Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

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all41
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Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by all41 » Sun Apr 21, 2019 10:24 pm

Hi,
I'm just getting into this--I am a complete novice but enjoying photography.
I am currently using a crop sensor camera but hopefully I will have a 5D mk III before summer.
I have been using rawtherapee and a LG monitor at 1920x1280.
I am wondering if I should consider a higher resolution monitor. Is there better Linux software?
What do you use?

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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by BenTrabetere » Mon Apr 22, 2019 2:11 am

I use darktable to process my RAW image. I have used RawTherapee and I found it easier to learn to use, but I prefer darktable because it offers more selective editing and I prefer the way it manages noise reduction.

GIMP is not part of my normal workflow - I find I can do pretty much everything that needs to be done in darktable (or RawTherapee). But there are times when GIMP is the better tool for the job.

If you are not using image management software ... start. I prefer digiKam, but Shotwell has a following.

As for monitors, 1920x1280 should be fine for someone just getting started. That said, if I were planning to upgrade or replace my monitor, I would go with at least 27" monitor. If money were no object, I would get a BenQ SW271 - the $1100 price also means I would need a new computer to drive it. :)

What camera do you have now? Is there a reason you want to move away from a crop sensor camera? Don't misunderstand, there are many advantages to a full frame camera, but every time I have been tempted to move up I have always put my money on a new or better lens.

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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by absque fenestris » Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:20 am

EIZO - has 5 years warranty and at least in Switzerland an extraordinarily competent representation.

A hardware calibration (with Eye One) both on a 24" EIZO CG (unfortunately not mine...) and on my 24" EIZO FlexScan showed practically no color shifts - that means the factory settings are excellent.
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by vansloneker » Mon Apr 22, 2019 4:31 pm

My LG 24BK550y calibrated screen is much better than my older Eizo L768 and S1921. I also use this screen for video and photo editing.
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by Petermint » Tue Apr 23, 2019 3:52 am

Colour depth is one thing to look at. Within a monitor brand, there may be models with different colour depths. The cheapest model in an expensive brand may be worse than the best model in a cheaper brand.

Your basic image is 8 bit colour, although the JPEG format compresses most of the quality out. RAW might be 8, 10, 12, or more bits depending on the sensor in the camera. Darktable and the latest releases of GIMP calculate colours internally as 32 bit, preserving the colours better than light weight editors.

Darktable has the additional benefit of not changing the original file. Instead the changes are stored in an XMP file, giving you the option to backtrack or stat again with no loss of quality.

When you get to the image to the monitor, you have preserved the maximum colour detail and contrast. You are ready for a monitor that can display the wider range of colours.

The following is a description of two similar Asus displays. One has better electronics but they both are restricted to 10 bit displays. You really have to dig into the specifications.
One of the key differences between the PA328Q and its more expensive sibling is that the former calculates colour in 12-bit, while the PA329Q uses 16-bit, although both have 10-bit displays.

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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by absque fenestris » Tue Apr 23, 2019 10:39 am

For photographers who never know exactly whether to set their screen upright or horizontally... :mrgreen:

https://www.eizo.com/products/flexscan/ev2730q/

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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by vansloneker » Tue Apr 23, 2019 2:31 pm

lol, good find. How about a screen automatically rotating in the portrait or landscape position depending on the image :mrgreen:
Serious, they should remove either portrait or landscape from all cameras, printers and monitors!
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by absque fenestris » Tue Apr 23, 2019 2:44 pm

vansloneker wrote:
Tue Apr 23, 2019 2:31 pm
lol, good find. How about a screen automatically rotating in the portrait or landscape position depending on the image :mrgreen:
Serious, they should remove either portrait or landscape from all cameras, printers and monitors!
That's why I've always liked this camera...

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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by BG405 » Tue Apr 23, 2019 3:12 pm

A square monitor? A great idea! Now, I wish they'd use square sensors in cell phones, to help combat the epidemic of vertical videos .. which even a few BBC reporters are guilty of. :roll: :x

For colour depth, the above posts in this thread an interesting read. I'd actually forgotten about those Windows colour-depth settings (in older versions, anyway; don't know about Win8.x onwards) where one could select up to 32 bit, if I recall correctly. I haven't noticed an equivalent in Mint or other Linux distros, will have to look in to this. Wonder what the default is, usually?

My main monitors are ex-office Asus 5:4 & native resolution is 1280x1024@56Hz. These seem pretty good W.R.T. image editing, for LCD technology, but I wonder if a good-sized CRT would be a better (and cheaper) option, if you have the space?
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by absque fenestris » Tue Apr 23, 2019 3:29 pm

BG405 wrote:
Tue Apr 23, 2019 3:12 pm
... but I wonder if a good-sized CRT would be a better (and cheaper) option, if you have the space?
Certainly not - the time of the cathode tube is definitely over.
About a month ago I disposed of my last two 19" specimens (vintage 1998/99) in the local recycling plant. No more waddling around with 45 kg in the area or in the studio...
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by BG405 » Tue Apr 23, 2019 7:50 pm

Certainly not - the time of the cathode tube is definitely over.
About a month ago I disposed of my last two 19" specimens (vintage 1998/99) in the local recycling plant. No more waddling around with 45 kg in the area or in the studio...
[/quote]
Maybe so, but .. can these modern displays attain true "black level" like CRTs can and also the wide viewing angle? Yes, the size & weight is an issue for many, perhaps most in our cluttered lives, but can these modern displays beat that? Probably so with respect to colour purity and certainly with power consumption, but are they really obsolete? I still use CRT TVs & enjoy doing so. They produce a very watchable image, IMHO, even if considered "old hat".
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by absque fenestris » Tue Apr 23, 2019 8:14 pm

The disposal of the CRT's was no easy decision. But a quick look into my old CAD program was enough: once you've worked on a good 24" LCD monitor, the shaky, flickering and blurred display is only shuddering.
I still have one CRT - a nice B&O Television. It sounds very good and old VHS and S-VHS videos look better than on an LCD. It also weighs less than 45 kg...

Because of the "darker black" - and because they were awfully expensive at that time - I kept the CRT's so long. Black-and-white photos can actually look better - but only as a slide show.
At the latest in the image processing the flickering disturbs - and the things are simply blurred...
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by Petermint » Tue Apr 23, 2019 11:18 pm

CRTs were good for contrast and similar to OLED because black is the light off, not like the LCD always on backlight. Dark themes work on CRT and OLED plus they reduce power usage on both. My last CRT had a far better image than the first two generations of LCD. Only a late model IPS LCD could compete.

The one thing you could not do with an LCD was hotdesk. Carrying a 30" LCD down to the beach for a coffee break is not :shock: practical.

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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by vansloneker » Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:04 am

I've had a range of top-notch Eizo and Samsung CRTs and only one left. I have trouble parting with it for sentimental reasons and occasionally use it for playing a racing game because of the instant screen response.
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by absque fenestris » Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:09 am

vansloneker wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 4:31 pm
My LG 24BK550y calibrated screen is much better than my older Eizo L768 and S1921. I also use this screen for video and photo editing.
To stay with current screens that are suitable for demanding image editing: How did you calibrate your LG?

What hardware (colorimeter) did you use?
Under Linux Mint?
Were you able to create an ICC color profile, i.e. calibration and profiling?

Besides, I was shocked about the LG prices, at least in the USA. There is cannibalism among the manufacturers and especially at LG one has the impression of self-cannibalization...
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by vansloneker » Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:35 pm

absque fenestris wrote:
Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:09 am
vansloneker wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 4:31 pm
My LG 24BK550y calibrated screen is much better than my older Eizo L768 and S1921. I also use this screen for video and photo editing.
To stay with current screens that are suitable for demanding image editing: How did you calibrate your LG?

What hardware (colorimeter) did you use?
Under Linux Mint?
Were you able to create an ICC color profile, i.e. calibration and profiling?

Besides, I was shocked about the LG prices, at least in the USA. There is cannibalism among the manufacturers and especially at LG one has the impression of self-cannibalization...
It is factory calibrated and not very expensive.
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by absque fenestris » Wed Apr 24, 2019 3:03 pm

all41 wrote:
Sun Apr 21, 2019 10:24 pm
Hi,
I'm just getting into this--I am a complete novice but enjoying photography.
I am currently using a crop sensor camera but hopefully I will have a 5D mk III before summer.
I have been using rawtherapee and a LG monitor at 1920x1280.
I am wondering if I should consider a higher resolution monitor. Is there better Linux software?
What do you use?
I know a professional photographer who works with exactly this Canon. He is so satisfied with the JPG's that he doesn't work with RAW's anymore...
He converts the JPG's into TIFF's - it is faster done with the work and he can go home earlier. That's why you still need a good color-accurate monitor. The employer or customer wants something for his/her/their money... :mrgreen:
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by absque fenestris » Wed Apr 24, 2019 5:02 pm

vansloneker wrote:
Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:35 pm
absque fenestris wrote:
Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:09 am
vansloneker wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 4:31 pm
My LG 24BK550y calibrated screen is much better than my older Eizo L768 and S1921. I also use this screen for video and photo editing.
To stay with current screens that are suitable for demanding image editing: How did you calibrate your LG?

What hardware (colorimeter) did you use?
Under Linux Mint?
Were you able to create an ICC color profile, i.e. calibration and profiling?

Besides, I was shocked about the LG prices, at least in the USA. There is cannibalism among the manufacturers and especially at LG one has the impression of self-cannibalization...
It is factory calibrated and not very expensive.
I was quietly hoping, one, only one has actually created a color management in Linux Mint...
Do I really have to buy a colorimeter at my age and read an infinite number of pages about its use with unspeakable Linux commands in the terminal?

*/(%)*** ...;;;!..! !

So I could start publishing with LaTex right away... :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: Yes! it's not "lateks"- it's "latech" ... ... ...
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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by Petermint » Wed Apr 24, 2019 6:42 pm

He converts the JPG's into TIFF's
He could go from RAW to TIFF without the destructive JPEG stage.

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Re: Mint Photographers recommend a monitor for RAW

Post by absque fenestris » Wed Apr 24, 2019 6:55 pm

Petermint wrote:
Wed Apr 24, 2019 6:42 pm
He converts the JPG's into TIFF's
He could go from RAW to TIFF without the destructive JPEG stage.
The good friend saves storage space (and time) by working exclusively with JPG's - no RAW...
Yes, I was also amazed - when I recognized him as absolutely competent in questions of lenses, photo equipment, darkroom technology and light guidance.
It's kind of ironic when professionals earn their money with JPG's and amateurs use their digital RAW darkroom...
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