig10x wrote:which mirrors have the mint 11 gnome final release? (links please) thanks :)
Just about all of them by what I've checked so far. Head to the "Mirrors" page and see for yourself. :D

http://www.linuxmint.com/mirrors.php

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 11:30 am
by craig10x
thanks buddy :D
didn't know about that particular "mirrors" page...thanks for the link...downloading the 64 bit version now :wink:

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 12:23 pm
by exploder
Boo, we could go with the Gnome Network Manager to get around the problems you are having.

Edit: mastablasta, I experienced the nvidea problems you mentioned. I have 2 computers with nvidea graphics, one has an nvidea GT 220 and the other has nvidea 6150 on-board graphics. I tried Kubuntu 11.04 on both machines and at first was real happy with it, after about a days worth of use both systems suddenly had the nvidea drivers installed but were not in use problem. Removing and reinstalling the drivers only made things worse, desktop effects were completely trashed. I ended up going with something else to have KDE.

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 12:44 pm
by kmb42vt
exploder wrote:Boo, we could go with the Gnome Network Manager to get around the problems you are having.
I agree (for whatever my agreement is worth). The default KDE network manager has always been problematic and users of the KDE desktop environment, by what I've seen and read over the last few years and in my own experience, have been complaining on a regular basis about the very problems that Boo is seeing. Many of which are asking/recommending/suggesting/(downright demanding?) that the Gnome network manager (which is just about bullet proof) be used instead. In many cases I've read about users just dumping the KDE network manager for the Gnome version by themselves. Unless there's a specific reason for using the KDE network manager why not save them the trouble? :D

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 1:45 pm
by thouartsimple
Why don't we just use wicd by default? It's a great little network manager.

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 5:48 pm
by exploder
kmb42vt, you are right. We used Gnome Network Manager in the past because of issues. PCLinuxOS, Pardus and probably others use Gnome Network Manager to get around these kinds of problems.

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 7:46 pm
by Boo
I tried wicd but it had the same problem so I think it may be a deeper problem than the network manager.
I'll try gnome network manager again and see what happens.
EDIT
well network manager gnome made no difference but what it appears to be telling me is that maybe network manager connected to the network with auto-eth and then when i logged in the connection was dropped. then after a wait connects again.
EDIT2
further investigation shows it is the interface not network manager, so the gui frontend used dose not matter.
the interface still works perfectly on mint 10 KDE.
I have even updated the kernel to 2.6.39 from the kernel ppa and still no love.

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Fri May 27, 2011 10:48 am
by schrodinger's cat
Wicd is available in the repos for those who wish to use it. However, wicd does not yet have vpn support, so IMO it should not be the default network manager.

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Fri May 27, 2011 8:09 pm
by manny
My 2Cents in here and my ignorance on OS development also. It seems to me that the LTS releases are the best ones followed by regressions after them. In my opinion if some thing works we shouldn't try to fix it. If LM based in Kubuntu 11.04 has regressions from the previous releases why bother to release something that is broken? Wouldn't be better to fix the few problems that LM KDE 9 has, which by the way is solid rock stable and built from it LM11? As I said, I'm just an user but I hate regressions and I prefer something that works good than bleeding edge stuff that doesn't.

Again, an opinion from an ignorant.

Thanks

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Fri May 27, 2011 8:40 pm
by cpatrick08
manny wrote:My 2Cents in here and my ignorance on OS development also. It seems to me that the LTS releases are the best ones followed by regressions after them. In my opinion if some thing works we shouldn't try to fix it. If LM based in Kubuntu 11.04 has regressions from the previous releases why bother to release something that is broken? Wouldn't be better to fix the few problems that LM KDE 9 has, which by the way is solid rock stable and built from it LM11? As I said, I'm just an user but I hate regressions and I prefer something that works good than bleeding edge stuff that doesn't.

Again, an opinion from an ignorant.

Thanks
i agree if you cant get the lm11 kde to work then I think you should start basing kde off of debian testing.It would be easier for you and people would not have to reinstall every 6 months with is too short of time to get many changes that are not poorly implemented look at Ubuntu and unity, for a example, they needed 6 more months to get a good version of unity made ,it is usabile dont get me wrong, but still needs more work.

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Fri May 27, 2011 9:06 pm
by craig10x
Keep in mind that debian testing can have plenty of breakages...it's not all "peaches and cream" in fact if anything, you will get less stability if he puts KDE version on debian testing...

I ran LMDE for several months..but back on Mint 10 main edition now...much more relaxing and reliable....
To those who always complain about ubuntu and ubuntu based distros i can only say one thing (a very old saying) "The Grass is Always Greener on the Other Side".....NOT :lol:

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Fri May 27, 2011 9:19 pm
by kmb42vt
Boo wrote:I have been doing development since Kubuntu Beta1, Beta2 and now final.
What problems have been found... my network connection rarely comes up and the nVidea drivers can cause all sorts of problems.
Networking is some sort of auto-eth0 issue not being created or something lower down the driver chain.

Has anyone else been playing with Kubuntu and having similar network issues?

no network connection makes it really hard to do development.

Linux Mint 10 KDE on the same machine runs no problems.

Cheers
Jamie
Now that I've finally had time to load up Kubuntu 11.04 into a test partition (and beat it into some form of usability--I like my codecs dammit! :D ) the one thing I haven't had a problem with is my network. I'm running a standard Comcast cable modem hooked into a wireless/Ethernet hub and I'm connected at login without fail from the initial Kubuntu install. Both mine and my wife's computer are hooked into the same wireless/Ethernet hub (her OS is Windows 7 and both our connections are wired) and I can log into hers without a problem as well. Now the one glitch I've seen so far with 11.04 which has been present in every KDE network manager I've used in past versions of KDE is that under 'Network Management Settings' my wired connection has never shown up however, it does show up in the pop-up window when you click on the network icon in the tray.

I'll post a couple of screen grabs so you can see what I mean.

As far as the Nvidia drivers are concerned I'm not able to test at the moment due to a faulty Nvida GT220 card. As soon as I can pick up a replacement I'll test that as well.

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Fri May 27, 2011 9:34 pm
by kmb42vt
craig10x wrote:Keep in mind that debian testing can have plenty of breakages...it's not all "peaches and cream" in fact if anything, you will get less stability if he puts KDE version on debian testing...

I ran LMDE for several months..but back on Mint 10 main edition now...much more relaxing and reliable....
To those who always complain about ubuntu and ubuntu based distros i can only say one thing (a very old saying) "The Grass is Always Greener on the Other Side".....NOT :lol:
I absolutely agree. Let's face it, Debian testing is...well...Debian testing and LMDE, as much as I enjoy using it, is not an OS for the average user or at least not in it's current state. Of course Clem never stated it was. Linux Mint has always been about the best "out-of-the-box" experience and the Gnome and KDE editions reflect that. There's a lot to be said about Ubuntu based .deb packages and the PPAs at Launchpad . The (Ubuntu) .debs might not be as common as cow pats like Windows .exe's are but they're slowly but surely becoming that way in the world of GNU/Linux. The easy ability to add drivers via jockey is another plus. You'd lose all of that and more if you based Linux Mint KDE (or Main) on Debian testing. I'd have to honestly say that I'd be very disappointed if Linux Mint KDE went to Debian testing instead of Ubuntu. And that's coming from a complete tech-head.

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Fri May 27, 2011 10:21 pm
by manny
My comment wasn't about developing LM KD11 based on Debian but on LM KD9 instead, which is the latest LTS and proven to be rock solid. It feels like after every LTS follows up some regressions. I'm getting the impression that the wheel is reinventing over and over fixing things that used to work at one point. If LM KDE 11 based in Kubuntu 11.04 is not superior in performance and stability to LM KDE 9 I will not consider it an advance.

My 2 cents.

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Fri May 27, 2011 10:55 pm
by craig10x
I've run Kubuntu 11.04 on the live cd (even though i lean more toward gnome but have used kde in the past) and i liked it alot....couldn't consider it because like all other new distros with the new kernel, my laptop is being "plagued" by the "power bug" we all know about that hits many but not all computers...Other then that, the only real issue i found is a problem getting the mic input to function properly...otherwise, it is very very nice :D

And thank you kmb42vt for the kind comments....yes...at this stage of the game, LMDE certainly is not as smooth and polished and reliable as the average ubuntu based mint distro... :wink:
It would be great if it could be...i did love the thought of not having to keep re-installing but all those updates and annoying breakages was getting to me :lol:

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Sat May 28, 2011 10:12 am
by nomadewolf
cpatrick08 wrote:
manny wrote:My 2Cents in here and my ignorance on OS development also. It seems to me that the LTS releases are the best ones followed by regressions after them. In my opinion if some thing works we shouldn't try to fix it. If LM based in Kubuntu 11.04 has regressions from the previous releases why bother to release something that is broken? Wouldn't be better to fix the few problems that LM KDE 9 has, which by the way is solid rock stable and built from it LM11? As I said, I'm just an user but I hate regressions and I prefer something that works good than bleeding edge stuff that doesn't.

Again, an opinion from an ignorant.

Thanks
i agree if you cant get the lm11 kde to work then I think you should start basing kde off of debian testing.It would be easier for you and people would not have to reinstall every 6 months with is too short of time to get many changes that are not poorly implemented look at Ubuntu and unity, for a example, they needed 6 more months to get a good version of unity made ,it is usabile dont get me wrong, but still needs more work.
That's the great thing about Linux.
If you want Rock Solid, stick with LTS LM9.
If you want bleeding edge, update.

No one forces your choice.

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Sat May 28, 2011 5:32 pm
by craig10x
I was just reading the new thread about the interview with Clem in which he talks about the various things he will be developing for LMDE now that he is wrapping up Mint 11...If some of the rough edges can be smoothed out (including optional auto-install options) as well as the new "stable monthly snapshot" updates as an alternative to the standard debian testing way of updating, it sounds very promising that debian base for gnome and kde could work out to a very nice rolling and pretty stable distro...I hope it develops nicely :D

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Sat May 28, 2011 5:46 pm
by kmb42vt
craig10x wrote:I was just reading the new thread about the interview with Clem in which he talks about the various things he will be developing for LMDE now that he is wrapping up Mint 11...If some of the rough edges can be smoothed out (including optional auto-install options) as well as the new "stable monthly snapshot" updates as an alternative to the standard debian testing way of updating, it sounds very promising that debian base for gnome and kde could work out to a very nice rolling and pretty stable distro...I hope it develops nicely :D
Which thread is that? Could you post a link? (sometimes I miss the obvious you know?)

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Sat May 28, 2011 6:02 pm
by Andrew33
I know you all can't stand it when I mention this but, there's a problem with the drivers in the kernel module for the Alps P/S 2 Dual Point Touchpad in LM 10 & 11.....they aren't complete or included as they are in LM 9. This is the only one issue I have with Gnome & KDE 10 & 11, everything else is wonderful & LM rocks.....everyone involved with its development is doing a grand job. I just would make one request.....if someone would look into why this one issue was left out of kernel programming.......please...thank you and have a great day....cheers.


Andrew

Re: Mint 11 KDE development

Posted: Sat May 28, 2011 6:08 pm
by rec9140
cpatrick08 wrote:i agree if you cant get the lm11 kde to work then I think you should start basing kde off of debian testing
There is more to this than just switching to Debian... lets start with the 30,000+ packages of software you've just required recompiled, especially if its involving audio or video.

Thanks to idiotic DFSG, none of the audio programs will ever support MP3... trot out all the its not an open, yadda protocol... doesn't matter... I offer streams in MP3 and OGG. The OGG's are a waste of bandwidth other than ME, NO ONE, ZILCH use them! They sound better, are higher quality and still ZERO... NONE of the streamers Android will play OGG, none...

I am all for a KDebMint.. BUT I am not going to sacrifice the ease of sudo apt-get install superaudio only to get a version which is neutered.. and NO I AM NOT compiling from source.. this is why I use KMint... I install and I am ready to get down to business, not spend 2 hours to maybe possibly compile what I need.


cpatrick08 wrote:It would be easier for you and people would not have to reinstall every 6 months with is too short of time to get many changes
Theres no need to upgrade every 6 months... once I install its probably there for the next 2-3 years.

I like the idea of rolling/upgradeable distros, and would like to see that in KMint|[KDebMint].... but I've also read the pros and HUGE CONS of this.... There are some really bright people involved in the Mint dev's who I think could solve this, but to do this would require Mint make a tough and very unpopular decision (at least for that version).

I will test out KMint 11, and any new builds if it passes will get it, but existing boxen would not be upgraded with out an absolute need. Simply its too much hassle to move all that stuff around, partitions or HD's etc... There is no requirement to upgrade...
cpatrick08 wrote: that are not poorly implemented look at Ubuntu and unity, for a example, they needed 6 more months to get a good version of unity made ,it is usabile dont get me wrong, but still needs more work.
Unity and the other stupidity, wayland are c r a p, garbage, which are not needed, there is nothing wrong with X other than a bunch of whippersnappers who just don't get it, and that its overkill for TABLETS which is where canoicial is headed.. there will be no ubunntu for the desktop by the end of 2012.. The others will supplant it on the desktop and they will be using KDE (YES EVEN KDE 4.x,) or other better DE's and NO thats NOT unity or wayland. These two projects are doing more harm to Linux in general than a lot of other things.

I would like KMint, KDebMint (when it arrives) to move away from following the release schedule of upstream..thanks to an EXCELLENT decision Kmint 10 had 4.6.x, upstream is just getting it... waiting till after 4.6.4 is released would be a good move. Changing the release schedule though has a lot to do with getting the upgrade process resolved as well.. I think a good 12 month cycle and releasing in SEPTEMBER of the year would be a good choice.