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The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 2:03 pm
by tovian
Is this the future of all Operating Systems - or just what Microsoft thinks it will (should) be?

Microsoft sees the future of Windows 10 as Sets, ditching windows for a tabbed app interface

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 3:59 pm
by BenTrabetere
It is putting lipstick on the wrong end of the pig.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:05 pm
by jimallyn
I don't care how Microsoft sees anything. I do not see Microsoft in my future.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 7:21 pm
by tovian
jimallyn wrote:I don't care how Microsoft sees anything. I do not see Microsoft in my future.
I think we can all pretty much agree with that (at least to some extent).

The problem is (and has always been) that Microsoft is like a giant cargo-ship or aircraft carrier steaming at full speed. Anything that gets close gets sucked into its wake. So, the question remains... is this concept something of real value... something that will be adopted in some fashion by all the "standard" OS publishers? Or will it be a belly-flop? It takes change for companies to remain viable. Refusal to change - with few exceptions - is a certain path to the end of a product or company. Therefore, if Linux doesn't follow in this direction (with this same basic concept) where will it go? How will it evolve? It's not always such a bad idea to let "somebody else" do all the R&D and the bleeding-edge intro and testing, then take the concept and "do it better". Even though I don't much care for Microsoft I would wager a tidy sum that in a few years we will see all the major Linux DE publishers implement their version of this same concept.

Just my opinion !

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:34 pm
by kenetics
It might be good for some business or student applications but not for the majority of users. Definitely not for me!

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:55 pm
by Pierre
the biggest problem is still the Size of Microsoft Windows Updates,
:roll:
there are now humongous in size, especially on a new machine,
that is connected to the 'net for the first time.
- their Operating System is also getting even more buggy, as well.

If the the Microsoft Way, is the Only Way - - then it's a Very :( day indeed.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:03 pm
by Royal-Mint
Who cares about other OS?
Let them dig their own grave for all I care.
We're here on linux Mint we should care about our own distro future
instead of concern about something else that you don't even use.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:51 pm
by Night Wing
jimallyn wrote:I don't care how Microsoft sees anything. I do not see Microsoft in my future.
Since I don't need any specialized programs which are Windows only, Microsoft isn't in my future either. As for Windows 10, speaking just for myself, I rate it "two thumbs down". :twisted:

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 5:42 pm
by AndyMH
I like mint the way it is, bit of a luddite, don't like change. But... I remember when MS changed the user interface in office from 2003 to 2007. HATED it. Now several years later - wouldn't change back. So I'll never say never.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 6:27 pm
by xenopeek
Here is a short video by the Windows team, giving an example of how the new feature could be used: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lEjuU-XFHg

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:45 pm
by jimallyn
xenopeek wrote:Here is a short video by the Windows team
I will admit that's interesting. I have at times done pretty much the same thing by putting all the windows from one project on the same workspace. And having program icons on the panel gives much the same functionality, except that we can't save panels. (Or can we?) I don't like that their search simultaneously searches the computer and the web. If I want to search my computer, I will use Catfish or one of the other fine search programs that are available. And if I want to search the web, I will use a web browser. And while I do find that interesting, I most certainly would not use Windows just for that feature. There's just too much other unacceptable stuff that comes with Windows.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:10 am
by tovian
@xenopeek - Thanks for the link. The visual makes the concept a lot easier to understand.

This feature should be a massive help in terms of multi-tasking... not only will it remember exactly where you were and what you were doing when you switched to something else - the way it automatically recalls everything will help re-orient my (our) thinking to where it was just before the tasks were switched.

I have achieved part of this functionality over the years by using virtual desktops or "activities" - even used "PCTools" multiple desktops in the days of DOS (before Windows). But those options were static - either they were always present or they weren't - AND, there was no auto-recall to restore the exact state of a project from the past. This new feature looks almost like multiple, dynamic sleep-states... they are only present when/if you need them.

I think the concept is cool and may be very handy AND productive. In that regard it would be good for the Linux DE publishers to be working on a similar feature.

This thread is NOT supposed to be an opportunity for Windows (Microsoft) bashing - it's supposed to be an opportunity to see a new concept/feature and evaluate that. It seems that some folks may have completely missed that point and have simply focused on their particular dislike of "that other OS". Thanks to xenopeek (and now jimallyn) for getting this thread back on the right track (it will be a lot more useful this way).

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2017 3:48 pm
by felemur
I don't like using Windows 10, but I do think that is an excellent idea.

It reminds me of Vivaldi browser, where you can tab-stack related tabs and hibernate the tab stack, and then reopen it. Vivaldi has a history feature that is so very useful and unlike any other browser.

Vivaldi browser has made my work much easier. I have a feeling someone at Microsoft likes Vivaldi as well, and thought, "hey, lets do that with everything in the OS"

Instead of getting our backs up as Linux users about anything Windows, we should just pick and choose what we like and incorporate ideas if they seem good.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 4:26 pm
by Rebel Dog
I'm getting old,,,but if I ever do need another desktop, I hope I can still build a unit and furnish it with Mint,,,,and a copy of Puppy Linux in the closet, only get it out as needed, when nobody is looking......
When I purchased my Laptop ASUS offered it with Ubuntu 12.04, same hardware and another $200 it came with WIndows...
I feel like I'm in AA, I do have a copy of MS Windows, in a VMBox, I'm so ashamed.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:57 pm
by trapperjohn
the biggest problem is still the Size of Microsoft Windows Updates,
Yup, it's a DDoS attack.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 5:47 pm
by lisabonne citadel
For me the future of the operating system has to be not in the utility but in the visual form that one works.
The operating system of today is already quite practical in the utility with the visualization of all the open windows. The visual replacement of the standard css background with any transparency application with blurry effect.
That i could call a revolutionary thing. NOT the chrome thing.
another tip:
Removing ALL REMOTE ACCESS TOOLS included in the system and leave the decision to include or not to the end user.
for windows the EXE file SHOULD BE REPLACE with another more safer and with a secure password prompt in every installation.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2017 4:42 pm
by InkKnife
Microsoft has always been tragically bad at predicting where things were going. They didn't think the Internet was going to be a big thing in the 90s, they didn't think portable digital music was going to be a big thing in the early '00s,they failed to see the threat Linux represented in the server space, missed the boat on the smart phone revolution and now they have been flailing about, futilely trying to guess what the "next generation" of GUIs would look like for a few years.
The only thing Microsoft is good at is serving their core user base in business and enterprise and practically everything else has been a failure except maybe the Xbox.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:10 pm
by Portreve
xenopeek wrote:Here is a short video <snip>
Actually, that's pretty cool, xenopeek, and finally they've managed to clean up the cosmetics of it and make it a lot more elegant-looking than their crap used to be. It's also obvious that the people doing this project are not of the same generation as those who originally had written DOS, or Windows, or Office, and so I suppose that's a good thing.

I share your concerns, too, tovian, but to my mind, this isn't necessarily some kind of paradigm shift that's going to suck all the air out of the room. Mind you, the concept of Sets in the video is very elegant and if Microsoft marketed it sufficiently and thoroughly, they could really have something there.

My view is that the GNU+Linux world has long been this hodge-podge affair with a significant degree of "by geeks, for geeks" still lingering about. There are some really elegantly-executed libre licensed software out there, but a lot of it really seems very amateurish by comparison. It would be great to not just write software, but really work on the various underpinning UI stuff, with an eye to something between Microsoft and Apple, both of which do have (especially lately with Microsoft, if this is an example) something to say about the fit-and-finish of interface design.

A lot of what is in that video would, of course, fall into a mixed camp of the Open Document Foundation, Mozilla, and somewhere to cloud-store all the data and glue which makes that happen. The question is: does the GNU+Linux community have an interest in this?

EDIT: It occurs to me, after writing all that, that Canonical and RedHat might be the best positioned, along with Alphabet, to really put out a competing product, because while obviously software has to be written to work in this sort of way, this also requires a tremendous backend operation, and that's just not a trivial thing to pull off.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:25 pm
by CoffeeFiend
trapperjohn wrote:
the biggest problem is still the Size of Microsoft Windows Updates,
Yup, it's a DDoS attack.
True. The last update my 10 machine got took over an hour and two reboots to install. And that's just what I was aware of as the update started, without prompting me to do so, while I was asleep. Nothing more annoying that needing or wanting to use my computer and having to wait for the updates to finish.

Re: The future of the PC OS ?

Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 4:07 pm
by trapperjohn
Here in the deep woods where we use wet string for our broadband connections, a single Windows update slows every connection from them thar hills down to the swamp over yonder. The lights brown-out too.

I assume these thugs think everyone lives in trendy Redmond. (Humm... what is the default time zone on a new Windows install?)