GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

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RollyShed
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by RollyShed » Thu Nov 28, 2019 3:57 pm

vansloneker wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 3:13 pm
Okay, but how much snow do you see in Australia?
We were staying with my partner's sister in the SE and went off for a 3 day bicycle trip on a rail-trail. We came back and she suggested we do another one to the north, to Bright for those who know it.

We all know Australia is hot, flat and dry. Yes?

We didn't get any riding in because of rain and couldn't get back, other than by a 2 day diversion via Melbourne, because the road over the mountain was closed due to snow.

Yes, Australia is hot, flat and dry ...... sometimes.

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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by AZgl1500 » Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:17 pm

Portreve wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 9:06 am
For my job, I use Google Navigation five days a week (most weeks) and on the whole, it's great. However, what I have noticed is that sometimes it gives ridiculous routes. For example, it will tell you to exit the interstate at an overpass, then basically do a gigantic u-turn to get back on the Interstate. Or, it will have you go through an intersection where your destination is at and go up the road and make a u-turn and come back to it, when there is absolutely no reason.
I have observed this so many times, that I am extremely wary of major Interstate junctions like this.

However, on the Plus Side, last March, I was towing my big Toy Hauler RV Trailer with my Suburban, going to downstate Florida from OkieLand.... as I came into Birmingham, AL on a route that I was very familiar with, the world just came apart with my Garmin Nuvi 2797LMT suddenly announcing a major detour to my route.

The Traffic Alert System worked perfectly in this particular case, even though, we were routed to some extremely tight and ridiculous downtown streets.

The New Construction there is still in progress, and on our return trip, we avoided the intersection we always used in the past, and took an outside loop and never slowed down..... an extra "5 minutes" saved an hour's worth of frustration.

Birmingham, AL400.PNG
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farkas
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by farkas » Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:28 pm

On paper maps these roads are clearly marked " Closed in winter"
https://mailtribune.com/archive/hypothe ... opsy-shows
https://mailtribune.com/archive/texas-c ... -camp-road
If I'm headed to an unfamiliar area my first stop is the local AAA office to get paper maps!
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by lsemmens » Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:44 pm

Snow? What's that? Seriously, I've never seen the stuff, but I can understand the problems that a covering of snow can cause, without the need for safer driving IYKWIM.
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by cliffcoggin » Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:59 pm

AndyMH wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:31 pm

We do have the odd island linked to the mainland by road on a tidal causeway but only accessible at low tide, e.g. St Michaels Mount and Lindisfarne. So not quite as stupid as it would first appear, piccy is Lindisfarne. :D
Anyone foolish enough to ignore the warning signs on the approach to Lindisfarne (aka Holy Island) deserves what they get. They at least provide entertainment for the rest of us as they shelter in the central refuge awaiting the lifeboat.
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by GS3 » Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:03 am

People blindly following GPS directions is just a reflection of how, as things become more complicated, we tend to just trust machines blindly.

I am an exception in that I do not want "intelligent/connected" appliances and other such "advances". I like being in control of my own things but most people feel it is a burden and like to leave decisions to others.

Here in Spain we regularly get news of some tractor-trailer eastern European driver who drove into some small town center where the streets get narrower and narrower until the truck is wedged between two buildings with no way to back out. Cranes have to be called in while the locals cry "not again!".

A friend of mine did exactly that in a rental car. Drove into a narrowing street while his wife warned him not to and finally got stuck and damaged the rear view mirrors when backing out.

Having said that, I kind of suffered a similar situation myself except that it was my wife navigating with her phone so I blame her. If truth is to be told probably exactly the same thing would have happened if I had been navigating. The instructions took us along country roads that gradually narrowed and deteriorated until there was no road at all and no way to turn around. Trying to back out a rear wheel fell off the side and the back of the car was unmovable. We were in a pickle in the middle of nowhere. I like to blame my wife even though she was just reading the GPS.

I am not so stupid as to drive into a lake but plenty of people every year try to drive through flood waters and get into trouble.

If the GPS gives you a route which is slowly deteriorating you keep hoping it will start to improve and not that it will continue to deteriorate to the point where you get stuck.
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vansloneker
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by vansloneker » Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:14 pm

If you're in unknown territory, the navigation helps you to get to your destination. That is what counts in that moment.
Whenever possible, I try to look up routes upfront, and look for landmarks on Google Streetview.
It is true the navigation often gives routes that are not the most logical. I often had the impression they did not classify roads. Driving from city into my hometown, they suggest a route that is not shorter, not faster, and not safer. Why they want me to leave the major road for a route over narrow country roads that has not a single advantage is beyond my understanding.
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by AZgl1500 » Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:07 pm

vansloneker wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:14 pm
If you're in unknown territory, the navigation helps you to get to your destination. That is what counts in that moment.
Whenever possible, I try to look up routes upfront, and look for landmarks on Google Streetview.
It is true the navigation often gives routes that are not the most logical. I often had the impression they did not classify roads. Driving from city into my hometown, they suggest a route that is not shorter, not faster, and not safer. Why they want me to leave the major road for a route over narrow country roads that has not a single advantage is beyond my understanding.
Amen to that.

when going thru Strange destinations, I use Google Maps on my laptop before I leave,
I some times, print out the important interchanges so I can make pencil notes that I want to take route 77, not route 22....

and on paper, you can make the timeline for the routes you intend to take to review quickly.

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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by GS3 » Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:37 pm

GPS navigators rely on map information they buy from many sources and a lot of that information can be outdated or just plain wrong. I have sent corrections but they don bother to use them.

The residence of the prime minister here ("Moncloa", 40.4431, -3.7351) has shut off and enclosed what used to be public streets and some navigators still show them as public and usable. Never mind that they were shut off decades ago. Google still shows them as usable routes.

I also remember a case where there used to be a railway level crossing but it has been walled off and thus closed to traffic (40.126, -3.8434). My navigator still shows it as usable even though it has been blocked off for at least 15 years that I know and probably more than 25.
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by RollyShed » Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:50 pm

GS3 wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:37 pm
GPS navigators rely on map information they buy from many sources and a lot of that information can be outdated or just plain wrong. I have sent corrections but they don bother to use them.
Google is no better unless you keep at them.

A place we stay at often when on holiday. I walked up the drive to the letter box and there is a van. The driver asked me where a road was. My reply,"Are you using Google maps?"
"Yes."
"OK, where you want is 20 minutes away over that mountain and is along the bay/harbour you came from."

Eventually with a lot of "nudging" Google admitted it had placed the road in the wrong bay and corrected the address.

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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by stormryder » Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:24 pm

Flemur wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:12 am
I think "officials with Jackson County Roads and the Sheriff's Office" are trying to cover their asses because they blocked a main road and diverted people unto unsuitable road(s).
They didn't divert anybody. The interstate was closed because there was a blizzard, the stuck people figured they could make it across a scenic byway when officials had already closed the main route due to unsafe weather conditions, brilliant. You don't travel a road you've never been on in a blizzard unless you're prepared to spend the night in a snowbank. They could have easily driven off the road traveling the interstate as well, That's why it was closed.

Its not just the snow and ice on the road, during a storm the falling snow becomes so thick you can't see the road, which is white like everything else. You have to rely completely on the reflectors on the side of the road to navigate, Unfortunately sometimes the snowplows blast the snow onto them hard enough to completely obscure them.

Ever seen star wars? Yea, its like being stuck in the jump to lightspeed scene.

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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by Flemur » Wed Dec 04, 2019 10:07 am

stormryder wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:24 pm
Flemur wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:12 am
I think "officials with Jackson County Roads and the Sheriff's Office" are trying to cover their asses because they blocked a main road and diverted people unto unsuitable road(s).
They didn't divert anybody. The interstate was closed because there was a blizzard, the stuck people figured they could make it across a scenic byway when officials had already closed the main route due to unsafe weather conditions, brilliant.
If people were not diverted from a closed road, what were they? Expected to sit at the closed road until it was open in a couple of days?

I've driven i70 and I25 when they're been closed because of snow and the traffic is diverted - cop cars, lights, etc,; people don't sit there until the road is open again.

Jackson Country didn't do it right and they're trying to shift the blame.
You don't travel a road you've never been on in a blizzard unless you're prepared to spend the night in a snowbank. They could have easily driven off the road traveling the interstate as well, That's why it was closed.
The article didn't provide any evidence that GPS or computerized maps caused any problems. People have been getting stuck on crappy roads and in snowbanks long before there were computers.
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by old_noob » Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:31 pm

I wonder about our species sometimes...

There is a mountain pass in my part of Vermont that is very narrow and twisty at the top. Large trucks and even RV's are banned, but a lot of truck drivers try to pull their trailers over it because the GPS says so, despite numerous signs warning against it up to 20 miles away from the turnoff. They get stuck and it is a daylong operation to get them out. Meantime, legitimate road users get a 35 mile detour. At least the driver is fined $1000. The road is closed in winter, and when it opens in May there are multiple betting pools on when the first truck will get stuck "in the notch" - usually about 1 - 2 weeks after it opens. And even in winter truck drivers will try to take the route and are unable to turn around at the gate, but at least they are not blocking anyone.

If we rely on tech to the point that we don't use our brains and eyeballs we are going to lose them!

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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by cliffcoggin » Wed Dec 04, 2019 7:08 pm

old_noob wrote:
Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:31 pm
If we rely on tech to the point that we don't use our brains and eyeballs we are going to lose them!
The cynic within me believes that has already happened; the optimist within hopes I am wrong.
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by GS3 » Wed Dec 04, 2019 7:52 pm

Flemur wrote:
Wed Dec 04, 2019 10:07 am
People have been getting stuck on crappy roads and in snowbanks long before there were computers.


True but attitudes have changed. People in the past were much more self-reliant and if they got into trouble of any kind would just work themselves out of the bind. Gradually, over the decades, governments have come to protect us by requiring safer products and greater responsibility from suppliers of goods and services. This is objectively good but the public has developed a feeling that if something bad happens to me someone must be responsible. Sometimes it is just the public not assuming their own responsibility and sometimes there may be some shared responsibility by the supplier.

I, being older, am more in the camp of leave me alone and I will take responsibility if I get myself into trouble, but that is not the mentality of the younger generations.

A couple years ago in Spain there was a snowstorm and the media warned people to stay home but thousands got in their cars and were blocked in a toll road and had to spend the night there. Most of them had no coats, nothing to keep them warm, nothing to eat or drink, just stuck there, many with babies or old people. Even though it was freezing cold they went without any warm clothes because they were used to driving from door to door in freezing weather in a warm car.

Not one of them said "It was stupid of me to leave the house when a warning had been issued, and even more stupid to leave so unprepared." They blamed the toll highway for letting them in. In my view those people were utterly stupid and relied on their mentality that everything will be OK and if anything happens Daddy State will come and help us. In my view that is irresponsible but I can also see a certain share of responsibility on the part of the toll road. Don't let people in if you cannot assure them the road is practicable.

In summary: stupid people driving cars, stupid people controlling the toll road, stupid and worthless rescue services. I would fine them all. That's because I was home. If I had been in one of the stranded cars I am sure I would have a different view. :)
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by lsemmens » Wed Dec 04, 2019 7:56 pm

We have a Bridge in Melbourne that claims a new victim regularly: Montague St Bridge
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by farkas » Wed Dec 04, 2019 10:18 pm

lsemmens, your avatar:
Screenshot from 2019-12-04 18-11-07.png
Screenshot from 2019-12-04 18-11-07.png (14.74 KiB) Viewed 114 times
should be permanently etched on the back of all so called "SMART" phones.
Maybe as a splash screen when opening gps map applications.

Although, I doubt it would do much good.
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by lsemmens » Thu Dec 05, 2019 3:16 am

farkas wrote:
Wed Dec 04, 2019 10:18 pm
lsemmens, your avatar:

Screenshot from 2019-12-04 18-11-07.png

should be permanently etched on the back of all so called "SMART" phones.
Maybe as a splash screen when opening gps map applications.

Although, I doubt it would do much good.
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Re: GPS Maps can steer you wrong and be very dangerous to your life

Post by cliffcoggin » Thu Dec 05, 2019 2:00 pm

lsemmens wrote:
Wed Dec 04, 2019 7:56 pm
We have a Bridge in Melbourne that claims a new victim regularly: Montague St Bridge
That's reminiscent of a bridge in the USA that was struck so many times a Youtube channel was devoted to it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USu8vT_tfdw
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