Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

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rene
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by rene »

Pjotr wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 4:23 am Because who is to determine in advance what is foolishness and what is wisdom?
Scientists who spend their lives learning about some specific subject tend to be in fair position to make predictions. Net-wads making unsubstantiated claims are however in fair position to, currently among poorly educated youth most dominantly, undermine their hard work again.

You probably know that it is in your country illegal to publicly deny the Holocaust, an event propelled by German conspiracy-theories in the nineteen twenties and thirties as to how the Jews were supposedly responsible for the losses of WW1. Those of us mature enough to moreover know that we are as a group not in fact so different from our parents or grandparents have from that event learned why it is a good idea to not allow limitless freedom of (public) speech. But we are quite literally dying off and those to who the in those events directly involved are more generations removed currently find themselves in a social environment on the internet fully dominated by American values; values that through physical distance to the event and certainly at the time youthful societal naivete have never incorporated that vital historic lesson about the nature of humanity.

Shall this be allowed to continue our societies will have very serious problems in due time. The US itself clearly already has fairly serious problems in this context even today as the world has seen on January 6th of this year. Resist the dogma's of your time.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by Pjotr »

rene wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 5:55 am Shall this be allowed to continue our societies will have very serious problems in due time.
On the contrary, I think.... Of course some extremes of free speech are rightly banned: incitement to violence comes to mind as the most striking example (pun intended).

But you can't have the productive huge benefits of free speech, without also leaving room for the crazies. That annoying side effect has to be taken onto the bargain. Limit free speech too much, and you'll end up in a horrible dystopia.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by Moonstone Man »

Pjotr wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:19 am That annoying side effect has to be taken onto the bargain. Limit free speech too much, and you'll end up in a horrible dystopia.
I think the line is much thinner than you've painted it. With freedoms, especially speech, for one to enforce one's freedom to speech, it usually, if not always, entails trampling on the rights of someone else, the someone else having the right not to be bombarded with crazy talk for example, which leads me to think that such freedoms are illusory and carry a cost.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by Pjotr »

Kadaitcha Man wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:24 am the right not to be bombarded with crazy talk for example
Thank God, there is no such right.... :mrgreen:

If one feels offended by crazy talk, one should grow a thicker skin. If one doesn't like it, one can lump it. The price of eliminating crazy talk is simply too high.

There is no more fundamental requirement for freedom in general, than freedom of speech. Which is why we should proceed with utter caution and curtail only a few extremes. And why we also must also leave room for the cackling of highly irritating, annoying and deranged voices.

It's the price we have to pay for freedom. :wink:
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by Moonstone Man »

Pjotr wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:36 am
Kadaitcha Man wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:24 am the right not to be bombarded with crazy talk for example
Thank God, there is no such right.... :mrgreen:
But there is, it's called freedom of speech. Anyway, just to clarify, I was talking from a philosophical POV, not an actual point of view.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by Lady Fitzgerald »

Pjotr wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 4:23 am ...Back on topic: the USA have already vaccinated almost half their population...
Actually, it's around 36% of the population of the SSA that have received at least one dose.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by LanceM »

The topic has diverged from my post's intended subject. That said, day 4 and no side effects. My friend I grew up with had some side effects. Itchy arm for 2 days, somnolence, sore muscles. He's on day 5 and is good now. I'm hoping on seeing more J&J posts and not the yada.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by Portreve »

rene wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 5:55 am Net-wads making unsubstantiated claims
Sounds like the same kind of substance of about 60 individual lawsuits which all were filed and heard right around the end of 2020 and the start of 2021. :wink:
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by SMG »

LanceM wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 11:24 am My friend I grew up with had some side effects. Itchy arm for 2 days...
Apparently, that is known as COVID arm and is "delayed hypersensitivity reaction to a component of the COVID vaccine" per the doctor quoted in this article New Vaccine Side Effect "COVID Arm" Striking Patients, Say Doctors.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by LanceM »

Glad I had no itch.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by JeremyB »

LanceM wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 11:24 am The topic has diverged from my post's intended subject. That said, day 4 and no side effects. My friend I grew up with had some side effects. Itchy arm for 2 days, somnolence, sore muscles. He's on day 5 and is good now. I'm hoping on seeing more J&J posts and not the yada.
Itchy arm for 2 days, that sounds like what happened the last time I was stung in the hand by a yellow jacket. A reaction to something in the vaccine
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by LanceM »

According to news online, only about 5 million US citizens got the J&J so far. So out of the 185 million vaccinated total with all three, not many comparatively to get a lot of feedback from. They said J&J is preferred for homeless people.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by JeremyB »

LanceM wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:43 pm According to news online, only about 5 million US citizens got the J&J so far. So out of the 185 million vaccinated total with all three, not many comparatively to get a lot of feedback from. They said J&J is preferred for homeless people.
Some counties here saved the J&J for teachers
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by LanceM »

Some counties here saved the J&J for teachers
seems like teachers and students need to be done for sure.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by SMG »

LanceM wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 7:03 pmseems like teachers and students need to be done for sure.
None of the vaccines have yet been approved for use in kids.

Pfizer is 16yrs old and older (with parental permission required for 16 an 17 yrs old).
Moderna and J&J are 18 yrs old and older.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by LanceM »

SMG wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 7:14 pm
LanceM wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 7:03 pmseems like teachers and students need to be done for sure.
None of the vaccines have yet been approved for use in kids.

Pfizer is 16yrs old and older (with parental permission required for 16 an 17 yrs old).
Moderna and J&J are 18 yrs old and older.
Probably almost a year away in the US.
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by rene »

Portreve wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 5:09 pm
rene wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 5:55 am Net-wads making unsubstantiated claims
Sounds like the same kind of substance of about 60 individual lawsuits which all were filed and heard right around the end of 2020 and the start of 2021. :wink:
That might be a more specifically American reference than I'd know about --- or I just don't get what you mean. It's in any case probably not related specifically to the Janssen vaccine so it may be a fair idea to do LanceM a favour and not yada about it further...
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by Pjotr »

LanceM wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:43 pm They said J&J is preferred for homeless people.
Probably because with Janssen, they don't need to return for a second shot?
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by SMG »

For those wanting to know about J&J experiences, this tweet and the response below it indicate some people had chills and felt like they had the flu. The person who tweeted said she nearly went to the emergency room because of the shakes, high temperature, and her fingers being numb and tinglish. She referred to her symptoms as a severe "normal" reaction. She felt better the next day.

That tweet was a response to another one indicating the CDC and FDA in the USA are recommending putting a temporary pause on J&J vaccines due to six reported cases of a rare and severe blot clot issue. I seem to recall reading earlier this year some blood clot issues showed up with other vaccines as well. The frequency of these issues were in line with the frequency of how often that type of issue normally happens, so it may not be related to the vaccines.
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rene
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Re: Johnson & Johnson Covid Vaccine

Post by rene »

SMG wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 8:50 am I seem to recall reading earlier this year some blood clot issues showed up with other vaccines as well.
Yes, AstraZeneca: https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/news/astra ... -low-blood

Here's the report that SMG refered to: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/13/us/p ... a-cdc.html
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