Why do we need so much help...

[richyrich]

It has to do with actual science as opposed to science with agendas.

..and 4 to 1 Geologists agree ...

Hahaha , stop, you are hurting my tummy with your make believe pseudo-science !

Since when does agreement fit into any scientific observation or equation ?
Boy, the things we call science now-a-days . . . and we quote it as facts ! We've all been brain-washed !

[Arch_Enemy]

Because my main interest is in Nature and Wildlife, I'm in a number of forums with similar interests to mine. A few users of those forums are Ornithologists/Geologists/Zoologists/Naturalists, and a few other "ists" (probably Satanists/Anarchists/Atheists ). My point is I see this discussion about Climate Change often, and some of the posters appear confident that they know what they're talking about - many have worked in their fields for over 30 years, and they've reams of data to back up their arguments. They mostly don't quote other people... they quote themselves.

However, there are two distinct sides (not counting the Religious side) of the argument, and they can't both be right. It seems to me that neither side fully understands the problem, let alone the solution, and the most vocal on either side appears to have an agenda. In the end, it all comes down to money... trillions of dollars/pounds/euros to be made by the winners, the same amount in lost profits for the losers.

If we can't accurately (and we can't) predict the weather tomorrow, even with the help of the most powerful (and expensive) hardware available - how can we predict years in the future? It seems to me that nobody understands much at all about how the weather works... there's just lots of people quoting a few of the "experts", and the "experts" are being paid by someone for their research.

But it makes for an entertaining discussion, trouble is, all those taking part in the discussion will have been dead for 100s of years before anyone even gets close to discovering who was right

Indeed. It will take a minimum of hundreds of years. My bet is on the cyclical nature of the planet. The Earth has survived other infestations before.

PS: The Religious side had us all dead about 200 years ago...

[Arch_Enemy]

It has to do with actual science as opposed to science with agendas.

..and 4 to 1 Geologists agree ...

Hahaha , stop, you are hurting my tummy with your make believe pseudo-science !

Since when does agreement fit into any scientific observation or equation ?
Boy, the things we call science now-a-days . . . and we quote it as facts ! We've all been brain-washed !

Well, perhaps agree wasn't the correct word. When I ask the "Global Warming" question I usually get a little scoff and an "Oh, geeze". And it's not old professors or young professors, it's a cross-section. Usually accompanied by "Don't believe what politicians tell you". (I don't). The number of Earth Scientists who believe global warming is runaway is actually very small compared to the number studying it. They just have the microphone is all.

BTW, this includes UMASS, Amherst College, Dartmouth College, UVermont, Keene State College and a few others. (All in New England). All agree it will end with an ice age. One said it will be delayed by ~200 years, compared to an IPCC scientist who says it will be delayed by 2000 years. But, try to find evidence of that. It has been obliterated.

[samriggs]

PS: The Religious side had us all dead about 200 years ago...

Not to harp or go into depth on this point mainly because of forum rules but just one comment.
It says the earth and humans will still be here when the second coming happens, and that won't happen until after that one get's revealed, so that part is wrong unless it's someone who didn't read it right.
It'll be more then obvious when it happens, but that's a subject we can't talk about here.

As far as us mistreating the planet we live on, yup we do it, how far that will go, we'll see.
I never thought I would have to buy water because we made it undrinkable, can it be reversed? How long will it take?
If it doesn't change it'll only get worse, what else does this effect.
Like I said earlier, I stopped fishing because of tumours on fish I catch now.

When you destroy the water you destroy all life unless you like rocks and sand.
Whether global warming or another ice age, the fact is the water is is undrinkable.

[Arch_Enemy]

PS: The Religious side had us all dead about 200 years ago...

Not to harp or go into depth on this point mainly because of forum rules but just one comment.
It says the earth and humans will still be here when the second coming happens, and that won't happen until after that one get's revealed, so that part is wrong unless it's someone who didn't read it right.
It'll be more then obvious when it happens, but that's a subject we can't talk about here.

As far as us mistreating the planet we live on, yup we do it, how far that will go, we'll see.
I never thought I would have to buy water because we made it undrinkable, can it be reversed? How long will it take?
If it doesn't change it'll only get worse, what else does this effect.
Like I said earlier, I stopped fishing because of tumours on fish I catch now.

When you destroy the water you destroy all life unless you like rocks and sand.
Whether global warming or another ice age, the fact is the water is is undrinkable.

Oh geeze. I have a great big glass in front of me right now. What do I do now?

[Moem]

When you destroy the water you destroy all life unless you like rocks and sand.
Whether global warming or another ice age, the fact is the water is is undrinkable.

Oh geeze. I have a great big glass in front of me right now. What do I do now?

My suggestion: learn how to quote selectively. It won't make any difference with regards to the water, but it's a useful skill.

[Arch_Enemy]

When you destroy the water you destroy all life unless you like rocks and sand.
Whether global warming or another ice age, the fact is the water is is undrinkable.

Oh geeze. I have a great big glass in front of me right now. What do I do now?

My suggestion: learn how to quote selectively. It won't make any difference with regards to the water, but it's a useful skill.

I generally do, but I'm not quite as sharp at ~2AM...

[samriggs]

drink it
its probably been run through a few things to make it somewhat drinkable again.
If it smells like chlorine your good to go

I think that's the main thing that worries me more then anything else, cities can disapear and the smog goes away, eventually natures reclaims it all, animals can reproduce if their not all killed off, but water, not sure how good that is in coming back once it's been polluted to the point that it might not be able to become clean enough again and all life dies in the waters and whatever needs it.
It might be able to come back, just not sure about it.

Plus I just miss the good ole days of just drinking out of a river that now has signs "No Swimming" because of the pollution.

[Arch_Enemy]

drink it
its probably been run through a few things to make it somewhat drinkable again.
If it smells like chlorine your good to go

I think that's the main thing that worries me more then anything else, cities can disapear and the smog goes away, eventually natures reclaims it all, animals can reproduce if their not all killed off, but water, not sure how good that is in coming back once it's been polluted to the point that it might not be able to become clean enough again and all life dies in the waters and whatever needs it.
It might be able to come back, just not sure about it.

Plus I just miss the good ole days of just drinking out of a river that now has signs "No Swimming" because of the pollution.

Water is distilled every time it is picked up by transpiration, carried in the clouds and falls as rain. As long as it's not acid rain. We don't need a lot of chlorination around here, and I'm in New England. Don't know where you are in Canada, but it can't be too much worse. Unless you're around Windsor, that is. To paraphrase Horace Greeley, "Go North!"

I can't believe Canada is that bad. All of those signs have disappeared around here. Unless, of course, the person doesn't WANT you swimming, it's a reservoir, or its near a pasture and full of cow poop...

[samriggs]

I'm in Trenton, the No Swimming signs are not always up, just when it gets really bad and most times you can smell the river (bad smell), which I never smelled before I moved down here, in port hope the fish have quite a bit of mercury in them so you have to be careful there also.
Hopefully it'll clean up eventually, right now it's not that way though.

[Arch_Enemy]

I'm in Trenton, the No Swimming signs are not always up, just when it gets really bad and most times you can smell the river (bad smell), which I never smelled before I moved down here, in port hope the fish have quite a bit of mercury in them so you have to be careful there also.
Hopefully it'll clean up eventually, right now it's not that way though.

Mercury is one of the worst. How did it get into the water? Is it seeping up from below ground or is it waste from industry? Waste from industry can be stopped easily, but it will be a long, long time before you can eat any of those fish, depending upon the concentration.

[samriggs]

It was caused by a leak from a factory that has since closed down a long time ago but the mercury is still there.
you can read about the cleanup and what happen here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Hope,_Ontario

Everyone is leary about eating the fish they catch there, I won't but some still do.
Hopefully they will eventually clean up that mess, it is getting better but not there yet.

[Arch_Enemy]

It was caused by a leak from a factory that has since closed down a long time ago but the mercury is still there.
you can read about the cleanup and what happen here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Hope,_Ontario

Everyone is leary about eating the fish they catch there, I won't but some still do.
Hopefully they will eventually clean up that mess, it is getting better but not there yet.

I didn't see anything about mercury.

I read a lot about Radium.

I'll take the mercury.

[Penn]

So now we are on to water? Does anyone here have survival training?

If I drop you off in a wilderness area without waterways polluted by human activity you will find it easy to find water (unless you are in a desert). Question is, how much of that water is drinkable to animals? Humans have more fragile systems than most animals, how much is fit for consumption for us? Not nearly as much as you might think. There is more drinkable water in most parts of the first world than there was 200 or more years ago.

Drinking straight from a river? Again, more often than you might think natural waterways can't be consumed by humans even without those evil homo-sapiens dumping stuff into it.

Important to note also, what we consider fit for consumption now has different standards than it once did. This could bring us back to the original topic and something that was touched on already. What people found drinkable then as oppose to now has changed. Some of this is something that would change with time if we started drinking unprocessed water again. I was once in an undeveloped part of the world and the locals could drink the water with no problems but most of the big city people would get sick from the water.

I'll stop here since I may have strayed a bit. Basic point is, some of this focus lately by environmentalists and media is overblown or distorted to make it sound like some areas of the world having difficulty finding safe water is something new. It isn't and it can be argued that at current it isn't as bad as it has been in the past.

[Arch_Enemy]

Indeed. Well said.

[austin.texas]

Just be glad if you don't live in US coal mining areas

[jimallyn]

Just be glad if you don't live in US coal mining areas

Just be glad if you don't live on a planet where they burn coal.

[Arch_Enemy]

Just be glad if you don't live in US coal mining areas

Just be glad if you don't live on a planet where they burn coal.

Indeed...

[Moem]

Mod note:
Since this topic apparently can't stay away from the subject of politics, time to close this up.