Mint 12 KDE

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Fandangio
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by Fandangio »

kage wrote:
manny wrote: The problem with LM-KDE has been its abandonment, the project has been put aside for too long now, that created the feeling on most of us that we are not welcome any longer in here and as result, people have been abandoning the community steadily, even Bo, who was in charge, has left the project definitively. We have been hearing empty promises that never arrived. So, most of the community decided "not to wait for them" any longer because the general feeling is, there is not seriousness in this project.

Is nothing wrong installing KDE on Lisa 12 or other Gnome based OS. Most of us does that too and I wish your experience is a positive one, but the attitude matters a lot and that is what is lucking in LM towards KDE. This was a good community but for most of us, unfortunatly "the wait is over". Hope you understand now. I hope also LM reconsider its attitude and delivers a shiny KDE the way it deserves with the "fonts tweaked" so newbies like you don't need to spend time correcting it, but I doubt that would ever happen soon and if it does, I will doubt it was done with much love either.

Take care and Have a Happy Holidays
manny
Thank you Manny

You wrote what I wanted to write but you did that so much better.
I fully agree with you.

In spite of the above I would also like to wish the devs and community a happy holiday

kage
I'm glad I'm not the only one feeling this.
I think Cinnamon was the nail in the Mint KDE coffin. Clem had said the KDE would be the priority, but how can this be when he's spending so much time on Cinnamon?
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tdockery97
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by tdockery97 »

I hunted up some news on Mint 12 KDE. This is an excerpt from Clem's reply to a question about KDE on the cinnamon.linuxmint.com site on December 24th:

"I am also working on the KDE and LXDE editions, I started them at the beginning of the month. The KDE edition is not far from entering testing but it’s got a few issues I need to fix (in particular in regards to mime types, Firefox and apturl) before submitting to QA."

So KDE has not been abandoned.
Mint Cinnamon 20
ferri
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by ferri »

I thank DeMus for asking this question because we really miss any information about LM 12 KDE.
http://cinnamon.linuxmint.com/?p=53
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by colyn »

tdockery97 wrote:I hunted up some news on Mint 12 KDE. This is an excerpt from Clem's reply to a question about KDE on the cinnamon.linuxmint.com site on December 24th:

"I am also working on the KDE and LXDE editions, I started them at the beginning of the month. The KDE edition is not far from entering testing but it’s got a few issues I need to fix (in particular in regards to mime types, Firefox and apturl) before submitting to QA."

So KDE has not been abandoned.
I wonder if the firefox issue is related to firefox in Ubuntu/Kubuntu where the back button does not always respond and you have to click save image as several times before it will save..

I do not have this issue on my PCLinuxOS machine..

Only the whiners are saying that KDE has been abandoned..
Daboo
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by Daboo »

I think you are missing something though, ferri. There are two ideas that I grew up with. First, a man's word is a commitment to be honored.
clem wrote: In December, with Linux Mint 12 released and LMDE in good shape I will hopefully have the time to focus on KDE. If Boo isn't back by then, I'll address the issue myself. Based on all these facts we might confirm the switch to LMDE or we might revert to Ubuntu and continue on as before. Either way, the presence or absence of Boo in this project will be an important factor in the decision.

I can't tell you when you'll see a release, but December this year we'll have some news and if nothing is ready, I'll personally work on it myself. You've seen how quickly the Xfce edition now follows LMDE, they get released together. One of the reasons that was done initially was because Merlwiz wasn't as available anymore. LMDE simplifies that process, though a fourth edition is a little too much for me to take on on my own.
Have you seen any news? This was written last October 23rd.

Second, actions speak louder than words.
Fandangio wrote:I am really going to try and not be cynical in this post but I have some worries that KDE has been dropped (in part) for the development of Cinnamon. Looking here https://github.com/linuxmint/Cinnamon it appears that Clem is working flat out on this project. Where this leaves Mint12 KDE is anyones guess...
Image

When I look at this snapshot of the directory for Cinnamon, it appears some of the initial directories were set up on December 10th by clem. Linux Mint 12 was released on November 26th.

Then I look at the posts on Cinnamon and I see things like this...ironically, the first post was from the thread "Clem is awesome".
rhY wrote:...So what is he doing about it?
He's forking the Gnome Shell to fix everything wrong with Gnome 3 (Cinnamon).
It's clear he listens to us here and on the blog, and in IRC...
craig10x wrote:waldo...calm down! Cinnamon is in ALPHA for pete's sake...already you are putting it down when Clem has like 5 months to hone, refine, add features to it, etc...for mint 13......
Note, Cinnamon is in alpha and people are using it. How many of us have seen the alpha of LM 12 KDE? How many of us have seen a directory where we can even see the work being done, like you can see for Cinnamon?

So would anyone like to guess when you'll see a LM 12 KDE version? If ever? As rhY wrote, Clem has 5 months now to get LM 13 ready. Where will the priority be?

As for the issues they are having, openSUSE 12.1 KDE has been out since November 16, 2011. It seems very polished. I wanted to stay with LM KDE. It was my first good experience with linux and I felt very comfortable with it. I thought at the time it was a supported distro.

Actions speak louder than words.

Chris
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by GeneC »

Daboo wrote:..................... How many of us have seen a directory where we can even see the work being done................

Chris
I noticed this repo that opened about 3 weeks ago. Its being worked on

http://packages.linuxmint.com/list.php?release=Lisa-KDE
craig10x
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by craig10x »

Also this comment in the cinnamon blog from Clem:

@DeMus: I am also working on the KDE and LXDE editions, I started them at the beginning of the month. The KDE edition is not far from entering testing but it’s got a few issues I need to fix (in particular in regards to mime types, Firefox and apturl) before submitting to QA. Note that your question is legitimate but also completely off-topic. Please don’t hijack discussions like this.

So now you know the status...it's definitely being worked on and that is a very RECENT comment too...i prefer gnome myself and don't forget gnome is the main mint distribution...just like with PcLinuxOs where KDE is the main distribution...so naturally you would expect it to get the priority here...however, as you can can see from GeneC's and my post here...you can relax now...it's coming along..no doubt the RC would probably be out within the next few weeks (once it finishes going through initial testing)...
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by manny »

colyn wrote:
Only the whiners are saying that KDE has been abandoned..
a·ban·don (-bndn)
tr.v. a·ban·doned, a·ban·don·ing, a·ban·dons
1. To withdraw one's support or help from, especially in spite of duty, allegiance, or responsibility; desert: abandon a friend in trouble.
2. To give up by leaving or ceasing to operate or inhabit, especially as a result of danger or other impending threat: abandoned the ship.
3. To surrender one's claim to, right to, or interest in; give up entirely. See Synonyms at relinquish.
4. To cease trying to continue; desist from: abandoned the search for the missing hiker.
5. To yield (oneself) completely, as to emotion.
n.
1. Unbounded enthusiasm; exuberance.
2. A complete surrender of inhibitions.


Colyn, If you feel this is a serious project, believe me, I will not argue with you.

Wishing all of you a Happy New Year!
ferri
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by ferri »

According me there was fear from LM 12 KDE. Currently KDE is much closer common users than experiments like Unity and Gnome 3.
Many people use Gnome version 11 because Gnome version LM 12 with MGSE seems them like some conglomerate and prefer rather migrate to LM12 KDE.
Other words there was fear that KDE version would be better than main MGSE version.

So what can we do?
Give them little bone named cinnamon. Hope for future, some toy for playing, just do not think to migrate to KDE. :(
craig10x
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by craig10x »

KDE is very pretty but i've worked with it and it has it's problems too you know...i still prefer gnome myself even in it's new form (gnome 3) which by the way, does have technological advantages over the old gnome 2...but it's just like kde4 was when it was new...takes time to develop...and there are a lot of impatient people on the mint forums, unfortunately...

Also..i recall reading that when KDE5 arrives, it may well be quite a radical departure of what you are currently use to...so you kde fans may be going through the same stuff us gnome fans are experiencing now :wink:

A lot of things developed that unfortunately caused the delay in a new kde version of mint to come forth...like apparently Boo dropping out of the project...the major switch over in gnome, things going on with LMDE, etc etc...Mint is a small project and doesn't have the resources that Ubuntu has...As far as Cinnamon goes, Clem wisely has chosen to to do a rewrite of the gnome shell (which is what ubuntu did with unity and is the reason it is pretty stable as compared to gnome shell using many extensions)...at this point in time it's very important that he be working on the cinnamon project, as Gnome still IS the major distro used among mint users...

However, at the same time, the fact remains is that he has working on the KDE right now at the same time as Cinnamon and in fact it should soon be up for the testing stages... :) So please stop "princess and moaning" about it :roll:
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by ferri »

craig10x wrote: However, at the same time, the fact remains is that he has working on the KDE right now at the same time as Cinnamon and in fact it should soon be up for the testing stages... :) So please stop "princess and moaning" about it :roll:
Thank you very much for information. :D
This is according me correct approach. There are 2-3 sentences per week about kde version development enough.
Again thanks.
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by craig10x »

you are very welcome, ferri :wink: glad to be of help in clarifying what has been happening and what's going on right now with it :)
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by Fandangio »

Craig, I am fully aware of the events that have continually led to the rescheduling of Mint KDE and I don't think it is correct to say people are princess when thay are concerned about the ever changing date of the KDE release.

I know full well that the Mint team has limited resources and that they really are doing the best they can. With that said KDE has been "bumped" down the chain of releases for one thing after another. This is the source of frustration.

Cinnamon is the latest in the list of more important things. I know Clem has said that he is working on both but if you look at the updates to the project it is clear that Cinnamon is taking up the majority of his time. This is when KDE is meant to be the priority (Clem's words not mine). Would KDE be here now if it were not for Cinnamon? I do not know. What is apparent is that KDE would be here sooner if Clem was not working on Cinnamon.

Please don't take these comments as "I want, I want, I want". I have sponsored Mint and am fully willing to give to projects I support. The frustration is in that KDE has been said to be the "next" thing so many times now it's difficult to know what is true. As I've said before I love the Mint community and wist to stay loyal to Mint but it is becoming increasingly difficult.
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by craig10x »

I fully understand and appreciate your frustration...i didn't mean to imply that everyone was princess and moaning but i do see a lot of those comments sprinkled in among those that are just concerned about what is going on with the kde project for mint...

As far as Clem working on Cinnamon at the same time, on that one i have to disagree with you..as i am sure you realize, Gnome IS and always will be the biggest used version of Linux Mint (much in the same way as KDE is and will always be the main version used of PcLinuxOs for example)....and Clem is taking a bold step to refine the Gnome 3 shell to increase the stability, reliability and flexibility (a lot of which was lost going over to gnome 3)...KDE fans can't fully appreciate what we have been going through over here on the gnome side with all these changes which were FAR more radical then when KDE changed from it's version 3 to version 4....

Basically, Clem is doing the right thing in using the ubuntu approach to re-design the shell itself as they did for unity, rather then continue with extensions which can cause problems...and it is very important that he be working on it now so that by the time mint 13 is released he will have an awesome distro ready for us...

In the case of the KDE version...it's really just making kubuntu "minty" :lol:
And in fact...just a few days ago he did mention that he is working on mint kde at the same time, and there is just 3 small "issues" that need to be ironed out and then it will be going up on the testing site... :wink:
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by ferri »

craig10x wrote: In the case of the KDE version...it's really just making kubuntu "minty" :lol:
And in fact...just a few days ago he did mention that he is working on mint kde at the same time, and there is just 3 small "issues" that need to be ironed out and then it will be going up on the testing site... :wink:
I mentioned one thing. But this is problem of vmware tool.
There is impossible to run or test LM 12 with MGSE or Cinnamon in vmware virtual machine due to 3D acceleration. There is only gnome "classic".
The same Ubuntu with Unity.
But when I test Kubuntu, Mandriva, Mageia KDE, openSuse KDE, Fedora KDE there is not any problem in vmware virtual. I have environment in full beauty.
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by Fandangio »

Hi Craig, I must admit I am getting a little bit defensive about KDE.

Your comment about Gnome being most important is wrong though. I understand that Gnome is the main edition and will always make the first release, but Clem has explicitly said that KDE will be his priority (after Mint 12 Gnome). I just can't see this being the case.

Cinnamon is less important. The Gnome users have their Gnome release. I suffered as you all are when KDE went to 4.0.
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by craig10x »

Cinnamon wouldn't be less important if you were a gnome fan instead of a kde fan :lol:
So, we will have to agree to disagree on that one point :wink:

By the way...not that i use it...but over at PcLinuxOs (which i am sure you know is opposite of mint in that is primarily a kde based distro even though other versions are available) do you know how long the gnome fans over there have been waiting for the gnome 3 shell based version to come out for it...ages!!! :shock:
In fact, there hasn't been a new gnome version for it in awfully long time...
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by ferri »

craig10x wrote: In the case of the KDE version...it's really just making kubuntu "minty" :lol:
I quite wonder what shall be prepared extra compared to kubuntu.
Can you give away some information?
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by craig10x »

Well, it's really kubuntu with a bit different theming, mint tools added (like the gnome version has), codecs already installed, mint software center instead of the one that kubuntu has... and actually more gnome programs installed by default then kubuntu normally has...that sort of stuff...I played with earlier editions of the kde mint and i was just as happy using kubuntu as i was using the mint version of it, to be quite honest...but after a spell i realized that i just felt more "comfortable" using gnome... :wink:
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Re: Mint 12 KDE

Post by manny »

@Craig10x

Craig10x, I'm wishing you enjoy the Cinnamon and Mate in the future and hopping LM be at the top for years to come. You finally convinced me that Linux Mint is not for me, tacking your advice from previous posts I will try to find greener pastures. I'm canceling my sponsorship to LM and all I can say is, it was wonderful till it lasted.

Cheers to all of you!
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